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Release Notes (New Attributes) - August 31, 2020

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1 hour ago, niraD said:

What does "Recommended for kids" mean? What is a "Difficult climb" or a "Significant hike"? What is "Recommended for tourists"? There are plenty of attributes that Groundspeak hasn't defined for us. Somehow, we still manage to use them.

I have addressed the difference at least twice previously in this thread. Also, you have been geocaching for over a decade so your we is utterly irrelevant to the concern I raised.

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2 hours ago, jellis said:

I didn’t see an answer to the CHECKER attribute.  Why is it only for GC checker and not others?

That way it can separate the reliable checkers from the others. The GC checker always tests for the proper coordinates instead of some bogus solution in the middle of the Pacific and updates the corrected coordinates for you. These are both major features. It also does not allow for random misspelled words as the solution instead of coordinates in a well-defined format, also cutting down on frustration significantly.

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For those who need to generate a list of GC codes in your power trail to get HQ to populate the attribute for you, here is an html/js script that will take a GPX file and put the list you need in a text box where you can copy it and send it for processing. Now if the forums don't mangle things too badly, here it is. Save it to a .html file and open the file in a browser. 
 

<html><head>
<title>Make list of GC codes from GPX</title>
<meta charset="utf-8">

<script>
// Check for the various File API support.
if (window.File && window.FileReader && window.FileList && window.Blob) {
    // Great success! All the File APIs are supported.
} else {
    alert('The File APIs are not fully supported in this browser.');
}

var output = [];
var error = [];
var gcSeen = {};

function updateView() {
    document.getElementById('list').innerHTML = output.join(',');
    document.getElementById('error').innerHTML = '<ul>' + error.join('') + '</ul>';
}

function handleFileSelect(evt) {
    var files = evt.target.files; // FileList object

    // files is a FileList of File objects.
    for (var i = 0, f; f = files; i++) {
        var reader = new FileReader();
        reader.onloadend = function(evt) {
            if (evt.target.readyState == FileReader.DONE) {
                var re = /<name>(GC[A-Z0-9]*)<\/name>/g, match;

                while (match = re.exec(evt.target.result)) {
                    if (!(match[1] in gcSeen)) {
                        if (match[1].length > 7 || match[1].indexOf("-") > 0) {
                            continue;
                        }
                        output.push(match[1]);
                        gcSeen[match[1]] = 1;;
                    }
                    evt.target.result = "";
                }
            }
            var sortChecked = document.getElementById('sort').checked;
            if (sortChecked) {
                output.sort();
            }
            updateView();
        }
        reader.readAsText(f);
    }
}

function start() {
    document.getElementById('files').addEventListener('change', handleFileSelect, false);
}
</script>
</head>
<body onload=start()>
<input type="file" id="files" name="files[]">&nbsp;
Sorted: <input type="checkbox" id="sort"/><br>
<textarea id="list" rows="20" cols="80"></textarea>
<div id="error"></div>
</body></html>

Edited by rragan
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17 hours ago, dani_carriere said:

I support all the new attributes. Thanks.

 

This may be unpopular, but I'd like to see them do away with the L&F attribute since no one has been able to collect them in over 10 years, Not really a good idea for an attribute to have a specific short time frame (like only valid in 2010, and only if a HQ lackie attended that particular event). I'd be ok if they'd open it up to be any lackie attended event without the time aspect.

 

Thanks.

 

Then I'd lose my L&F attribute! :cry:

Fantastic update! And certainly one I did not expect to see. Lovely surprise, GS. :wub:

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3 hours ago, MtnProf said:

I love these changes. Searching will be much easier. I especially like the idea of knowing which mystery caches are field puzzles. 

Can you explain? I'm not sure what this means. 

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@Keystone, are there negative versions of the new attributes?  Some sources indicate that negative versions of the attribute images exist but the website doesn't seem to allow me to set a negative version.

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Not @Keystone, but simply looking at the PQ attribute filtering, I see no negative version of any of the 4 new attributes. I wouldn't expect a negative version of Challenge, Bonus, HQ Checker.  I could see some use for a negative version of Powertrail. But apparently it does not exist.

 

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6 hours ago, jellis said:

I didn’t see an answer to the CHECKER attribute.  Why is it only for GC checker and not others?

Really? Wow, I missed that entirely. I assumed when they talked about adding the checker attribute automatically, it was because they were going to scan descriptions for the common checker links, so I didn't have to do anything.

 

Wait, are you saying it can *only* be used for the GC checker? Or it's just only automatically added when the GC checker is enabled?

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4 minutes ago, dprovan said:

Wait, are you saying it can *only* be used for the GC checker? Or it's just only automatically added when the GC checker is enabled?

 

From the original Release Notes:

23 hours ago, Geocaching HQ said:

Note that you will not see this attribute in the attribute section of the cache submission process or on the edit page, since the attribute will be added automatically when you select the checkbox to add the Geocaching.com solution checker.

 

That sounds to me like the attribute simply mirrors the state of the GC checker. If the GC checker is enabled, then the attribute is added. If the GC checker is not enabled, then the attribute is not added. If the GC checker is disabled, then the attribute is removed.

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On 8/31/2020 at 3:03 PM, Geocaching HQ said:

Note to cache owners: As a one-time community service, we offer cache owners the opportunity to email us a list of GC-codes of their currently published & active power trail caches where they would like the attribute added retroactively. Please email a comma-separated list of the GC-codes to us via the Help Center (choose Appeals) by September 30, 2020. 

This is great. But in general, now that we have a cache owner dashboard, it might be worth adding some batch tools that allow us to modify aspects of our cache listings (including attributes) to multiple caches at once.

Edited by Mineral2

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Ok,  so although they will update the Power trail attribute, it wont be done till the end of September,  would have thought they would want it updated quicker.  a batch at a time would seem more logical.  Oh well looks like manual updates.

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On 8/31/2020 at 3:42 PM, TTO2 said:

Can the new attributes be added to existing caches with 'edit'? 

Yes. I just updated all of my caches that needed bonus or challenge attributes.

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2 hours ago, Pinkpiggy7 said:

Ok,  so although they will update the Power trail attribute, it wont be done till the end of September,  would have thought they would want it updated quicker.  a batch at a time would seem more logical.  Oh well looks like manual updates.

It doesn't say they won't apply them as received --Just that the end of September is the deadline for submittal.

Edited by rragan
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2 hours ago, rragan said:

It doesn't say they won't apply them as received --Just that the end of September is the deadline for submittal.

 

After I submitted a list, I received a response saying they would all be done in one batch at the end of September or early October.

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20 hours ago, Vooruit! said:

Also, now that challenges have their own attribute, are there any plans for dropping the mandatory 'challenge' in challenge cache titles as well?

PLEASE, NO!!! I MUST be able to avoid all Challenges, those new ones with the attribute, and the old ones without it.

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5 hours ago, Pinkpiggy7 said:

Ok,  so although they will update the Power trail attribute, it wont be done till the end of September,  would have thought they would want it updated quicker.  a batch at a time would seem more logical.  Oh well looks like manual updates.

Did you think on Selenium for that task? 

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6 hours ago, rragan said:

It doesn't say they won't apply them as received --Just that the end of September is the deadline for submittal.

 

Thats their marketing spin,  this is what they tell you later

 

Hello Pinkpiggy7,

Thank you for forwarding your list of caches to Geocaching HQ.

We will gather all requests until the submission window closes on September 30 and then process them all at once. Please expect the attribute to be applied during the first week of October.

Thank you for your patience and your contribution to the game.

Cheers,

Geocaching HQ

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Not sure if it’s the new bonus cache attribute or solution checker attribute, but when I open these cache types in the app and go to look at the attribute list the app crashes.

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1 hour ago, Mister Doctor said:

Not sure if it’s the new bonus cache attribute or solution checker attribute, but when I open these cache types in the app and go to look at the attribute list the app crashes.

 

Thanks for reporting that. We'll take a look.

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21 hours ago, Mister Doctor said:

Not sure if it’s the new bonus cache attribute or solution checker attribute, but when I open these cache types in the app and go to look at the attribute list the app crashes.

I'm not seeing this - I can view the attribute list as usual: (Android 10, App v 8.30.1, Google Pixel)

 

Screenshot_20200903-112058.png

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On 8/31/2020 at 10:03 PM, Geocaching HQ said:

Challenge cache attribute

 v3QaaPRgH58yO-v15XP42KLR1WsUxG4_PR6A9-SQ


If you own a challenge cache, you can now add the challenge cache attribute to your cache. Geocaching HQ will also run a script to add the challenge cache attribute to all* published challenge caches within the next several days. The challenge cache attribute is available for Mystery Caches. It is only allowed on challenge caches that meet the current guidelines, as well as grandfathered challenge caches. Geocaching HQ may remove the attribute from cache listings where it has been incorrectly added.

 

I don't know if the script has already run, but I'm guessing it hasn't, since right now, of all challenges I have found, only 30% has got the attribute.

 

As no script can identify all challenges, I'm just wondering if you are aware of Project GC's community efforts in identifying challenges.

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On 8/31/2020 at 4:29 PM, barefootguru said:

A what cache?

Cache high up that typically requires telescoping pole or similar to retrieve.

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On 8/31/2020 at 6:20 PM, predator1337 said:

an attribute for biltema caches would be nice

On 8/31/2020 at 6:29 PM, barefootguru said:

A what cache?

1 hour ago, ecanderson said:

Cache high up that typically requires telescoping pole or similar to retrieve.

 

Thanks for that.   :)    Took a while, but found it online too.

I agree with HHL, that "special tool required" will work with "biltema" caches,  and "climbing gear required" for actual tree climbs.

 

It'd be nice if COs would use either, as lugging a pack fulla every option of JIC "climbing gear" a bit heavy for longer walks, to find all that was needed was a hook taped to my hiking stick...

The same with cache hides meant to be climbed, finding the container on the ground because "someone"  realized they can't climb, so plucked the container from its attachment. 

No way to put it back,  the experience for future finders shot until the CO can fix it.  There's one similar I plan on NM soon.

Making access more clear to both cachers of course depends on them noticing the attribute.   ;)

 

 

 

Edited by cerberus1

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On 9/1/2020 at 11:32 AM, rragan said:

For those who need to generate a list of GC codes in your power trail to get HQ to populate the attribute for you, here is an html/js script that will take a GPX file and put the list you need in a text box where you can copy it and send it for processing. Now if the forums don't mangle things too badly, here it is. Save it to a .html file and open the file in a browser. 
 

<html><head>
<title>Make list of GC codes from GPX</title>
<meta charset="utf-8">

<script>
// Check for the various File API support.
if (window.File && window.FileReader && window.FileList && window.Blob) {
    // Great success! All the File APIs are supported.

etc etc

 

 

script.html:49 Uncaught TypeError: Failed to execute 'readAsText' on 'FileReader': parameter 1 is not of type 'Blob'.
    at HTMLInputElement.handleFileSelect (script.html:49)

 

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12 hours ago, cerberus1 said:

 

Thanks for that.   :)    Took a while, but found it online too.

I agree with HHL, that "special tool required" will work with "biltema" caches,  and "climbing gear required" for actual tree climbs.

 

It'd be nice if COs would use either, as lugging a pack fulla every option of JIC "climbing gear" a bit heavy for longer walks, to find all that was needed was a hook taped to my hiking stick...

The same with cache hides meant to be climbed, finding the container on the ground because "someone"  realized they can't climb, so plucked the container from its attachment. 

No way to put it back,  the experience for future finders shot until the CO can fix it.  There's one similar I plan on NM soon.

Making access more clear to both cachers of course depends on them noticing the attribute.   ;)

 

 

 

The biltema caches are the biggest bulls*** that has ever been created/invented, because they are handled differently in Germany/Europe according D- and T-values:

-in some parts they are T5, because you need a fishing rod to get them (they are hanging up to 10-12m in a tree)

-in other parts they are D5 for whatever reason, I do not know
 (I think it's not that DIFFICULT to get them down with a fishing rod that is long enough)

 

The results of these biltema caches are:

-you can forget the 81 matrix, because D5- and also T5 caches can now be earned with biltema caches, you don't need to solve a hard mystery anymore for a D5 and you also you do not need to climb up a tree - just a biltema cache is enough, it's done in minutes.

-you can not be sure to have a climbing or boat cache, if it is a T5, it could also be a biltema cache

-you can not be sure to have a hard mystery or multi cache to solve, it could also be a biltema cache

-special tool required does not tell you, if you need a fishing rod, a lock picking set or something else

 

Since we have biltema caches, it's the owner's descision to make it a D5 or T5, the information of these values are worth NOTHING, they do not tell you, which cache type or difficulty you can expect and even not how hard to get your caches have been that you visited. Now everybody has the best statistic values, but they are only pimped !!!

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Now that the rest of the world knows what a biltema cache is, further discussion of this hiding style should take place in a separate thread.  Biltema caches do not appear to be related to these Release Notes.  Thanks in advance for getting back on topic.

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Everything I've read here leads me to believe that the Challenge attribute is able to be added by the owner when editing the cache page, but on the 4 challenges I own that have not (yet) had the attribute added automatically, I don't see it in the list of attributes that I can select. Is there a secret to having the new attribute available for selection?

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3 minutes ago, Ringrat said:

Everything I've read here leads me to believe that the Challenge attribute is able to be added by the owner when editing the cache page, but on the 4 challenges I own that have not (yet) had the attribute added automatically, I don't see it in the list of attributes that I can select. Is there a secret to having the new attribute available for selection?

 

We have not run the script yet for the attribute for challenge caches. We expect to do that early next week.

 

What you have discovered is a BUG. The new attributes are not showing visible on the cache Edit Page (although they were there for most of last week). We have notified the engineers and hope for a fix soon, so that you can apply the attribute yourself. Thanks for your patience.

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1 hour ago, Frau Potter said:

 

We have not run the script yet for the attribute for challenge caches. We expect to do that early next week.

 

What you have discovered is a BUG. The new attributes are not showing visible on the cache Edit Page (although they were there for most of last week). We have notified the engineers and hope for a fix soon, so that you can apply the attribute yourself. Thanks for your patience.

 

Thank you, I will be patient. I have another challenge cache that has had the attribute applied, so the script for that must have been running at some point!

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8 minutes ago, Ringrat said:

 

Thank you, I will be patient. I have another challenge cache that has had the attribute applied, so the script for that must have been running at some point!

 

I'm happy to report that the new attributes are now visible again on the Edit Page. So you can add the attribute yourself!

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Love the new attributes!

 

HQ, can you give guidance on when the solution checker attribute will be updated on existing mystery caches that use the hq solution checker?

I have a challenge based on those attributes "in the can" and just need the caches to get their attribute.

 

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On 9/1/2020 at 6:00 AM, brendan714 said:

I think the attributes are great, but I really wish challenge caches would get their own icon. I just foresee some COs adding on the challenge cache attribute on a non-challenge cache either on purpose or by mistake and muddying up the purpose of the attribute. The same already happens fairly often for one reason or another with the SCUBA, climbing gear and tree

climbing attributes, just to name a few. 

 

There's already one cache in my city that's incorrectly identified as a challenge cache:

https://www.geocaching.com/geocache/GC8V1V2

Now it will forever show up when I filter by challenge cache attribute. 

 

A challenge cache icon wouldn't have these problems as the reviewer would have to approve it. 

 

On 8/31/2020 at 10:03 PM, Geocaching HQ said:

Within the next few days

 

:anibad:

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I see very few of the caches with the Solution Checker as having had the Solution Checker Attribute added.   Did something happen to HQ's plan to automatically add the attribute?

Edited by DrPflug
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I've seen three new challenge caches published in the last few days that don't have the Challenge Cache attribute (GC8ZZNE , GC8ZP5F and GC8ZP5J). Wasn't this supposed to be mandatory on new challenges?

 

Edit to add: Globally, there are 110 mystery caches with "challenge" in the title and a placed date after the 1st of September but only 88 of those have the Challenge Cache attribute. Are the reviewers not enforcing this?

Edited by barefootjeff
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Does Groundspeak actually read this topics? So many unanswered questions. You guys need to step it up bigtime!

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17 hours ago, barefootjeff said:

I've seen three new challenge caches published in the last few days that don't have the Challenge Cache attribute (GC8ZZNE , GC8ZP5F and GC8ZP5J). Wasn't this supposed to be mandatory on new challenges?

 

Edit to add: Globally, there are 110 mystery caches with "challenge" in the title and a placed date after the 1st of September but only 88 of those have the Challenge Cache attribute. Are the reviewers not enforcing this?

 

The Challenge Cache attribute is required for all Challenge Caches, and this requirement is part of the review process.  Conversely, when reviewing new caches that are not Challenge Caches, Reviewers will ask the cache owner to remove the Challenge Cache attribute if it's been mis-applied.

 

There's nothing to prevent a Cache Owner, post-publication, from removing an attribute when it's required, or from adding an attribute that isn't permitted.  As I've posted earlier, these situations may be brought to the local Reviewer's attention, and the Reviewer can correct the cache page.

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3 hours ago, Vooruit! said:

Does Groundspeak actually read this topics? So many unanswered questions. You guys need to step it up bigtime!

 

23 posts from Lackeys and Community Volunteer Reviewers in this thread suggest that yes, this topic is actually being read.  Perhaps you missed all those posts amongst the biltema cache discussion.

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5 hours ago, Keystone said:

 

The Challenge Cache attribute is required for all Challenge Caches, and this requirement is part of the review process.  Conversely, when reviewing new caches that are not Challenge Caches, Reviewers will ask the cache owner to remove the Challenge Cache attribute if it's been mis-applied.

 

There's nothing to prevent a Cache Owner, post-publication, from removing an attribute when it's required, or from adding an attribute that isn't permitted.  As I've posted earlier, these situations may be brought to the local Reviewer's attention, and the Reviewer can correct the cache page.

 

I find it a bit hard to believe that the COs of one in five new challenge caches are removing the Challenge Cache attribute the moment the cache is published, which is what the numbers indicate, and those 22 caches my search found are spread all over the globe, not just in one area or by one CO. But if that is now a widespread practice, it kind of defeats the whole purpose of the attribute.

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I still see many caches with the GC.com solution checker still NOT having the attribute.   Has something happened to cause a slow down on HQ's adding the attribute automatically?

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On 8/31/2020 at 4:03 PM, Geocaching HQ said:

Within the next few days, Geocaching HQ will run a script to add the Geocaching.com solution checker attribute to all published caches that have the solution checker selected.

 

Maybe they started it and it's just running really slow not to place locks on their DB?

 

Not real: 

insert into tbl_cache_attributes (cache_id, checker_attribute_id)

select cache_id from tbl_cache_detail where hq_checker=true;

My initial reaction, and possibly posted when announced, was the data should have been updated prior to enabling the front-end to customers.  HQ should consider this approach for future updates of this type.

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Sorry for the delay in running the script to apply the solution checker attribute to existing caches. (I, too, am looking forward to being able to search for those caches :D ).

 

I will post an update once we've run the script!

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On 9/21/2020 at 7:45 PM, nykkole said:

Sorry for the delay in running the script to apply the solution checker attribute to existing caches. (I, too, am looking forward to being able to search for those caches :D ).

 

I will post an update once we've run the script!

Great!

 

I've had my challenge cache and checker ready for weeks!  https://project-gc.com/Challenges/GC8ZC6B/54290
 

 

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It's been a week now, and I still don't see that the script to add the Solution Checker attribute to caches has run.  Is it polite to ask When?  Or has a technical issue arisen?

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Current worldwide search for Mysteries with "challenge" in the title produces ~29706 results. Worldwide search for any cache type with challenge attribute produces ~29269 results.

The counts are pretty close.

 

On 9/26/2020 at 6:28 PM, TravelingGeek said:
On 9/21/2020 at 8:45 PM, nykkole said:

Sorry for the delay in running the script to apply the solution checker attribute to existing caches. (I, too, am looking forward to being able to search for those caches :D ).

 

I will post an update once we've run the script!

Great!

 

I've had my challenge cache and checker ready for weeks!  https://project-gc.com/Challenges/GC8ZC6B/54290

 

I think there may be a cross communication here. May need to try to keep topics distinct - script to add the solution checker attribute on cache, and the script to add the challenge cache attribute to existing challenges.  The former we can't control and should be automated, the latter was a one-time script to sync up existing challenge caches.

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29 minutes ago, thebruce0 said:

Current worldwide search for Mysteries with "challenge" in the title produces ~29706 results. Worldwide search for any cache type with challenge attribute produces ~29269 results.

The counts are pretty close.

 

The difference, at least in part, seems to be new challenge caches published after the introduction of the new attribute. Here in New South Wales (Australia), there have been four new challenges this month but only one has the attribute in spite of it being mandatory.

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8 hours ago, thebruce0 said:

Current worldwide search for Mysteries with "challenge" in the title produces ~29706 results. Worldwide search for any cache type with challenge attribute produces ~29269 results.

The counts are pretty close.

 

 

I think there may be a cross communication here. May need to try to keep topics distinct - script to add the solution checker attribute on cache, and the script to add the challenge cache attribute to existing challenges.  The former we can't control and should be automated, the latter was a one-time script to sync up existing challenge caches.

 

You misinterpreted my link.  It is a link to a challenge checker (for an unpublished challenge) that will check if you have found 100 caches with the Geocaching HQ Solution Checker attribute.   My comment was not about the challenge cache attribute.

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12 hours ago, TravelingGeek said:

It is a link to a challenge checker (for an unpublished challenge) that will check if you have found 100 caches with the Geocaching HQ Solution Checker attribute.   My comment was not about the challenge cache attribute.

 

Ah, I see now. Topical crossover. =P

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Hello,

We have run the script to apply the Geocaching.com solution checker attribute to those Mystery Caches that have the solution checker selected. For all new Mystery Caches that use the Geocahcing.com solution checker, the attribute is automatically applied.

(Note that due to database indexing, the search results will not show all caches that got the attribute from the script for another ~2-3 days.)

 

As for the challenge cache attribute, most (close to all) caches that were published at the time the challenge cache attribute went live received the new attribute on September 9.

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