I'm Mad....

[+Spoo]

This is not a new topic. It has been here before but I have to speak up again.

 

I have four caches. All of a sudden, I start getting complaints.....and rightfully so. Two of the four are wet and two of the four have been moved.

 

My containers are VERY weather tight and inside, everything is in zip-lock bags. I find the bags unzipped and the containers un-sealed. WHY can't people take the extra minute to reseal things properly. I have come across other owned caches with the same problem.

 

SHAME on the folks that are out for the BIG count....5 or 10 or 20 caches in a day! Take two more minutes and reseal things.

 

As for moving caches, I suspect people think their co-ordinates are more accurate, therefore the cache should go HERE. Those people that do that make it hard for owners to perform maintenance. And after all, it probably no longer fits the clue description.

 

Now...guess what people? You can review the logs and SEE almost to the day who and when things went bad. WE owners know who you are !

 

OK....I'll get off my soap-box now. After all, people who are guilty of these offenses do not usually even read these forums.

[+Yamahammer]

Feel betta now?

 

[+Kit Fox]

SHAME on the folks that are out for the BIG count....5 or 10 or 20 caches in a day! Take two more minutes and reseal things.

 

I found 24 caches yesterday, and I replaced each one as I found it. You assume that all "big count" cachers are in a hurry, and don't replace caches as they found them.

[+sbell111]

Shame on you people! A pox on your house!

Edited August 1, 2005 by sbell111

[+The Leprechauns]

I am sorry about your caches falling into disrepair due to finders not caring for them properly. With about 25 active caches, it seems like I'm always attending to one problem or another. Yesterday I learned that my microcache magneted to a bicycle path bridge is now a Terrain 5 SCUBA cache at the bottom of the river, after the last finder dropped it.

 

But I do think you're painting with too broad a brush. Not *all* high-number finders are careless with caches. If you inspect a cache after Mr. 2500 finds blazed through, what's to say that the condition isn't the cumulative effect of the 20 prior finders? In my experience, newbies cause more harm to caches than veterans. I don't mind that a bit, though, if my caches brought them enjoyment and helped them get hooked on the sport. It is just part of owning a cache.

[+deimos444]

If you mean mad as insane I think you have lots of company.

Even myself and I or we or whatever the voices say.

[+BlueDeuce]

SHAME on the folks that are out for the BIG count....5 or 10 or 20 caches in a day!

Whew! That leaves me out. I guess I reseal everything juuussst right.

 

Actually I think it's the mosquito count that affects the replacement effort.

Edited August 1, 2005 by BlueDeuce

[+Kit Fox]

I'm curious as to how you know that it was the "big count" cachers that left your caches improperly closed. I read the logs for all of your caches, and I didn't see any logs like, "this was cache 25 of 50 today."

[+Spoo]

All of you responding above are correct. I am just mad. (upset...well, ok....maybe insane too)

 

And I apologize to all that I have offended with my blanket statements. Although I again reiterate that probably anyone reading this is probably not the kind of culprit I am complaining about.

 

I do, however, stand by my statement that you can narrow the cuplrit(s) down to one or two by looking at the logs.

[+VegasCacheHounds]

Man, I didn't realize that I was damaging the integrety of all those caches that I found a couple of weekends ago. I mean, I must have found 14 in one day, imagine all the harm I musta done!

 

For the record, I put them all back in the same place I found them, and all were replacing in as good or better condition than they were when I found them. I was tempted to slightly move one cache, as it was in the thick of some PI (other logs complained about it, otherwise I may not have reconized it, I still have trouble with that) but decided I was able to get to it, so will others. So

 

I just wish that all hider would keep up with the maintenace like it sounds like you do. There are a few cachers in my area that have a ton of caches out there, but a lot of them have logs mentioning damage, wet logs, missing lids, etc but the owners do nothing. Its like they placed them and forgot them, just another number. Kinda sad.

 

Do you really need 100+ caches if you can't maintain them? Not to say all are like that. I know its usually the other way, those with a high hide rate are usually dedicated to they're caches. I'm just refering to the few that don't maintain.

 

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack your rant with one of my own...back to our regularly scheduled angst....

Edited August 1, 2005 by VegasCacheHounds

[+Renegade Knight]

Sometimes it's the destiny of a cache to be wet. That's my conclustion after having dozens of dry ones, and one that just stays wet even though it's not exposed to the rain.

[+Joypa]

All of you responding above are correct. I am just mad. (upset...well, ok....maybe insane too)

 

And I apologize to all that I have offended with my blanket statements. Although I again reiterate that probably anyone reading this is probably not the kind of culprit I am complaining about.

 

I do, however, stand by my statement that you can narrow the cuplrit(s) down to one or two by looking at the logs.

You are forgetting the segment of the community that does not log.

[+AtoZ]

I am sorry about your caches falling into disrepair due to finders not caring for them properly. With about 25 active caches, it seems like I'm always attending to one problem or another. Yesterday I learned that my microcache magneted to a bicycle path bridge is now a Terrain 5 SCUBA cache at the bottom of the river, after the last finder dropped it.

 

But I do think you're painting with too broad a brush. Not *all* high-number finders are careless with caches. If you inspect a cache after Mr. 2500 finds blazed through, what's to say that the condition isn't the cumulative effect of the 20 prior finders? In my experience, newbies cause more harm to caches than veterans. I don't mind that a bit, though, if my caches brought them enjoyment and helped them get hooked on the sport. It is just part of owning a cache.

Well put and probable true. They guy I cache with has close to 4000 cache snd usually leaves them in better then when we find it.

cheers

[Yankees Win!]

Sometimes it's the destiny of a cache to be wet. That's my conclustion after having dozens of dry ones, and one that just stays wet even though it's not exposed to the rain.

I think I can guess what people have been doing to your cache.

[+sbell111]

...

I do, however, stand by my statement that you can narrow the cuplrit(s) down to one or two by looking at the logs.

You are forgetting the segment of the community that does not log.

and those dasterdly cachers (like me) who forget to log some caches for months (years, sometimes).

[motrekker]

I usually carry around extra bags so that I can replace any torn or old ones I find and I know of many cachers in my area who do similar things because they have reported placing new logs or bags for the owner. Heck, I had a cacher replace the log in one of my caches because I hadn't responded to a few previous logs saying it was getting wet. I know, my bad, should took better care of it, but I was gone for a while, unexpectedly.

 

What I've found that helps solve the problematic "wet cache", is purchasing weatherproof paper. The stuff I bought can be printed and written on. I held it underneath the faucet at home and didnt have a problem, its made from plastic I think.

 

If it really angers you, design the cache in such a way that it requires as little repackaging work from the cacher as possible.

[+Team Perks]

SHAME on the folks that are out for the BIG count....5 or 10 or 20 caches in a day! Take two more minutes and reseal things.

SHAME on you for making a rash judgment about how I re-hide the caches I find. Every high-finder I know of does just as good as the next guy at making sure the cache is sealed.

 

As for moving caches, I suspect people think their co-ordinates are more accurate, therefore the cache should go HERE. Those people that do that make it hard for owners to perform maintenance. And after all, it probably no longer fits the clue description.

Not always. I've seen quite a bit of what I call "cache creep"--depending on how they're hidden, it's not hard to imagine that they'd move a little each time. While it might be obvious to you where the cache should go, it might not be so evident to the finder when they grab the cache and have to move 50 feet away to open the container away from spying eyes. Wait...now which bush was the cache hidden under? I'm almost positive it's this one. Maybe I got it exactly where it belongs, or maybe I'm off by a foot or two. And maybe the next guy has to do the same thing. After a dozen finders, it's now no longer where it started.

[+caderoux]

We have a lot of moisture problems here in New Orleans. It's a pretty cache dense area and getting denser. Ammo cans are pretty good, but everything else is prone to problems. Even ammo cans can get a ziploc caught in the gasket, and then you're f****d, 'cos once the moisture gets in it seems to stay there.

 

And then in the heat, you get moisture vapor INSIDE the ziplocs in waterproof containers. We've got people here (Bamboozle) putting an extra log in a film can inside the cache to keep it dry. But then there are two logs, a notebook and a film can - that seems kind of silly, 'cos some people will sign one and not the other. And then you might upset the purists who claim "if you don't sign the log, you didn't find it" if there are two logs.

 

RULE #1 - DO NOT CACHE IN THE RAIN

 

RULE #2 - DO NOT CACHE IN THE RAIN

 

No matter how hard you try, a drop of water will get in the cache, and then it's all over.

 

After that, there are other "guidelines" I try to follow (if I have the materials with me - and that's another topic completely - I try to travel a little too lightly):

 

If the outside of the cache is wet, dry it off as best you can before opening the cache, because moisture on the outside is going to get to the inside, no matter how hard you try.

 

If the cache is dirty and you rinse the cache from your camelbak, you need to dry it off, too. If dirt gets in the seal, water will get in later.

 

If the log is damp or the ziploc is damp inside, dry it or replace it

 

No ziploc is sometimes better than a ziploc which holds the water in

 

A pencil will probably pierce a ziploc before you've even zipped the bag shut

 

Little logs in baggies (rolled or folded) are doomed, and they always will be - until someone comes up with something better, I just handle them as best I can

[+Kai Team]

....If it really angers you, design the cache in such a way that it requires as little repackaging work from the cacher as possible.

Good point.

 

You also might want to print out and distribute some copies of the Geocachers' Creed Brochure (print landscape, double sided on 8.5 x 11 paper), or order some of the Geocachers' Creed buttons and leave them in caches. The issues you raised are addressed. It might not help, but it can't hurt to try to educate fellow cachers who may not be aware of the mistakes they're making!

[+robert]

I understand your pain, and sorry your caches got messed up. We often go for big numbers when possible (yet not disappointed at all if we don't get them) and always take the time to repack the cache well, add plastic bags, pencils, notebooks, etc. I know you said it in a bit of frustration but just trying to prove not all "big numbers" people leave things astray.

 

Then again it's been a while since I've had any big number days, maybe I gotta stop packing the caches back up, it's taking too much time!

 

Have a good evening!

[+sbell111]

You also might want to print out and distribute some copies of the Geocachers' Creed Brochure

I seriously doubt that the people that rush to the point of not closing up the cache corrently are going to take time out to read that incredibly long brochure. Edited August 1, 2005 by sbell111

[+Kai Team]

Home before the fire, worn out from a day of power caching, "Gee, maybe I'll take a look at that brochure I hurriedly grabbed from the cache before I dumped it half open in a different spot so I could find the next one".

 

Like I said, it may not help, but it can't hurt.

[+sbell111]

I guess I'll trash out this wet paper...

[+MountainMudbug]

And what about those cachers who put HUGE trade items in small caches?

Then the lid doesn't close all the way and water seeps in.... do you really have to trade giant items in those circumstances? Take one big thing *and* one small thing with you in your cache bag, for pete's sake. Or don't trade at all.

We did maintenance on a cache today with this problem, just plain frustrating. Removed the offending item. Sorry, but it compromises the quality of the cache and that just isn't worth it. Get with the program, people!

 

Also, somebody recently shoved a business card in my altoids mint strips cache that had NEVER had any problems whatsoever. The next finder found it open, wet, and trashed. Geez

 

</rant>

Edited August 2, 2005 by MountainMudbug

[+Spoo]

First off......everybody here has a valid and absolutely correct point. I do not mean to offend anyone here that has given valid points and I thank you all for your input. Here are my points:

 

1) I live in the middle of no where. My finds are in the middle of no where. Those of us around these parts hiding cahces are trying to show everyone else areas and things they have never seen and would not see if they weren't caching. Read my Cache intros......you will see what I mean. Anyone out to grab 5 or 10 or 20 caches is NOT looking at the sites we are trying to offer......certainly not when it takes a half a day to hike in and find them! You are only looking for the 'numbers'. If that is so.....then ok....so be it.

 

2) My Caches are VERY well concieved waterproof containers. Again, look at my cache intros to see what I mean.

 

3) I have had two cache logs mention mugglers, so maybe that is a point........but two are clearly not on the beaten path. There is NO excuse for not re-sealing baggies and containers.

 

4) It is easy to read the logs. If someone is not signing them, then you are NOT following the rules of the game and do not deserve to be claiming finds. People that say things like "Traded some loot" are not being honest about what was taken and what was left. Do not tell me you can not remember your 20 trades today.....carry pencil and paper and write it down at the time.

 

This game is for all. If you choose not to re-seal items, you only hurt the next cahcer that comes around.....and if THEY did not reseal properly, they are only hurting your game.

 

At any rate, I hope to meet each and every one of you on the trail! Excelsior !

[+sbell111]

You've kinda degraded into a general rant about power cachers. What was your issue, again?

[+SRD525]

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=104328

[+JohnnyVegas]

BIG count....5 or 10 or 20 caches in a day

Around here 5 or 10 in a day on not uncommon, It is not just geocachers with big numbers that are doing 5 or 10 a day, Around here (Sacramento and the San Francisco bay area) there are so many caches even a noob can get 20 a day.

 

I have also had problems with people placing my caches in locations that I did not place them in. On person said my coordinates were off so he placed my cache in a new spot. I went to check it and could not find it He was a noob, the noobs just think a GPSr is going to get then within an inch of a cache

[+Team Cotati]

Man, I didn't realize that I was damaging the integrety of all those caches that I found a couple of weekends ago. I mean, I must have found 14 in one day, imagine all the harm I musta done!

 

For the record, I put them all back in the same place I found them, and all were replacing in as good or better condition than they were when I found them. I was tempted to slightly move one cache, as it was in the thick of some PI (other logs complained about it, otherwise I may not have reconized it, I still have trouble with that) but decided I was able to get to it, so will others. So

 

I just wish that all hider would keep up with the maintenace like it sounds like you do. There are a few cachers in my area that have a ton of caches out there, but a lot of them have logs mentioning damage, wet logs, missing lids, etc but the owners do nothing. Its like they placed them and forgot them, just another number. Kinda sad.

 

Do you really need 100+ caches if you can't maintain them? Not to say all are like that. I know its usually the other way, those with a high hide rate are usually dedicated to they're caches. I'm just refering to the few that don't maintain.

 

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack your rant with one of my own...back to our regularly scheduled angst....

Believe you me, if it was only the cachers with over 100 hides that weren't maintaining their caches, there would be NO problem.

[+budd-rdc]

All of you responding above are correct. I am just mad. (upset...well, ok....maybe insane too)

 

And I apologize to all that I have offended with my blanket statements. Although I again reiterate that probably anyone reading this is probably not the kind of culprit I am complaining about.

 

I do, however, stand by my statement that you can narrow the cuplrit(s) down to one or two by looking at the logs.

I use the term "dislocated" for caches that get moved by finders. The term is borrowed from this puzzle cache:

GCHYNN "DISLOCATER"

 

You'll just have to tolerate the general sloppiness - it's human nature. However, it's harder to tolerate people who try to "hide it better" since that's a premeditated act - why can't they just respect the way it was hidden to retain the difficulty/terrain ratings and the hints?

 

I hope people aren't dislocating caches based on "better coordinates" because GPSr's have position errors. It's better to rehide it at the same place, but post the alternate coordinates instead.

 

Accusing the high find count "numbers" people for sloppiness or dislocation is inaccurate based on my experience. In fact, most put their experience to good use by relocating dislocated caches based on difficulty/terrain/hints and mention the action on the logs.

[+phoenix-rose]

I'm relatively new, but I do try to replace the caches where I found them and make sure that they stay dry. I've even been known to replace caches that have been muggled on occasion. (I think that in the next couple weeks I'll start carrying around an extra "cache" in my car to resolve this faster in the future!)

 

I will say I hear your pain about improperly sealed/maintained caches - but I live in a desert so more to our issue is a) dirt, rattlesnakes and bugs in the "rock" hidden caches, and c) heat taking its toll.

 

If you'll allow me - re the cache re-hiders/movers - We have 2 cache owners in my area (they know whom they are) who aren't careful about the co-ords - and it drives all of us newbeez crazy. They're off by sometimes 50 to 500 (in one particular case) feet - and they know it. However, they don't bother to go back and re-check the co-ords before submitting to the site. For newbeez, it's discouraging because we have to go back and recheck all the logs where we find maybe 3 pages before someone has put in the new (more correct) co-ords and then go back and find it a second or third time. After a while, you just learn NOT to do those individual owners caches, or to try and post better co-ords/average the ones posted in the logs.

 

Just to make note, sometimes it may not be the "cacher" moving the container (not saying it never happens...), but instead, the gps being off due to time of day or the number of satellites active on your GPS. I've learned with alot of reading that you have to take the co-ords at 3 different times of day and average them, but I can't convince others how important this is to making sure the numbers are as accurate as possible. If you're doing this, and the finders are replacing them properly there should be no problem. If not, then it's possible that this could be why you're finding them "moved".

[twjolson & Kay]

As someone that is just now getting into the hiding aspect of things, I get frustrated at the way my caches have been treated. I hid one of mine in a wood den, covered in bark with the cache in a camo burlap bag. Almost without fail I find it out in the open, uncovered. The back is starting to get a couple holes and the string to close the bag is long gone (not even in the area, it's like someone took it). It's not like this happened one either, every cache maintence is like this. One of my caches, it wasn't even hidden near where they found it. How does that work? "I found it over here, but what the heck, lets just up and put it wherever!". People sometimes.

[Azaruk]

Reading through this thread it strikes me that your caching community must be huge and anonymous.

Here in South Africa we are a very small community and simply don't have the problems you are talking about in this thread, Perhaps it is because we all know each other, or at least know of each other.

Or maybe it is because there are so few caches here that we simply value each and every one.

I make camoflage bags to hide our caches in, tied at the top with a cord. Each and everytime the cache is placed back in the bag and tied up again.

All I know is that our lot seem to be an awful lot more considerate than the cachers you are dealing with.

Pity that, when once upon a time I envied the states for having soooooooo many caches to choose from.

 

Still, all you can do...in my humble opinion ..is to play to the highest common denominator....not the lowest.

[+wimseyguy]

I'm glad the OP has reposted and lowered the soapbox a little bit. I wonder if it was raining in Maine on 7/2? Waterproof containers will not only keep water out, they won't let any water inside the container get out.

 

I think your rant against high numbers cachers is entirely misplaced. Cachers who put a lot of time and energy into the game are more likely to care , are more likely to travel with replacement baggies and log sheets, and more likely to replace the cache exactly where they found it. Someone who is just dabbling or even beginning may not understand these concepts yet.

It doesn't matter if you are in dense cachecity, or the middle of nowhere.

[+VegasCacheHounds]

Man, I didn't realize that I was damaging the integrety of all those caches that I found a couple of weekends ago.  I mean, I must have found 14 in one day, imagine all the harm I musta done!   

 

For the record, I put them all back in the same place I found them, and all were replacing in as good or better condition than they were when I found them.  I was tempted to slightly move one cache, as it was in the thick of some PI (other logs complained about it, otherwise I may not have reconized it, I still have trouble with that) but decided I was able to get to it, so will others.  So 

 

I just wish that all hider would keep up with the maintenace like it sounds like you do.  There are a few cachers in my area that have a ton of caches out there, but a lot of them have logs mentioning damage, wet logs, missing lids, etc but the owners do nothing.  Its like they placed them and forgot them, just another number.  Kinda sad.

 

Do you really need 100+ caches if you can't maintain them?  Not to say all are like that.  I know its usually the other way, those with a high hide rate are usually dedicated to they're caches.  I'm just refering to the few that don't maintain.

 

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack your rant with one of my own...back to our regularly scheduled angst....

Believe you me, if it was only the cachers with over 100 hides that weren't maintaining their caches, there would be NO problem.

Oh, I know that there is a ton of folks with only a cache or two that have abandoned them, my rant is about those that continue to place caches, even though it is obvious that they don't intend to maintain the ones that are already out there.

[+Gecko1]

SHAME on the folks that are out for the BIG count....5 or 10 or 20 caches in a day! Take two more minutes and reseal things.

They should also re-hide them properly.

[+Sagefox]

RULE #1 - DO NOT CACHE IN THE RAIN

 

RULE #2 - DO NOT CACHE IN THE RAIN

You must not be from Oregon, Washington or Northern California. We aren't always successful in scheduling the rain to not fall when our caching day comes up.

 

Full-on rain caching can make for a challenging and memorable day. Drizzle and Mizzle caching is pretty much standard. Misty days and soppy brush are very common. These conditions must be similar to east of the Rockies where the summer thunder storms come up every few days.

 

I've placed a lot of container caches in the wet country and you just have to get used to making extra maintenance trips. I can't begin to count how many of other people's caches I have dried out. It's all part of the game.

[+tirediron]

RULE #1 - DO NOT CACHE IN THE RAIN

 

RULE #2 - DO NOT CACHE IN THE RAIN

You must not be from Oregon, Washington or Northern California. We aren't always successful in scheduling the rain to not fall when our caching day comes up.

 

Full-on rain caching can make for a challenging and memorable day. Drizzle and Mizzle caching is pretty much standard. Misty days and soppy brush are very common. These conditions must be similar to east of the Rockies where the summer thunder storms come up every few days.

 

I've placed a lot of container caches in the wet country and you just have to get used to making extra maintenance trips. I can't begin to count how many of other people's caches I have dried out. It's all part of the game.

Or the wet coast of Canada.. Living on Vancouver Island, if I couldn't 'cache in the rain, ummm... when would I 'cache???

[+sept1c_tank]

I'm mad as h-e-double hockey sticks,

And I'm not going to take it any more.

[+ShowStop]

I'll throw in my $0.02 that as a seasoned cacher with 2500+ finds, I'm a little more prepared then the average n00bie. I almost always have extra baggies and log sheets with me and can assist in cache maintenance when I see fit. Also, I still have yet to use stickers to log a find. Every cache I've found has my name written in pen.

 

Even when I was a n00bie with only 40 finds, I still helped with cache maintenance:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/log.aspx?LU...2c-57cf8c7e838c

[+sbell111]

Was this rant about stickers, also? I must have missed that.

 

I have used stickers on occasion. What is the difference if I write 'Thanks for the fun. SBELL111' by hand v. using a sticker?

[+deimos444]

Who is this SBELL person?

[+tozainamboku]

Was this rant about stickers, also? I must have missed that.

 

I have used stickers on occasion. What is the difference if I write 'Thanks for the fun. SBELL111' by hand v. using a sticker?

I've gone caching with ShowStop where, after the rest of us have put our stickers in the the log, we have to wait for him to sign his name with a pen. Then we have to wait while he makes sure the lid is on securely and he puts the cache back exactly the way we found it

[+Marky]

Was this rant about stickers, also?  I must have missed that.

 

I have used stickers on occasion.  What is the difference if I write 'Thanks for the fun.  SBELL111' by hand v. using a sticker?

I've gone caching with ShowStop where, after the rest of us have put our stickers in the the log, we have to wait for him to sign his name with a pen. Then we have to wait while he makes sure the lid is on securely and he puts the cache back exactly the way we found it

So that's why they call him ShowStop, he stops the show for everyone in the group.

 

P.S. I'm not a power cacher.

 

P.P.S. Really, I'm not.

 

P.P.P.S. Why is it that when I tell people that I have a lot of battery powered toys, they look at me funny...

[+Troul Hawk]

First of all NOOB here.

 

I have even recently adopted three caches that I had found as some of my first, and am very interested in doing a good job of maintaining them.

 

Some of the log books that I have signed do indeed get wet and here in East Tennessee humidity is just a way of life. I am guilty of logging in the rain, but it was a swift thunderboomer and caught me with the ammo box open.

 

Here is my question. Has anyone ever used "Write in the rain paper" books to keep the water troubles down?

 

Write in the rain paper

 

Just wondering if this little investment could help curb the water logged, er, log book

[+Team Perks]

Every cache I've found has my name written in pen.

Any chance to brag about your legible penmanship, eh Tyler?

 

Why can't you just leave those of us with doctor's handwriting alone!?

 

[nobby.nobbs]

here in uk. so again no caching in raid would mean maybe three finds ayear!

 

damage to outside of caontainers/ bags and caches alwasys out in open. lets not forget the actions of animals who'll chew and drag stuff. not always the result of careless cachers.

[+The Jester]

First of all NOOB here.

 

I have even recently adopted three caches that I had found as some of my first, and am very interested in doing a good job of maintaining them.

 

Some of the log books that I have signed do indeed get wet and here in East Tennessee humidity is just a way of life. I am guilty of logging in the rain, but it was a swift thunderboomer and caught me with the ammo box open.

 

Here is my question. Has anyone ever used "Write in the rain paper" books to keep the water troubles down?

 

Write in the rain paper

 

Just wondering if this little investment could help curb the water logged, er, log book

If you go to the Groundspeak store/site you'll find a waterproof logbook - made by rite-in-the-rain. I've used some of rite-in-the-rain mini-books as replacement logbooks (about $20 dollars for 12, I carry several with me) or in small caches. I've also cut strips from their full size pads to put in micro and such.

 

Adventure Paper (from National Geographic, for inkjet printers) also works, but is a bit more expensive. It is easier to find.

[4wheelin_fool]

My thoughts :Are you using tupperware containers? They are very waterproof, but not forever. After multiple uses the lids warp and dont close right. Try LOCK N LOCKS. Either they are closed, or they are open - no in between.

 

As to people moving caches, that usually doesnt happen. Sometimes they "migrate". Example: a magnetic key container is not replaced in the exact spot, and then the next person doesnt replace it exactly either. After several visits it seems to be trying to crawl away. Just keep an eye on it. If you are in a rural location maybe this happens the same way.

Edited August 3, 2005 by 4wheelin_fool

[+Sue Gremlin]

A cache that we found a couple of weeks ago got muggled right after our find. We absolutely left it in exactly the same shape and location as we found it. Sometimes, it just happens. I felt awful about it.