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jpamusher

caches on other planets?

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I was reviewing the geocache requirements prior to placing a new cache and came across this: "Geocaches are allowed in space, other planets and spacecraft." This is actually published in the official guidelines! I was just wondering why this is included as 1 the only way to place a geocache on say Mars would be via an unmanned probe and thus nobody could get there to find it 2 there are no gps satellites in orbit around Mars,so a gps wouldn`t work there anyway!

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1) for the fun of it

 

2) because there is a cache on the International Space Station....really ;-)

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That is really interesting,Isonzo Karst! I just wonder if a gps would work in orbit since the gps satellites pinpoint a location on the surface of the earth. I am going to try and look it up!

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quote name='jpamusher' timestamp='1298819853' post='4632192']I was just wondering why this is included as 1 the only way to place a geocache on say Mars would be via an unmanned probe and thus nobody could get there to find it 2 there are no gps satellites in orbit around Mars,so a gps wouldn`t work there anyway!

 

The only way to place a geocache on say Mars today would be via an unmanned probe and thus nobody could get there to find it without a lot of effort and money.

 

There are no gps satellites in orbit around Mars right now,so a gps wouldn`t work there yet.

 

Nothing quite like future-proofing the guidelines. :lol:

 

Seriously though, I think Post #2 pretty much hit it right on the money.

Edited by DanOCan

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That is really interesting,Isonzo Karst! I just wonder if a gps would work in orbit since the gps satellites pinpoint a location on the surface of the earth. I am going to try and look it up!

 

There's no reason it wouldn't. Each satellites signal is a sphere. Two spheres (satellites) intersect to create a circle. Add a third sphere to intersect with the circle and you have two points. One more and it is down to a single point in space.

 

Our GPS's give us a location (inaccurately) with just three satellites by making an assumption that we are on the planet. The other point is in space somewhere.

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That is really interesting,Isonzo Karst! I just wonder if a gps would work in orbit since the gps satellites pinpoint a location on the surface of the earth. I am going to try and look it up!

 

There's no reason it wouldn't. Each satellites signal is a sphere. Two spheres (satellites) intersect to create a circle. Add a third sphere to intersect with the circle and you have two points. One more and it is down to a single point in space.

 

Our GPS's give us a location (inaccurately) with just three satellites by making an assumption that we are on the planet. The other point is in space somewhere.

 

The satellites are too close to the earth in comparison to the distance of other planets. A typical commercial GPS receiver would show all of the satellites on top of each other. However, a modified military or scientific GPS unit with a "Kipkay" hack would be able to identify the specific planet once you were in space. After that, you would need to use the hint to locate it and a LOT of searching. Or you could find out the precise time that it was hidden and calculate the distance from the planet that the lightwaves have traveled, and see if there has been any images captured from the planet during the time frame that would show where it was being hidden, and then zoom in really close. If it was on Mars, the light would take about 4 minutes to arrive here, but on Uranus it would take about 2 and a half hours and from Neptune it would be over 4 hours.

There is also the possibility of having the first stage on this planet with instructions on how to get to the second stage.

 

ConstellationGPS.gif

Edited by 4wheelin_fool

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That is really interesting,Isonzo Karst! I just wonder if a gps would work in orbit since the gps satellites pinpoint a location on the surface of the earth. I am going to try and look it up!

 

There's no reason it wouldn't. Each satellites signal is a sphere. Two spheres (satellites) intersect to create a circle. Add a third sphere to intersect with the circle and you have two points. One more and it is down to a single point in space.

 

Our GPS's give us a location (inaccurately) with just three satellites by making an assumption that we are on the planet. The other point is in space somewhere.

 

But remember the other element to the GPS is that we have a grid on the planet saying where those points relate to on the earth.

The satellites will know where we are, but there is no GPS grid in space (correct me if I'm wrong) so we wouldn't be able to put a reference to where the satellite was telling us we were.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=611d0635-a1cf-41bc-a0cc-a6038ae288d5

 

There's a link to the space station cache. Please don't post notes on it. They've had a lot of trouble with people posting notes and cluttering up the pages. Also then everyone who has a watch on it writes in and complains because they're getting a ton of email, which in turn creates more mess.

They've had to lock it periodically because of this. Post comments on these forums if you've got them, not the cache pages in this case.

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I put a cache on the sun. Have fun retrieving it though.
I'd save that one for a night-cache run. Too hot during the day. Edited by Portland Cyclist
  • Funny 1

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That is really interesting,Isonzo Karst! I just wonder if a gps would work in orbit since the gps satellites pinpoint a location on the surface of the earth. I am going to try and look it up!

 

There's no reason it wouldn't. Each satellites signal is a sphere. Two spheres (satellites) intersect to create a circle. Add a third sphere to intersect with the circle and you have two points. One more and it is down to a single point in space.

 

Our GPS's give us a location (inaccurately) with just three satellites by making an assumption that we are on the planet. The other point is in space somewhere.

 

But remember the other element to the GPS is that we have a grid on the planet saying where those points relate to on the earth.

The satellites will know where we are, but there is no GPS grid in space (correct me if I'm wrong) so we wouldn't be able to put a reference to where the satellite was telling us we were.

I don't have personal experience with this - if anyone has $30 million to spare I'll be willing to check it out in person. But seeing that the ISS orbits at about 350 km above sea level, significantly below the GPS satellites (20,000 km), I believe that it is possible to get a reading with the right receiver.

 

Civilian GPS receivers are artificially limited to not work above a certain elevation and velocity, to prevent it from being used in weapons. Link : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Positioning_System#Restrictions_on_civilian_use

 

As for the grid, imagine the grid lines, projected out into space, with origin being the center of the Earth.

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The satellites will know where we are...
No, no they don't. Your receiver knows where it is in relation to the satellites, but only the Tinfoil Cap Club thinks the satellites know where you are.

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I put a cache on the sun. Have fun retrieving it though.
I'd save that one for a night-cache run. Too hot during the day.

 

So now that the final location is given away, I suppose that the firetacks on Mercury and Venus are unnecessary. :unsure:

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I hope the first geocache on Mars is not a lamp post hide.

Wrong. I, Personally, built the lamp post. I didn't want it to be dark for the FTF, after all! :P

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1) for the fun of it

 

2) because there is a cache on the International Space Station....really ;-)

and for a mere twenty million dollars you can log it[if you can find it]

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I hope the first geocache on Mars is not a lamp post hide.

No, it'll just be like all those lunar hides. Under a suspicious pile of rocks.

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Very interesting... GreyRedEyesFlashing.gif

 

I would cross post my Martian and Venusian caches but your Terran coordinate system is not compatible with the galactic standards that are used throughout this, and neighbouring, galaxies. See my profile for more details... AlienBorgAssimilationAnim.gif

 

GreySquint.gif

 

There is no dark side of the moon. It's all dark...

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Very interesting... GreyRedEyesFlashing.gif

 

I would cross post my Martian and Venusian caches but your Terran coordinate system is not compatible with the galactic standards that are used throughout this, and neighbouring, galaxies. See my profile for more details... AlienBorgAssimilationAnim.gif

 

GreySquint.gif

 

There is no dark side of the moon. It's all dark...

 

High-Four Gorak! Extraterrestrial caches rule!

 

Silly Hoomans.

Edited by daschpeeg

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I put a cache on the sun. Have fun retrieving it though.

 

Whaddaya use for a container? You think keeping water out of a cache is tough.... :)

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I hope the first geocache on Mars is not a lamp post hide.

No, it'll just be like all those lunar hides. Under a suspicious pile of rocks.

rocks? nah! nothing but cheese on the moon!

have fun finding that blinkie in one of those cheese holes.

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I put a cache on the sun. Have fun retrieving it though.

 

Whaddaya use for a container? You think keeping water out of a cache is tough.... :)

"couldn't sign log, it was wet" :anitongue:

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The satellites will know where we are...
No, no they don't. Your receiver knows where it is in relation to the satellites, but only the Tinfoil Cap Club thinks the satellites know where you are.

 

One of the most misunderstood aspects of GPS. I remember trying to convince my Dad that the receiver didn't "send a signal to the satellite" and that the satellites won't become overloaded because too many people are trying to use GPS at the same time!

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But the guidelines also say you must be able to place and retrieve the cache......as well as do maintenance to it....

 

I was reviewing the geocache requirements prior to placing a new cache and came across this: "Geocaches are allowed in space, other planets and spacecraft." This is actually published in the official guidelines! I was just wondering why this is included as 1 the only way to place a geocache on say Mars would be via an unmanned probe and thus nobody could get there to find it 2 there are no gps satellites in orbit around Mars,so a gps wouldn`t work there anyway!

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Its doesn't seem right that a Geocache should be allowed to be placed on spacecraft or other planets, because its a Geocache! geo means earth right??

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Knowing my luck, if I got to Mars and placed a cache there, I'd send it for submission and it'd come back it's within 0.1 miles of the final of a puzzle cache...

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Its doesn't seem right that a Geocache should be allowed to be placed on spacecraft or other planets, because its a Geocache! geo means earth right??

 

As a prefix: geo- is taken from the Greek word γη or γαια meaning "earth", usually in the sense of "ground or land".

 

Open to interpretation...

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Is their a cache on Mars? I know there is one on the ISS but what about the red planet?

 

Unless the Curiosity rover placed one recently and it just hasn't been published yet, then no, there is not a cache on Mars.

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I put a cache on the sun. Have fun retrieving it though.

 

FTF!!!!!! Log was burnt needs maintenance. TFTC!!!

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Its doesn't seem right that a Geocache should be allowed to be placed on spacecraft or other planets, because its a Geocache! geo means earth right??

 

You'd better hurry up and register lunacache.com!

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Is their a cache on Mars? I know there is one on the ISS but what about the red planet?

 

Unless the Curiosity rover placed one recently and it just hasn't been published yet, then no, there is not a cache on Mars.

 

I first suspected that the plastic beads found by Curiousity was a clever cache camo. But later I learned that Martian authorities do not permit physical caching on the planet because it would interfere with the black ops antigrav martian mining program.

 

I heard that Aura Raines wanted to submit a cache on Mars, but it was a virtual of the Face (or was it the Monolith or Sneaker?) and could not be published on this site. She was going to make it a challenge, but . . .

Edited by geodarts

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Since you don't use a GPSr to navigate to the ISS cache, and there's no log, it's really just a very large travelbug. But if they put a stamp there, I think that would make it a legal letterbox hybrid. "At the posted coordinates, get on a spaceship..."

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I don't have personal experience with this - if anyone has $30 million to spare I'll be willing to check it out in person. But seeing that the ISS orbits at about 350 km above sea level, significantly below the GPS satellites (20,000 km), I believe that it is possible to get a reading with the right receiver.

 

Civilian GPS receivers are artificially limited to not work above a certain elevation and velocity, to prevent it from being used in weapons. Link : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Positioning_System#Restrictions_on_civilian_use

 

As for the grid, imagine the grid lines, projected out into space, with origin being the center of the Earth.

Most GPS receivers have a maximum speed at wich they will operate. I suspect it is related to their calculation speed. The orbital speed of the ISS is way too high for any GPSr that we geocaches have, and maby for any GPSr. Also, the calculation engine within most GPSr assume the GPSr is within a few thousand meters of sea level. At 350 000 meters, the calculations would not work.

 

Interesting information about the orbatal distances. I thougth GPS satellites were in low earth orbit, and the ISS would be outside of the contalation. I guess if the ISS could hold still for a few minutes, you could get a GPS lock. Of course that would result in free fall back to earth, with would induce its own speed issues.

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Most GPS receivers have a maximum speed at wich they will operate. I suspect it is related to their calculation speed. The orbital speed of the ISS is way too high for any GPSr that we geocaches have, and maby for any GPSr. Also, the calculation engine within most GPSr assume the GPSr is within a few thousand meters of sea level. At 350 000 meters, the calculations would not work.

 

Interesting information about the orbatal distances. I thougth GPS satellites were in low earth orbit, and the ISS would be outside of the contalation. I guess if the ISS could hold still for a few minutes, you could get a GPS lock. Of course that would result in free fall back to earth, with would induce its own speed issues.

The real problem isn't whether you can find your location when you're in the ISS. The problem is picking the coordinates to post in the description.

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The real problem isn't whether you can find your location when you're in the ISS. The problem is picking the coordinates to post in the description.

I thought Groundspeak's (or was it Richard Garriott's) decision to use the coordinates for Baikonur Cosmodrome is a logical one since NASA does not give rides to paying customers (and of course now does not have the capability after retiring the shuttle fleet). It was amusing to note that they did screw up the longitude initially and it was listed in Nova Scotia.

 

Of course, if Groundspeak wants to really get fancy about it, they can update the coordinates in near real time. One can argue that it should have been listed as a multistage instead of a traditional, but considering that it is unique, I think the whole argument is pointless.

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Honestly if I ever became an astronaut, I would be sure to place some sort of cache on whatever I visited before leaving.

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Imagine if NASA dropped a cache on Mars when they visit, how awesome would that be!?

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There is a cache on Saturn......

 

Check GC2QV55 18 finds....

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a couple observations for the mathematically inclined.

 

1. Planets moves relative to the placement of GPS satellites.So would'nt we have moving caches with no stable GPS coordinates? unless published in an different matrix.

 

2. GPS mesurements for geocaches are 2-dimensional with no coordinate for altitude. If another planet is at a particular spot in it's orbit, the cache could violate the saturation rule by being within 528 feet of a cache on Earth when measured in 2 dimensions.

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Both Mars and Moon have their own coordinate systems similar to Earth one. So, we "only" need gps satellites around those planets and we can play our game there same as here on Earth. ;)

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2. GPS mesurements for geocaches are 2-dimensional with no coordinate for altitude. If another planet is at a particular spot in it's orbit, the cache could violate the saturation rule by being within 528 feet of a cache on Earth when measured in 2 dimensions.

You could get it published, if you give your reviewer evidence, that there is no direct path between them and so they are not likely to be confused with each other. :)

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On 12/5/2012 at 11:13 AM, Maconb said:

 

FTF!!!!!! Log was burnt needs maintenance. TFTC!!!

Hey I came in five minutes later and guess what you left the FTF geocoin

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