A Pictoral Mapping Quiz

September 7, 2009

This is perhaps a tough one - inspired by a sudden blast of nostalgia while searching for the previous location...

What used to stand on the now barren plots circled below?

And what is the link with Bruce? (that's your clue :laughing: )

Oh yes, name the nearest cache too.

3.8k · September 8, 2009

A life-changing event occurred here in the 1960s.

That gave it away - Chappaquiddick Island, specifically Dike Bridge.

For those that are wondering (as I was) the incident was the Chappaquiddick Incident which was most certainly life changing for Ted Kennedy, if not anyone else.

September 8, 2009

This is perhaps a tough one - inspired by a sudden blast of nostalgia while searching for the previous location...

Another clue maybe... it's not too far (relatively speaking) from the last one. Identifying the place shouldn't be too difficult - if you're stuck, ask The Boss...

1.4k · September 9, 2009

Tiny Often Empty Park, though I don't think the town Council of Asbury Park would like that name!

The vacant lots in the red ellipse were once part of the Casino next door. One was a skating rink and the other is the link to Bruce Springsteen. He used to play in the arena there. Dutch speakers would say that it was a Stepping Stone in his career.

I still think Mark Knopfler is a better guitarist though.

September 9, 2009

Tiny Often Empty Park, though I don't think the town Council of Asbury Park would like that name!

The vacant lots in the red ellipse were once part of the Casino next door. One was a skating rink and the other is the link to Bruce Springsteen. He used to play in the arena there. Dutch speakers would say that it was a Stepping Stone in his career.

I still think Mark Knopfler is a better guitarist though.

A DING for the cache - and close enough for the rest...

It is actually the former home of Palace Amusements (http://www.palaceamusements.com/). As you say, Asbury Park was also home to Bruce Springsteen and the E Street Band - and "the Palace" is referred to in the lyrics of "Born to Run". No arena that I know of - only the Convention Hall further North along the Boardwalk. Bruce also played at the Stone Pony - a far smaller venue.

I worked at the Palace for 3 months in 1979. Apologies for the self-indulgent nostalgia.

1.4k · September 9, 2009

I'll get another picture up in a few hours. I'm a bit busy dealing with a panic in the Gulf of Mexico at the moment.

1.4k · September 9, 2009

Panic over. Stoopid Murricane "surveyors" had been using the wrong datum and wondered why their pipe-crossing co-ordinates were more carp than usual.

OK, staying with the same continent, here are two pictures of the same marked location, at different scales.

I want the name of either one of the two caches in the vicinity which are relevant to this exact spot.

and

I think I've already given quite enough clues already.

1.4k · September 11, 2009

Time for another clue.

This precise location is of great significance to geocachers.

1.4k · September 12, 2009

Most countries have one of these. Some countries, such as much of Western Europe shares a single one, such the one in Potsdam.

Greenland has one at 64° 31.026N 51° 12.146W.

September 13, 2009

I get the distinct impression that no one is doing this quiz anymore.......

September 13, 2009

I get the distinct impression that no one is doing this quiz anymore.......

I think it's more to do with the fact that if you don't 'know' this one, you can't find the answer easily.

*my google fu is too weak for this one*

1.4k · September 13, 2009

Looking at the number of views I think quite a few geocachers will quietly kick themselves when they see the answer to this one. It really is of relevance to all geocachers, not just North American ones.

For my next clue, take a look at Google Earth or Flashearth or whatever, imagery for Greenwich. Pay particular attention to how badly wrong the Longitude lines are. Then think about why they appear to be so wrong. The "error" is well over a hundred metres. Ask yourself: Why?

3.9k · September 14, 2009

Not sure of the terminoligy, but it the point about which the WGS84 (or NAD27?) Datum is errr... Datumd?

1.4k · September 14, 2009

Your thinking is good, Rutson.

Now answer the question! :laughing:

3.9k · September 14, 2009

GC1X9QD?

1.4k · September 14, 2009

I like your thinking, Rutson! :laughing:

You are so close!!

September 14, 2009

Geodetic Center-as close as you get.. (GC9064)

(But Rutson should get all the credit, including the ding if there is one...)

I'm intrigued by the patchwork effect around this area - are the locals encouraged to do their own lunar landscaping?? :laughing:

1.4k · September 14, 2009

Milvus gets the Ding.

Before GPS came along, most countries used theodolities to measure angles between triangulation points. A Baseline was measured between at least two of those points to give the lattice-like trig framework scale and then the whole thing was pinned to Lat/Long at a single, carefully measured, astro-geodetic point.

For Europe in the second half of the 20th century the Origin of the European Datum 1950 was Helmert's Tower in Potsdam.

If you delve into the nether pages of your GPSr you'll find a list of about a hundred or so such datums, one of which is NAD27. When the Murricane surveyors who surveyed in the point at Meades Ranch did their thing in 1927 they made a complete arse of the job. Being a very insular nation, nobody noticed or even cared.

Once the first artificial satellite was launched, people started noting the Doppler whistle effect and could measure the precise orbital parameters visually. Combining a measurement of the satellite's position with the 4-D spatial point which was identifiable by its Doppler null point gave a single line of position on Earth. Do enough of those measurements (80 well spaced measurements is a practical minimum) and you've got a pretty good measure of your observation point's co-ords on your chosen spheroid.

By the late 1950s it became very obvious that the stated co-ords of the Origin of North American Datum 1927, at Meades Ranch, was a load of bolleaux. What any reasonable nation would have done would have been to create a new Datum, let's call it NAD63, to bring that datum point into line geodetically with what the already agreed definition of what zero degrees Longitude (Greenwich Meridian) actually means. We are not talking about a reasonable nation though. The Murricanes simply declared that the entire world was out of step with Murrica, so they sang a hymn and they steadfastly insisted on propagating their error by carrying it over into NAD63 and WGS72 and WGS84. Now we're stuck with it.

They did something similar with their absurd claims that an independent and reuinified Vietnam would lead to a Domino Effect and that Iraq was full of Weapons of Mass Destruction and that Afghans were involved in 9/11, but that's political geography, not geodetic geography, so we'll say no more.

May their god Bless 'em.

1.4k · September 14, 2009

I'm intrigued by the patchwork effect around this area - are the locals encouraged to do their own lunar landscaping??

It's called contour ploughing. It was introduced in the 1930s as a way of reducing the rain-washed "dustbowl". By ploughing along the lines of the contours water runoff is greatly slowed down and percolation is much more effective.

September 14, 2009

I'm intrigued by the patchwork effect around this area - are the locals encouraged to do their own lunar landscaping??

It's called contour ploughing. It was introduced in the 1930s as a way of reducing the rain-washed "dustbowl". By ploughing along the lines of the contours water runoff is greatly slowed down and percolation is much more effective.

And protecting recently seeded land from wind? Or am I mixing that up with something else?

September 14, 2009

Before GPS came along, most countries used theodolities to measure angles between triangulation points. A Baseline was measured between at least two of those points to give the lattice-like trig framework scale and then the whole thing was pinned to Lat/Long at a single, carefully measured, astro-geodetic point.

For Europe in the second half of the 20th century the Origin of the European Datum 1950 was Helmert's Tower in Potsdam.

If you delve into the nether pages of your GPSr you'll find a list of about a hundred or so such datums, one of which is NAD27. When the Murricane surveyors who surveyed in the point at Meades Ranch did their thing in 1927 they made a complete arse of the job. Being a very insular nation, nobody noticed or even cared.

Once the first artificial satellite was launched, people started noting the Doppler whistle effect and could measure the precise orbital parameters visually. Combining a measurement of the satellite's position with the 4-D spatial point which was identifiable by its Doppler null point gave a single line of position on Earth. Do enough of those measurements (80 well spaced measurements is a practical minimum) and you've got a pretty good measure of your observation point's co-ords on your chosen spheroid.

By the late 1950s it became very obvious that the stated co-ords of the Origin of North American Datum 1927, at Meades Ranch, was a load of bolleaux. What any reasonable nation would have done would have been to create a new Datum, let's call it NAD63, to bring that datum point into line geodetically with what the already agreed definition of what zero degrees Longitude (Greenwich Meridian) actually means. We are not talking about a reasonable nation though. The Murricanes simply declared that the entire world was out of step with Murrica, so they sang a hymn and they steadfastly insisted on propagating their error by carrying it over into NAD63 and WGS72 and WGS84. Now we're stuck with it.

And there was I thinking this was a friendly quiz, not the basis for a PhD thesis....

September 14, 2009

And there was I thinking this was a friendly quiz, not the basis for a PhD thesis....

I quite like the trivia that comes with the questions to be honest :laughing:

7.2k · September 14, 2009

They did something similar with their absurd claims that an independent and reuinified Vietnam would lead to a Domino Effect and that Iraq was full of Weapons of Mass Destruction and that Afghans were involved in 9/11, but that's political geography, not geodetic geography, so we'll say no more.

Right, since we don't discuss politics in these forums. In the future, let's all leave that out please.

1.4k · September 14, 2009

And protecting recently seeded land from wind? Or am I mixing that up with something else?

You're right, but not quite right.

The wind-borne "dust bowl" was an effect, not a cause. The underlying cause of the problem was incompetent farming methods which ripped the heart out of the topsoil, thus rendering it extremely vulnerable to being lifted by wind. 1930s farmers often described thew sight of seeing newly sown seeds being ripped out of the land by quite moderate winds. That was because the very structure of the topsoil had been grievously damaged by stupid farming techniques.

Contour ploughing, and contour bunding, is basically a variant of terrace farming which had been practiced wisely in the "Old World" for millennia.

3.8k · September 15, 2009

Snip.....When the Murricane surveyors who surveyed in the point at Meades Ranch did their thing in 1927 they made a complete arse of the job. Being a very insular nation, nobody noticed or even cared.

Snip.....

By the late 1950s it became very obvious that the stated co-ords of the Origin of North American Datum 1927, at Meades Ranch, was a load of bolleaux. What any reasonable nation would have done would have been to create a new Datum, .......Snip..... We are not talking about a reasonable nation though. The Murricanes simply declared that the entire world was out of step with Murrica, so they sang a hymn and they steadfastly insisted on propagating their error by carrying it over into NAD63 and WGS72 and WGS84. Now we're stuck with it.

They did something similar with their absurd claims that an independent and reuinified Vietnam would lead to a Domino Effect and that Iraq was full of Weapons of Mass Destruction and that Afghans were involved in 9/11, but that's political geography, not geodetic geography, so we'll say no more.

May their god Bless 'em.

Large amount of the gumf deleted to show what I think is a hidden statement of a personal agenda and a solicitation of personal beliefs against a particular nation!! Surely this isn't allowed on the forums?

3.8k · September 15, 2009

And protecting recently seeded land from wind? Or am I mixing that up with something else?

You're right, but not quite right.

The wind-borne "dust bowl" was an effect, not a cause. The underlying cause of the problem was incompetent farming methods which ripped the heart out of the topsoil, thus rendering it extremely vulnerable to being lifted by wind. 1930s farmers often described thew sight of seeing newly sown seeds being ripped out of the land by quite moderate winds. That was because the very structure of the topsoil had been grievously damaged by stupid farming techniques.

Contour ploughing, and contour bunding, is basically a variant of terrace farming which had been practiced wisely in the "Old World" for millennia.

Although the basis of this statement may be true, we all know what nation of farmers the Forester is referring to, so this to me is a continuation of his solicitation of beliefs!

1.4k · September 15, 2009

The corrective measure which were taken to combat the dust bowl certainly have worked. Old lessons were relearned, such as the need for crop rotation. Government instigated practices, such as contour ploughing, are still in use to this day, as has been shown in the satellite/aerial photographs above.

I don't know whether such measures could be mandated by government today. There would be a great deal of resistance to the nanny state getting involved in private enterprise such as farming.

September 15, 2009

Milvus gets the Ding.

Thanks - but as I say, Rutson did the work - I only searched for caches near to the above-mentioned event.

So the Ding is his if he has the next photo ready?

3.9k · September 15, 2009

Thanks MM :-)

Name the cache at the cross:

3.8k · September 16, 2009

Sneaky turning the picture so North is at the bottom of the picture :blink:

It's Alberts Famine GC2E4D

Edited September 16, 2009 by Haggis Hunter

3.9k · September 16, 2009

Sneaky? MOI? :-P

You are of course right, I attempted the cache at night the day after I found my first cache and have never been nearby during the day since!

3.8k · September 16, 2009

I'll get a new picture up once I finish work

3k · September 16, 2009

Contour ploughing, and contour bunding, is basically a variant of terrace farming which had been practiced wisely in the "Old World" for millennia.

And where exactly did these new world farmers come from, with their oh so silly farming techniques ???? :blink: :blink:

1.4k · September 16, 2009

They came from countries which didn't have mechanical aids such as tractors.

They came from countries which didn't have any untouched prairies to rip up with plough and harrow, so they had no way of knowing what the effect would be on the physical structure of the virgin soil and the resultant climate changes.

Many of them came from NorthWestern European countries which have a temperate maritime climate, so they didn't understand that places like the Texas panhandle and Kansas have a completely different type of climate with vastly greater extremes.

They came from tiny peasant owned farms, where they tilled the soil symapthetically with oxen and fed the land with the manure of farm animals. They passed the land down through generations and they cared for the land. They emigrated to a land where they could only be tenants or "sharecroppers". It was/is a land where "greed is good" and where the pursuit of the fast Buck is not only a way of life, it's almost a religion. They stopped thinking 10, 30 or a 100 years ahead. In fact, they stopped thinking at all. They blindly and stupidly chased a fast buck here and now, instead of thinking strategically about what was good for the land and what was good for the future.

Now their descendants are doing the same thing to the globe's atmosphere as the stupid ones did to a hundred million acres of topsoil in the 1920s.

This is not a political matter at all. It's human geography and human geography is inseparable from any other other kind of geography. Geography is what we see all around us when geocaching and when surfing websites such as Google Earth et al.

I should also point out that the sharecroppers of 1920s America certainly don't have a monopoly on stupidity. Nor is it limited to the New World. Indonesian and Brazilian strip-logging of primary rainforest are prime examples of the moral equivalence of New World and Third World stupidity.

It doesn't have to be like that though. For many years, almost a decade, I lobbied the Noggie Parliament to have Wangari Maathai nominated for a Nobel Prize. Currently my hero is Willie Smits. He's an Indonesian who is intelligently repairing the damage done to the rainforests of Borneo and Sumatra. He's quietly and effectively showing the difference between stupidity and intelligent husbandry of the land. If you have 20 minutes to spare and can listen to an audio track of a streamed video, then I would urge you to listen to his TED Talk on how he is rebuilding a rainforest from scratch].

Edited September 16, 2009 by The Forester

3.8k · September 16, 2009

OK let's get back on topic!! :blink:

Name the cache

September 16, 2009

I must admit - Forester's posts make for some thought-provoking reading...

September 16, 2009

I must admit - Forester's posts make for some thought-provoking reading...

True, but not geocaching related.

3.8k · September 17, 2009

No guesses? Here is an image I captured from the cache site.

I might get a bit more pacific tomorrow if it still hasn't been guessed. :huh:

September 17, 2009

Observatory + Volcanoes suggests somewhere in Hawai to mei.

Using google maps, it's Mauna Kea. Without the extra picture I'd never have got it.

September 17, 2009

OK - closer to home.

September 18, 2009

OK - a clue or two:

The nearest cache isn't in the picture, for obvious reasons.

A world first that went with a bang a couple of years ago.

September 18, 2009

The nearest cache is GC11PX5 - Peace BE With You Two.

The pic is Sellafield nuclear power station, the world first being it was the first commercial nuclear station. Knew it was some sort of power station by the high voltage power lines. With regards to what went bang, I would think, judging by the pic, demolishing of the cooling towers.

Passed the posting of a pic over last time, but, will have a think and post one soon. Assuming it is a ding!

September 18, 2009

As long as it is OK, I am self dinging..

The nearest cache is a Mystery one, so name that, and the building in the centre has quite a significance for caching

September 18, 2009

Technically, it is Calder Hall power station. Sellafield is the reprocessing facility mostly on the other side of the river, whilst Windscale is the old 'research' reactors.

It WAS the cooling towers that went bang. Quite impressive.

You're right with the cache of course, though!

Wish I had the faintest Idea where your picture is.

September 18, 2009

As long as it is OK, I am self dinging..

The nearest cache is a Mystery one, so name that, and the building in the centre has quite a significance for caching

Is that Jeremy's house?????

September 19, 2009

The building CONTAINS items we may use

September 20, 2009

Another clue........

The building is the headquarters of a manufacturing company that makes plastic products.

Also just north of here is a....... (so called) Theme Park!!

6.2k · September 20, 2009

Another clue........

The building is the headquarters of a manufacturing company that makes plastic products.

Also just north of here is a....... (so called) Theme Park!!

Well that's going to be the Tupperware HQ in Orlando, Florida.

Nearest cache is probably Platitudinous #28 Caching is Very Satisfying

September 20, 2009

Another clue........

The building is the headquarters of a manufacturing company that makes plastic products.

Also just north of here is a....... (so called) Theme Park!!

Well that's going to be the Tupperware HQ in Orlando, Florida.

Nearest cache is probably Platitudinous #28 Caching is Very Satisfying

Darn. I should have know that. I remember driving past it a few years ago.

September 21, 2009

That's a ding for Martybartfast.....

A Pictoral Mapping Quiz

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