can jeeps be resident to a cache

[+Munkeh]

I thought they where to share, not be locked up

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...e0-5674980bba74

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...56-58cfb161328f

[+Jaz666]

I've no problem with it.

It's better that they stay in a cache for all to share, rather than staying in someone's private collection.

[+pklong]

It's gotta be a firm NO! from me. Don't they originate in the US? We wouldn't even have any if they stayed put.

 

TB's are for moving and sharing not decorating your own cache with icons (unless you own them of course).

Edited February 14, 2008 by pklong

[+Gralorn]

All vehicles have to fill up with fuel at some time on their journeys. So why not let people come and admire it for awhile in it's pit stop! Serious though, on the road first priority, resident second, pinched for collection third !

[+third-degree-witch]

Jeep Tbs are the property of Jeep and not individual cache owners.

[+Munkeh]

another one.....members only

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...ad-ae3593fdd301

[+Happy Humphrey]

There's a collection of Jeeps in one of mine (I haven't been able to persuade a Red one to join just yet). There's a sort of informal agreement to leave them there so that people can log them, but I don't like the idea of making rules about it - they don't belong to me. On the other hand, I consider myself the "keeper" of the Moun10Bike Coin so I'd be annoyed if that was moved.

[+Bud Lightbeer]

Keep em moving I say. They don't belong to individuals, so I don't belive anyone has the right to essentially take them over for their own purpose. Bud

[+The Bolas Heathens]

Exactly the situation with our Jeep Challenge cache which has been linked to above.

 

We've not fixed the Jeep's into the cache as they are not ours to do so with, but we do politely request that finders leave the Jeep's in the cache so other people can get to see them and get the icon. All very informal, like HH's cache.

 

We've had really good comments about the cache so far with lots of newer cachers who may not have even known about the Jeep TB's, let alone find one getting to see them in the flesh. It's all raising the awareness of Jeep amongst the geocaching community, which after all is what the TB's were created for in the first place.

 

There's a collection of Jeeps in one of mine (I haven't been able to persuade a Red one to join just yet). There's a sort of informal agreement to leave them there so that people can log them, but I don't like the idea of making rules about it - they don't belong to me. On the other hand, I consider myself the "keeper" of the Moun10Bike Coin so I'd be annoyed if that was moved.

[+MBFace]

The owners of these caches have bugs and coins with goals of their own. No doubt they would complain vociferously if they were similarly imprisoned.

 

What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander???

 

MBF

[+Munkeh]

another one

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...42-f5f660fcc367

[+SidAndBob]

I nearly visited this one recently and was amazed to see the same thing also in the Bristol area again.

 

Edited to say : Oops! I see that's the one in the link above.

Edited February 14, 2008 by SidAndBob

[+Munkeh]

Exactly the situation with our Jeep Challenge cache which has been linked to above.

 

We've not fixed the Jeep's into the cache as they are not ours to do so with, but we do politely request that finders leave the Jeep's in the cache so other people can get to see them and get the icon. All very informal, like HH's cache.

 

We've had really good comments about the cache so far with lots of newer cachers who may not have even known about the Jeep TB's, let alone find one getting to see them in the flesh. It's all raising the awareness of Jeep amongst the geocaching community, which after all is what the TB's were created for in the first place.

 

There's a collection of Jeeps in one of mine (I haven't been able to persuade a Red one to join just yet). There's a sort of informal agreement to leave them there so that people can log them, but I don't like the idea of making rules about it - they don't belong to me. On the other hand, I consider myself the "keeper" of the Moun10Bike Coin so I'd be annoyed if that was moved.

 

if I was to request people to leave a coin belonging to you in a cache and it was left long term would you not object, there is a difference in requesting something that belongs to you to remain as averse to something that does not belong to you

[markandlynn]

Exactly the situation with our Jeep Challenge cache which has been linked to above.

 

We've not fixed the Jeep's into the cache as they are not ours to do so with, but we do politely request that finders leave the Jeep's in the cache so other people can get to see them and get the icon. All very informal, like HH's cache.

 

We've had really good comments about the cache so far with lots of newer cachers who may not have even known about the Jeep TB's, let alone find one getting to see them in the flesh. It's all raising the awareness of Jeep amongst the geocaching community, which after all is what the TB's were created for in the first place.

 

There's a collection of Jeeps in one of mine (I haven't been able to persuade a Red one to join just yet). There's a sort of informal agreement to leave them there so that people can log them, but I don't like the idea of making rules about it - they don't belong to me. On the other hand, I consider myself the "keeper" of the Moun10Bike Coin so I'd be annoyed if that was moved.

 

Its a lovely idea but why is it a subscriber only cache ?

[+The Bolas Heathens]

Have any of them been left long term in our cache?

 

If you took the time to look you would find they have not and indeed, several have already been exhanged and there is no reason why they should continue to be exchanged like this. In fact, I have a replacement for one of them sat here and ready to go and will drop it into the cache as soon as I remember to take it with me.

 

I'd just like to re-iterate that the Jeep's are not being held in our cache and are absolutely free to go at any time. It would ruin the idea of the cache and spoil the fun for lots of other cachers if they do, but it's not an impossibility.

 

 

if I was to request people to leave a coin belonging to you in a cache and it was left long term would you not object, there is a difference in requesting something that belongs to you to remain as averse to something that does not belong to you

[+MartyBartfast]

I don't think this is right. TBs are meant to travel and belong to the TB owner not the cache owner. Saying that keeping them in a particular cache gives others the chance to collect the icon is a fallacy as there will only be a limited number of cachers in that area who are able to log them, if they are released to travel the country then they can be found by many more cachers.

 

Keep 'em moving I say!

Edited February 14, 2008 by MartyBartfast

[+The Bolas Heathens]

Thanks .

 

All of our newer caches have been subscriber only until last night when we opened them back up for all. I'm sure you can imagine the reason (feel free to DM if you don't) so I won't go into it here and bore everyone else.

 

We've left the Jeep one as subscriber only for now as we have a lot of TB's in there at any one time and as a cache owner we felt a duty of care to those TB's and think the subscriber only option helps with this.

 

The jury is still open on this though but left it subscriber only overnight while I ponder it a little more.

 

Its a lovely idea but why is it a subscriber only cache ?

[+The Bolas Heathens]

Is it any different than the many Jeep TB's that you see on the event circuit? Those cachers that do not go to events or do not go to the right events do not get to see them as they quite often get passed from one event goer to the next.

 

edited to add: I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the above so don't shoot me down for saying it.

 

Saying that keeping them in a particular cache gives others the chance to collect the icon is a fallacy as there will only be a limited number of cachers in that area who are able to log them, if they are released to travel the country then they can be found by many more cachers.

 

Edited February 14, 2008 by The Bolas Heathens

[+Munkeh]

1 more for the collection

 

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...d1-4d70fd4b5646

Edited February 14, 2008 by Munkeh

[+Munkeh]

Have any of them been left long term in our cache?

 

If you took the time to look you would find they have not and indeed, several have already been exhanged and there is no reason why they should continue to be exchanged like this. In fact, I have a replacement for one of them sat here and ready to go and will drop it into the cache as soon as I remember to take it with me.

 

I'd just like to re-iterate that the Jeep's are not being held in our cache and are absolutely free to go at any time. It would ruin the idea of the cache and spoil the fun for lots of other cachers if they do, but it's not an impossibility.

 

 

if I was to request people to leave a coin belonging to you in a cache and it was left long term would you not object, there is a difference in requesting something that belongs to you to remain as averse to something that does not belong to you

 

by making a request you are discouraging people from moving them on

[+The Bolas Heathens]

I give up. I'd love to have the time to split hairs over the exact meanings of things like this with you but to be honest I've got 1001 better things to be doing this evening. It is Valentines Day after all

 

 

by making a request you are discouraging people from moving them on

[+MartyBartfast]

Is it any different than the many Jeep TB's that you see on the event circuit? Those cachers that do not go to events or do not go to the right events do not get to see them as they quite often get passed from one event goer to the next.

 

edited to add: I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the above so don't shoot me down for saying it.

 

 

I don't think it's right to 'trap' TBs on the event circuit either

[+The Bolas Heathens]

LOL - I had a feeling you might say that

 

I don't think it's right to 'trap' TBs on the event circuit either

[+MartyBartfast]

1 more for the collection

 

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...d1-4d70fd4b5646

I think this is a "false positive" :-

1. The cache TB history doesn't have a red jeep TB in it
   
2. I checked a few visitors and they haven't collected a red jeep icon
   
3. Several cachers have posted a picture of "the jeep" and it looks like it has a homemade tag attached
   

so it looks like it could just be a toy jeep that the cache owner put in there, which is fair enough !

 

edit to add: and I've got too much time on my hands!

Edited February 14, 2008 by MartyBartfast

[+maxkim]

As the owner of the first link is not on the forums at the moment can I state on his behalf that the jeep was in the cache when he won it at an event. If the owner of the jeep wants to complain they are fully at liberty to do so. As they are just a marketing gimick they don't and won't so they are totally different to TB's and coins which are owned by cachers themselves. I'm fairly sure that the MD of Jeep Corp is not in the least bit upset that some of his advertising gimics are trapped in tupperware boxes in the UK...... If I'm wrong i'd like to hear from him/her on this forum......

As to the fixed ones at least you know where you can find one... if they are too far from you and thats your gripe then just come right out and say it, otherwise no probs... Cheers MaxKim.

[+Happy Humphrey]

As they are just a marketing gimick they don't and won't so they are totally different to TB's and coins which are owned by cachers themselves. I'm fairly sure that the MD of Jeep Corp is not in the least bit upset that some of his advertising gimics are trapped in tupperware boxes in the UK...... If I'm wrong i'd like to hear from him/her on this forum......

As to the fixed ones at least you know where you can find one... if they are too far from you and thats your gripe then just come right out and say it, otherwise no probs... Cheers MaxKim.

Well said... good night everyone!

[nobby.nobbs]

Sorry haven't checked all those links but are there any red jeeps anywhere near Southampton? It's the only one I've never seen.

 

Should they be kept? To be honest I don't mind.

[+SidAndBob]

Current GOAL: Log your visit, and move me to a new geocache!

[Deceangi]

The owner of a cache with a TB/Geocoin resident in it or a 1 for 1 swap, minimum No rule. Is stating a personal preference only. They may not make it a Mandatory Additional Logging Requirement, unless the TB/Geocoin which must remain resident in the cache belongs to them.

 

The finder of such caches has 2 options:

 

i) They can honour the cache owners request.

 

or

 

ii) Remove all TB's/Geocoins including resident ones not owned by the cache owner. With no need to leave behind any replacements.

 

personally I can't remember ever Reviewing a cache which had a Mandatory Additional Logging Requirement regarding TB's/Geocoins, only ones were the cache owner has stated a personal preference. If I was to Review such as cache the owner would have to remove the M.A.L.R before publication. If I came across such a cache post publication, I'd contact the owner of the cache, to point out that TB's/Geocoins are Game pieces. Which if they do not own them, they may not put restrictions on the movement of them, and give them 2 options

 

iii) Remove the Mandatory Additional Logging Requirement regarding TB's/Geocoins they do not own

 

or

 

iv) The cache will be Reclassified as a Puzzle cache, due to it having a Mandatory Additional Logging Requirement.

 

As I have stated above I do see new cache submissions which have the owners preference regarding TB's/Geocoins in the cache. And have and will always publish without questioning that preference. Provided that they are not attempting to dictate how TB's/Geocoins are moved into and out of their cache, as it is down to each person finding the cache to personally decide whether to honour that request, without fear of their log being deleted for not honouring that request.

[+The Bolas Heathens]

Agree totally - they are a different thing to a personal TB, no matter how people try and argue they are the same. Their existence is purely to promote the Jeep brand amonst geocachers and perhaps the wider world.

 

Having spent a lovely valentines night with my loved one last night rather than continuing the debate over the rights and wrongs of Dinky toys on here, I have just emailed the CEO of Jeep asking if they mind terribly if some of their promotional TB's stay for a short while in a cache which could be argued raises the awareness of the Jeep brand amongst geocachers in the UK, including photos of most of their range.

 

I'm not sure I'll receive a response but you never know. If he/she is as good at marketing as I suspect they are I think I know what the answer is. Of course, I could well imagine a couple of Dinky toys sat in an ammo-box somewhere in the UK does not really figure on their radar.

 

In the meantime I'll get back to thinking up innovative caches that cachers really enjoy finding (read the logs on our Jeep cache to see how much cachers have loved seeing all the Jeeps) rather than chucking un-imaginative tupperware under bushes at random as some cachers seem to do (not that I'm saying there is anything wrong with that, before someone jumps down my throat for saying it ).

 

If the owner of the jeep wants to complain they are fully at liberty to do so. As they are just a marketing gimick they don't and won't so they are totally different to TB's and coins which are owned by cachers themselves. I'm fairly sure that the MD of Jeep Corp is not in the least bit upset that some of his advertising gimics are trapped in tupperware boxes in the UK...... If I'm wrong i'd like to hear from him/her on this forum......

As to the fixed ones at least you know where you can find one... if they are too far from you and thats your gripe then just come right out and say it, otherwise no probs... Cheers MaxKim.

 

edited: I really must learn to spell!

Edited February 15, 2008 by The Bolas Heathens

[+Eartha]

I don't know how to put this in more simple terms, but I'll try.

 

It's a TRAVEL bug.

 

Edited to add the meaning of the word:

 

Pronunciation:

\ˈtra-vəl\

Function:

verb

Inflected Form(s):

trav·eled or trav·elled; trav·el·ing or trav·el·ling Listen to the pronunciation of travelling \ˈtra-və-liŋ, ˈtrav-liŋ\

Etymology:

Middle English travailen, travelen to torment, labor, strive, journey, from Anglo-French travailler

Date:

14th century

 

intransitive verb1 a: to go on or as if on a trip or tour : journey b (1): to go as if by traveling : pass <the news traveled fast> (2): associate <travels with a sophisticated crowd> c: to go from place to place as a sales representative or business agent2 a (1): to move or undergo transmission from one place to another <goods traveling by plane> (2): to withstand relocation successfully <a dish that travels well> b: to move in a given direction or path or through a given distance <the stylus travels in a groove> c: to move rapidly <a car that can really travel>3: to take more steps while holding a basketball than the rules allowtransitive verb1 a: to journey through or over b: to follow (a course or path) as if by traveling2: to traverse (a specified distance)3: to cover (an area) as a commercial traveler

Edited February 15, 2008 by Eartha

[+Von-Horst]

I'm not sure where I stand on this but, with regard to the Eartha's post, Travel bugs are surely meant to travel so that the owner can travel vicariously.

 

Are Jeep avidly looking to see where their TBs have gotten to?

[NickPick]

Well, it's Friday afternoon, so it's time for me to add my 2p worth...

 

With normal TBs, I'd say that they belong to the owner, so the owner's wishes should come above anyone else's, so I'd be annoyed if my TB was left in a 'TB Hotel' because the cache owner said 'don't take a TB unless you're dropping one'. This would annoy me because it's my TB to give a mission to, not theirs.

 

With Jeeps, the 'owner' is apparently not bothered about them, but the mission is "Log your visit, and move me to a new geocache!". From this, and from what I presume to be reasonable, I think they're supposed to be moved from cache to cacher to cache.

 

The big question seems to be (and I don't aim this at any person): What gives anyone the right to decide that a jeep stays in their cache?

 

I'll use one of the TBs noted in the OP (again, not aimed particularly at the cache owner, there are several similar caches): It's chained inside a cache, because they're "rather rare in these parts". well, they're rather rare around my area too, and if they travel, then I can hope to find one near me. I know that if I travel to that cache, I can be assured of finding it, but I rather prefer the randomness of trying to find one 'in the wild'. I've managed to find a green and a white jeep like this, but not yet found a yellow or red one, so I'm still enjoying the hunt.

 

So, my point is that they were intended to travel, so that's what they should do.

 

(Disclaimer)

The cache I use as an example, I seem to recall, was made up as a prize for an event by the person who brought over from the states / was sent the jeep in order to release it. As this seems to be a special case, it perhaps should be left to stand, but if I decided to make a cache and imprison a JTB in it, I wouldn't expect it to.

[+UncleJimbo]

I'm not sure where I stand on this but, with regard to the Eartha's post, Travel bugs are surely meant to travel so that the owner can travel vicariously.

 

Are Jeep avidly looking to see where their TBs have gotten to?

There might be other people watching the Jeep TB to enjoy its travels. The enjoyment is not necessarily only for the "owner".

 

Trapping a Jeep in someone's personal collection (theft), or on an event circuit in the hands of one person, or in one cache are all contrary to the spirit and goals of TBs.

[SlytherinAlex]

So, my point is that they were intended to travel, so that's what they should do.

 

(Disclaimer)

The cache I use as an example, I seem to recall, was made up as a prize for an event by the person who brought over from the states / was sent the jeep in order to release it. As this seems to be a special case, it perhaps should be left to stand, but if I decided to make a cache and imprison a JTB in it, I wouldn't expect it to.

I've probably brought more Jeeps (of all colours) to the UK than anyone.

 

The white Jeep in Jeep Jail mentioned in the OP was one I brought over. I brought five white ones I seem to remember. One of them went INSIDE a Jeep showroom in Wakefield and could be "discovered" through the window. Unfortunately the Jeep franchise went to the wall and the Jeep TB disappeared.

 

2,3 and 4 went out in the wild. NONE OF THOSE ARE STILL TRAVELING. All three were nabbed from caches at some point and disappeared. Hardly anyone got to find oner in a cache.

 

Number Five went in a cache that I built with the Jeep strapped inside the box. I gave it as a prize at a Harrogate Hunter event and the cache was placed and is still there.

 

To date 70 cachers have logged the Jeep without complaint. That's about 60 more than would have done if I had released it in the wild in W Yorkshire. It's 70 more UK cachers that got to log a white Jeep than if I had left it on my desk in Texas.

 

It was my choice to do what I did with it, and I still stand by what I did.

 

Alex

[+Donmoore]

I think a lot of this is pointless jibber jabber. Personally i think it is wrong for us to bring Jeeps out of the US while they are still in game play. Although i did bring one back last year. but have had reservations ever since looking at the whole game play and such on the web site.

 

Once they are no longer part of the Jeep game then any put in a cache should get the chance to travel and for as many people to log.

 

But perhaps now we hould try and get some kind of similar game up and running for the UK not sure how to go about this or if indeed any car company would entertain the idea in the UK

[+Moote]

Jeep Tbs are the property of Jeep and not individual cache owners.

Yes I totally agree with the above, no cacher has a right to make a TB prison, only the owner of the TB / Coin / Jeep can make these demands!

[+maxkim]

The main issue here is surely why are Jeeps only issued in the USA and not world wide, are we second class citizens or something???? same with DB TB's etc MaxKim

[+maxkim]

ps I agree with Alex, I would prefer to log a captivge Jeep than not log a free stolen one.... just my thoughts you understand

[+MBFace]

The main issue here is surely why are Jeeps only issued in the USA and not world wide, are we second class citizens or something???? same with DB TB's etc MaxKim

 

DB TB's - which ones do you mean?

 

MBF

[WashoeZephyr]

The main issue here is surely why are Jeeps only issued in the USA and not world wide, are we second class citizens or something???? same with DB TB's etc MaxKim

I often wondered about this too? I would guess the contest rules would have to vary so drastically from country to country. I think they have enough of a problem dealing with individual state rules etc. (I know in other contests some states are even excluded due to local laws regarding gambling, age restrictions, etc.)

For the record I did send a Red Jeep over to the UK before the contest was over

On another note, I thought the Diabetes TB's were available to everyone? A good friend of mine (NVGreenGecko) attended the WWFM in London and scored one of the Diabetes coins over there?

[+keehotee]

The main issue here is surely why are Jeeps only issued in the USA and not world wide, are we second class citizens or something????

Probably because...

1. Geocaching.com is an American organisation, run by an American, from an American address (even though it's used worldwide.

2. Jeep is an American brand.

 

Rather than complaining that Jeep TB's are only issued in the US, why aren't we lobbying Land Rover to do something similar over here?????

Edited February 15, 2008 by keehotee

[+Eartha]

The main issue here is surely why are Jeeps only issued in the USA and not world wide, are we second class citizens or something???? same with DB TB's etc MaxKim

 

This was discussed in one of the older earlier Jeep threads, I think it was during the yellow Jeep season. It's because international contest rules vary all over the world and it would take a team of lawyers so large to go through all the laws in all the lands to make it a worldwide contest, that it wouldn't be economically feasible to hold the contest. It's also been suggested that people in other countries contact auto manufacturers in their countries and suggest a contest, or travel bug be made as a promotional item.

 

But does anyone know why there are Jeep Travel Bugs? It all started with the original Yellow Jeep Fever locationless cache, back when there were locationless caches. I think Groundspeak had the largest online photo gallery of Jeeps with that cache, with 2051 Jeep photos on that one cache. It is archived now, but I believe that is what started it all, and that is why the original Jeeps were yellow.

 

If it were me, I would let them travel from cache to cache as travel bugs (and Jeeps) were intended to travel. Jeep does care where they go, or they wouldn't have the photo contests.

 

I'll go back to the Travel Bug forums now. Have a nice weekend.

 

Eartha

Groundspeak Travel Bug Forum Moderator

[+Eartha]

Since you asked, and slightly off topic - sorry, 20,000 Unite For Diabetes Travel Bugs were handed out. But they were offered on web sites other than www.geocaching.com as well, and non-cachers got some of them. Probably 60%, or so, are moving judging by my own personal research (which is really lacking in any formal criteria).

[+BlueDeuce]

The main issue here is surely why are Jeeps only issued in the USA and not world wide, are we second class citizens or something???? same with DB TB's etc MaxKim

 

The DB coins were sent (somewhat) international. I haven't even seen one pass through a single cache here in Iowa.

 

 

Edited for clarification.

Edited February 15, 2008 by BlueDeuce

[+Tiger-Eyes]

I have been lucky enough to have been sent a DB TB and a DB coin to release, even though these were not "Mine" I still keep an eye on where they are in the same as coins or TB's that I do own and have released.

The DB TB I Ireleased is still travelling, I am also watching the 2 DB TB's that are supposed to come to Norfolk - One has never moved, never even been grabbed, the other has only just been released and is in it's first cache.

The DB coin I released is now travelling in france

If I was a US citizen and was lucky enough to release a Jeep in the wild I would follow that as if it was my own too.

I have been lucky enough to see all 4 types of Jeep, 3 I have been in the wild and are still travelling, 1 I discoved at an event and it has since been put back into the wild and is still travelling.

Some people have Kept these TB's and coins for there own pleasure and I think this is wrong, Some people keep these TB's and Coins and take them to events for others too discover, If they didn't I wouldn't have discovered the yellow jeep but I would have prefered to see it in the wild and had the chance to move it (and take it home for my kids to see).

On one hand it's great that people who have never seen these jeeps know that if they go to a particular cache they can be assured that they will get the icon, on the other hand the people who live in the rest of the country/world are getting 1 less chance of a jeep coming close to them. I say don't chain them up, keep them travelling, nicer for the people who released them on behalf of jeep/DB and nicer for us who when we see the icon pop up close by can rush out to get it and try and beet the others.

Just my 2p worth

[+MartyBartfast]

Having had another look the caches above, some of them are puzzles so even though you might know "where to find the jeeps" if you can't figure out the puzzle you've still got no hope of finding them which is even worse.

[SlytherinAlex]

 

Rather than complaining that Jeep TB's are only issued in the US, why aren't we lobbying Land Rover to do something similar over here?????

Isn't Land Rover an American brand?

 

a.

[+Munkeh]

used to be British!

[+keehotee]

Isn't Land Rover an American brand?

No - it's owned by a US company, but it's a British brand.

Just as Jeep is owned by a German company , but is still undeniably an American brand!

 

Walmart own Asda - but Asda is a british brand.

Ford own Mazda - but Mazda's a Japanese brand.

Edited February 16, 2008 by keehotee