Ladybird Invasion

[+John & Hazel]

"The Times" today printed an article regarding the spread of the Harlequin ladybird which is

native to Asia and first appeared in SE England in 2004. Full Article

This voracious predator is a big threat to the 46 native species of ladybird.

We can help by recording details of all ladybird sightings - native & Harlequin along with a grid reference

and submitting the information to the UK Ladybird Survey, Biological Records Centre.

More information and how to submit your findings can be found Here Harlequin-survey.org.

 

On a lighter note, apologies in advance to Andy & Kerrie

[+Stuey]

"The Times" today printed an article regarding the spread of the Harlequin ladybird which is

native to Asia and first appeared in SE England in 2004. Full Article

This voracious predator is a big threat to the 46 native species of ladybird.

We can help by recording details of all ladybird sightings - native & Harlequin along with a grid reference

and submitting the information to the UK Ladybird Survey, Biological Records Centre.

More information and how to submit your findings can be found Here Harlequin-survey.org.

 

On a lighter note, apologies in advance to Andy & Kerrie   

Ahhh, I was wondering what this had to do with Geocaching, then I spotted the crucial words

[Deego]

And No before anybody ask's no points on COTM if you spot one

[+mongoose39uk]

And No before anybody ask's no points on COTM if you spot one

Paul would be breeding them if there were points in it

[+Alibags]

I did notice that Andybug and Ladybird's avatar, which is a ladybird, is NOT a UK 7 spot variety!! can we report them to the ladybird police? I think we should be told!!

 

Does anybody else remember the ladybird infestation we had in 1976 in that very hot summer? I seem to recall that those were more tomato-y orange and were larger than the usual bugs.

[+Turkey Trotter]

Does anybody else remember the ladybird infestation we had in 1976 in that very hot summer?  I seem to recall that those were more tomato-y orange and were larger than the usual bugs.

Yeah I do, and the nasty little beggers bit as well.

Edited March 15, 2005 by Turkey Trotter

[+Kitty Hawk]

So, on to the practicalities - do we squash them when we find them?

[+The Forester]

So, on to the practicalities - do we squash them when we find them?

Nope.

 

Put 'em into a sealed box, such as a taped-up matchbox and send them to the researchers with the time/date and co-ords of where you found them, together with a description of what they were doing (ie, playing the cello, rearranging their stamp collection, watching football on telly, writing their memoirs, doing The Times crossword, practicing polevaulting, etc) at the time you found them.

 

Cheers, The Forester

[+Boneychest & Catsuey]

So, on to the practicalities - do we squash them when we find them?

Nope.

 

Put 'em into a sealed box, such as a taped-up matchbox and send them to the researchers with the time/date and co-ords of where you found them, together with a description of what they were doing (ie, playing the cello, rearranging their stamp collection, watching football on telly, writing their memoirs, doing The Times crossword, practicing polevaulting, etc) at the time you found them.

The article says record and report - not collect and send.

 

You wouldn't get a cello in a matchbox anyway!

[+ANDYBUG&LADYBIRD]

Youve got us bang to rights Alibags! Please don't tell immigration!

Edited March 15, 2005 by ANDYBUG&LADYBIRD

[+Turkey Trotter]

Put 'em into a sealed box.

Can we then post the coordinates on GC.com and let the person who is FTF keep them? or even better tie a TB tag to their leg and release back into the wild so that they can be tracked properly...

[+Haggis Hunter]

Put 'em into a sealed box,

......and suffocate the poor little blighters, that is certainly preserving the species isn't it

[+The Forester]

The article says record and report - not collect and send.

This article gives a bit more detail..

 

Dr Majerus believes there is still time to save the UK from a full invasion. He urges anyone who finds the insect to send it to him with precise details on when and where the ladybird was found.

 

The feller interviewed on BBC News 24 today repeated that he wants people to send him any of these beasties that are found, secure in a sealed box. The interviewer said something to the effect that there would be thousands sent in. He replied something like "good, that's what we want".

 

Apparently, the threat to our native species is that the invaders have been wiping out all the greenfly! I know some gardeners who will not be weeping for them.

 

Cheers, The Forester

[+The Forester]

that is certainly preserving the species isn't it

I didn't get the impression that these scientists want to preserve the species, only the specimens.

 

With the species making a lot of money for the commercial sellers of them in the US, somehow I don't think the species (the invading one) is under threat!

 

Cheers, The Forester

[+Alibags]

The problem is that they eat all the greenfly and out compete our native ladybirds and then when they have noshed on all the greenfly, they eat the other ladybirds. Nothing wrong with them as such, just in the wrong place.

 

It's a bit like grey squirrels, perfectly cute and fluffy (if that's the way you like your rats!) until suddenly... hey, where have all the red squirrels gone?!!

[+Haggis Hunter]

that is certainly preserving the species isn't it

I didn't get the impression that these scientists want to preserve the species, only the specimens.

 

With the species making a lot of money for the commercial sellers of them in the US, somehow I don't think the species (the invading one) is under threat!

 

Cheers, The Forester

Ah!! I now see where you are coming from, you didn't make this clear in your last post, as I read it, you where saying just capture any ladybird and send it to them. Your posts now make it clearer.

 

What must be asked is, did these Ladybirds get here naturally, if so let nature take it's course, if they where introduced, such as the squirrels, then something needs to be done to preserve our native ladybirds.

[+The Forester]

It's a bit like grey squirrels, perfectly cute and fluffy (if that's the way you like your rats!) until suddenly... hey, where have all the red squirrels gone?!!

I agree entirely.

 

The grey tree rats have undoubtedly driven out the reds, although nobody has ever seen a grey actually attack a red. One theory is that greys are carriers but not casualties of some kind of viral disease.

 

I've also noticed that reds seem to be much more prone to being hit by cars than greys, despite being much less numerous.

 

Cheers, The Forester

[+The Forester]

you didn't make this clear in your last post, as I read it, you where saying just capture any ladybird and send it to them.

That was remiss of me. Thanks for pointing out my error.

 

I should also have made clear that when I said a "sealed" box, I did not mean airtight, only escape proof so that the live specimens of the invading species do not spill out in transit.

 

What must be asked is, did these Ladybirds get here naturally, if so let nature take it's course, if they where introduced, such as the squirrels, then something needs to be done to preserve our native ladybirds.

They were sent artificially to Northern Europe from the US as a pest control measure because they are so good at wiping out greenfly and aphids. I dunno how the first ones came across the Channel, but I suspect that it was either by naturally air in a Southerly wind or perhaps accidentally embedded in a consignment of some kind of vegetable matter. It's illegal to import critters like that to the UK knowlingly without declaring them to HM Customs at the port of arrival.

 

Cheers, The Forester

[+rutson]

But this, dated yesterday says:

 

PLEASE DO NOT SEND LIVE LADYBIRDS IN THE MAIL

 

 

writ large

[+Alibags]

They are actually from Asia originally and were imported into the US to scoff the greenfly and have become quite a pest since then. They have just started to appear and grow in numbers in Belgium/NL/France.

 

BTW there are other species of ladybirds apart from the 7 spot that are native to the UK. I am not entirely clear that any large multi spotted slightly orangy ladybird I saw would be one of the evil interlopers. Presumably the 1976 ladybirds were native to the UK, just exploiting the favourable conditions?

[+The Forester]

Specimens should be sent, preferably alive, to Dr Michael Majerus, Department of Genetics, Downing Street, Cambridge, CB2 3EH.

 

That message is still on their website. Click on the above link to read it for yourself.

 

He repeated that message in a television interview yesterday.

 

They also say:

A verified record is one where the identification of the ladybird has been checked by one of the project officers. To do this they have to see either the ladybird itself, or a photograph of it.

 

 

Cheers, The Forester

[markandlynn]

Put 'em into a sealed box.

Can we then post the coordinates on GC.com and let the person who is FTF keep them? or even better tie a TB tag to their leg and release back into the wild so that they can be tracked properly...

Do you think they would approve a cache for this?

 

I can see the log

.

.

.

Took Ladybird Left nothing Signed Matchbox Thanks for the Catch

.

[+The Forester]

I have just (17:00UTC) talked to Dr Majerus on the telephone. I looked up his number in the Cambridge Uni phone directory and was talking to him within about 10 seconds.

 

He was the chap I saw on the telly yesterday (C4, not Beeb as I had said earlier in this thread). I explained our discussion on this forum and briefly described geocaching to him and why some geocachers are interested in helping out if we can.

 

He confirmed that he wants people to send in live Harlequin ladybirds.

 

The nonsense in the press release will be corrected tomorrow, he said. What happened was that some officious little prat in the post office, on some kind of job experience scheme, thought that it was against post office rules to send live insects through the post. Complete and utter bolleaux, of course, but the librarian lassie who took his call yesterday could not get through to Dr Majerus 'cos he (Majerus) was doing interviews with the media, so she went ahead and wrote that incorrect bit about not sending harlequin ladybirds by post.

 

To clarify and simplify. They want people to send in either good macrophotos or the ladybirds (harlequins, not the native species) together with the description which is detained on the webspage.

 

Dr Majerus's email addy, if anyone needs it, is:

m.majerus at gen.cam.ac.uk

phone: (01223) 356372 or 276190

 

He expects an FtF this weekend!!

 

Cheers, The Forester

[+McDeHack]

I think I know how they got into the UK.

They flew in with the other illegal immigrants

[+wildlifewriter]

The grey tree rats have undoubtedly driven out the reds, although nobody has ever seen a grey actually attack a red.  One theory is that greys are carriers but not casualties of some kind of viral disease.

It's no longer just a theory, I'm sorry to say.

 

The disease is called Parapox, and very nasty it is, too. Perhaps inevitably, when a grey squirrel catches this virus it gets sick, but will usually recover.

 

But when a red squirrel goes down with the same thing, the effects are severe and extremely unpleasant. It will usually die.

 

Here in Norn Iron, there was in the early '90s a DARDNI policy of allowing both species to "co-exist" in managed forests, the idea being that there should be sufficient food supply to support viable dual populations.

 

It was an unmitigated disaster. Populations of Reds declined on those sites, and continue to do so.

 

If anyone is out caching, and you come upon a squirrel of either species which is dead, or obviously ill or behaving oddly, and it has a discharge round the eyes or nose (or any other visible lesions), do not touch it.

 

Keep any dogs and sprogs away from it too. If there is a park ranger office or similar in the area, try to report what you have seen.

[nobby.nobbs]

buy a shotgun and shoot the grey buggers. long tailed tree rats. do no good and loads of damage. without them the red recovery would take ages but it would happen. except for the mink that have been released by our tree hugging friends.

 

man's got a lot to answer for mucking stuff up in nature.

[+Alibags]

no, the mink are too busy eating all our water voles and ground nesting birds...

[+wildlifewriter]

buy a shotgun and shoot the grey buggers. long tailed tree rats. do no good and loads of damage. without them the red recovery would take ages but it would happen. except for the mink that have been released by our tree hugging friends.

 

man's got a lot to answer for mucking stuff up in nature.

 

... An answer which eloquently explains why there are people like me involved in wildlife conservation projects - but no people like you...

 

-Wlw.

[+Alibags]

... An answer which eloquently explains why there are people like me involved in wildlife conservation projects - but no people like you...

Do you get equally offended when people kill rats? People never seem to shed many tears for them. Perhaps it is because they are not cute and fluffy?

[+mongoose39uk]

I did see a very cute and fluffy rat near one of my caches once.

[+Pharisee]

Nellie Grockle keeps two very cute, but not particularly fluffy, rats in his flat

[+Lost in Space]

Nellie Grockle keeps two very cute, but not particularly fluffy, rats in his flat 

Does either of them wear a funny hat?

 

 

edited for bad grammar

Edited March 17, 2005 by Lost in Space

[+Alibags]

pet rats are COOL!

[+wildlifewriter]

Do you get equally offended when people kill rats?  People never seem to shed many tears for them.  Perhaps it is because they are not cute and fluffy?

The only thing that offended me was the stupidity and ignorance displayed by the remark.

 

For info: shooting is not a practical way of controlling grey squirrels (or rats.)

 

In fact, the method commonly used in overlap areas is systematic live trapping. This works, because we can bait the traps with stuff that Greys like to eat but Reds don't.

 

The law permits grey squirrels to be captured, provided that no suffering is caused to the animals during trapping.

 

.

.

.

 

The law ALSO says that grey squirrels in captivity may not be released back into the wild anywhere in the UK, because they are a proscribed alien species.

 

Somewhere in the space between those two sentences, something "happens" to them...

 

Squeamish about squirrels? Not me.

 

-Wlw.

[+Boneychest & Catsuey]

Getting back to the ladybirds....

 

I emailed the address at the end of the article to ask, and here is their reply

 

"The message on the BBC website about sending ladybirds is, I think, an old one, but I believe it still stands. The ladybirds should be sent in any sort of small container, alive or dead. But if they are alive, without any food.

 

Would you please go to the new survey website and report any findings you might have on the standard form there, so that the results can be properly co-ordinated and followed up. Findings were collected in this department last year, but the new survey team is far better able to manage the data.

 

The new website is at: www.harlequin-survey.org"

[+The Forester]

there are people like me involved in wildlife conservation projects

There are people like you involved in conserving grey squirrels?

 

If true, you are misguided.

 

If untrue, why say so?

[+The Forester]

For info: shooting is not a practical way of controlling grey squirrels (or rats.)

For info: shooting grey squirrels is a recognised and approved (by the Forestry Commission) method of controlling vermin such as grey squirrels.

 

Read their literature to learn.

 

Cheers, The Forester

[+The Forester]

If anyone is out caching, and you come upon a squirrel of either species which is dead, or obviously ill or behaving oddly, and it has a discharge round the eyes or nose (or any other visible lesions), do not touch it.

 

Keep any dogs and sprogs away from it too. If there is a park ranger office or similar in the area, try to report what you have seen.

Excellent advice.

 

I hope that all geocachers will read it and learn from it.

 

Cheers, The Forester

[+Nellies Knackers]

So what good recipes does anybody have for harlequin ladybirds?

[+rutson]

They tend to be a bit dull. Try stirfrying in a little peanut oil.

Edited March 18, 2005 by rutson

[+Eckington]

They tend to be a bit dull. Try stirfrying in a little peanut oil.

....I think with chilli flakes also......

[+rutson]

Well, each to their own of course, but I find the the chilli overpowers the natural piquancy of the harlequin ladybird.

 

Domestic ladybirds on the other hand are a different matter, though even then, FRESH chilli really makes the difference between average and first class ladybird.

[+Flyfishermanbob]

Eating ladybirds ! You sick people !!!!!

 

Where do you think you are????

 

I'm a celebrity?????

 

On the other hand ....... YUMMEEE

 

[+wildlifewriter]

there are people like me involved in wildlife conservation projects

There are people like you involved in conserving grey squirrels?

If true, you are misguided.

If untrue, why say so?

If you bothered to read my posts before reaching for the "reply" button...

 

... you still wouldn't know much - but you'd know more than you did before.

 

Oh, and - if your GB Forestry Commission want to improve their current dismal record in Red Squirrel conservation, chase them over here and we'll be happy to show them how it's now done.

Edited March 19, 2005 by wildlifewriter

[nobby.nobbs]

so my reply showed how ignorant i am?

 

ok it was abit tongue in cheek and off the cuff but i'm afraid they are not native. they are vermin and they do get controlled by shooting.

 

they cause huge amounts of damage and are responsible for the demise of the reds.

 

you're welcome to all the greys you can find. come get them and take them home with you. without them in competition the reds have a chance.

 

sorry if i offended you with my attempt at humour whilst addressing a real problem should we conserve these harlequin ladybirds aswell?

[+wildlifewriter]

you're welcome to all the greys you can find. come get them and take them home with you. without them in competition the reds have a chance.

 

If you bothered to read my posts before reachi -

 

.. forget it.

 

Can't read, won't read.

[+The Forester]

So what good recipes does anybody have for harlequin ladybirds?

If we can just train the red squirrels to eat the harlequin ladybirds, we've got it sorted.

 

Cheers, The Forester

[+The Forester]

i'm afraid they are not native. they are vermin and they do get controlled by shooting.

 

they cause huge amounts of damage and are responsible for the demise of the reds.

nobby nobs actually shows a better understanding of the subject than WLW does and has a better sense of humour on the subject

 

Edited to remove a personal attack which is in contravention of the forum guidelines

 

Shooting greys is an expensive form of eradication, but it has several advantages. It's much more selective than live trapping. It is virtually stress free for the squirrel, so long as it's a good hit.

 

Trapping is hugely expensive in terms of manpower because the traps have to be inspected so often (one a day minimum by law, but usually inspected two or three times a day on well run estates). Then there is the cost of the gas to euthanise the squirrel.

 

We have to accept that we'll never ever be able to eradicate the grey squirrels from mainland Britain. There are just too many of them and they are too successful a coloniser. Anyway, lots of townies get a lot of pleasure from feeding them in city parks and there would be public uproar if a serious programme of mass eradication were to be proposed.

 

All we can hope to do is to environmentally separate the reds from the greys. That can be done by clever forest management and by localised eradication of straying greys. In time (35-65 years is a minimum realistic timeline) we could begin to win back some territory for the reds from the greys. Meanwhile, the best we hope to do is to stem the tide.

 

Some of us are actively doing our best.

 

 

Cheers, The Forester

Edited March 19, 2005 by Lactodorum

[+kbootb]

Our local motorists seem to be the most effective method of culling the grey squirrel. The gutters are positively lined with corpses every morning.

 

I have no idea how the squirrel became a symbol for road safety.

 

Hardly ever see a dead rat though, when you think how prevalent they are meant to be they must have got the hang of crossing the road.

[+The Forester]

f your GB Forestry Commission want to improve their current dismal record in Red Squirrel conservation, chase them over here and we'll be happy to show them how it's now done

Yeah, right.

 

Send them to talk to people who engage in conservation of grey squirrels? No thanks.

 

Send them to learn about the folly of trying to force reds to co-exist with greys in an inappropriately laid out forest? No thanks.

 

The FC is an odd chimera, capable of some truly inspired forestry practices but still partly encumbered by the 1940s thinking of monocultures such as Sitka in that pathetic socialist attempt to reduce the UK's dependency on imported pulp wood. If you look hard enough, you can find a lot of very good manuals in their copious bibliography and you might learn something from them (if you don't already know it all).

 

 

Cheers, The Forester