Properly Logging You Dnf's

[+D & K]

I saw in a recent post that someone had mentioned they had visted a cache 3 times before actually finding it.

 

How many times do you have to NOT find it before you should consider it a DNF?

For the person mentioned above apparently 2 times not finding it was not reason enough for them to post a DNF.

 

So is the limit 3? 4? 5?????????

 

dik

[+Stunod]

For me: 1.

 

Your results may vary.

[+Seamus]

I'm with Stunod on this one. If I make an attempt to find a cache and fail to find it, it's a DNF. If I cannot get to the cache site due to reasons that will still be in effect for more than a couple of hours (something that may prevent others from being able to find it), it's a DNF as well.

 

There's no dishonor in logging a DNF, and it doesn't make you any less of a cacher to do so. I figure that if I can't make it to the site due to trail washout, maintenance, etc., then it's the least I can do to inform anyone coming after me that there were issues that they may need to take into consideration before seeking it.

 

On the other hand, I know several "death before DNF" types who wouldn't log a DNF (and would probably log it as a find) if they arrived to find a smoking crater in the ground where the cache should be.

[+Rogue_monkey]

for me its 1.

I will log a dnf after the first try. this is to let the cache owner that i couldn't find it and that maybe its gone. i will try a few more times to find it if i didn't find it on the scond find before i post another dnf. the only reason any more dnf posts will be logged is if the last few people who visited the cache after my first visit also posted dnfs.

[+Renegade Knight]

One for me as well. I've logged all my DNF's but but for two caches. One I was relying on the other persons cache stats to log my finds and since I can't see skunks forgot which cache it was. As for the other after 5 DNF's in a row on it I think they got the gist of the message.

[+D & K]

This would be a good topic to get opinions on. I wonder if anyone will step up and admit that they will return time and time again until the find it.

 

I have 2 DNF's so far.....I'm not bothered by it. One I simply couldn't find and someone right after me found it and the other the people before me couldn't find and the people after me couldn't find it.....

 

dik

[CoyoteRed]

Each time you search for something and don't find it, log a DNF.

 

Always log your first unsuccessful attempt, but the choice is up to you if you log any subsequent DNFs if you are not able to give it a good going. In other words, log when you have something to contribute and your first attemp is always a contribution.

 

That's MHO and I'm sticking to it!

[dampeoples]

My very first log ever was a DNF

One trip where I was able to search around constitutes a DNF for me. I've never run into a situation where the cache area was inaccesible. I think I would recommend an archive via a note in that situation.

[Zoptrop]

This is good to see... I was struggling with this very concept earlier. I *almost* logged a DNF, but wasn't sure what the proper protocol was for this. So, when I finally did find the cache I just made a note that I found it on the 2nd attempt.

[+Seamus]

This would be a good topic to get opinions on. I wonder if anyone will step up and admit that they will return time and time again until the find it.

 

I have 2 DNF's so far.....I'm not bothered by it. One I simply couldn't find and someone right after me found it and the other the people before me couldn't find and the people after me couldn't find it.....

 

dik

Trolley Line #9 stumped Fergus and I twice (logged DNFs both times) before we found it. It was odd to see people finding it so easily after it had given us such trouble, but once we found it, we understood that we'd been relying too much on the coordinates and not enough on the description. Sure we felt a little bit silly once we found it right where it was supposed to be, but it was a fun cache and we enjoyed it.

[+Team BAHumbug]

Still being relatively new at this, I always figure the fault in not finding it is mine. I have logged a number of DNFs, but not until after the second attempt with some serious searching going on. (With one exception, where I knew I wasn't going to get a second attempt.)

 

Even after the logged DNF, I keep going back. I just don't log any of those succesive attempts.

 

If I eventually find the cache, then I log a succesful find. (Is that wrong?) The only cache I have done that for so far was after my 9th attempt - showing I may not be bright, but I am determined!

[+fly46]

There's a couple things you have to remember...

 

1. Logging a DNF tells the cache hider that "Hey, something's up" and gives them warning to go check out their cache.

2. Logging a DNF tells other cachers that they may not be able to find it.

 

With that said, to me, logging a DNF depends on the situation.

 

Now, if I went to the cache and didn't find it, but know it's there (someone checked, found it after me, etc), I log a DNF.

If I go there and can't find it and it's missing, to me, it depends on what the cache owner says, and the situation I'm caching in. The ones I've gone to independantly and not found, I log as a DNF to let the owner know it's muggled. There were a couple that I went to with the cache owner/placer who told us it was missing but to log it anyway, so I logged it.

 

However, if I never got to the cache, and It's not a permanent problem, then I'd log a note. "Couldn't get there because of an accident on the freeway" or "someone cutting down a tree had the road blocked" or "ran out of daylight, I'll come back" Yeah, that'd be a note.. "Couldn't get to it because there's now a 56 foot high barbed wire fence and attack dogs" on the other hand, warrants an ARCHIVE NOW.

 

As I said.. It depends on the situation..

One thing though.. If you go to the cache and can't find it, at least PM the finder so they can check and see if the problem is you or something else.

 

 

And no, it's not wrong to log a find if you go back and find it after you couldn't earlier. Just don't log multiple finds for the same cache.

[CoyoteRed]

There were a couple that I went to with the cache owner/placer who told us it was missing but to log it anyway, so I logged it.

There are many people who wouldn't dream of logging a cache they didn't find.

[+Cherokeecacher]

No one is counting our DNF's, so Michelle and I log a DNF each time we visit/revisit a cache. If nothing else, maybe the owner will get tired of the e-mail alerts and do something about it. So far I think we have only needed to do this on one cache. Some of our DNF's have turned out to be "missing in action" some were there and we found them the next time we went out. OK I will be honest...there was one cache on our road trip to Delaware that we did not find, but by the time we were at a location where we could get on the internet, it was already archived, so we could not log a DNF on it. So to say we have always logged our DNF's would be a bit misleading.

 

All in all it is a personal decision, and we decided to log DNF's each time we have not found a cache, no matter what the reason, just like we plan to log all of the caches we do find. But this is just how we decided to do things.

 

If you decide not to log a DNF, who will know? If you do log a DNF, or 2 or 25, who is counting?

 

I must agree with CR, if we did not find a cache, that turned out to truly be missing, and the owner said we could log it as a find, we would respectfully decline and leave the DNF. Once again, that is just how we have decided to do things.

[+briansnat]

I saw in a recent post that someone had mentioned they had visted a cache 3 times before actually finding it.

 

How many times do you have to NOT find it before you should consider it a DNF?

 

One

[+Robespierre]

ONE

I hate it, but one.

-as mentioned above, as a cache owner I want to KNOW, and I will check to be sure.

-There's a local cache I help to watch which gets a lot of dnf's. If it gets 2, then I check for the owner, since he lives a lot further than I.

-And, yes, it hurts when the last 12 finders thought it was easy, and you can't even find it after an hour.

[+Rogue_monkey]

This would be a good topic to get opinions on. I wonder if anyone will step up and admit that they will return time and time again until the find it.

 

I have 2 DNF's so far.....I'm not bothered by it. One I simply couldn't find and someone right after me found it and the other the people before me couldn't find and the people after me couldn't find it.....

 

dik

sure i'll step up. I went to look for this once cache 3 times. me and my partner looked at the cache each time we where there but didn't actually find it. the cache was a 1/1 too. that was my first dnf. my second one was the other day, the person before found it the person right after me found it too. i'll be back tho.

 

never give up, never surrender

[+ZackJones]

I fall into the "it depends" crowd. If I have made an honest effort to find the cache but can't I will, but if I start a search and have to call it off suddenly due to sudden rain storm, call from home or work or whatever I won't log a DNF until I've had a 2nd chance to go back out and give it an honest effort.

 

As others have pointed it out there's no shame in logging a DNF and I even go as far as update my map showing which caches I can't find by using a red way point symbol instead of a green symbol.

 

Zack

[+briansnat]

This would be a good topic to get opinions on. I wonder if anyone will step up and admit that they will return time and time again until the find it.

 

I have 2 DNF's so far.....I'm not bothered by it. One I simply couldn't find and someone right after me found it and the other the people before me couldn't find and the people after me couldn't find it.....

 

dik

sure i'll step up. I went to look for this once cache 3 times. me and my partner looked at the cache each time we where there but didn't actually find it. the cache was a 1/1 too. that was my first dnf. my second one was the other day, the person before found it the person right after me found it too. i'll be back tho.

 

never give up, never surrender

But did you log them? If not, how is the cache owner going to know that the cache may be a bit harder than he rated it,

Edited July 15, 2004 by briansnat

[+jj3]

I'm still a nooB too (only found 20) and ALWAYS log my DNFs! I've found 20 and probably have 5 DNFs but I attribute that to my 'green' senses

 

I logged another one just this past weekend and could have swore I was right on top of it...I refuse to read hints in the field (which has probably helped lead to my DNFs) but always come back and watch the caches until the next time I go out and then try to find the again...So far I haven't had to log a DNF twice.

[+G-Squad]

When I first started out, I didn't read the forums. So, I didn't really understand the thought process of why I should log a DNF. Now that I am more experienced, I log DNF's first time, every time.

 

But, I should tell you what I define DNF to mean. For me, the hunt doesn't begin until I step out of the cachemobile, GPSr in hand, and I start hunting in earnest. If I am unsuccessful in the hunt after getting out of the cachemobile, then it is a DNF. It is a DNF regardless of circumstances at this point. If a huge barb wire fence is in my way while I am OUT of the cachemobile, it is a DNF. Driving to the cache location doesn't count. If I pull up to a huge barbwire fence while still driving IN the cachemobile, I will log a note. Same with trees across the road, swollen streams/rivers, traffic backup for 10 miles and I turn around, etc. This is just the way I see it.

[+KG7JE]

One. Each and every one. There was one where I noted that I'd be back. I expected this to be hard and didn't have enought time. But logged a DNF with a note that said "I'll be back!"

 

I have folks log a DNF on one of my caches and the next person (about an hour later) will say "It was out in the open so we covered it up a bit better." Those I grin about. 'Cause I remember that same cache that took a total of 3 visits and nearly 8 hours to find! Other folks were finding it in minutes (or so it seemed).

 

So, a DNF simply means that I could not find it. Now, I don't expect the owner to jump off the couch and look each time I log a DNF. But I can say that when I see somebody else finding it after I DNF, then it gives me an incentive to go back and hunt a little longer/harder.

 

<<maybe I have URL references figured out for this message>>

Edited July 15, 2004 by KG7JE

[+Imajika]

If I go look for it once and cannot find it, I will log a DNF.

 

But I do know of a few Colorado cachers that will go to a site many times and never log a DNF.

 

I guess they think it is some sort of personal failure or embarrassing to log a DNF. I see DNF logs as a way to alert the cache owner that there may be a potential problem with the cache.

 

For example, if one person logs a DNF on one of our hides, they could just be having a bad day or they are brand new and just having a hard time. If a few people log DNF's in a row, I will go check on my cache and verify it is still there and post a note on the cache page.

 

People have debates in these forums about DNF logs a lot and I guess people will play this game however they feel like it but I really appreciate DNF logs.

[+as77]

If I can't find the cache but I feel that I have still not exhausted all my possibilities and I intend to continue the search really soon then I don't log a DNF. I go back the next day and continue where I stopped. It's not a DNF because it's not a failure, I just need more time/thinking. When I finally find it, I usually indicate in the log that I made several visits to it.

 

If however I'm stumped and I feel that I cannot really do much more than what I already did and I do not intend to (or cannot) return anytime soon, i.e. have practically given up, then I log a DNF. I still might make another attempt weeks or months later, but it's uncertain so the DNF should be there.

[+briansnat]

When I finally find it, I usually indicate in the log that I made several visits to it.

 

So you're the one who is doing that! If it takes repeated visits for you to find the cache, is it possible that the cache is a bit harder than the owner might have rated it? How is the owner going to know this if he doesn't see your DNF's?

 

When I go to look for a cache, I scan the logs and if I see DNF's sprinkled among them, I know that I may have to budget more time and look a bit longer for it. If everyone did the same as you, I'd see nothing but "smilies" and I probably look for 10 minutes and give up, figuring the cache is gone. Nothing but smilies indicates that it should be an easy find to me. Seeing DNF's tells me it might not be a piece of cake.

Edited July 15, 2004 by briansnat

[+SixTen]

Well...I am guilty of NOT logging a DNF...

 

I searched for the cache prior to having a GPS...so It was more of a guessing game for me since the maps I had were very uninformative...I wasn't sure if I was looking in the right area at all...so I did not log a DNF on that one...I just went back when I had a GPS and realized that yes..I was in the wrong area!

 

Now that I have a GPS...I would not hesitate to log a DNF if I didn't find it on my first try...

 

-Six

[+JayFredMuggs]

I recently logged a DNF on a cache while on vacation. I will not be returning to the area for severals years, so I logged a DNF after only one attempt.

I also went to a spot closer to home and ran out of daylight in the woods while searching. Even though I didn't find it on the first attempt, I will return in within a few days to resume my search. I didn't log this as a DNF since I am cnfident that I will find it when I have more time.

[+Harrald]

Properly Logging You Dnf's, When to log a DNF?

I generally log them as soon as I get home from not finding a cache.

[+AtoZ]

Well the first DNF we logged was after a second attempt at a local, within a mile and half, cache. Now the cache appears to be abandoned as the Admin have sent a messsage to the owner and no reply so far.

But then on the other had we found a cache that three other people on three differant occasions had sworn was no longer there, one thought it was washed away, NO WAY. So it is a mixed bag it seems. Not sure how to DNF still. I guess if I have one shot then I'll hunt till I drop, LOL. If it is close, read the message again and see if it is inactive, been there. But all kidding aside I guess a DNF can be a nitification that a problem may exist.

cheers

[Dare and Jo]

We logged a DNF a few days ago. Turned out we had the wrong coordinates in the GPS. We were about a half minute walk from the acutual cache location. With the correct coordinates it was a very easy find.

 

--Dare

[Neos2]

I am very, very new to caching (11 finds). I bought my husband a GPS unit for his birthday so we could start geocaching. The first day we ever went out we had two "not finds" that we did not log because we weren't sure if we were even using the GPS the right way. We also didn't spend a very long time on either site (maybe 15 minutes) and we had not read the clues (thought we wouldn't need them-ha!).

I have gone back to both of them since then, and looked more thoroughly, and still not found them. That's when I logged them as DNF and said in my log that it was the second attempt.

From this point forward, I intend to log the first time I look and do not find, and add a note to the same log for each time that I go look without finding the cache. When I finally do find the cache, I will log a separate "Found it"--Unless some cache owner emails to ask me to log each attempt separately.

Not everyone agrees, which makes it difficult to know what to do. One cache owner actually disabled one of their caches temporarily because my husband I had logged our DNFs just after another person logged a DNF--There were three in a row, but 2 of us were newbies. (If it were me, I would take that into consideration). Turns out the owner has a different take on when to log a DNF---and will only do so when they "are sure the cache is missing" (the owners words)--I don't see it that way--after all, if I didn't hide it, how do I know whether it is missing or I am just unable to find it?

[+as77]

So you're the one who is doing that!      If it takes repeated visits for you to find the cache, is it possible that the cache is a bit harder than the owner might have rated it? 

 

No. These are usually hard ones, difficulty 4-5.

 

How is the owner going to know this if he doesn't see your DNF's?

 

If I think the cache harder than it's rating I will indicate that in my log when I finally found it. And he does see my DNF if I give up.

 

If everyone did the same as you, I'd see nothing but "smilies" and I probably look for 10 minutes and give up, figuring the cache is gone.

 

That is not true. As I have clearly described, I will log a DNF after I give up or cannot return to the cache anytime soon.

 

I think what I'm doing is completely fair. Nothing wrong with it.

Who says I'm limited to one visit to find a cache? If while searching for a cache I get hungry and go home for lunch then return then you think I should log a DNF while home?

Edited July 15, 2004 by as77

[+okpondlady/N5PNE]

But, I should tell you what I define DNF to mean. For me, the hunt doesn't begin until I step out of the cachemobile, GPSr in hand, and I start hunting in earnest. If I am unsuccessful in the hunt after getting out of the cachemobile, then it is a DNF. It is a DNF regardless of circumstances at this point. If a huge barb wire fence is in my way while I am OUT of the cachemobile, it is a DNF. Driving to the cache location doesn't count. If I pull up to a huge barbwire fence while still driving IN the cachemobile, I will log a note. Same with trees across the road, swollen streams/rivers, traffic backup for 10 miles and I turn around, etc. This is just the way I see it.

 

Me too. If I don't find it after I am at the Park or Site or whatever then it is a DNF. I didn't find it, I didn't sign the log or get proof if it is a virtual. Since we do alot of caching out of town, if we broke for lunch and agreed to go back later (which we usually don't, we look till we quit then move on to next) then I wouldn't consider it a DNF. I wouldn't have had access to a computer to log it anyway.

 

Last Sunday we were in Tulsa and STILL Can't find BAJoker's Norberg Park cache :P

But we have been there 2 times and WE WILL return. Both times logged DNF. We visited the site of another micro and we attempted a hunt but it was hot and we just weren't in the mood anymore. We have about decided we hate micros. We will probably be more likely to find after we get Norberg Park. Our main problem is it is an hour and half to find an area with any number of caches to pick from. Since we are quite new we are probably going to filter out micros for the time being.

 

Hope I posted the cache page right

 

Karen aka okpondlady/N5PNE