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Does the Mystery at the Museum "Penalize" Geocachers?

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20 hours ago, dprovan said:

 And I understand what you're saying about the justification for challenge rules, but, at the same time, when the challenge rules were presented, the justifications seemed pretty weak, really almost rationalizations more than explanations.

 

I guess this really goes more to my underlying point.  The idea of "rationalizations more than explanations" aligns perfectly with the way I view this and I think looking at it that way supports my overall argument.  In other words, that they don't really genuinely believe in the rationale behind some of the explanations/justifications that they gave for some of these rules.  It seems to me it would be much more honest if they were just like "Look challenge caches are a pain in the a** to administer and we're just making these rules to make our lives a lot easier" rather than trying to come up with these weak lame explanations that they don't seem to actually believe in themselves.

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There are plenty of threads about challenge cache rules if folks wish to continue the discussion there.  This thread is about the alleged punitive effect of the Mystery at the Museum promotion.

 

Back on topic, I finished the promotion Sunday after making two caching roadtrips.  The roadtrips were both awesome; one took me into the Allegheny mountains for some tough hikes, and the other took me to a well-run Mega Event with lots of fun caches to find, including some showcase "gadget caches."  I did not feel "penalized" in any way by doing my roadtrips.

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39 minutes ago, Keystone said:

I finished the promotion Sunday after making two caching roadtrips.  The roadtrips were both awesome; one took me into the Allegheny mountains for some tough hikes, and the other took me to a well-run Mega Event with lots of fun caches to find, including some showcase "gadget caches."  I did not feel "penalized" in any way by doing my roadtrips.

 

+1

 

I look forward to a road trip. I even consider the hour drive to a cache-rich place, due to some promotion. It's highly unlikely that I'd find about 50 caches in a month (roughly what the Souvenir promotions require), but I make some plans and see how well I do. This time, I managed to acquire the first souvenir. But if I ever begin to think that Groundspeak is forcing me into the drudgery of Geocaching in faraway places, I might consider a different hobby.  :anicute:

 

 

Edited by kunarion
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With a "cache centroid" two states away in Indiana, it's clear that my player account enjoys roadtrips.  The promotion gave me an excuse to take one.  (Attending the Mega Event was already planned.)  If the promotion required all finds to be within 50 miles of home, I'd feel penalized, as I've found quite a few caches in that radius.  If the promotion required all finds to be greater than 50 miles from home, you and others would feel penalized.

 

Fortunately the ground rules did not require either of these things.  I acknowledge that the results for a geocacher living in a cache-sparse area, or who has "cached out" their local area, may operate to force a roadtrip if that geocacher wants to pursue the promotion's souvenirs.  That's true to some extent with many promotions, such as International Earthcache Day.  There's always the choice of not pursuing the souvenirs if the effort doesn't appear fun.  For me, roadtrips were more fun than completing the tasks locally.

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23 minutes ago, Keystone said:

For me, roadtrips were more fun than completing the tasks locally.

In more developed countries there is even a way to do that by Public Transport. 😉

 

Hans

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8 minutes ago, HHL said:

In more developed countries there is even a way to do that by Public Transport. 😉

 

 

My underdeveloped country will take back its internet and satellites, thankyouverymuch.

 

Enjoy Glonass and your bus ride.

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21 minutes ago, Keystone said:

 

My underdeveloped country will take back its internet and satellites, thankyouverymuch.

 

Enjoy Glonass and your bus ride.

 

We'll enjoy Glonass AND Galileo ;)

And take back our www (developed At CERN, Switserland), enjoy text based internet ;)

 

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1 hour ago, HHL said:

In more developed countries there is even a way to do that by Public Transport. 😉

 

AAACK! Long trips on Public Transport?!! Now I'm really beginning to sympathize with that unfortunate OP!

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2 minutes ago, kunarion said:

 

AAACK! Long trips on Public Transport?!! Now I'm really beginning to sympathize with that unfortunate OP!

 

Depends on the public transport. From where we live we can get to 3 major cities in about 30 minutes. Ideal way to cache in a city as it's hard/expensive to park and it costs less than the parking fee and we can take our bikes or rent one at the many city bike/blue bike self serve stands.  For longer trips we have a choice of high speed trains we can transfer to after a 25 minute ride on a "normal" train. It takes less than 3 hours to get to Amsterdam, London, Paris, Koln...  The same goes for other places but of course, you can't compare that to the US situation.

 

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29 minutes ago, on4bam said:

 

Depends on the public transport. From where we live we can get to 3 major cities in about 30 minutes. Ideal way to cache in a city as it's hard/expensive to park and it costs less than the parking fee and we can take our bikes or rent one at the many city bike/blue bike self serve stands.  For longer trips we have a choice of high speed trains we can transfer to after a 25 minute ride on a "normal" train. It takes less than 3 hours to get to Amsterdam, London, Paris, Koln...  The same goes for other places but of course, you can't compare that to the US situation.

 

 

I took a train a couple of years ago from Portland to Eugene, Oregon.  Not specifically for Geocaching, but on the suggestion that it saves driving from the airport and is cheaper.  It was the Coast Starlight.  Plenty of room for my suitcase, no “security check-in”, no strapping oneself in, you can walk around, visit a restaurant car, whatever.  Several college kids were excitedly returning to Los Angeles from a trip north.  People to chat with.  It was not an especially scenic route, and the train was one and a half hours late.  Plus, waiting on a side track for an express, it arrived even a half-hour later than that.  But over all, it was a cool trip!

 

 

Edited by kunarion
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2 hours ago, Keystone said:

With a "cache centroid" two states away in Indiana, it's clear that my player account enjoys roadtrips.  The promotion gave me an excuse to take one.  (Attending the Mega Event was already planned.)  If the promotion required all finds to be within 50 miles of home, I'd feel penalized, as I've found quite a few caches in that radius.  If the promotion required all finds to be greater than 50 miles from home, you and others would feel penalized.

 

Fortunately the ground rules did not require either of these things.  I acknowledge that the results for a geocacher living in a cache-sparse area, or who has "cached out" their local area, may operate to force a roadtrip if that geocacher wants to pursue the promotion's souvenirs.  That's true to some extent with many promotions, such as International Earthcache Day.  There's always the choice of not pursuing the souvenirs if the effort doesn't appear fun.  For me, roadtrips were more fun than completing the tasks locally.

 

My cache centroid is in another country, but  the closest I've ever come to taking a road trip specifically for geocaching was the 100 mile r/t trip I took to The Spot (GC39).  I doubt that a promotion will ever provide an incentive to go on a road trip specifically for geocaching.  For 7 days of the promotion I was 3300 miles from home, but I only found one cache and it didn't count at all for the promotion.

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Is there a way to opt of this mystery? 

 

A setting I can adjust to stop getting notifications or whatever regarding mystery?

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8 minutes ago, kunarion said:

 

I took a train a couple of years ago from Eugene to Portland, Oregon.  Not specifically for Geocaching, but on the suggestion that it saves driving from the airport and is cheaper.  It was the Coast Starlight.  Plenty of room for my suitcase, no “security check-in”, no strapping oneself in, you can walk around, visit a restaurant car, whatever.  Several college kids were excitedly travelling from Los Angeles on a 3-day trip north.  People to chat with.  It was not an especially scenic route, and the train was one an a half hours late.  Plus, waiting on a side track for an express, it arrived even a half-hour later than that.  But over all, it was a cool trip!

 

Now that I think about it, I did take a train from  Hassalt, Belgium to Luxembourg for an overnight stay and partially so that I could find a few caches in a new country.   That was about a 3 hour trip with transfers.   I have taken the train to find a few cachs on a few other occassion (always in Europe).   I took the half hour train ride from Copenhagen airport to Malmo, Sweden and a 10 minute ride from Tokyo airport to the town of Narita.  In both those cases, it was specifically to find a few caches.  

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1 minute ago, brodiebunch said:

Is there a way to opt of this mystery? 

 

A setting I can adjust to stop getting notifications or whatever regarding mystery?

Not sure what you mean but I haven't seen any notifications about this promotion. I don't get newsletters or other stuff either. So I guess you subscribed to something to get the e-mails.

 

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44 minutes ago, kunarion said:

 

AAACK! Long trips on Public Transport?!! Now I'm really beginning to sympathize with that unfortunate OP!

 

Is a flight on a commercial airline considered public transport?  I've chosen flight itineraries several times that allowed me to visit a new country, and partially for the opportunity to geocache there.  In some cases, it was in lieu of a direct or more "convenient" itinerary with a quick layover and often has included an overnight stay.

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1 minute ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 and a 10 minute ride from Tokyo airport to the town of Narita.  In both those cases, it was specifically to find a few caches.  

 

Japan is train heaven. In 2009 we traveled all over Japan (everything south of Tokyo) by train, this year we'll start in Sapporo and make our way South by car and 2 Shinkansen trains.

 

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We just finished Mystery at the Museum.  We live in Montana with lots of miles and relatively few caches.  We started in '01, so we have pretty well cleaned out anything close (~100 mile radius).  We used a Nuvi to track our mileage - 1133 miles, 60-70 gallons of fuel, and three big bags of sunflower seeds.  No complaints other than the let down of looking forward to solving the case only to find out we needed to find another 35 caches.  It felt a little like an old "bait and switch" scheme.

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1 hour ago, kunarion said:

 

AAACK! Long trips on Public Transport?!! Now I'm really beginning to sympathize with that unfortunate OP!

 

Oh, I don't know: all the caches I've found in the last fortnight have been gotten to using public transport - a trip that would have been over 3,700 kilometres (2,300 miles) and taken 42 hours worth of driving.

 

It's so much easier to sleep on public transport.

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I used public transport in my home city for years, only getting my own vehicle a couple of years ago. It's certainly doable, it's just a very different mentality and scheduling strategy. In a way, you shape your life around your transit means. It's hard to simply jump from one to the other.

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8 hours ago, Keystone said:

Back on topic, I finished the promotion Sunday after making two caching roadtrips.  The roadtrips were both awesome; one took me into the Allegheny mountains for some tough hikes, and the other took me to a well-run Mega Event with lots of fun caches to find, including some showcase "gadget caches."  I did not feel "penalized" in any way by doing my roadtrips.

 

To get my fingerprints and footprints I did a road trip up north (95km each way) where there was a bit of a cluster of caches with the clues I needed. I went to a mega too, the Oz Geomuster in Wollongong (about 180km each way), but that was held the weekend before the promotion started. A longer road trip up north past Maitland to do the dog's (or is it a goat's) head power trail near Colleda is something I considered, but I don't think I have the mental stamina to endure 50 caches on a power trail in one day (my "best day" is 22 on a similar trail at last year's mega and that was enough for me in one day).

 

6 hours ago, HHL said:

In more developed countries there is even a way to do that by Public Transport. 😉

 

There'a a new metro just opened in northwestern Sydney with a turn up and ride service frequency, so I looked to see if that might be an option for the jewel caches but no, there are few caches within walking distance of any of its stations. I did a couple of train trips down to Sydney harbour to get the high-FP caches I needed for the Cache Carnival promotion earlier in the year and have done other caching around there over the years so that area's pretty much cached out for me now. The rest of our rail network isn't really well suited to this sort of promotion as there aren't enough caches clustered close to stations.

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On 7/31/2019 at 6:26 PM, barefootjeff said:

There'a a new metro just opened in northwestern Sydney with a turn up and ride service frequency, so I looked to see if that might be an option for the jewel caches but no, there are few caches within walking distance of any of its stations.

Seems like there's an opportunity there.

 

In Europe caches located near train stations are quite common.  In some areas they're part of an informal series called "Sidetracked" or "REALLY Sidetracked"

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28 minutes ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

Seems like there's an opportunity there.

 

In Europe caches located near train stations are quite common.  In some areas they're part of an informal series called "Sidetracked" or "REALLY Sidetracked"

 

We have quite a few Sidetracked caches at some of the older stations around Sydney, but there's usually a bit of cache-friendly parkland or greenery around those. The metro stations are either underground or elevated, and the line essentially runs parallel to one of Sydney's busiest six-lane highways (they built the metro to try to ease some of the chronic traffic congestion), so not really conducive to caches. Of course having said that, there'll probably be a northwest metro Sidetracked power trail published tomorrow.

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5 hours ago, barefootjeff said:

 

We have quite a few Sidetracked caches at some of the older stations around Sydney, but there's usually a bit of cache-friendly parkland or greenery around those. The metro stations are either underground or elevated, and the line essentially runs parallel to one of Sydney's busiest six-lane highways (they built the metro to try to ease some of the chronic traffic congestion), so not really conducive to caches. Of course having said that, there'll probably be a northwest metro Sidetracked power trail published tomorrow.

 

I would image that, like caches near airports, the areas around some train stations might not be especially scenic.  If one stays on a train long enough, eventually it might get somewhere fairly nice, or a 15 minute walk from the station might improve things.    I don't really know what the criteria is for a Sidetracked or REALLY Sidetracked cache other than they're generally accessible from a train station.

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3 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 

I would image that, like caches near airports, the areas around some train stations might not be especially scenic.  If one stays on a train long enough, eventually it might get somewhere fairly nice, or a 15 minute walk from the station might improve things.    I don't really know what the criteria is for a Sidetracked or REALLY Sidetracked cache other than they're generally accessible from a train station.

I'm not sure that there is a specific criteria. Most of the ones I've found have been fairly adjacent I'd say.

 

I agree that many stations might not be all that pleasant areas to be around - but plenty in the sort of area I live in are. And there's always https://coord.info/GCYTN2 (not a sidetracked cache of course).

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1 hour ago, Blue Square Thing said:

I agree that many stations might not be all that pleasant areas to be around - but plenty in the sort of area I live in are. And there's always https://coord.info/GCYTN2 (not a sidetracked cache of course).

 

Probably the most scenic station in these parts is Wondabyne, located at the headwaters of Mullet Creek and servicing the small waterside community there as well as providing access to the national park.

 

image.png.a82b711ca7ba345387c60568edfd0574.png

 

There are no Sidetracked caches there but there's an old 2002 traditional about 100 metres from the station as well as an EarthCache just up the hill a bit. I also have a multi with one of its virtual waypoints on the platform and the final on the clifftops overlooking the waterway.

 

None of those caches are likely to see much traffic from Mystery at the Museum, though, as the train service is only once an hour.

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Just OT for sec. Is there a link somewhere re "Sidetrack" caches. I have something in mind depending on criteria.

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With that "thank you," I declare the sidetracking of this thread for purposes of discussing the Sidetracked series to be at an end.  Let's return to the topic at hand.

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Posted (edited)
On 7/31/2019 at 6:59 AM, Keystone said:

...

Back on topic, I finished the promotion Sunday after making two caching roadtrips.  The roadtrips were both awesome; one took me into the Allegheny mountains for some tough hikes, and the other took me to a well-run Mega Event with lots of fun caches to find, including some showcase "gadget caches."  I did not feel "penalized" in any way by doing my roadtrips.

 

I'll throw in my vote.

This quote is clutch, for me, in understanding the situation.

I had a similar thought process reflected in this thread when the promotion first came out. First I thought, "Ugh, not only do I have to go out of my way to get caches, but I have to get specific ones at specific times!" My first inclination about the promotion was that it was lousy. But after a few minutes I realized that actually this is what a promotion should do - get me off my butt to go get some caches I might otherwise have little desire to seek out. Now I've been to several areas that I wouldn't normally seek out, because of the promotion. I mean, sure, I may have eventually gone to the areas "because I'm bored" and wanted to do geocaching, like that could have eventually happened, but this promotion spurred me to do it sooner.

I'll also point out that a lot of my family members, who are really new geocachers, love this sort of thing and this has really gotten them to get out and go go go for more caches. It's definitely cementing the hobby for them, if you know what I mean.

Do I think the promotion "penalizes" me because I have to go out of my way to get more caches? Not in the slightest. You know, Jesus taught about this concept with the parable of the laborers in the vineyard in Matthew 20:1-15 . Long story short, we are not diminished when someone else is added upon. It's an optimistic and others-focused way of seeing things.

 

Edited by Korichnovui
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This is my final gemstone find related to the mystery at the museum souvenir hunt that GC HQ is running for 2019. I am not returning the gemstones to the vault. I am keeping them to cover the cost of wear and tear on my car and my gas expenses.

 

Found this log on a cache page today...

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I have punted on the promotion.

 

Generally I am pretty picky on which caches I will look for.

To do the promotion I had to lower my general standards to find the attributes.

To get a gem I did a cache before softball right by the field that I had been ignoring for the past 3 months. 

It is 1 foot inside the park hidden a bush specifically there to give the neighbor some privacy and the cache has been having issues with getting muggled recently.

Sure enough I find half a cache like a bunch of other cachers and there is no sign of a recent throw down.   

I file a "needs maintenance" and promptly get an aggressive PM saying there is a recent throw down so it should be there.

Whatever - I going back to being picky about what I look for and ignoring a random constraint from Seattle.  

 

 

 

 

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35 minutes ago, schmittfamily said:

I have punted on the promotion.

 

Generally I am pretty picky on which caches I will look for.

To do the promotion I had to lower my general standards to find the attributes.

To get a gem I did a cache before softball right by the field that I had been ignoring for the past 3 months. 

It is 1 foot inside the park hidden a bush specifically there to give the neighbor some privacy and the cache has been having issues with getting muggled recently.

Sure enough I find half a cache like a bunch of other cachers and there is no sign of a recent throw down.   

I file a "needs maintenance" and promptly get an aggressive PM saying there is a recent throw down so it should be there.

Whatever - I going back to being picky about what I look for and ignoring a random constraint from Seattle.  

 

 

 

 

I'd log a NA in a flash.  Arrogant, lazy COs tick me off.

Edited by colleda
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45 minutes ago, schmittfamily said:

I have punted on the promotion.

 

Generally I am pretty picky on which caches I will look for.

To do the promotion I had to lower my general standards to find the attributes.

To get a gem I did a cache before softball right by the field that I had been ignoring for the past 3 months. 

It is 1 foot inside the park hidden a bush specifically there to give the neighbor some privacy and the cache has been having issues with getting muggled recently.

Sure enough I find half a cache like a bunch of other cachers and there is no sign of a recent throw down.   

I file a "needs maintenance" and promptly get an aggressive PM saying there is a recent throw down so it should be there.

Whatever - I going back to being picky about what I look for and ignoring a random constraint from Seattle.  

 

 

 

 

I've just returned from a 3300 mile county collecting road trip with no intentions to do this promotion. When I got home and started logging finds I saw that I was two "diamonds" away from completing it so might as well finish. Since I live in a cache poor area my 100 miles search only returned three caches with a diamond and when I looked at the first one on the list I lost interest. Earlier this year the CO logged an OM saying he was removing the cache because mowers kept breaking it, this was followed by six DNF and then flagged for NM 90 days ago, why was this included in a promotion? If the CO didn't get a CHS email then CHS is broken, if he did get an email why include this cache in the promotion?

 

I think the concept is a good idea but it needs some fine tuning, for now I'll go back to ignoring the promotions. I'm going caching tomorrow and if I find what I need fine, if not I'm not too concerned.

Edited by 31BMSG

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22 hours ago, Korichnovui said:

I'll also point out that a lot of my family members, who are really new geocachers, love this sort of thing and this has really gotten them to get out and go go go for more caches. It's definitely cementing the hobby for them, if you know what I mean.

 

That's fine, if you and your family enjoy going out and getting lots of caches, and I'm glad this promotion is enhancing your enjoyment. For me, though, finding the cache is almost an anticlimax, as it's often the preparation (solving the puzzle if it's a mystery, planning the trip if it's a long hike, checking the tides and winds if it's a kayaking cache, etc.) and the journey to the waypoints and GZ that I enjoy the most. The two biggest things I've gotten from caching over the past six years have been the amazing places it's taken me to, often places I would never have otherwise discovered, and the camaraderie of other like-minded cachers. Yesterday, for example, was one of the highlights of my caching year. With ten others in the group, we headed off on a 10km hike with the main goal being a cache near the summit of Mount Wondabyne where a family team amongst us made their 1000th find. From there we headed back along a different track past a couple of my hides which the rest of the group enjoyed while I watched on in amusement. Since I'd previously found the Mt Wondabyne cache in 2013, my find count for the day was zero yet it was still one of my most memorable and enjoyable caching days.

 

Yes, I know souvenir promotions can't really cater for that sort of caching activity, but perhaps there could some recognition occasionally that, for some, caching isn't just all about finding lots of caches. One thing I have to keep in mind if I want caching to continue to play a major role through my retirement years is that every cache I find today is one I won't be able to find tomorrow.

Edited by barefootjeff
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On 7/20/2019 at 7:21 PM, Keystone said:

I split off all the above posts about the concept of "penalizing" geocachers from the main "Mystery at the Museum" thread.  Definitional debates can continue here.  Questions and feedback about the promotion can occur in the main thread.

Can you tell me where the real Mystery at the Museum Thread is?  I would like to read it but a simple search was not helpful

 

I still regret all the time wasted reading about the definition of "penalty"

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Posted (edited)

Thank you The Jester!

Edited by Team OPJim

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I just closed the case... and had fun doing it.  What I don't understand is how there can be a design that does't require more work for someone who has exhausted their local pool of caches.  No matter how you slice it, if you have to drive to get new caches you have to drive to get any promotion of this type.  

 

So was this one well designed?   It certainly wasn't perfect, but it wasn't too bad. 

 

I have plenty of caches in my area left to satisfy the entire set of steps, yet I still went with my caching partner to a park 2 hours from home this Saturday.  Why?  Because that's why I cache.  I don't cache to stay near home... and I can't afford to travel via plane each weekend but we can split the gas money and go see a waterfall that I've never seen, walk a few miles on a trail that had us make several 1000 foot elevation changes to get the heart going... and cussing at film containers over a mile from the nearest road that are labelled regular size.  The need to hit the final 20 caches didn't make us travel... it was the urge to so something new.  The 15/35 just set the numeric goal at 20.  We did 23.

Edited by CachedIronSkillet
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10 minutes ago, CachedIronSkillet said:

I just closed the case... and had fun doing it.  What I don't understand is how there can be a design that does't require more work for someone who has exhausted their local pool of caches.  No matter how you slice it, if you have to drive to get new caches you have to drive to get any promotion of this type.  

 

So was this one well designed?   It certainly wasn't perfect, but it wasn't too bad. 

 

I have plenty of caches in my area left to satisfy the entire set of steps, yet I still went with my caching partner to a park 2 hours from home this Saturday.  Why?  Because that's why I cache.  I don't cache to stay near home... and I can't afford to travel via plane each weekend but we can split the gas money and go see a waterfall that I've never seen, walk a few miles on a trail that had us make several 1000 foot elevation changes to get the heart going... and cussing at film containers over a mile from the nearest road that are labelled regular size.  The need to hit the final 20 caches didn't make us travel... it was the urge to so something new.  The 15/35 just set the numeric goal at 20.  We did 23.

I concur.  I would like to see promotions that aren't twice as hard for those who have already found everything nearby

 

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2 hours ago, CachedIronSkillet said:

What I don't understand is how there can be a design that does't require more work for someone who has exhausted their local pool of caches.  No matter how you slice it, if you have to drive to get new caches you have to drive to get any promotion of this type.  

 

Well you only have to look back to 2015 for that year's Road Trip promotion. Each week had a different task to perform to get that week's souvenir:

  • Meet Your Road Trip Crew - attend an event.
  • Fun with Favourites - find one cache with ten or more FPs.
  • High Five for the Earth - find one EarthCache or attend a CITO.
  • Let's Get Extreme - find one cache with terrain 5 or difficulty 5.
  • Put On Your Thinking Cap - find one mystery cache.
  • Road Trip Hero - awarded just for getting the other five souvenirs.

So all up a total of four caches to find and one event to attend (or three caches, an event and a CITO). A far cry from the present-day promotions requiring anything up to 100 finds (as in Hidden Creatures) to complete, and on top of that they're now quarterly instead of annual.

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10 hours ago, barefootjeff said:

 

Well you only have to look back to 2015 for that year's Road Trip promotion. Each week had a different task to perform to get that week's souvenir:

  • Meet Your Road Trip Crew - attend an event.
  • Fun with Favourites - find one cache with ten or more FPs.
  • High Five for the Earth - find one EarthCache or attend a CITO.
  • Let's Get Extreme - find one cache with terrain 5 or difficulty 5.
  • Put On Your Thinking Cap - find one mystery cache.
  • Road Trip Hero - awarded just for getting the other five souvenirs.

So all up a total of four caches to find and one event to attend (or three caches, an event and a CITO). A far cry from the present-day promotions requiring anything up to 100 finds (as in Hidden Creatures) to complete, and on top of that they're now quarterly instead of annual.

 

[Sarcasm warning]. Maybe they could redo this next year but add a final step where you then go find 100 caches in a 10 square mile area :)

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4 minutes ago, Team OPJim said:

[Sarcasm warning]. Maybe they could redo this next year but add a final step where you then go find 100 caches in a 10 square mile area :)

This forum really needs a sad :sad: smiley response...

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On 8/5/2019 at 12:04 AM, barefootjeff said:
  • Let's Get Extreme - find one cache with terrain 5 or difficulty 5.

 

Someone who has exhausted the 5s in their area may have a harder time doing this than they would finding 35 random caches, no?   Again, every design will make it harder for people who have cached longer.  

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1 hour ago, CachedIronSkillet said:
On 8/4/2019 at 9:04 PM, barefootjeff said:
  • Let's Get Extreme - find one cache with terrain 5 or difficulty 5.

Someone who has exhausted the 5s in their area may have a harder time doing this than they would finding 35 random caches, no?   Again, every design will make it harder for people who have cached longer.  

If I had cached out my local area, then I'd rather plan a trip to find a single T5 or D5 cache, than plan a trip to find 35 random caches.

 

For that matter, even if I hadn't cached out my local area, I'd rather go find a single T5 or D5 cache than find 35 random caches.

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2 hours ago, CachedIronSkillet said:

 

Someone who has exhausted the 5s in their area may have a harder time doing this than they would finding 35 random caches, no?   Again, every design will make it harder for people who have cached longer.  

 

I generally avoid 5T caches.  But for my Fizzy Challenge, I needed a 3.5/5.  Long drive.  Hiked through the frozen swamp.  Sat on a fallen log in the river.  Reached out over the river.  And I got it!!  (Most of my 5Ts aren't really 5T.  But this one was!)

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Posted (edited)
On 7/19/2019 at 1:18 AM, barefootjeff said:

 

The penalty is in the travel required and of course the time that entails. So far I've managed a whole 3 caches in this promotion, the detective and two shadow clues, using what were the closest caches to home that would serve the purpose, but getting to those and back took 146km of driving. With 54 more required to complete all the souvenirs, my car, which was serviced last week, would almost need another by the end of it.

 

This also comes on top of the more recent promotions which have all been numbers chases, the Hidden Creatures in particular which needed 100 finds for the top level (I got as far as the mermaid with 11 finds). The Cache Carnival could be done with a smaller number of 50+ FP caches but they pretty much only exist in the big city tourist hotspots here so it still required a lot of travelling. Planetary Pursuit had another high find count target, helped a bit with some D/T multipliers, but I only scraped through that thanks to all the geoart caches for the nearby mega which coincided with the promotion. Even starting with a reasonable density of nearby unfound caches, a few of this style of promotion back to back soon uses that up, especially now that the promotions are quarterly rather than annual.

I am pretty new to this, but isn't the whole point of geocaching getting out, traveling, and exploring?  If you don't want to travel and explore, why are you doing it? That's an honest question. 

Edited by spacemule

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40 minutes ago, spacemule said:

I am pretty new to this, but isn't the whole point of geocaching getting out, traveling, and exploring?  If you don't want to travel and explore, why are you doing it? That's an honest question. 

 

You're putting too much emphasis on the literal meanings of those words associated with the phrase "the whole point".

 

I enjoy caching, but don't have a lot of time to travel, and frankly couldn't justify taking trips JUST to bag caches.

 

So, while getting out, travelling and exploring are excellent benefits of geocaching, some of us get other things out of it.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, spacemule said:

I am pretty new to this, but isn't the whole point of geocaching getting out, traveling, and exploring?  If you don't want to travel and explore, why are you doing it? That's an honest question. 

 

Yes, getting out and exploring is very much my thing. A few months back I made my 1000th find on a cache that took me on a 7 hour hike through rugged terrain to a spectacular location on the clifftops high above the Hawkesbury River:

 

DSC_0011_small.jpg.f2d606ae66a04d7166a7aa4d2a4a26f7.jpg

 

But caches like that don't get you very far in this promotion because of the time they take to complete, the distance between them and the quota of finds needed at each level. Instead all the travelling I did for just the first two levels (detective and clues) led me to suburban P&G micros; over 300km of driving, mostly in heavy traffic on the motorway, with the "getting out" being just opening and closing the car door. At that point I gave up on it and went back to doing the style of caches I enjoy, which at this point in time have netted me just one of the required fifteen jewels.

 

This promotion, like the four preceding it, is really promoting urban and power trail caching, not out-in-the-wilderness caching. That's great for all those who enjoy that style of thing, and it seems they're now the great majority in caching, but it's not for me. Just as well, as the nearest power trails are over 100km away and there aren't that many urban caches around here either, not enough to sustain the rate these promotions are now happening at.

Edited by barefootjeff
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18 hours ago, spacemule said:

I am pretty new to this, but isn't the whole point of geocaching getting out, traveling, and exploring?  If you don't want to travel and explore, why are you doing it? That's an honest question. 

 

Some people don't have the time or inclination to travel and explore on a regular basis.  Some prefer the thrill of the hunt and the excitement of finding a cache, even if it's the 1000th P&G they've found.  Others want to find caches that take them to an interesting or off-beat location.  Others want to find caches that have swag.  Others want to get out on a trail for physical exercise and find that caching provides some extra incentive but is secondary to their main goal.  Others want to learn about some geological features near home or abroad.  Others want to drive .10, hop out, find a cache, and do it over again for 20 miles.  None of these things "require" you to travel and explore as many people have access to caches less than 5 miles from home.  There's no single way to define how or why cachers choose to cache.

 

That being said, the point for me is to find caches that I enjoy, which might include travel and exploration but also might include finding a cache a mile from home that's hidden in a way I've never encountered before.

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