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Dogmeat*

FTF Being Claimed Before Cache is Published

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Tonight around 2am the emails started pouring in and I was already in my car and literally around the corner from the first of an 18 cache series. Within five minutes I was at GZ with my flashlight searching for the first one. I found it, opened it up, and to my surprise the FTF was already claimed. Yet, one of the three people that claimed the FTF in the logbook is six years old and it's 2am. I know they weren't out there because when I say I was literally around the corner I mean it. I was coming off the highway and the GZ was in sight when I got the email. Once I loaded the app and followed it, which took about five minutes, I was there.

 

How do you feel about people logging finds before friends put the cache out or signing the logbook in general before a cache is published?

 

I didn't log it as found yet because I'm waiting to see what they say in their log before I log it.

Edited by Keystone
original content restored

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There's a difference between FTF (First To Find) and FTFAP (First To Find After Publication). And FTL (First To Log) is different still.

 

And geocaching.com is just a listing service. There is nothing in Groundspeak's TOU that prohibits cache owners from distributing the geocache coordinates before they're published on the geocaching.com site.

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Nothing wrong with people signing the logbook if they were with their friend when they hid it.

 

As for the FTF business, if I signed the logbook before publishing I wouldn't claim FTF, although I guess technically I was. If you're not sure what to write in your log, you can just say 'FTF after publishing' and add it to your FTF bookmark list (if you have one). I ran into a situation exactly like you described and did just that.

 

Other than that, I wouldn't worry too much about it. It's just not worth getting upset about.

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Tonight around 2am the emails started pouring in and I was already in my car and literally around the corner from the first of an 18 cache series. Within five minutes I was at GZ with my flashlight searching for the first one. I found it, opened it up, and to my surprise the FTF was already claimed. Yet, one of the three people that claimed the FTF in the logbook is six years old and it's 2am. I know they weren't out there because when I say I was literally around the corner I mean it. I was coming off the highway and the GZ was in sight when I got the email. Once I loaded the app and followed it, which took about five minutes, I was there.

 

How do you feel about people logging finds before friends put the cache out or signing the logbook in general before a cache is published?

 

I didn't log it as found yet because I'm waiting to see what they say in their log before I log it.

 

Depends on the circumstances. I remember being second to find on a cache, four days before it was published. I was meeting a caching buddy in town and he'd found a cache that wasn't on his pocket query for the area, so he asked me about it and it reminded me of a really old one. But then he said the log was blank, so I checked my map and found no cache there. He showed me the cache and I signed the log too.

 

I gave my local friendly reviewer the coordinates and asked if we'd found a new cache or the final to a puzzle, and it turned out it was a cache that hadn't been published yet. It was pure luck, my caching buddy saw the area and figured it would be a good spot for a cache, and as luck would have it there was a cache there. So he claimed FTF and I claimed 2TF.

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Sorry. I didn't realize we had to "claim" our first to finds and seconds to finds to make them count. I should be good now.

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I never understood the concepts of "claiming" or "awarding" FTFs. FTF is a simple matter of fact.

 

As far as FTFs before publishing, this is just a listing service. The cache belongs to the owner and its nobody elses business to who, how, when and where the owner advertizes hs cache coodinates. There is no rule, written or otherwise, that says a cache must be published on geocaching.com first.

Edited by briansnat

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Tonight around 2am the emails started pouring in and I was already in my car and literally around the corner from the first of an 18 cache series. Within five minutes I was at GZ with my flashlight searching for the first one. I found it, opened it up, and to my surprise the FTF was already claimed. Yet, one of the three people that claimed the FTF in the logbook is six years old and it's 2am. I know they weren't out there because when I say I was literally around the corner I mean it. I was coming off the highway and the GZ was in sight when I got the email. Once I loaded the app and followed it, which took about five minutes, I was there.

 

How do you feel about people logging finds before friends put the cache out or signing the logbook in general before a cache is published?

 

I didn't log it as found yet because I'm waiting to see what they say in their log before I log it.

 

Hello Dogmeat. You're going to find that a lot of the people around here think the whole FTF thing is silly (guilty here), and therefore so is caring about who gets to "claim" FTF as well. If your area is like most, only a tiny number of premium members whom you can probably count on your fingers are into the FTF thing.

 

All that being said, I always thought shenanigans like you describe are rude and underhanded to those who seek blank logs. I for one, at least sympathize with you. :)

Edited by Mr.Yuck

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FTF's appear to be important to Dogmeat* as he has 41 of them prominently listed on his profile page. I was excited for my first FTF (and still am to a lesser degree) but the FTF "specialists" always beat me to it, lol.

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FTF's appear to be important to Dogmeat* as he has 41 of them prominently listed on his profile page. I was excited for my first FTF (and still am to a lesser degree) but the FTF "specialists" always beat me to it, lol.

 

So he does! I wonder what these threads would be like if only people who displayed their FTF's in their profile were allowed to respond. There would probably be a it's rude and underhanded consensus. :P

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All that being said, I always thought shenanigans like you describe are rude and underhanded to those who seek blank logs. I for one, at least sympathize with you

 

You should have seen the nasty e-mail I got from one FTF hound when I recycled a container and a logbook. I had simply re-listed a wildly unpopular puzzle as a traditional and because there were only a few sigs in the logbook, I didn't bother swapping it out.

 

Well apparently (judging from the blistering e-mail) that blank logbook is more important to many FTF hounds than the fun of finding the cache.

Edited by briansnat

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How do you feel about people logging finds before friends put the cache out or signing the logbook in general before a cache is published?

 

I didn't log it as found yet because I'm waiting to see what they say in their log before I log it.

I have been with cachers while they have hidden caches. I never sign the logbook and I never claim a Find. When I know they are getting ready to hide a cache I will often continue on down the trail so I don't see exactly where or how it is hidden. If I return that way on a later date I will stop in, find the cache, sign the log, and log it as a Find just like any other cache.

 

I think signing the log at the time a cache is hidden is cheesy. I think a cache owner giving coordinates to his friends/family before the cache is published is fine. It doesn't really matter to me because I don't care one iota about being the FTF anymore. (I had a stretch back in 2007 where I became a bit of a FTF freak and then I reformed myself.)

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So for an entire 5 minutes you felt entitled to 18 FTFs to list in your profile, but now you are sore over it because a 6 year old defiled the log improperly? I think that if being second on the log sheet is going to get you upset, you might not be cut out for the hound business. You know that you were first, so is it really that important for everyone else to know? Just claim FTF after publishing, geez. :rolleyes:

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It doesn't matter what the log says. You can claim the FTF in your stats no matter how many people have found it before you. There are several that encourage multiple FTF's. One in Yuma recently was in a guard rail and you were told to move it one post after finding so each person can claim a FTF. There are two locally that say as long as it is the first time you found that cache on that day you get a FTF.

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I agree the FTF is controlled (somewhat) by the CO. If I wanted my kids to get FTF on a cache I hid, I would probably let them sign it when I hid it. But, to me, that would be giving them something they didn't earn. If I wanted them to get a smiley for a cache I hid, I would just let them log it as a find without making them sign the log (as long as they helped me hide it). Technically, their name is not on the log, but I am the one auditing it anyway, and who else is going to know (or care)?

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I agree the FTF is controlled (somewhat) by the CO. If I wanted my kids to get FTF on a cache I hid, I would probably let them sign it when I hid it. But, to me, that would be giving them something they didn't earn. If I wanted them to get a smiley for a cache I hid, I would just let them log it as a find without making them sign the log (as long as they helped me hide it). Technically, their name is not on the log, but I am the one auditing it anyway, and who else is going to know (or care)?

Some good thoughts here. we don't put a lot of value on FTF, but respect the local FTF community. I think we would take the kids (they're teens now, so this is hypothetical) back after publication and let them seek on their own knowing it would be a high percentage opportunity for us to run into some local cachers.

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I'd log immediately and joke about how I got to GZ at 2am, 5 minutes after publication, and found the log already signed by a 6-year-old. My official attitude would be to assume the other find was legitimate -- perhaps the publication e-mail to me got delayed several hours, or perhaps the person found it accidentally before it was published -- although depending on what I learned from the logs, I might add the cache to the list of caches I consider FTFs if, for example, the person that signed it admitted to being there when it was hidden or some such.

 

I've also had cases like yours where the person signing didn't consider themselves FTFs, including a few new caches in one area that the CO himself, not intending to claim a find at all, signed in the first slot without realizing it would be confusing.

 

Unlike some, I enjoy the FTF game and think it's a good idea, but, on the other hand, I'm only interested in the chase and don't really care whether I actually get there first. So in a case like this, if someone else wants to claim to be FTF, I'd never dream of worrying about it.

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Depends on the circumstances. I remember being second to find on a cache, four days before it was published. I was meeting a caching buddy in town and he'd found a cache that wasn't on his pocket query for the area, so he asked me about it and it reminded me of a really old one. But then he said the log was blank, so I checked my map and found no cache there. He showed me the cache and I signed the log too.

 

I gave my local friendly reviewer the coordinates and asked if we'd found a new cache or the final to a puzzle, and it turned out it was a cache that hadn't been published yet. It was pure luck, my caching buddy saw the area and figured it would be a good spot for a cache, and as luck would have it there was a cache there. So he claimed FTF and I claimed 2TF.

 

Similar thing happened to me a couple years back. Showed up at a LPC just an hour after publication, only to find it signed three days prior. Later that day, the FTF noted that he had been planning to put his own cache there and much to his surprise discovered the cache when we went to hide his. So, he signed the log as the FTF and kept an eye out for the cache to be published. No mischief or dirty dealing ... just a really weird coincidence.

 

I've been to events where new caches were hidden for the event and coordinates distributed to the attendees prior to their official publication. Sometimes, the FTFs (or the opportunity for a FTF) were raffled off as a door prize.

 

As others have already noted ... there are no rules for what constitutes a "FTF": when you can find it, how many people can co-claim it at the same time, or even if a cache (like a moveable cache) can have multiple FTFs. It's a side game that Groundspeak doesn't recognize (anymore).

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-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Edited by Dogmeat*

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How do you feel about people logging finds before friends put the cache out or signing the logbook in general before a cache is published?

 

I didn't log it as found yet because I'm waiting to see what they say in their log before I log it.

 

Only one ? but there's two questions there...

 

OK it could be the CO's children, and he/she is trying to keep them interested in caching? Thus, lets them sign the log before the cache is placed. Are they claiming FTF on the cache page log?

The other, finding before it's published? Happens often. Caches at events published later, or a lucky find before publication.

 

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Edited by Bear and Ragged

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Hogmeat*, I frankly wouldn't care. You found it first after publishing and can certainly claim that. Only you know how special you are. Otherwise it sounds like sour grapes. You can always duke it out with the 6 year old if you want the unique fame on your profile. :D

Edited by 4wheelin_fool

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It has nothing to do with logging a FTF. It's the fact that there are 18 caches that they're logging without having visited as I expected because the CO emailed me telling me exactly what happened. They helped him make the containers and signed every log and then he put them out,
For the record, this is new information that was not included in your original post.

 

which is why my question clearly asks:

 

How do you feel about people logging finds before friends put the cache out or signing the logbook in general before a cache is published?

There are two questions here, so I've got two different answers.

 

Claiming a "kitchen-table" find (signing the log before the container was even placed) is pretty cheesy, not unlike claiming an "armchair" find (logging a find online without ever visiting the site).

 

Claiming a find because you found the cache and signed the log before the cache listing on geocaching.com was published is fine.

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Nothing wrong with people signing the logbook if they were with their friend when they hid it.

 

If you were there when it was hidden, then you already know where it is located, how do you 'find' it? I'd say it's akin to finding your own cache.

 

 

In a certain state I visit often and geocache in, it's totally acceptable to bring a new cache to an event, let people sign the log, then go out and place it:

 

:D Found it

WooHoo FTF. Xxx Xxxxx was the first to ink this sweet blank log at the meeting in Xxxxxxxx. Thanks for putting out this cool idea for a cache.

 

:D Found it

Found it at the Xxxxxxxx XXX meeting. Thanks for the cache XXX. Cool idea.

 

:grin: Publish Listing

Published

 

:D Found it

First to log. Saw this at the meeting in Xxxxxxxx.

 

:D Found it

Found this one in the back of Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxxxx truck.

 

There are about a dozen similar logs.

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Nothing wrong with people signing the logbook if they were with their friend when they hid it.

 

If you were there when it was hidden, then you already know where it is located, how do you 'find' it? I'd say it's akin to finding your own cache.

 

 

Have you never been caching with someone else? You're both searching, they find it and bring it to you, you sign the log. Not much different. If I'm out hiking with someone and they hide a cache, yes, I am going to sign the logbook. If it's a park and grab, it's not big deal to go back, but if it's a hike, it totally makes sense to sign it while you're there.

Edited by The_Incredibles_

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In a certain state I visit often and geocache in, it's totally acceptable to bring a new cache to an event, let people sign the log, then go out and place it:[/b]

 

:D Found it

WooHoo FTF. Xxx Xxxxx was the first to ink this sweet blank log at the meeting in Xxxxxxxx. Thanks for putting out this cool idea for a cache.

 

:D Found it

Found it at the Xxxxxxxx XXX meeting. Thanks for the cache XXX. Cool idea.

 

:grin: Publish Listing

Published

 

:D Found it

First to log. Saw this at the meeting in Xxxxxxxx.

 

:D Found it

Found this one in the back of Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxxxx truck.

 

There are about a dozen similar logs.

 

This is something I wouldn't do. I don't consider it a geocache until it's at the listed coordinates. Plus, I think if I just signed it at an event, I'd miss out on the best part of geocaching which is the adventure of getting to the cache.

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In a certain state I visit often and geocache in, it's totally acceptable to bring a new cache to an event, let people sign the log, then go out and place it:[/b]

 

:D Found it

WooHoo FTF. Xxx Xxxxx was the first to ink this sweet blank log at the meeting in Xxxxxxxx. Thanks for putting out this cool idea for a cache.

 

:D Found it

Found it at the Xxxxxxxx XXX meeting. Thanks for the cache XXX. Cool idea.

 

:grin: Publish Listing

Published

 

:D Found it

First to log. Saw this at the meeting in Xxxxxxxx.

 

:D Found it

Found this one in the back of Xxxxx and Xxxxxxxxxx truck.

 

There are about a dozen similar logs.

 

This is something I wouldn't do. I don't consider it a geocache until it's at the listed coordinates. Plus, I think if I just signed it at an event, I'd miss out on the best part of geocaching which is the adventure of getting to the cache.

 

There are a number of people who have conflated signing the physical log and logging a find online. To these people the two acts are one in the same. The guidelines don't help when they say "Physical caches can be logged online as 'Found' once the physical log has been signed."

 

If we were to get rid of this puritan interpretation of logging a find online, the silliness of signing a pocket cache at an event or signing the log in a friend's kitchen would be obvious. But we now are in a situation where the signing of the physical entitles you to log a cache online.

 

I'm sure that some people will claim the puritan moniker for someone who believes that to log a find online you have to not just sign the log but also have found the cache. But it is difficult to determine what is meant by 'found' when this activity is often done in groups and teams, including groups that accompany a cache hider to the cache site when the cache was hidden. We can all make up our own rules for just what effort needs to be done to say you found something. But as a wise man once said, "There's no prize, no leaderboard, and no trophy, so there's no reason to get your knickers in a twist about anyone else's definition of a find. "

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This...

 

Bickering over the rules of a cache "find" was never the intent of Geocaching.com. There's no prize, no leaderboard, and no trophy, so there's no reason to get your knickers in a twist about anyone else's definition of a find.
:mmraspberry: :mmraspberry: :mmraspberry:

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Boy, this went downhill, including the OP editing out both of their posts. For the record, I told him that in my opinion, claiming FTF before publishing was "rude and underhanded". Now if you people would all stop putting "congratulations for the FTF to ___________" on your cache pages, perhaps the FTF hounds would realize they're like .01% of the caching populace. :ph34r:

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Boy, this went downhill, including the OP editing out both of their posts. For the record, I told him that in my opinion, claiming FTF before publishing was "rude and underhanded". Now if you people would all stop putting "congratulations for the FTF to ___________" on your cache pages, perhaps the FTF hounds would realize they're like .01% of the caching populace. :ph34r:

 

What? Like this?

 

Scrolling Marquee

 

You know what? I enjoy seeing people rush out to get a FTF on my caches and reading their FTF logs.

 

It would be terribly boring if you published a cache and you're sitting there for days waiting for someone who 'happened to be in the area' to find it. :(

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Groundspeak's Official Rules regarding FTF:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Informal Rules: Anything goes.

 

All too often there are people complaining that it wasn't logged online within an hour, so they wasted their time. :rolleyes:

Also there commonly are coords distributed at events before publishing, or sometimes shared within a clique. Sometimes there are beta testers who sign the first spot a few days beforehand, but don't claim the FTF. Then there are the "teams" that dont cache together, and break up to try and grab ALL of the FTFs. Sometimes a muggle will find it first and others will dispute whether they were an official FTF because they don't have an account. Then there are the people that go into parks at 2AM to grab it..

 

It's nice to see a blank log, but if not, please don't complain about it, or expect any sympathy. :) In the last few years I've logged most of my FTFs with a sock account in an effort to keep my account from looking too cheesy. :P

Edited by 4wheelin_fool

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Have you never been caching with someone else?

Yes, many times.

 

You're both searching, they find it and bring it to you, you sign the log.

Agreed, done it.

 

Not much different.

I totally disagree. If your friend is about to hide the cache and hands you the log to sign before they stash it, you didn't find it. It doesn't matter how close to GZ you are.

 

Some other examples:

 

:lol: Found it 08/08/XXXX

I was with the CO at placement. I'm not claiming FTF.

 

or

 

:D Found it

Wander waist deep and no go. Good the have CO with a replacement container in hand.

 

better yet:

 

:D Found it

We were all there as the "hide" team to teach XX xxxx how to hide caches now that he's not a newbie any more.

 

We wouldn't consider any of these a 'find'.

 

How about you?

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Now if you people would all stop putting "congratulations for the FTF to ___________" on your cache pages, perhaps the FTF hounds would realize they're like .01% of the caching populace. :ph34r:

 

+1

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Have you never been caching with someone else?

Yes, many times.

 

You're both searching, they find it and bring it to you, you sign the log.

Agreed, done it.

 

Not much different.

I totally disagree. If your friend is about to hide the cache and hands you the log to sign before they stash it, you didn't find it. It doesn't matter how close to GZ you are.

 

 

What is the difference between these 2 cases. In the first case, you didn't find it either and yet you logged your Find. In both cases, someone handed you the cache at GZ and you signed the log.

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Boy, this went downhill, including the OP editing out both of their posts. For the record, I told him that in my opinion, claiming FTF before publishing was "rude and underhanded". Now if you people would all stop putting "congratulations for the FTF to ___________" on your cache pages, perhaps the FTF hounds would realize they're like .01% of the caching populace. :ph34r:

 

What? Like this?

 

Scrolling Marquee

 

You know what? I enjoy seeing people rush out to get a FTF on my caches and reading their FTF logs.

 

It would be terribly boring if you published a cache and you're sitting there for days waiting for someone who 'happened to be in the area' to find it. :(

 

Who doesn't love bouncing marquee's? The background and text color on the cache page are actually quite soothing, I like it. :lol:

 

I guess what I'm saying is VERY FEW people are into the FTF game. Yet VERY MANY people congratulate people on FTF's on their cache page, including bouncing Marquee's. Therefore the very few in the FTF crowd think that like everyone who ever found a cache is into that stuff, when in fact the FTF crowd is a fringe element. The OP thought nothing of coming here and saying they rushed out at 2:00 AM when their phone went off for a new cache. And look what happened, he made two posts, and completely edited them out. And yes, I have a good memory (still) before he edited them out, in the OP, he said he ran out at 2:00 AM when his phone went off. :P

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How do you feel about people logging finds before friends put the cache out or signing the logbook in general before a cache is published?

How do I feel? In the west end of Paris France, somewhere around May, 1963, a young man was playing a game of solitaire. One hand wasn't going well, so this dude peeked under one of the stacks, in a bid to better his odds. I have about as much care for the way folks engage in the unsanctioned, unregulated FTF side game as I do for the aforementioned Parisian. It doesn't affect me in any way, so I really don't care. If you like, feel free to claim FTFs on all my caches. Maybe that'll make you feel better?

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I guess what I'm saying is VERY FEW people are into the FTF game. Yet VERY MANY people congratulate people on FTF's on their cache page, including bouncing Marquee's. Therefore the very few in the FTF crowd think that like everyone who ever found a cache is into that stuff, when in fact the FTF crowd is a fringe element. The OP thought nothing of coming here and saying they rushed out at 2:00 AM when their phone went off for a new cache. And look what happened, he made two posts, and completely edited them out. And yes, I have a good memory (still) before he edited them out, in the OP, he said he ran out at 2:00 AM when his phone went off. :P

 

Well, if cache owners are into the FTF game, then you have to ask yourself, why are they posting congratulations messages? It must excite them somehow.

 

We have only a few people here that are REALLY into FTFs. These are people who will regularly drive across town for a FTF.

 

Then there's quite a number of us (myself included) who will go for a FTF if it happens to be closeby at a good time.

 

There are some people that don't give a darn and some that even hate the game.

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You know that you were first, so is it really that important for everyone else to know?

This is exactly how I feel about the whole FTF business.

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:lol: Found it 08/08/XXXX

I was with the CO at placement. I'm not claiming FTF.

If I helped the CO hide the cache, then I wouldn't log a find.

 

If I waited while the CO went ahead to hide the cache, then entered the coordinates into my device and found it before it was published, then sure, I'd log a find. I'd even add it to my milestones bookmark list as an FTF. Someone else can have FTFAP.

 

:D Found it

Wander waist deep and no go. Good the have CO with a replacement container in hand.

Again, it depends on how this played out. If the CO confirmed that I had found the correct hiding spot, and then replaced the missing container, then sure, I'd log a find. Or if the CO replaced the missing cache while I wasn't watching and allowed me to find the replacement container, then sure, I'd log a find.

 

:D Found it

We were all there as the "hide" team to teach XX xxxx how to hide caches now that he's not a newbie any more.

That sounds a lot like the "helped the CO hide the cache" situation I described above. But I suppose it could be the "found it before it was published" situation instead, if we taught XX xxxx how to hide caches, and then let XX xxxx hide a cache, and then used the coordinates to find the cache to verify that XX xxxx really learned the lesson we had taught.

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I guess what I'm saying is VERY FEW people are into the FTF game. Yet VERY MANY people congratulate people on FTF's on their cache page, including bouncing Marquee's. Therefore the very few in the FTF crowd think that like everyone who ever found a cache is into that stuff, when in fact the FTF crowd is a fringe element. The OP thought nothing of coming here and saying they rushed out at 2:00 AM when their phone went off for a new cache. And look what happened, he made two posts, and completely edited them out. And yes, I have a good memory (still) before he edited them out, in the OP, he said he ran out at 2:00 AM when his phone went off. :P

 

Well, if cache owners are into the FTF game, then you have to ask yourself, why are they posting congratulations messages? It must excite them somehow.

 

We have only a few people here that are REALLY into FTFs. These are people who will regularly drive across town for a FTF.

 

Then there's quite a number of us (myself included) who will go for a FTF if it happens to be closeby at a good time.

 

There are some people that don't give a darn and some that even hate the game.

 

Well first of all, because of the whole email notifications thing, only Premium members are "into FTF" and that right there takes you down to a single digit percentage of all Geocachers. :) I totally agree with you though, a good percentage of highly active Premium members will go for an FTF if it happens to be close by at a good time. I certainly did not mean to imply that all other Geocachers loathe the 4 or 5 people in their area that "run out at 2:00 AM when the phone goes off". A lot of them do and think it's stupid though. :lol:

 

I actually know a guy who has said some disparaging things about the FTF game in a regional forum, yet has Congratulations for the FTF banners on his cache pages. I don't know, I'll have to confront him on that, and get back to you. :P

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If you can't handle the disappointment, then stop playing the FTF game. A FTF hound needs to be able to handle:


  •  
  • bad coordinates, as they are the beta tester
  • a bad puzzle that hasn't been verified yet
  • going out to find a cache that hasn't actually been hidden yet (happens here a bit)
  • not being FTF because another cacher stumbled upon it or followed foot prints before it was listed
  • not being FTF because cache owner listed it on another listing service first
  • not being FTF because cache owner posted coords on a local forum or facebook group first
  • not being FTF because cache owner gave coords to friends to beta test it
  • not being FTF because cache owner was accompanied by friends/family who signed in
  • not being FTF because you were too slow getting to the cache

 

If you go out not expecting a FTF you'll have a good time. If you are always expecting a FTF or expect others to play to your rules, you'll often be disappointed.

 

I no longer put "congrats to xxx on the FTF" on my cache pages. I've had people send me a note asking if I'd put it on, and I say "no". I also no longer post anything about being FTF in my log when I am FTF, as that can be annoying to the cache owner if the log is all about how great I am for being FTF and that I beat these other cachers.

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If you can't handle the disappointment, then stop playing the FTF game. A FTF hound needs to be able to handle:


  •  
  • bad coordinates, as they are the beta tester
  • a bad puzzle that hasn't been verified yet
  • going out to find a cache that hasn't actually been hidden yet (happens here a bit)
  • not being FTF because another cacher stumbled upon it or followed foot prints before it was listed
  • not being FTF because cache owner listed it on another listing service first
  • not being FTF because cache owner posted coords on a local forum or facebook group first
  • not being FTF because cache owner gave coords to friends to beta test it
  • not being FTF because cache owner was accompanied by friends/family who signed in
  • not being FTF because you were too slow getting to the cache

 

If you go out not expecting a FTF you'll have a good time. If you are always expecting a FTF or expect others to play to your rules, you'll often be disappointed.

 

I no longer put "congrats to xxx on the FTF" on my cache pages. I've had people send me a note asking if I'd put it on, and I say "no". I also no longer post anything about being FTF in my log when I am FTF, as that can be annoying to the cache owner if the log is all about how great I am for being FTF and that I beat these other cachers.

 

Great post, thanks! And living I'll guess about 75 miles apart, I know you were once a Super Duper Big Time FTF fanatic. :ph34r:

 

Especially since this was many many years ago, and a fellow Geocacher from 75 miles away was like the fellow Geocacher a mile away. :)

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If you can't handle the disappointment, then stop playing the FTF game. A FTF hound needs to be able to handle:


  •  
  • bad coordinates, as they are the beta tester
  • a bad puzzle that hasn't been verified yet
  • going out to find a cache that hasn't actually been hidden yet (happens here a bit)
  • not being FTF because another cacher stumbled upon it or followed foot prints before it was listed
  • not being FTF because cache owner listed it on another listing service first
  • not being FTF because cache owner posted coords on a local forum or facebook group first
  • not being FTF because cache owner gave coords to friends to beta test it
  • not being FTF because cache owner was accompanied by friends/family who signed in
  • not being FTF because you were too slow getting to the cache

 

If you go out not expecting a FTF you'll have a good time. If you are always expecting a FTF or expect others to play to your rules, you'll often be disappointed.

 

I no longer put "congrats to xxx on the FTF" on my cache pages. I've had people send me a note asking if I'd put it on, and I say "no". I also no longer post anything about being FTF in my log when I am FTF, as that can be annoying to the cache owner if the log is all about how great I am for being FTF and that I beat these other cachers.

 

Agree with a lot of this. Have grown tired of the FTF game in some ways but sometimes its fun to go try especially if you think you have a chance. Nice to meet cachers you normally do not cache with on a hunt. I do not worry about FTFs anymore if I do not get them. I will happily share with anyone else at GZ.

 

However, I do not think its a bad thing to say, got a FTF, woo hoo or something quick and silly like that. Not sure how such a log would ever annoy me as a cache owner. Folks like FTFs, if a CO does not participate in FTF hunts, can't imagine why they would be upset if someone enjoyed getting it first.

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I do not think its a bad thing to say, got a FTF, woo hoo or something quick and silly like that. Not sure how such a log would ever annoy me as a cache owner. Folks like FTFs, if a CO does not participate in FTF hunts, can't imagine why they would be upset if someone enjoyed getting it first.

When I began Geocaching, I discovered quickly that FTF hounds get pretty rabid about "FTF" (maybe the CO doesn't, but the finders sure do). Since I may meet them somewhere sometime, I decided to not create angst (your mileage may vary). I'm careful to not even use the word "First" in any context in my online log when the "FTF" has yet to be logged online. Learned that the hard way. :ph34r:

 

If there's something particular about the sequence of my "FTF" find, such as found at an Event where a lot of people are waiting to go find it, I post the time I found it and leave it at that. Especially if the others are logging by phone, since I'm probably logging later by PC.

Edited by kunarion

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Wow. Dogmeat* certainly didn't like the responses he got in this forum, but he seems to have many local supporters on the cache page. All the logs are pretty much about the cache owner "cheating", and calling them out on this. And this cache owner just joined last month. I do not condone this, and think it is uncalled for. :huh:

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I'm not an FTF Hound, but I understand those that are. I also have no sympathy for those that feel denied an FTF because someone else somehow played unfairly and signed the log before they did.

 

Slightly off topic, how about a funny FTF story to lighten things up. I ran the cache-opening contest at a CVGA Richmond Rally years ago. The requirement was to open the container, find the log amid all of the SWAG, sign the log, and put the cache back together as found. Somehow, one of these signed logs got mixed into my supply of logs I was using in my caches. I put out a really nice cache and waited for the FTF log. The first on-line log claimed STF as there was already a name on the paper log. I asked the person whose name was first on the log and they had not even looked for that cache. It took several days for me to figure out what I done and was able to straighten out the FTF note on the cache page. Luckily, everyone was cool about it and nobody got their feelings hurt.

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It would be terribly boring if you published a cache and you're sitting there for days waiting for someone who 'happened to be in the area' to find it. :(

 

I've got two out there that have yet to be found. One for 9 months, the other for 5. I can't wait for a FTF on those, but I am not sitting by the inbox waiting for them.

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It would be terribly boring if you published a cache and you're sitting there for days waiting for someone who 'happened to be in the area' to find it. :(

 

I've got two out there that have yet to be found. One for 9 months, the other for 5. I can't wait for a FTF on those, but I am not sitting by the inbox waiting for them.

 

Small world. The cacher that DNF'd your paddle cache first is a local Jersey cacher that I sometimes pal around with. Looks like a tough cache, must be a nice hide.

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It would be terribly boring if you published a cache and you're sitting there for days waiting for someone who 'happened to be in the area' to find it. :(

I've got two out there that have yet to be found.

So... Are you bored? :ph34r::P:lol:

 

I couldn't quite wrap my head around why The_Incredibles would 'sit around for days', (or even minutes), waiting on someone to log their cache. Do folks really do that? When I hide a cache, and get it published, whoever happens to nab the allegedly coveted FTF will generate an email with their log. I'll see the logs the next time I'm online.

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