GC2DDQY

[+Bamilbis]

Anybody see a problem with this cache?

[+Roman!]

It's a cache in a park like millions of others, at least the CO lets you know what you're in for before going there..

[+ExhaustScum]

That's a little different... but I would still go get it either in the morning or at night. Pretty bogus rule nonetheless.

[+Walts Hunting]

I disregarded it but was unable to find after rummaging around for awhile. Such restrictions can't be enforced. Go find it and if he deletes your log put in a NA for violation of guidelines.

[+Dgwphotos]

Sounds like it should be phrased more as a recommendation. If it was in my area, though, I personally would ignore list it.

[jholly]

I'm guessing the cache page was edited after publication. I don't see how that could have passed muster.

[+Sol seaker]

I find it a bit annoying.

I'd imagine a great percentage of cachers cache alone.

also a great percentage are above the age of having kids to tote around.

What? Do I have to go borrow some?

Do adult children count?

could I just go to the park and borrow some?

 

 

That's definitely an ALR (additional logging requirement) which is now against the guidelines.

It's also choosing who you're allowing to find your cache, which is also against guidelines.

If I were in the area I'd find it and log that I found it alone. :ph34r:

Edited July 18, 2012 by Sol seaker

[+Bamilbis]

Well this is refreshing. For some reason I thought I'd find a buch of support for this cache.

Thank you all.

[+Dgwphotos]

I'm guessing the cache page was edited after publication. I don't see how that could have passed muster.

Not sure. I think it could be read both ways.

 

Also, unless you specifically mention you went alone or mentioned having kids with you, how could the cache owner prove it one way or another?

[+lamoracke]

I am on the side of this cache being against rules and just bad form and probably edited after publication to be sneaky. Just a guess though. If a cache is not in a location that it can ONLY be found with children, then it should not be published. Sure some caches are probably easier with kids, but it should not be required.

 

A simple email to the reviewer I bet (hopefully) would solve this problem.

[+niraD]

Are you asking about the cache, or about the "FAMILY ONLY" designation?

 

I don't have a problem with the cache. I've found others in similar locations (based on what Google Maps and Google Street View show).

 

And as others have mentioned, the "FAMILY ONLY" designation is an unenforceable ALR that can be ignored. Although it's possible that the playground rules prohibit adults not accompanied by children; I couldn't make out the rules sign in Google Street View.

[+DragonsWest]

Time for me to reconsider that plan for national franchise chain of rent-a-midgets...

[+Dgwphotos]

Time for me to reconsider that plan for national franchise chain of rent-a-midgets...

[+OZ2CPU]

just make a TFTC log, he did not say anything about log length :-)

 

it is just another under-bench in park near play ground caches,

ok it could be fun to find if you go there with kids,

we got small kids, and we often goto parks with playgrounds so they play and run a bit

if there is a cache under the bench, we surely find it :-)

it may even be the reason why we find the park :-)

 

ALR is NOT alowed ! not for a traditional,

make it a Puzzle type and write CHALLENGE CACHING WITH KIDS

then it would be just as legal as any other challenge cache, where a special requirement must be fullfilled,

a recommendation IS ok for a Traditional, to me it could be understood like just a remommendation, not a rule or demand.

I think this explain about the CO and his idea about single adults sneeking arround the playgrounds might be odd or susperious,

that is NOT illegal either, or even not wanted.

if you as a parent or CO dont like (susperious looking) people sneeking arround a playground, DONT PLACE A CACHE THERE !!

caches tend to look a bit odd, and they tend to pop up any time of the day.

[Mr.Yuck]

Anybody see a problem with this cache?

 

Yes. Nomex, apparently Like him, you might want to consider putting on your asbestos suit now. <== That means I'm just kidding. but yep, it's disabled.

[+Touchstone]

ALR is NOT alowed ! not for a traditional,

make it a Puzzle type and write CHALLENGE CACHING WITH KIDS

then it would be just as legal as any other challenge cache, where a special requirement must be fullfilled,

 

Just a wild guess, but that idea would probably get rejected in Review (i.e. not a Geocaching related achievement).

[knowschad]

I'm guessing the cache page was edited after publication. I don't see how that could have passed muster.

 

Agreed. Some of the early logs would seem to support that theory:

 

11:38. Waited a lot for muggles in the playground to possibly leave. They didn't leave while I was waiting, but I was able to see it, so I picked and replaced it while they are busy enough. The patience was awarded by the FTF! SL. TFTC. #1215

 

3TF! A mom was watching a child at play, and I asked her if she could help me.

 

Found it when the muggles weren't watching

[4wheelin_fool]

I'm guessing the cache page was edited after publication. I don't see how that could have passed muster.

 

Agreed. Some of the early logs would seem to support that theory:

 

11:38. Waited a lot for muggles in the playground to possibly leave. They didn't leave while I was waiting, but I was able to see it, so I picked and replaced it while they are busy enough. The patience was awarded by the FTF! SL. TFTC. #1215

 

3TF! A mom was watching a child at play, and I asked her if she could help me.

 

Found it when the muggles weren't watching

 

Yes, the later logs show not many parents and kids are going there anymore. Perhaps they decided to go elsewhere after all the moms got together and talked about the creepy people who enter alone and sneak around while holding some electonic device in their hand..

[Pup Patrol]

make it a Puzzle type and write CHALLENGE CACHING WITH KIDS

then it would be just as legal as any other challenge cache, where a special requirement must be fullfilled,

 

Um, that wouldn't be published either. You can't just slap any old ALR on a cache and call it a "challenge cache".

 

The Guidelines for Challenge Caches are here:

 

http://support.Groundspeak.com/index.php?pg=kb.page&id=308

 

and here:

 

http://support.Groundspeak.com//index.php?pg=kb.page&id=206

 

 

B.

[+CanadianRockies]

ALR is NOT alowed ! not for a traditional,

make it a Puzzle type and write CHALLENGE CACHING WITH KIDS

then it would be just as legal as any other challenge cache, where a special requirement must be fullfilled,

Just a wild guess, but that idea would probably get rejected in Review (i.e. not a Geocaching related achievement).

Not to mention: "A challenge cache may not specifically exclude any segment of geocachers."

[+Dan2099]

Anybody see a problem with this cache?

 

No I just linger around the bath rooms scoping out where I think the cache could be then I offer kids candy to make sure that's where the cache is..then I quickly grab the cache sign it and speed away in my windowless van..

[+Wacka]

I take it as a recommendation not to go for it during the day. I went for this cache Friday 7/13. I pulled up , saw it was a real small playground with a few tables and full of kids. No problem. It goes on my rainy day list. I'll try for it when the weather is bad. Besides, there are tons of caches to get in that area.

[+JuleeD]

Anybody see a problem with this cache?

 

No I just linger around the bath rooms scoping out where I think the cache could be then I offer kids candy to make sure that's where the cache is..then I quickly grab the cache sign it and speed away in my windowless van..

 

[+Straight-Cache-Homey]

I take it as a recommendation not to go for it during the day. I went for this cache Friday 7/13. I pulled up , saw it was a real small playground with a few tables and full of kids. No problem. It goes on my rainy day list. I'll try for it when the weather is bad. Besides, there are tons of caches to get in that area.

Parks/baseball fields/soccer fields are definitely rainy day caches. In fact, I think we're expecting some rain today...

[+Legochugglers]

Anybody want to hire my kids for some park/play area caches!

 

Highest offer gets them for the day.

 

Lowest offer has to keep them for a month.

[+SwineFlew]

The cache got archived. I have to agree that its a problem. I cache alone most of the time and I find that really annoying that I have to have a kid with me to find that cache.

[+Kris32]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

[+Vater_Araignee]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

Almost agree, I think it is more like "teach them better." Once my daughter became old enough to go to the park by herself she became old enough to teach to hit sensitive spots, scream for help and attempt to jab neck and eyes with a pencil. A My First Ticonderoga to be exact.

Now she is 13 and because of cracked ribs I wont spar with her till she learns not to hit daddy so hard.

[+Harry Dolphin]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

 

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

[+T.D.M.22]

Do we actually know what the email that the reviewer said? I agree requiring you to have a child with you to log it, is an ALR, and not allowed, BUT there has to be more to it than that, otherwise they could just change the description. What I'm thinking is multiple people complained about adults "sneaking" around the park and some unlucky cacher got a visit by the police and emailed a reviewer about it. Or maybe the police know what this is and email Groundspeak directly...Either whatever the reason, I agree with Kris32, and Vater_Araignee. It's a public space, if you are too lazy to watch your children or teach them not to go with strangers then why do you take them out of the house? not counting the 1 or 2 year olds that don't know any better.

[MisterEFQ]

Do we actually know what the email that the reviewer said? I agree requiring you to have a child with you to log it, is an ALR, and not allowed, BUT there has to be more to it than that, otherwise they could just change the description. What I'm thinking is multiple people complained about adults "sneaking" around the park and some unlucky cacher got a visit by the police and emailed a reviewer about it. Or maybe the police know what this is and email Groundspeak directly...Either whatever the reason, I agree with Kris32, and Vater_Araignee. It's a public space, if you are too lazy to watch your children or teach them not to go with strangers then why do you take them out of the house? not counting the 1 or 2 year olds that don't know any better.

 

Why no respect for the local laws that people voted on? Instead you just insult them. If you think its silly, then do something about it.

[AZcachemeister]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

 

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

 

I understand that kids need a safe place to play, so I'm OK with that.

However, you are probably not going to get any grief unless someone 'calls it in'.

What to do?

Have a little discussion with the adults to explain what you are doing.

 

I love caching at playgrounds in bad weather, it gives me an excuse to wear my long, black raincoat.

[+Bamilbis]

Me in a park does not equal 'unsafe for kids to play'.

[AZcachemeister]

Me in a park does not equal 'unsafe for kids to play'.

 

Agreed.

 

But, the cops need 'a leg to stand on' when telling some undesirable to move on out of the park and away from the kids.

 

It's an incompletely tested theory, but my feeling is that posted park hours (and most other rules) are there mostly so the cops can tell you to leave when you are causing 'a ruckus'. If you are not causing a problem, nobody would care.

 

In any case, I wouldn't be upset if caches were banned if they are within 250 feet of the kiddie playground, let alone if they are actually on the equipment. Fat chance that the reviewer is going to check Google Earth before publishing EVERY cache.

[+SwineFlew]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

 

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

 

I understand that kids need a safe place to play, so I'm OK with that.

However, you are probably not going to get any grief unless someone 'calls it in'.

What to do?

Have a little discussion with the adults to explain what you are doing.

 

I love caching at playgrounds in bad weather, it gives me an excuse to wear my long, black raincoat.

Same here. I tend to only cache in park when its raining hard and cold. Nobody around to bother me.

[+Mudfrog]

Me in a park does not equal 'unsafe for kids to play'.

 

+1

 

As a parent of a small child, i do somewhat understand some of the concerns. I'm not going to walk right up and start talking to a child playing in a playground. On the otherhand, i'm also not gonna be so paranoid that i worry about my kid every time a single male comes within 50 feet of her.

[Nomex]

Do we actually know what the email that the reviewer said? I agree requiring you to have a child with you to log it, is an ALR, and not allowed, BUT there has to be more to it than that, otherwise they could just change the description. What I'm thinking is multiple people complained about adults "sneaking" around the park and some unlucky cacher got a visit by the police and emailed a reviewer about it. Or maybe the police know what this is and email Groundspeak directly...Either whatever the reason, I agree with Kris32, and Vater_Araignee. It's a public space, if you are too lazy to watch your children or teach them not to go with strangers then why do you take them out of the house? not counting the 1 or 2 year olds that don't know any better.

 

Whoa fella! Way too much conspiracy theories in this post. Said Reviewer sent a polite email asking the cache owner to remove the rather heavy handed sounding language that came across as an ALR. Said cache owner sent back a very polite reply almost immediately that they had decided to Archive the cache voluntarily due to their concerns about the cache and it's location, and the possibility of some unpleasantness that might arise if there were any confrontations with families in the park.

 

Sorry, but no police called in, no calls to Groundspeak. Just a responsible cache owner doing what they think is best for everyone.

[Mr.Yuck]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

 

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

 

Correct. I do believe there was a guy who was ranting in these forums about a year ago that his NYC playground cache was rejected, and the reviewer cited the law in a note on the cache page. I'd like to think there are other places in the USA with such a law, but then again, NYC is the only place that bans Trans fats in restaurants, and is threatening to regulate how much Pepsi you can have with your meal.

[+Kris32]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

 

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

 

Wow! I almost can't believe that. I'm kidless by choice. I'd totally feel discriminated against by that rule/law/whatever is is. Do those without kids have to pay any taxes for those parks? Do 4 legged kids count?

 

Here in Vegas, there are huge SID fees (thousands of dollars) for master planned communities. I'd be really upset if I had to pay that and then couldn't enjoy the park.

[+Don_J]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

 

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

 

Correct. I do believe there was a guy who was ranting in these forums about a year ago that his NYC playground cache was rejected, and the reviewer cited the law in a note on the cache page. I'd like to think there are other places in the USA with such a law, but then again, NYC is the only place that bans Trans fats in restaurants, and is threatening to regulate how much Pepsi you can have with your meal.

 

Actually, California banned trans fats about three years ago. It totally ruined the taste of Micky D's fries. LA City Parks has started putting up decorative fencing around the children playground part of their parks with a gate and a sign posted on it that states that you don't go in there unless you have a child with you.

[+Don_J]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

 

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

 

Wow! I almost can't believe that. I'm kidless by choice. I'd totally feel discriminated against by that rule/law/whatever is is. Do those without kids have to pay any taxes for those parks? Do 4 legged kids count?

 

Here in Vegas, there are huge SID fees (thousands of dollars) for master planned communities. I'd be really upset if I had to pay that and then couldn't enjoy the park.

 

I don't think that they are excluding anyone from the entire park, you just can't play on the Jungle Gym.

[+The_Incredibles_]

I actually kind of like caches at or near playgrounds. Gives me something to do while the kiddos play.

 

The only times I have felt creeped out while using a playground is when senior citizens sit down on a park bench and watch the kids and make comments, kind of like they're watching t.v.

[+T.D.M.22]

Do we actually know what the email that the reviewer said? I agree requiring you to have a child with you to log it, is an ALR, and not allowed, BUT there has to be more to it than that, otherwise they could just change the description. What I'm thinking is multiple people complained about adults "sneaking" around the park and some unlucky cacher got a visit by the police and emailed a reviewer about it. Or maybe the police know what this is and email Groundspeak directly...Either whatever the reason, I agree with Kris32, and Vater_Araignee. It's a public space, if you are too lazy to watch your children or teach them not to go with strangers then why do you take them out of the house? not counting the 1 or 2 year olds that don't know any better.

 

Whoa fella! Way too much conspiracy theories in this post. Said Reviewer sent a polite email asking the cache owner to remove the rather heavy handed sounding language that came across as an ALR. Said cache owner sent back a very polite reply almost immediately that they had decided to Archive the cache voluntarily due to their concerns about the cache and it's location, and the possibility of some unpleasantness that might arise if there were any confrontations with families in the park.

 

Sorry, but no police called in, no calls to Groundspeak. Just a responsible cache owner doing what they think is best for everyone.

No conspiracy theory. I'm just saying so we actually know what the reviewers email had said? It wouldn't be the first time someone here posted something like this and we found out that they were making it bigger than it really was. Like I said if it was a simple ALR the cache could have been changed. To me it seems more likely that the park and little children around was more cause for concern than the ALR.

[4wheelin_fool]

It's not an ALR, just a bad idea.

 

There is no mention of log deletion if you find it alone, and several people have done so anyway. There is only strong wording on the cache page creating unenforceable rules.

 

It's family friendly, just not lone-guy-holding-electronic-device friendly.

[MisterEFQ]

Would annoy me too. Adults not allowed at parks if they don't have kids? Maybe those with kids should watch them better.

 

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

 

Wow! I almost can't believe that. I'm kidless by choice. I'd totally feel discriminated against by that rule/law/whatever is is. Do those without kids have to pay any taxes for those parks? Do 4 legged kids count?

 

Here in Vegas, there are huge SID fees (thousands of dollars) for master planned communities. I'd be really upset if I had to pay that and then couldn't enjoy the park.

 

No the kids don't pay taxes. But there parents voted on this law. And it passed and it should be respected.

 

I don't feel discriminated when I can't go into a womens restroom at a park.

[+CanadianRockies]

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

Wow! I almost can't believe that. I'm kidless by choice. I'd totally feel discriminated against by that rule/law/whatever is is. Do those without kids have to pay any taxes for those parks? Do 4 legged kids count?

Your day is about to become even worse. Here's some more breaking news: Childless taxpayers also pay for schools.

[+Dan2099]

Most New York City playgrounds do not permit adults without children.

Wow! I almost can't believe that. I'm kidless by choice. I'd totally feel discriminated against by that rule/law/whatever is is. Do those without kids have to pay any taxes for those parks? Do 4 legged kids count?

Your day is about to become even worse. Here's some more breaking news: Childless taxpayers also pay for schools.

 

This has nothing to do with the topic at hand, but I love me some tacos.

[Pup Patrol]

Do we actually know what the email that the reviewer said? I agree requiring you to have a child with you to log it, is an ALR, and not allowed, BUT there has to be more to it than that, otherwise they could just change the description. What I'm thinking is multiple people complained about adults "sneaking" around the park and some unlucky cacher got a visit by the police and emailed a reviewer about it. Or maybe the police know what this is and email Groundspeak directly...Either whatever the reason, I agree with Kris32, and Vater_Araignee. It's a public space, if you are too lazy to watch your children or teach them not to go with strangers then why do you take them out of the house? not counting the 1 or 2 year olds that don't know any better.

 

Whoa fella! Way too much conspiracy theories in this post. Said Reviewer sent a polite email asking the cache owner to remove the rather heavy handed sounding language that came across as an ALR. Said cache owner sent back a very polite reply almost immediately that they had decided to Archive the cache voluntarily due to their concerns about the cache and it's location, and the possibility of some unpleasantness that might arise if there were any confrontations with families in the park.

 

Sorry, but no police called in, no calls to Groundspeak. Just a responsible cache owner doing what they think is best for everyone.

No conspiracy theory. I'm just saying so we actually know what the reviewers email had said? It wouldn't be the first time someone here posted something like this and we found out that they were making it bigger than it really was. Like I said if it was a simple ALR the cache could have been changed. To me it seems more likely that the park and little children around was more cause for concern than the ALR.

 

When you get a post in a thread from the Reviewer involved, I would think that would put the issue to rest.

 

It's certainly not expected that the Reviewers let everyone know what has happened with every cache that has "issues", but it's awfully nice when it does happen.

 

Thanks, Nomex.

 

 

B.

Edited July 19, 2012 by Pup Patrol

[+niraD]

Said Reviewer sent a polite email asking the cache owner to remove the rather heavy handed sounding language that came across as an ALR. Said cache owner sent back a very polite reply almost immediately that they had decided to Archive the cache voluntarily due to their concerns about the cache and it's location, and the possibility of some unpleasantness that might arise if there were any confrontations with families in the park.

Thanks, Nomex. That confirms what I guessed happened, based on the last couple logs posted by the owner and said volunteer reviewer.

[+Chrysalides]

I'd like to think there are other places in the USA with such a law, but then again, NYC is the only place that bans Trans fats in restaurants...

I've seen at least one playground in San Francisco with such signage.