Phishing for points.

February 13, 2012

Several cachers in this area received this same (cut & paste) e-mail today from a local prominent cacher.

Quote: "Hi Axxxx and Txxxx,

Was just going back down memory lane looking at some old caches that I have done before the Favorites points came out and rewarding them a point.

Looking at my “Mxxxx and Mxxxxxx” Night cache I see you seemed to thoroughly enjoy it. Thanx again for the kind words and I am glad you did have fun. Just one quick request though if you have some favorite points to spare and feel that my cache was worthy of one could you do me the favor of uping my Night Cache's favorite count.

Thanx again, I will have more caches of this nature coming soon.

Cxxxx (xxxxxxxxyy)"

This same person has also been known to send emails along the lines of "How come you haven't done my "xxxxxxx" cache."

I personally find these very annoying and in poor taste. (trying to be polite here)

I will not be replying to any of these and will definitely not be giving out any points here.

What are your thoughts when or if you receive something like this.?

Am I over-reacting to this.?

Is it common for this to be done in your area.?

2.4k · February 13, 2012

Tonight it's not bothering me, but try me again tomorrow.

I've never had anyone email me for points (that I can remember).

Maybe send him a nice reply saying, "thanks for the reminder of your nice cache.

I generally reward favorite points at the time I do the cache."

And leave it at that, which is a nice way of saying, "no way."

Or just ignore it and go on playing your game.

It might annoy me if it happened, but it's not a really big deal.

I mean world hunger and people starving all over the world and living in the street in places where it snows, bother me a whole lot more.

3k · February 13, 2012

Tacky.

3.6k · February 13, 2012

Against the guideline. I forward it to GS and let them deal with it.

2.8k · February 13, 2012

Tonight it's not bothering me, but try me again tomorrow.

I've never had anyone email me for points (that I can remember).

Maybe send him a nice reply saying, "thanks for the reminder of your nice cache.

I generally reward favorite points at the time I do the cache."

And leave it at that, which is a nice way of saying, "no way."

Or just ignore it and go on playing your game.

It might annoy me if it happened, but it's not a really big deal.

I mean world hunger and people starving all over the world and living in the street in places where it snows, bother me a whole lot more.

At some point in the distant future the Earth will be swallowed by the sun and any and all life that may remain will be extinguished so according to your philosophy anything not resulting in the destruction of the Earth and all life on it is OK?

February 13, 2012

Tacky.

+1

3.7k · February 13, 2012

LOL. This has never happened to me, but if it did, I would simply ignore the email. I've never heard of anything like that happening in our area.

There's one cacher here who must have hundreds or even a thousand favorite points banked up as he doesn't give them out that readily. He did one of my caches that I am realy proud of-I was a bit disapointed not to get a favorite point from him. He's done over 20 of my caches and only 1 favorite point which appears to be random as I can't think what was so great about that cache. I thought of emailng him something like 'pleeeeease more favorite points pleeeeese.' But then, yeah that would probably be a bit tacky. I've also had the opposite happen where I put out a cache and wondered why I got so many. 'Dear cacher, could you please take the favorite point back, I don't think it was that good.' LOL. Honestly, sometimes I wish they would get rid of favorite points, they can make a cache owner a bit loopy. There are some really awesome puzzle caches here in town and they seem to get few favorite points, then someone tosses a plastic animal under a rock and gets tons of favorite points. :unsure:

Edited February 13, 2012 by The_Incredibles_

2.8k · February 13, 2012

Tacky.

+1

+1. If I ever get such an email, the cache in question will not get a Fav. If I already did give it one, I would remove it.

6k · February 13, 2012

If I had given a point to any of his I would take it back. If there were negative points (something I would vote for) I would give one to everyone of his. This is arrogant and self-centered. Favorite points are as valuable as FTF doing challenges.

7.9k · February 13, 2012

At the beginning, I did get a few cachers asking me to give favorites to their caches...some even mentioned that they had 'just given one of my caches a point and wouldn't I like to give a point to one of theirs?'

I informed them that I had (and still have) no intention of using the system, and no points would be given by me.

The system is flawed, and the ability to see who gave a favorite point is one of the bigger ones. If the owner couldn't see who did or didn't give one, then they wouldn't know who to harass...and yes, it's harassment, albeit mild.

10.2k · February 13, 2012

Phishing for points has come up before. Never happened to me. The point phishing email, as posted in the OP, is well worded, and actually wouldn't offend me too much! I might even oblige, if it was a good cache, and I just overlooked awarding a fav. Now the 2nd half of the OP, where they say the same guy sends emails asking "why haven't you found my such and such cache", that would annoy the heck out of me.

February 13, 2012

Wasn't the premise that they were only asking people who found his cache BEFORE the fav point system?

8.4k · February 13, 2012

Never happened to me before although I do wish folks would give some consideration to caches that existed before favorite points as I have done. I favorited several caches that were archived years before favorite points.

Tacky? Maybe. More sad than tacky.

Like someone else said, the issue just fails to put me in a twist. :rolleyes:

7.3k · February 13, 2012

What are your thoughts when or if you receive something like this.?

It would strike me as a bit odd. I have gotten a few emails about "my cool cache that you might want to find". I generally reply with a quick, "thank you." I sometimes send emails to geo-buddies about cool caches that I've noticed and thought might interest them (not my own). I dunno, this doesn't really upset me at all. If it bothered me, I'd just delete it.

Am I over-reacting to this.?

You mean by starting a forum thread? seems okay to me, it's a topic that's suitable for this forum.

Your stated response, "I will not be replying to any of these and will definitely not be giving out any points here", seems okay too.

Is it common for this to be done in your area.?

I've never gotten one like this. I might respond by giving a favorite point, by the way. If the cache in question really did rise to that level for me.

2.8k · February 13, 2012

Never happened to me before although I do wish folks would give some consideration to caches that existed before favorite points as I have done. I favorited several caches that were archived years before favorite points.

I went though my entire Found It list, and awarded points for the good ones. I even awarded points to long archived caches if I felt they deserved it.

2.6k · February 13, 2012

Never happened to me before although I do wish folks would give some consideration to caches that existed before favorite points as I have done. I favorited several caches that were archived years before favorite points.

I went though my entire Found It list, and awarded points for the good ones. I even awarded points to long archived caches if I felt they deserved it.

It's never happened to me either.

I've also gone back and award points to caches I thought deserved it no matter when I found them or what their status now.

5.6k · February 13, 2012

I don't know if it's tacky or not, but I wonder if he's just trying to reach out and make contact with the local geo-community - I don't know how often events happen around there. Around here we have events everytime you turn around (some pretty big) so it's easy to meet just about everybody sooner or later.

Edited February 13, 2012 by The Jester

1.2k · February 13, 2012

The week after it was released there were a good number of reports of this happening. It has since seemed to slow down. I have seen cache pages where the CO kind of begs people who like the cache to give it a favorite. I think both are tacky and sad. I think a great cache speaks for itself, favorite points percentage can help find those.

9.3k · February 13, 2012

The phishing email, as posted in the OP, is well worded, and actually wouldn't offend me too much! I might even oblige, if it was a good cache, and I just overlooked awarding a fav.

Yeah, that pretty much sums it up for me. I have seen some of these that read as outright favorite points solicitation. Those were incredibly tacky, to me. This e-mail didn't have that same feel.

1.7k · February 13, 2012

I have never liked advice so wouldn't appreciate the request any more than all the e-mails telling me how to vote. Really don't like the request that if I don't pass it on I am not a good citizen.

Edited February 13, 2012 by W7WT

3.6k · February 13, 2012

As I mentioned in another thread, I notice cachers saying how good some of my caches are but they don't or forget to add a favorite point.

I would never send a message to ask or remind them. Either they eventually will or they won't.

It's not just the points that rate a cache. Lots of times if I want to see if a cache is good I just read the logs. But then I see cachers say nice things about the worst caches just to be polite. It goes the same sometimes for the Favorite points.

I also mentioned once when Favorites first came out, I don't even award them to my friends unless I really believe the cache deserved it.

You know the saying.

If you have nothing nice to say don't say anything at all.

Guess I wasn't practicing what I preach. Sorry

Edited February 13, 2012 by jellis

5.2k · February 13, 2012

I'd probably reply back with something along the lines of "I'm sorry, but I just don't remember your cache. It must not have been that special."

February 13, 2012

My observation:

There are reams of threads and posts complaining about COs who just don't seem to care about their caches. Poorly thought out and not maintained spark much ire and that gets vocalised right here.

Now, here's a guy who obviously cares a great deal about his cache(s). I would imagine he views favourite points as a means to attract even more people to his cache. Why would he want that? Well, my bet is because he is proud of it and wants to share it with as many in the community as possible.

From the letter posted here it seems he is targeting people who:

1) Found his cache,2) Found it before the Fav Point system was implemented, AND3) Had already put something in their find log to indicate that they 'really enjoyed it'.

Notice the AND there. He was looking for all three to be true, not just one. I say cut the guy a break. This game would be a zillion times more fun if every cache owner had as much passion as this guy.

.02 spent

2.1k · February 13, 2012

Tacky.

+1

+1. If I ever get such an email, the cache in question will not get a Fav. If I already did give it one, I would remove it.

I would also be sure to remove favorite points for the Co's other caches (if any) and not favorite any of theirs in the future.

February 13, 2012

picard-facepalm.jpg?1240934151

Edited February 13, 2012 by GeotaggedBloger

2k · February 13, 2012

hardly seems something to worry about. Folks ask for votes on cache of the month too. Tacky maybe, but hardly worth thinking about more than a few seconds. Friends have asked me on rare occasion and I have probably mentioned it to friends on rare occasions too.

3.8k · February 13, 2012

What are your thoughts when or if you receive something like this.?

Am I over-reacting to this.?

Is it common for this to be done in your area.?

Yep, you're overreacting. Geocaching is the only thing some people have and if the cache was worthwhile and you're being stingy on the favs, just ignore the email and move on.

3.8k · February 13, 2012

I think the requesting of a favorite point is a bit tasteless but it isn't nearly as tasteless as some of you that say you'd take the favorite back. If the cache was worthy then it was worthy. Get over yourselves. No wonder the earth will be going to hell in a handbasket come December. Forget what the Mayans say. We're self destructing.

1.4k · February 13, 2012

There are those caches that I have found, that I really enjoyed for one reason on another. However, there are reasons I might give a glowing log but not a favorite.

One example would be a micro were a regular would work. I know from the cache page it is a micro before I look, and that's OK. However, I still won't give that cache a point.

If someone wrote and asked why I didn't give their cache a favorite, I would just ignore them. However, if I were to tell them why they might not be too happy.

3.8k · February 13, 2012

I think the requesting of a favorite point is a bit tasteless but it isn't nearly as tasteless as some of you that say you'd take the favorite back. If the cache was worthy then it was worthy. Get over yourselves. No wonder the earth will be going to hell in a handbasket come December. Forget what the Mayans say. We're self destructing.

And to clarify..

Begging for a favorite is an act of desperation. But not awarding a favorite or pulling your favorite from a deserving cache (note, I did not say cache owner), because of a favorite request, is just outright mean spirited. In my humble opinion, there's a distinct difference between the two.

I'd be more likely to NOT award a favorite to a MEAN cacher than I would a DESPERATE cacher. but that's only if I didn't practice what I preach.

February 13, 2012

Ya think the request for a favorite point is tacky? I think most of the responses in this thread are tacky.

I think my response to that email would be to remember the cache and think whether I enjoyed it or not. My response wouldn't be an attack on the sender. Sheesh.

19k · February 13, 2012

Tacky.

+1

+1. If I ever get such an email, the cache in question will not get a Fav. If I already did give it one, I would remove it.

I can see where you guys are coming from, but there's an entirely different way of looking at this. "Points" may not at all be what the cache owner is looking for (in the sense of, he with the most points wins). That, I agree, would be tacky. But perhaps he realizes that favorite points are used by many cachers to find the better caches, and he is only wanting to help other cachers have a good experience.

15.3k · February 13, 2012

I think the requesting of a favorite point is a bit tasteless but it isn't nearly as tasteless as some of you that say you'd take the favorite back. If the cache was worthy then it was worthy. Get over yourselves. No wonder the earth will be going to hell in a handbasket come December. Forget what the Mayans say. We're self destructing.
And to clarify..

Begging for a favorite is an act of desperation. But not awarding a favorite or pulling your favorite from a deserving cache (note, I did not say cache owner), because of a favorite request, is just outright mean spirited. In my humble opinion, there's a distinct difference between the two.

I'd be more likely to NOT award a favorite to a MEAN cacher than I would a DESPERATE cacher. but that's only if I didn't practice what I preach.

I look at it this way: If the CO's solicitation for Favorites points is annoying enough, then it detracts from the overall experience of finding the cache. If it detracts from my experience, then it is likely to detract from others' experiences.

Given that there is something detracting from the experience of finding the cache, I am less likely to recommend the cache to others (i.e., less likely to award a Favorites point). If I've already recommended it, then I may retract my recommendation (i.e., remove the Favorites point).

That isn't mean spirited. That's just taking the complete experience into account when making recommendations to others.

5.6k · February 13, 2012

Tacky.

+1

+1. If I ever get such an email, the cache in question will not get a Fav. If I already did give it one, I would remove it.

I would also be sure to remove favorite points for the Co's other caches (if any) and not favorite any of theirs in the future.

Sheesh, the OP asked if he was over reacting, with these replies - no HE isn't, you guys sure are!

38.2k · February 13, 2012

I think a request like that is pretty darn cheesy. I'd respond with something like "I always give out favorite points to caches that I think are deserving" and leave it at that.

2.2k · February 13, 2012

The closest I ever had to a similar experience was from a CO asking why I had given one of her caches a Favorite point but not the other when they were very similar hiding styles.

I responded by explaining that I thought the one cache was in an area that was too visible but I liked both the style *and* location of the other one so that is why I gave it a point.

In this case I wouldn't bother responding -- in my case the owner wanted feedback, in this case the owner is clearly fishing for a compliment.

I agree though -- great caches that were around before the system was implemented deserve to be awarded points. I know when the system came out I went back and even awarded points to Archived caches that were on my old "Best Caches" bookmark list.

February 14, 2012

Tacky.

+1

+1. If I ever get such an email, the cache in question will not get a Fav. If I already did give it one, I would remove it.

I would also be sure to remove favorite points for the Co's other caches (if any) and not favorite any of theirs in the future.

While I agree soliciting favorite points is tacky, I certainly would not go back and take favorite points back or not award favorite points to the CO in the future. IMO I do not feel his email was that bad. If I enjoyed the cache and think it is worthy of a favorite point, I give it a point, regardless of what I think of the CO. I actually have a local cacher who I got into it with him over my cache placments. Even though I had some hard feelings towards him, one of his 5/5 caches was an amazing experience and I gave it a favorite point. Favorite the cache, not the CO.

Edited February 14, 2012 by slukster

3k · February 14, 2012

I said I thought the practice was tacky, but I wouldn't go so far as to get vindictive, or antagonistic, about it. I would ignore the email, and hit delete, unless I knew them personally. That might dignify a response.

I have over 100 favorite points to spend. I think I've actually used one or two. But I generally don't do it, I would have to go through all of my logs. Some of my best cache hunting expeditions were DNFs. And some are archived. I just haven't got the time to do the homework involved.

6k · February 14, 2012

Report his email to the froggie as spam and you don't want to hear from him ever again.

19k · February 14, 2012

I think a request like that is pretty darn cheesy. I'd respond with something like "I always give out favorite points to caches that I think are deserving" and leave it at that.

Yeah, but this guy is reminding you that you enjoyed his cache before Favorites were an issue. I'm not so sure I find that cheesy, especially if his motive is to get others to find his caches, and not necessarily to be top dog in the points arena. I think the latter is what most of those on the "cheesy" side of the fence are assuming.

19k · February 14, 2012

Against the guideline. I forward it to GS and let them deal with it.

Report his email to the froggie as spam and you don't want to hear from him ever again.

Huh? What is spammy or against the guidelines about a post like that? At the very worst, it may be cheesy, at the best, he is only trying to make the better caches more visible. Without knowing the guy or his caches better, we can only guess. But report it? Against guidelines? Come on, guys!

February 14, 2012

Not for nuthin...but,

My post #23 (and a star fleet Captain face palm photo a contridictory post later (#25)) and then Knowschad's #32, #40 and #41.

I think an alternate and logical view has been presented. Could a conversation possibly be formed around that or are all posts just going to keep bashing this 'tacky cheesy point hoarding spamer'?

Seriously, if you disagree then by all means post. But let's extinguish the torches and put down the pitch forks for a sec and discuss...on the forums....about it. I do think some valid points have been made.

6k · February 14, 2012

What's wrong with a little pitchforking?

3.6k · February 14, 2012

Against the guideline. I forward it to GS and let them deal with it.

Report his email to the froggie as spam and you don't want to hear from him ever again.

Huh? What is spammy or against the guidelines about a post like that? At the very worst, it may be cheesy, at the best, he is only trying to make the better caches more visible. Without knowing the guy or his caches better, we can only guess. But report it? Against guidelines? Come on, guys!

KnowsChad, Its spamming and its against the guideline. No need to get all PC (politically correct) about what is spam or whats not spam. Spam is a unwanted email from anyone. Period. If I said its spam, its spam because its a unwanted email. We can agree to disagree here.

One time someone in this area was spamming about his new cache and I reported it and it stops just like that. many cachers was complaining about it.

I do feel that GS needs to add another guideline about spamming for points to make it more clear.

22k · February 14, 2012

What's wrong with a little pitchforking?

You risk being told that while the cacher was being polite and friendly when describing the cache find, it ain't really worth a Favorite.

Although, If you need the stat so bad that you have to solicit a star you probably aren't someone who has time to waste listening to any other type of feedback.

February 14, 2012

1329189103[/url]' post='4971668']
KnowsChad, Its spamming and its against the guideline. No need to get all PC (politically correct) about what is spam or whats not spam. Spam is a unwanted email from anyone. Period. If I said its spam, its spam because its a unwanted email. We can agree to disagree here.

So when my employer emails me, it's spam? I think maybe your definition of spam is different than the real definition.

Edited February 14, 2012 by GeotaggedBloger

1k · February 14, 2012

I think many people were confused by the word "phishing" in the topic's title. Phishing doesn't simply mean asking for favorite points, but tricking someone into giving them. I originally thought the person was sending emails out to cachers with thousands of finds who might not recall each individual cache and tricking them into thinking that they had found the sender's cache and awarding them favorite points. It turns out they are only sending them the people who have actually found the cache and seemed to enjoy them. That's the difference between spam/fraud -- a violation of the TOU -- and someone who should just be ignored.

3.6k · February 14, 2012

1329189103[/url]' post='4971668']
KnowsChad, Its spamming and its against the guideline. No need to get all PC (politically correct) about what is spam or whats not spam. Spam is a unwanted email from anyone. Period. If I said its spam, its spam because its a unwanted email. We can agree to disagree here.

So when my employer emails me, it's spam?

Depend on the subject of the email and who own the email server. If your employer own the email server, its not spam. You are stuck with it. Plus, you cant ignore your employer because they are giving you the pay check. <_<

February 14, 2012

1329189981[/url]' post='4971678']
1329189443[/url]' post='4971673']
1329189103[/url]' post='4971668']
KnowsChad, Its spamming and its against the guideline. No need to get all PC (politically correct) about what is spam or whats not spam. Spam is a unwanted email from anyone. Period. If I said its spam, its spam because its a unwanted email. We can agree to disagree here.

So when my employer emails me, it's spam?

Depend on the subject of the email and who own the email server. If your employer own the email server, its not spam. You are stuck with it. Plus, you cant ignore your employer because they are giving you the pay check.

Regardless, my point is made that your definition is off. Just because I get an email I don't like doesnt make it spam.

Ergo, just because you get an email that you 'don't like' from a fellow cacher doesn't, by itself, make it spam.

Edited February 14, 2012 by GeotaggedBloger

1k · February 14, 2012

KnowsChad, Its spamming and its against the guideline. No need to get all PC (politically correct) about what is spam or whats not spam. Spam is a unwanted email from anyone. Period. If I said its spam, its spam because its a unwanted email. We can agree to disagree here.

So when my employer emails me, it's spam?

Depend on the subject of the email and who own the email server. If your employer own the email server, its not spam. You are stuck with it. Plus, you cant ignore your employer because they are giving you the pay check.

You are completely contradicting yourself. What does the subject and owner of the email server have to do with it if you get to decide what's spam? Does that mean the receiving or sending email server? What if it's an internal email and it stays on the same server?

Phishing for points.

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