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BeccaDay

How strict are you?

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Hello EC'ers. In the last few months I have developed 4 EC's. I have been a little surprised by the amount of people wanting to log them that didn't meet the requirements. I'm kind a by-the-rules sort of person so I haven't logged an EC without making sure that I met them. Anyway, just curious what other people do. If it seems likely that they have been there and have a photo and other nearby caches listed on their profile is that good enough? I don't really think my logging requirements are very hard. As I am not an expert in geology I have just been asking for questions found at a sign on-site. I am OK with a little flexibility but what is too much?

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I am the same on the logging requirements. Mine are specific to the area, obviously. The (3) I have placed are near informational signs that have the Geology of the area. I ask the cachers do estimate the distance on (2) of them which helps on making sure they really did go to the area.

 

Another way is the signs that I mentioned. They have a lot of information and I took some parts out and made questions. Example, the Missoula Flood came through this area. This information can probably be found on the internet, but it was a certain height when it came through the areas I have chosen.

 

I think you can make it as flexible as you want it to be based on your questions. If they made a good attempt and they can prove to me that this visited the site without taking a photo its good enough for me. However, if they don't complete all the requirements I would probably delete their log if they made no arrangements to fix it.

 

Note: I don't use the information signs to complete the purpose of my caches. They are used as a tool which are near the areas of what I am bringing people to.

 

PaneledZero

Edited by PaneledZero

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I don't think of the logging requirements as an exam, so as long as someone makes a good faith effort and their answers demonstrated that they were at the location, it is enough for me. I try to ask questions that require observations or information obtained at the site, but if people go there and answer something differently that still indicates they were there and put some thought into the earthcache, then the log will stand.

 

As I mentioned on another thread, I recently visited an earthcache where the owner required visitors to take elevation data with their gpsr but only accepts numbers within 25 feet of the readings he took with his unit. Even if his readings were "accurate" it raised some issues because my gpsr gave me different figures, units vary a great deal, and the margin of error even for the unit he used is greater than 25 feet. So you could meet the logging requirement - using your gpsr to record the elevation - and still face a log deletion. That seemed particularly rigid, although I understand the owner's concern over armchair logging.

 

I have only deleted one log, at a National Park where the person indicated that he could not do the cache because the trail did not allow dogs. I have asked for clarification, or at least some attempt to answer the questions, on a couple of other occasions.

Edited by mulvaney

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What I look for in the logging tasks is genuine effort and some understanding of what the site is. I don't expect every response to be "correct," but I do expect to see a bit of thought and care put into the response. I ask for individual responses from every account logging the cache, and I'm a stickler about that.

 

On 3 Earthcaches, I have a total of 95 finds. Only once have I told someone that their responses to the logging requirements were unacceptable. In that case, I wrote back with a bit of a clarification and asked them to reconsider and write back. Never heard from them again.

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I don't think of the logging requirements as an exam, so as long as someone makes a good faith effort and their answers demonstrated that they were at the location, it is enough for me. I try to ask questions that require observations or information obtained at the site, but if people go there and answer something differently that still indicates they were there and put some thought into the earthcache, then the log will stand.

 

As I mentioned on another thread, I recently visited an earthcache where the owner required visitors to take elevation data with their gpsr but only accepts numbers within 25 feet of the readings he took with his unit. Even if his readings were "accurate" it raised some issues because my gpsr gave me different figures, units vary a great deal, and the margin of error even for the unit he used is greater than 25 feet. So you could meet the logging requirement - using your gpsr to record the elevation - and still face a log deletion. That seemed particularly rigid, although I understand the owner's concern over armchair logging.

 

I have only deleted one log, at a National Park where the person indicated that he could not do the cache because the trail did not allow dogs. I have asked for clarification, or at least some attempt to answer the questions, on a couple of other occasions.

We are with you as to your approach with logs. Life presents many exams as it is, why make one out of earthcaches? We have deleted very few logs and with 55+ ECs, we get a lot of them.

If five cachers together visit one of our ECs and one is elected to send the required answers, that's fine. Why waste everyone's time, especially if you feel comfortable that all five were there! Keep it fun! <_<

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If five cachers together visit one of our ECs and one is elected to send the required answers, that's fine. Why waste everyone's time, especially if you feel comfortable that all five were there! Keep it fun! <_<

 

I don't see why it was necessary for you to make the comment denigrating my choice as a "waste of time."

 

For me, visiting an Earthcache is about more than just being there - I like to see evidence of learning from each visitor.

 

If you feel differently, that's okay. There was no need for the personal jab.

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If five cachers together visit one of our ECs and one is elected to send the required answers, that's fine. Why waste everyone's time, especially if you feel comfortable that all five were there! Keep it fun! <_<

 

I don't see why it was necessary for you to make the comment denigrating my choice as a "waste of time."

 

For me, visiting an Earthcache is about more than just being there - I like to see evidence of learning from each visitor.

 

If you feel differently, that's okay. There was no need for the personal jab.

 

The statement wasn't addressed to you!

Sorry, it's not a "personal jab" as you put it.

Not ony is it our opinion, we believe it's a fact! Requiring five different cachers who find the same EC to send five different emails is a total waste of time and just another thing that turns people off to earthcaching! Let's not make earthcaching any more difficult than necessary!

Of course, you are allowed your opinion, but don't deny us ours! :anibad:

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Requiring five different cachers who find the same EC to send five different emails is a total waste of time and just another thing that turns people off to earthcaching! Let's not make earthcaching any more difficult than necessary!

 

Earthcaches are supposed to be educational - encouraging independent thought and different viewpoints is certainly in keeping with this goal. If someone wants to log a find on my Earthcache, I want to see evidence that they've made an attempt to learn something at the site.

 

Having standards is what makes Earthcaches more than just geology virtuals. If people are turned off by learning, it's their loss.

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Earthcache answers are Earthcache answers. When my husband and I do an Earthcache, we do it together, and we have the same answers. So, even if we sent the answers separately, they would be the same. Unless we're supposed to try and word them differently so that we don't make it look like we're "copying" each other's answers. Just seems to be redundant, to me.

Edited by Ambrosia

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As an EC owner I'm willing to demonstrate flexibility. I try to develop logging requirements that demonstrate two things: 1) they have some understanding of the geology or geological processes at the Earthcache site and 2) the visitor was at the site (which should be evident from the answers they provide me). This of course also requires develop a listing to ensure that they are able to learn something while at the Earthcache.

 

In terms of flexibility, if a number of cachers visit as a group, I am okay with one of them sending me the answers for the group as a whole. I don't feel that each and every one of them has to send me a separate email, but if someone in the group says they have come to a different conclusion then they can certainly send their answers separately.

 

If I feel that a visitor is arm-chair logging their visit, then I will contact them first so see if they can fulfill the logging requirements. If I don't get an answer within a reasonable period of time, then their log will be deleted. If they do answer, and even if their answers are wrong, I will engage in discussion with them to see if I can help them come to the correct answers. If they do, their log stands, if it doesn't I suggest they consider a return to the site and try again.

 

This is how I treat folks who log visits to my Earthcaches. You may prefer to do it differently.

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Earthcache answers are Earthcache answers. When my husband and I do an Earthcache, we do it together, and we have the same answers. So, even if we sent the answers separately, they would be the same. Unless we're supposed to try and word them differently so that we don't make it look like we're "copying" each other's answers. Just seems to be redundant, to me.

 

You are absolutely correct. It is redundant! Hey, if you ever visit one of our ECs, one email will suffice!

We don't believe in burdening our visitors with the temptation of copying each others papers. Plagiarism is bad for the soul! Now if you independently answer the questions, we will allow more than one email, but no looking! lol. <_<

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If five cachers together visit one of our ECs and one is elected to send the required answers, that's fine. Why waste everyone's time, especially if you feel comfortable that all five were there! Keep it fun! :)

 

I don't see why it was necessary for you to make the comment denigrating my choice as a "waste of time."

 

For me, visiting an Earthcache is about more than just being there - I like to see evidence of learning from each visitor.

 

If you feel differently, that's okay. There was no need for the personal jab.

 

The statement wasn't addressed to you!

Sorry, it's not a "personal jab" as you put it.

Not ony is it our opinion, we believe it's a fact! Requiring five different cachers who find the same EC to send five different emails is a total waste of time and just another thing that turns people off to earthcaching! Let's not make earthcaching any more difficult than necessary!

Of course, you are allowed your opinion, but don't deny us ours! :D

 

Again I request that you please calm your responses down in this forum. Please don't take every comment as being personal and also consider that blunt responses are considered by many to be rude.

 

I am getting very tired of the rude, personal comments and attacks. Keep it on topic and keep it friendly.

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I don't think of the logging requirements as an exam, so as long as someone makes a good faith effort and their answers demonstrated that they were at the location, it is enough for me.
Yes agreed; even if (some of the) answers are plain wrong or incomplete, the cacher's log still stands. For us it still means the cacher was at the spot AND paid attention to the geological aspects of the spot. With incorrect or incomplete answers, we email the answers we expected with some additional explanation (if applicable) (and thank the cacher for visiting the location!)

 

Not sure what we'd do if all answers are wrong, but so far that hasn't happened with our ECs.

 

As with group visits, no need for individual emails, one for all really is enough.

 

So far we've deleted two logs, both because we didn't get any answers at all and no response to our emails. Have to add that one of those turned out to be a new cacher who didn't understand the requirements for logging and EC. After deleting his log, he did (finally) contacted us for an explanation, which we gave and he logged the cache again and sent us the requested answers.

 

Mr. Terratin

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Again I request that you please calm your responses down in this forum. Please don't take every comment as being personal and also consider that blunt responses are considered by many to be rude.

 

I am getting very tired of the rude, personal comments and attacks. Keep it on topic and keep it friendly.

 

Are you a moderator?

I agree with most of your remarks as long as they apply to everyone!

It may be intense, but it is on topic. Thanks. :)

Edited by Konnarock Kid & Marge

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Again I request that you please calm your responses down in this forum. Please don't take every comment as being personal and also consider that blunt responses are considered by many to be rude.

 

I am getting very tired of the rude, personal comments and attacks. Keep it on topic and keep it friendly.

 

Are you a moderator?

I agree with most of your remarks as long as they apply to everyone!

It may be intense, but it is on topic. Thanks. ;)

 

My comments apply to everyone. :D

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Earthcache answers are Earthcache answers. When my husband and I do an Earthcache, we do it together, and we have the same answers. So, even if we sent the answers separately, they would be the same. Unless we're supposed to try and word them differently so that we don't make it look like we're "copying" each other's answers. Just seems to be redundant, to me.

 

If it's a question with a single, particular answer, then yes, it's redundant to require everyone to provide it. Not all Earthcache tasks have single, precise answers.

 

I have some discussion-style questions, and I want independent responses on them. One of my favourite things about being an Earthcache owner is reading these individual responses. Often, two people who visit the site together will have a very different take on things.

 

One thing I really enjoy about visiting different Earthcaches is seeing the different sorts of requirements good Earthcache developers come up with. I might not choose these strategies for my own Earthcaches, but I certainly don't consider them "a waste of time."

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I don't think of the logging requirements as an exam, so as long as someone makes a good faith effort and their answers demonstrated that they were at the location, it is enough for me. I try to ask questions that require observations or information obtained at the site, but if people go there and answer something differently that still indicates they were there and put some thought into the earthcache, then the log will stand.

 

As I mentioned on another thread, I recently visited an earthcache where the owner required visitors to take elevation data with their gpsr but only accepts numbers within 25 feet of the readings he took with his unit. Even if his readings were "accurate" it raised some issues because my gpsr gave me different figures, units vary a great deal, and the margin of error even for the unit he used is greater than 25 feet. So you could meet the logging requirement - using your gpsr to record the elevation - and still face a log deletion. That seemed particularly rigid, although I understand the owner's concern over armchair logging.

 

I have only deleted one log, at a National Park where the person indicated that he could not do the cache because the trail did not allow dogs. I have asked for clarification, or at least some attempt to answer the questions, on a couple of other occasions.

 

I think your approach you describe in your first paragraph is right on.

 

As to the situation in your 2nd paragraph, requiring a GPS elevation within 25' is ridiculous. That demonstrates that the owner really has no idea about the errors in GPS measurements. That should be changed; I'm really surprised that would get approved, and it makes me wonder if the owner inserted that as a change after it was approved & published.

 

I would also delete someone who said they couldn't do it because a park didn't allow dogs on trails. If you want to log the cache, it's your responsibility to get to the place!

 

So well done!!

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Can anyone explain how a user logged one of my listings on 03/10/13, but their account shows that they have not logged on scince 08/27/12?

I suspected that the user was new, and failed to complete the requirements to log the listing, but now I'm confused. Any suggestions? :unsure:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=5d0f3866-bee6-4b54-8b1f-e38fec4e07ff

Edited by Manville Possum Hunters

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Can anyone explain how a user logged one of my listings on 03/10/13, but their account shows that they have not logged on scince 08/27/12?

I suspected that the user was new, and failed to complete the requirements to log the listing, but now I'm confused. Any suggestions? :unsure:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=5d0f3866-bee6-4b54-8b1f-e38fec4e07ff

 

Wild guess: he might have logged your cache with the geocaching app. Maybe using this doesn't count as logging into the site :huh:

 

Mrs terratin

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Can anyone explain how a user logged one of my listings on 03/10/13, but their account shows that they have not logged on scince 08/27/12?

I suspected that the user was new, and failed to complete the requirements to log the listing, but now I'm confused. Any suggestions? :unsure:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=5d0f3866-bee6-4b54-8b1f-e38fec4e07ff

 

Wild guess: he might have logged your cache with the geocaching app. Maybe using this doesn't count as logging into the site :huh:

 

Mrs terratin

That's my best guess too. That may also explain why they never bothered to email the answers. I don't know much about the smart phone apps, but I'm told that they don't show up on the audit of PMO listings either, not that I care who views my listings. I only use PMO listings to limit visits or when I have muggle problems. :) Any way, their log was nice and harmless and I don't like deleting peoples finds, but this user won't get my normal thanks for the visit email either. :laughing:

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Can anyone explain how a user logged one of my listings on 03/10/13, but their account shows that they have not logged on scince 08/27/12?

I suspected that the user was new, and failed to complete the requirements to log the listing, but now I'm confused. Any suggestions? :unsure:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=5d0f3866-bee6-4b54-8b1f-e38fec4e07ff

 

Wild guess: he might have logged your cache with the geocaching app. Maybe using this doesn't count as logging into the site :huh:

 

Mrs terratin

That's my best guess too. That may also explain why they never bothered to email the answers. I don't know much about the smart phone apps, but I'm told that they don't show up on the audit of PMO listings either, not that I care who views my listings. I only use PMO listings to limit visits or when I have muggle problems. :) Any way, their log was nice and harmless and I don't like deleting peoples finds, but this user won't get my normal thanks for the visit email either. :laughing:

 

There are lots of applications that use the API that don't require a direct site visit. I sometimes log my caches directly from GSAK for example. I don't know if an API call would trigger an update of the last log in date. You should still expect to get an email with the info you've requested though; as it doesn't matter what application they use to log the cache.

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You should still expect to get an email with the info you've requested though; as it doesn't matter what application they use to log the cache.

Yup.

 

Someone dropped a nice log on one of our earthcaches the other day. They're new, so I dropped them an email and even sent the logging questions I needed them to answer for the earthcache. I'm giving them another couple days, then I'll send another email with a suspense. Once that deadline passes, I'll regretfully delete the log if they still haven't followed up.

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You should still expect to get an email with the info you've requested though; as it doesn't matter what application they use to log the cache.

Yup.

 

Someone dropped a nice log on one of our earthcaches the other day. They're new, so I dropped them an email and even sent the logging questions I needed them to answer for the earthcache. I'm giving them another couple days, then I'll send another email with a suspense. Once that deadline passes, I'll regretfully delete the log if they still haven't followed up.

 

Yep, that occasionally happens to us as well :(

Oh well, things got better since one of ours is not situated at the end of a (newer, and now deleted) power trail anymore :laughing: I suppose the quality of logs will go up again as well.. if someone passes by at all :P

 

Mrs. Terratin

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You should still expect to get an email with the info you've requested though; as it doesn't matter what application they use to log the cache.

Yup.

 

Someone dropped a nice log on one of our earthcaches the other day. They're new, so I dropped them an email and even sent the logging questions I needed them to answer for the earthcache. I'm giving them another couple days, then I'll send another email with a suspense. Once that deadline passes, I'll regretfully delete the log if they still haven't followed up.

 

I did email the user asking for the answers, or for them to delete their log. I guess they ignored it. We always post a photo when we log EC's. Our goal is to make it to Platinum Level EC Masters without cheating. I'm like you, with regret I'm deleting the log. Now maybe I'll have another member here sending me hate mail. :laughing:

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I like to think I am flexible. I do need to get answers sent in. I always ask a question that "proves" you were there. Something that shows you read the description and looked at the spot. I have another one that asks for an elevation measurement. I accept something close, I don't have a tolerance that it has to fall within.

 

On the other hand I have tossed in a few "trick" questions too. I have one EC that I ask if there is a smell associated with the location.....and there is not. So when they make something up it's really obvious.

 

I have let some folks log an EC that is at the Gateway to Death Valley that did not answer the questions. This area is quite famous and gets A LOT of foreign visitors, I often get requests for questions be translated or what some words mean. My feeling with these is they are making an effort I am going to meet them at least half way (maybe more). Sometimes they just describe the area as best as possible that works for me.

 

Saying all that, no contact = a deleted log.

 

<<Really if you SAY you didn't do the cache in the log how do you expect that log not to be deleted?>>

Edited by AHOLLYS

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Requiring five different cachers who find the same EC to send five different emails is a total waste of time and just another thing that turns people off to earthcaching! Let's not make earthcaching any more difficult than necessary!

 

Earthcaches are supposed to be educational - encouraging independent thought and different viewpoints is certainly in keeping with this goal. If someone wants to log a find on my Earthcache, I want to see evidence that they've made an attempt to learn something at the site.

 

Having standards is what makes Earthcaches more than just geology virtuals. If people are turned off by learning, it's their loss.

 

Yes, educational. But everyone has different cognitive skills and abilities. So long as a genuine best effort was put forth, I'll accept a log. It is easy to determine the difference between genuine effort and armchair. Anything more is heavy handed, unnecessary, and bordering on being mean spirited in my opinion (across the collective).

 

Are you going to punish my ADHD daughter who's high on the bell curve of abstract abilities but doesn't have the brain chemistry to properly articulate a thought??

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For my ECs, if there is a group doing them, as long as the cacher whom is sending in the required answers, that all parties are in agreement then 1 email is fine. If 1 or more of the group feels their answer(s) differ I ask for them to email me their own answers then.

 

So far every cacher that has done any of my ECs has followed the required guidelines, WITH the exception of 2 local cachers from my area. They have been very well known to "phantom log" both regular & earthcaches in the area. In that case their logs had been deleted "ONLY" after I sent them a email asking for the required answers. If i did not hear from them within a month then their log(s) were removed.

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Sometimes it's hard to remember if the answers have been received already or not. If they are forthcoming or e-mailed at time of logging I'll let them stand.

-Most of my E.Cs require for them to send the answers 1st, and only if needed to post a "Note" until permission is granted. If an Earthcache is "Logged" and no mention is made of the answers being sent soon, or when getting home, I'll delete the post. If they see that you monitor your pages fraudulent logs will be very rare.

BTW.Had one young kid ( Regular Member) log over 300 caches for Hawai`i in 1 day even tho some were Earthcaches, Regular & 'Premium' caches and all were signed with "Found it" only. After checking some Earthcaches months later I found the "Found it" still standing and some of the Cache Owners never bothered questioning the logs ... or don't care ---- :huh:

Edited by Jake39

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-Most of my E.Cs require for them to send the answers 1st, and only if needed to post a "Note" until permission is granted. If an Earthcache is "Logged" and no mention is made of the answers being sent soon, or when getting home, I'll delete the post.

 

Early during the virtual cache era I transitioned to logging and sending answers simultaneously even when the cache page said wait for approval. This was a grass-roots movement that became the norm and I only ever had one CO complain about this. I was thankful that earthcaches are being handled the same way. I don't recall coming across any that require approval before logging.

 

I prefer to log all my cache finds in order primarily to have a cache count double check when logging multiple finds during road trips or big cache outings. It also is helpful when approaching century mark caches that I post to our profile. And it easier to look back into the find history when I might be missing a cache or when I'm looking for a specific sequence of cache visits. Waiting for an approval puts that cache out of order and throws off the cache count.

 

We love geology and earthcaches help us find good spots to observe it but pre-approval would cast a negative light to each approaching earthcache.

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Whenever I find multiple caches I'll post a "Note" until after it/they are approved and then change my log to "Found" thereby keeping my actual routes in tact.

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-Most of my E.Cs require for them to send the answers 1st

 

I always log in order of found. And I travel a lot which means that my info could come a day or two later. In ANY heavy handed scenario like this and my log gets deleted it is an automatic email to appeals. Maintaining the integrity of EC's important. Exercising mean spirited behavior just for the sake of power is laughable. If an EC owner isn't patient enough to wait a day or two or isn't capable of managing who has sent data or not, then perhaps you shouldn't be owning an EC's.

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I haven't had too many problems, mostly because my 1 earth cache is not visited that much.

 

I did have some issues with groups going out and logging it online and only 1 person sending the email. This is not a really big problem, but they do need to tell me who was in their group.

 

I only ask for people to answer a few questions so, other than the above issue, compliance has been good.

 

I'm also not super picky out answers, as long as they made an effort.

Edited by The_Incredibles_

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I am usually pretty liberal when it comes to the logging requirements for my Earthcaches. As long as the cacher has show that they have learned even a little bit about the area, then my work is validated. I understand that many answers will vary as far as things go, so I do take that into account. The only times I do delete logs are when there are no answers to my questions emailed, it's obvious that the person didn't visit the area or, in one special case, they openly admit that they didn't know the answers but logged it anyway.

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I was going to start a new thread but this one seems appropriate.

 

We don't have many Earthcaches around here in Central Arkansas. We have been near two when hunting traditionals. The first one we didn't attempt because half of the questions appeared to focus on our knowledge and prowess using our gpsr and not geology. The second we spent some time gathering answers until we saw it required a visit to another site and the picture be made there. And yes, it too required using the gpsr to do something I don't know how to do. Anyway, we really didn't have time to go to another site to answer the last question and make a photo.

 

So far, we don't have an Earthcache find. Perhaps one day.

 

My question, why go into the gpsr tech with your questions? Altitudes, waypoint projections, starting and ending coords, average angle of decline and things of that nature. How does requiring such to log a find improve the learning of geology?

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I was going to start a new thread but this one seems appropriate.

 

We don't have many Earthcaches around here in Central Arkansas. We have been near two when hunting traditionals. The first one we didn't attempt because half of the questions appeared to focus on our knowledge and prowess using our gpsr and not geology. The second we spent some time gathering answers until we saw it required a visit to another site and the picture be made there. And yes, it too required using the gpsr to do something I don't know how to do. Anyway, we really didn't have time to go to another site to answer the last question and make a photo.

 

So far, we don't have an Earthcache find. Perhaps one day.

 

My question, why go into the gpsr tech with your questions? Altitudes, waypoint projections, starting and ending coords, average angle of decline and things of that nature. How does requiring such to log a find improve the learning of geology?

Wow - jump through all of those hoops & you deserve not just a smiley but also a Ph.D.!

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My question, why go into the gpsr tech with your questions? Altitudes, waypoint projections, starting and ending coords, average angle of decline and things of that nature. How does requiring such to log a find improve the learning of geology?

 

Measuring landforms can teach us a lot about geology; a GPS unit is a tool most of us cachers will have handy anyway. There are other ways to measure some of those things, but since we already have the GPS, I appreciate it when I don't have to drag along extra equipment.

 

Comparing altitudes from one point to another is a simple way to measure depth. Using starting and ending coordinates is a way to measure length and direction (For example: does it run east-west or southeast-northwest?). Average angle of decline can tell us a lot about erosion rate, for one example, and is easy enough to determine if you know the depth and length of the landform.

 

Personally, I find this sort of interaction a lot more fun than "read the sign and tell me what year the park was established" or "estimate how high the feature is"

 

If you need help figuring out how to use your GPS to measure things for an EarthCache, we are always here for you! Or you can ask in some of the other forums as well. Someone will know your unit well enough to walk you through it.

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My question, why go into the gpsr tech with your questions? Altitudes, waypoint projections, starting and ending coords, average angle of decline and things of that nature. How does requiring such to log a find improve the learning of geology?

 

Measuring landforms can teach us a lot about geology; a GPS unit is a tool most of us cachers will have handy anyway. There are other ways to measure some of those things, but since we already have the GPS, I appreciate it when I don't have to drag along extra equipment.

 

Comparing altitudes from one point to another is a simple way to measure depth. Using starting and ending coordinates is a way to measure length and direction (For example: does it run east-west or southeast-northwest?). Average angle of decline can tell us a lot about erosion rate, for one example, and is easy enough to determine if you know the depth and length of the landform.

 

Personally, I find this sort of interaction a lot more fun than "read the sign and tell me what year the park was established" or "estimate how high the feature is"

If you need help figuring out how to use your GPS to measure things for an EarthCache, we are always here for you! Or you can ask in some of the other forums as well. Someone will know your unit well enough to walk you through it.

 

Maybe so, but every time someone asks for help solving a cache puzzle, etc., in the forums, someone says "helping solve that is not allowed in the forums." I guess in this case they need to stick to the generic question of "how do I do "x" with my gpsr?"

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Maybe so, but every time someone asks for help solving a cache puzzle, etc., in the forums, someone says "helping solve that is not allowed in the forums." I guess in this case they need to stick to the generic question of "how do I do "x" with my gpsr?"

 

You are so correct. I can see why you saw the correlation, but puzzle caches are different. With them, part of the fun of solving the cache is figuring out how to decode the information.

 

With EarthCaches, the fun is in the interactive learning. Your GPS unit is a tool to get a measurement about a landform. In most cases, there are other ways to measure the same thing (use a protractor, pace off the length and do the math, measure a stick and compare the length of its shadow to the shadow of the landform, etc). Since we already have the GPS with us, it's nice to be able to use it--and sometimes easier.

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My guess is those "Techy" Earthcaches don't have many logged finds. That is pretty intense, and that's from a guy who has written and had published 100+ earthcaches. I don't think ANY require that level of techy. I guess one of the reasons is that many people now use the app and that doesn't have those features, though other small and usually free apps do. I too agree that often leans towards techy and forgets geology in the process.

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I think the enjoyment and point of EarthCaches is to get us to pay attention to and learn about the geology of the world around us. I have submitted answers that did not match up with what the CO was looking for and my wrong answers lead to short e-mail discussions, more learning and a Found log left in place.

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We own a few earthcaches and a couple of them get tons of logs everyday . We try to be adaptable with people logging in a group , as in one e-mail will do as long as the e-mail states the identities of the people wanting to log it as a find. However due to the high traffic nature of the caches in question We do require that the found log does not come before the e-mail that was sent . Lately we have been getting a lot of people trying to log a find and not send the required e-mail " until a later date " . If we receive no e-mail , we delete the log until compliance is met. This has sometime resulted in some rather rude e-mails after deletion, however we feel we have to keep it fair to everyone. Some have even accused us of being unsportsmanlike because there find was deleted because they had not sent the required e-mail . Yet having deleted their log for non-compliance they sure were fast to send us an e-mail telling us how terrible and unsportsmanlike we were ! LOL

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We own a few earthcaches and a couple of them get tons of logs everyday . We try to be adaptable with people logging in a group , as in one e-mail will do as long as the e-mail states the identities of the people wanting to log it as a find. However due to the high traffic nature of the caches in question We do require that the found log does not come before the e-mail that was sent . Lately we have been getting a lot of people trying to log a find and not send the required e-mail " until a later date " . If we receive no e-mail , we delete the log until compliance is met. This has sometime resulted in some rather rude e-mails after deletion, however we feel we have to keep it fair to everyone. Some have even accused us of being unsportsmanlike because there find was deleted because they had not sent the required e-mail . Yet having deleted their log for non-compliance they sure were fast to send us an e-mail telling us how terrible and unsportsmanlike we were ! LOL

I have to say, I'm behind you on this one 100%. I've lost track of the number of times I had to wait a few days before I could sort out the requirements only to discover that I'd missed one when I went to send the e-mail. If I'd logged the find right away, I seriously doubt I would go back to delete the find log if I later discovered I was lacking, and I'm a remarkably honest person.

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We own a few earthcaches and a couple of them get tons of logs everyday . We try to be adaptable with people logging in a group , as in one e-mail will do as long as the e-mail states the identities of the people wanting to log it as a find. However due to the high traffic nature of the caches in question We do require that the found log does not come before the e-mail that was sent . Lately we have been getting a lot of people trying to log a find and not send the required e-mail " until a later date " . If we receive no e-mail , we delete the log until compliance is met. This has sometime resulted in some rather rude e-mails after deletion, however we feel we have to keep it fair to everyone. Some have even accused us of being unsportsmanlike because there find was deleted because they had not sent the required e-mail . Yet having deleted their log for non-compliance they sure were fast to send us an e-mail telling us how terrible and unsportsmanlike we were ! LOL

I have to say, I'm behind you on this one 100%. I've lost track of the number of times I had to wait a few days before I could sort out the requirements only to discover that I'd missed one when I went to send the e-mail. If I'd logged the find right away, I seriously doubt I would go back to delete the find log if I later discovered I was lacking, and I'm a remarkably honest person.

 

I think waiting a week is reasonable. Having to wait a couple of weeks is a gray area.. which I personally believe to still be reasonable. Anything beyond that I think a delete is very much warranted. But ANYONE who deletes a find because I didn't send my email 30 seconds after my Found It is just a jerk, pure and simple.

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But ANYONE who deletes a find because I didn't send my email 30 seconds after my Found It is just a jerk, pure and simple.

I always send my e-mail before logging the find so that that can't happen. As it happens, that also keeps me honest. If I only have time to post logs and don't have time to compose the e-mail right away, I just live with the fact that that means I'll be logging that cache out of order (although, naturally, I always put the correct date on it).

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We own a few earthcaches and a couple of them get tons of logs everyday . We try to be adaptable with people logging in a group , as in one e-mail will do as long as the e-mail states the identities of the people wanting to log it as a find. However due to the high traffic nature of the caches in question We do require that the found log does not come before the e-mail that was sent . Lately we have been getting a lot of people trying to log a find and not send the required e-mail " until a later date " . If we receive no e-mail , we delete the log until compliance is met. This has sometime resulted in some rather rude e-mails after deletion, however we feel we have to keep it fair to everyone. Some have even accused us of being unsportsmanlike because there find was deleted because they had not sent the required e-mail . Yet having deleted their log for non-compliance they sure were fast to send us an e-mail telling us how terrible and unsportsmanlike we were ! LOL

Perhaps they are puzzled because you're creating an additional logging requirement.

 

The earthcache guidelines say that you have to have logging tasks and that finders have to abide by them or owners can delete their logs.

 

There is no requirement that the "found it" log be preceded by an email. Deleting someone's logs simply because they logged and then emailed borders on arbitrary and capricious, and I doubt that Groundspeak would side with you if someone decided to appeal rather than play your game.

 

I always email before I log, and I'd prefer that those who log our earthcaches did the same -- but I don't require it, I treat cachers who log our earthcaches like adults.

Edited by hzoi

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Deleting someone's logs simply because they logged and then emailed borders on arbitrary and capricious, and I doubt that Groundspeak would side with you if someone decided to appeal rather than play your game.

Although your point is valid, I have to ask whether it's really fair to force a CO to keep tabs of each and every found log in order to come back later to see if the e-mail's arrived. And exactly what arbitrary amount of time later are you proposing they wait before you would not consider their actions "arbitrary"?

 

I concede that immediately deleting a find would be a jerky thing to do, but putting the CO in that position is even more jerky.

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I'm usually somewhat lax. If they made a fair attempt at it and came close with the answers, I'm OK. I've rarely deleted a log where they send answers. Though, last week on one of mine that requires six answers/tasks, the person got one right, two wrong (very wrong) and claimed they couldn't find the spot to get the answers to the other three. The final three answers come from a map embedded in the cement at GZ. I wrote back and said "sorry" and deleted the log.

Edited by HistDrew

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[Although not quite on topic, I thought this fitting for this thread.]

 

Something new (for us at least): we got perfect answers to the questions on one of our EarthCaches.

 

When a cacher sent their answers, I reply with a thank you and sent the 'correct' answers back. Now we've received our own answers from someone; They copied the 'correct' answers from someone else and sent those to us...

 

For me it is important cachers show they've learned something/given the topic some thought, so I'm not happy with getting copied answers. I'm sure it happens more often, but sending our own answers back as-is, well, then you're asking to be caught out.

 

I'm not sure what to do with that/how to respond. I'm inclined to just delete the logs. Or maybe reply with a "Your answers are all wrong, please try again."

 

Suggestions how to deal with this are more than welcome.

 

Cheers,

 

Mr. Terratin

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[Although not quite on topic, I thought this fitting for this thread.]

 

When a cacher sent their answers, I reply with a thank you and sent the 'correct' answers back. Now we've received our own answers from someone; They copied the 'correct' answers from someone else and sent those to us...

 

 

And you're absolutely sure it was a cut and paste thing?

 

I'd reply by writing "Usually when someone sends in their answers I reply with all the correct answers in a list. You seem to have copied that list from someone else. Can you give me an idea of why they are identical?"

 

And see what s/he writes back.

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Deleting someone's logs simply because they logged and then emailed borders on arbitrary and capricious, and I doubt that Groundspeak would side with you if someone decided to appeal rather than play your game.

Although your point is valid, I have to ask whether it's really fair to force a CO to keep tabs of each and every found log in order to come back later to see if the e-mail's arrived. And exactly what arbitrary amount of time later are you proposing they wait before you would not consider their actions "arbitrary"?

 

I concede that immediately deleting a find would be a jerky thing to do, but putting the CO in that position is even more jerky.

 

It may not be fair, but it's ultimately expected by Groundspeak. Isn't that part of the responsibility one assumes when publishing an earthcache?

 

Back when Groundspeak went through a major crackdown on armchair logs to virtual caches, they certainly placed the onus on cache owners, not cache finders. Here's a quote from one that got archived:

 

This cache has been identified as frequently being logged by persons who have not visited its location. Many people who have logged this cache are legitimate. However, as the cache owner, you must maintain your cache page by deleting bogus logs. This is required by the Geocaching.com guidelines. Please ensure that you complete this maintenance within four weeks, or we will archive this cache. Regards, Sandy

 

It's been a couple of years since Sandy posted that to the cache, but the guideline in question still puts the burden on the owner, not the logger.

 

It is one of your maintenance duties as the geocache owner to monitor quality control of posts to the geocache page. To this end, you have the power to delete logs.

 

Like I said -- I prefer it when I get the email first. And I always try to send the email first, in fact, I can't recall a single time I've logged prior to email that wasn't by accident. But that's not required, and cache owners have no right to delete logs just because their personal preferences aren't being satisfied.

 

edit to add: forgot to answer the second part of your question. I don't have an exact timeline, nor do I suspect Groundspeak does. It probably boils down to what's reasonable under the circumstances. Someone has regular access to a computer and is logging other caches? A day or two should be reasonable. Someone's on vacation and has sporadic access to email? A week or so. Someone logs my cache and then disappears into darkest Africa for a yearlong safari? That one's a little tricky, I'll wait until it comes up.

 

Bottom line for me, if it's been more than what I consider a reasonable time, and the cacher didn't specify when they'd be able to send an email in their log, I'll reach out and touch 'em with an email, then give 'em a day or so to respond. No response, I delete their log.

Edited by hzoi

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