Muggled Caches

June 21, 2013

Okay...last year sometime, some folks decided to branch out and create another Geocaching site called "Off the Grid Caching"...I registered and poked around a bit on their site and it did not appeal to me so I never signed back on and, actually forgot about it until now...

I just received an email from them saying that they've launched a "Sister site" called "Muggled.net"...

I just went to the "Sister site" and clicked on the "Muggling 101" link and found this...

http://www.muggled.net/muggling-101/

Are these morons serious? They promote PURPOSELY stealing caches and requiring you to PAY to register on their site to get your cache back?

June 21, 2013

Is there a way to report a website? Basically it sounds like a neighborhood gang forcing street venders to pay for "protection". They don't even know the definition of "muggle". What they propose is piracy. Muggling is when someone that's not involved stumbles on the cache and takes it. Either way, a site like that should be illegal, as it's promoting thievery and hostage-taking.

Sounds like they're upset that their first site didn't take off like they wanted.

Edited June 21, 2013 by Kacher82

June 21, 2013

Is there a way to report a website? Basically it sounds like a neighborhood gang forcing street venders to pay for "protection". They don't even know the definition of "muggle". What they propose is piracy. Muggling is when someone that's not involved stumbles on the cache and takes it. Either way, a site like that should be illegal, as it's promoting thievery and hostage-taking.

Sounds like they're upset that their first site didn't take off like they wanted.

Maybe a Groundspeak Lackey can weigh in here...

I am a Police Officer in GA and this is the very definition of Theft by taking...if they destroy a cache then it is Criminal trespass (since the value is less than $500)...either way IT IS A CRIME!! These idiots are promoting crime and charging you to be a part of it!

According to their website, when a cache owner seems "Civil" they may meet up to return the cache (after you've paid your $10 to join the site)...I will be very civil via email/phone but I will have the moron(s) in handcuffs shortly after the meeting takes place! I HATE A THIEF!

June 21, 2013

Also, the fact that they offer "Muggle Protection" for an additional fee, is EXTORTION!!! Since they are promoting this on a website (across state and international lines) it is a FEDERAL case!

1.2k · June 21, 2013

Yikes! And he actually shows his face in the video. Is this a joke?

6.1k · June 21, 2013

Its garbage alright. Ticks and leeches trying to make money off of someone else in an antisocial and illegal way. We have his image from the video, so he doesn't seem to be too bright.

I also noticed this site and this site, which appear to be linked to this member, through location and a blog which I am not allowed to link to due to forum rules, but I don't think they are related to the OP.

Edited June 21, 2013 by 4wheelin_fool

June 21, 2013

I just submitted this info to Groundspeak, hopefully they can do something about it!

1.6k · June 21, 2013

1. If you had not posted this message I and a lot of others would not know these sites existed.

2. Since his "original site" did not take off, what makes you think this new one will?

June 21, 2013

1. If you had not posted this message I and a lot of others would not know these sites existed.

2. Since his "original site" did not take off, what makes you think this new one will?

I'm 100% in agreement with you!! I really do not see very many people paying $10 to join his site AND paying another $30 for a premium membership on geocaching.com just to have access to caches to steal/destroy!!! It would really take a moron to pay $40 a year just to commit crimes!!

6.1k · June 21, 2013

Find out who registered the site. Wait until they leave their car in a public area or street, and then take it, and say it was abandoned, and leave a small card saying they have to register with their local towing company for $1000 to have it returned. Sounds like fun.

There are plenty of tow companies that will scoop a car up and hold on to it if you call them up and say you're the owner, you lost the keys, and it won't start anyhow. Use a throwaway cell phone, show them a fake ID, leave a card behind, and you're done.

7.8k · June 21, 2013

Find out who registered the site.

Bright guy who put his face out there did do something smart and used a proxy service to register his site, so we can't find his identity that way.

However, if he's doing something illegal as stated by GeoJunkie!, a court order might reveal that information.

June 21, 2013

Find out who registered the site.

Bright guy who put his face out there did do something smart and used a proxy service to register his site, so we can't find his identity that way.

However, if he's doing something illegal as stated by GeoJunkie!, a court order might reveal that information.

Yea, I did a "whois" search on his domain and saw that it is registered as confidential!! Like I said before, I don't think that we'll see any issues with it, it just makes me mad that someone would try to stoop that low and screw with caches! If Groundspeak can figure out who the moron is (I'm sure he has an account here) they should ban his user name and IP addresses forever!

6.1k · June 21, 2013

Find out who registered the site.

Bright guy who put his face out there did do something smart and used a proxy service to register his site, so we can't find his identity that way.

However, if he's doing something illegal as stated by GeoJunkie!, a court order might reveal that information.

Yea, I did a "whois" search on his domain and saw that it is registered as confidential!! Like I said before, I don't think that we'll see any issues with it, it just makes me mad that someone would try to stoop that low and screw with caches! If Groundspeak can figure out who the moron is (I'm sure he has an account here) they should ban his user name and IP addresses forever!

It would be more fun to attach a GPS tracking device to his car and wait until he is driving at night somewhere remote. With a cellphone jammer and high powered laser pointer, it would be easy to make it look like fell asleep and went off the road. The coroner will not check his retinas for burns either!

10.2k · June 21, 2013

Find out who registered the site.

Bright guy who put his face out there did do something smart and used a proxy service to register his site, so we can't find his identity that way.

However, if he's doing something illegal as stated by GeoJunkie!, a court order might reveal that information.

Yea, I did a "whois" search on his domain and saw that it is registered as confidential!! Like I said before, I don't think that we'll see any issues with it, it just makes me mad that someone would try to stoop that low and screw with caches! If Groundspeak can figure out who the moron is (I'm sure he has an account here) they should ban his user name and IP addresses forever!

Not just scumbags register domain names by proxy. I own three domain names, and I would have paid the extra for a proxy registry. I don't want people seeing my name, address and phone number on a WHOIS search. However, in my case, I got around it by just leaving it in the guys name who transferred them to me. Shh, don't tell him.

Well, if there was anyone to complain to (and probably nothing will happen), it would be his webhost, which is inmotionhosting.com:

TraceRoute from Network-Tools.com to 198.46.90.135 [muggled.net]

Hop (ms) (ms) (ms) IP Address Host name

1 0 0 0 8.9.232.73 xe-5-3-0.edge3.dallas1.level3.net

2 33 33 33 4.69.145.254 vlan90.csw4.dallas1.level3.net

3 33 35 33 4.69.151.170 ae-93-93.ebr3.dallas1.level3.net

4 33 33 33 4.69.134.22 ae-7-7.ebr3.atlanta2.level3.net

5 33 33 33 4.69.132.86 ae-2-2.ebr1.washington1.level3.net

6 33 33 33 4.69.134.134 ae-71-71.csw2.washington1.level3.net

7 33 33 33 4.69.149.78 ae-2-70.edge2.washington1.level3.net

8 34 37 34 4.79.22.110 inmotion-ho.edge2.washington1.level3.net

9 34 34 34 198.46.90.135 ecbiz135.inmotionhosting.com

Looks like this is their contact page.

June 21, 2013

I agree with you on that...I have a domain name as well and I spent the extra cash to have it protected and anonymous! I have a cache supply store and wanted to keep my customers' info safe, as well as my personal contact info. I have all of the pertinent contact info on my store site!

3.3k · June 21, 2013

I just submitted this info to Groundspeak, hopefully they can do something about it!

Glad you reported it. Can you imagine - they sell an "I Steal Geocaches" t-shirt ($18.80 plus shipping). What kind of moron wears a shirt advertising their illegal activity?

June 21, 2013

I do not know how many of you have heard, visited the website, or seen the video posted on YouTube, but there is an individual out there advocating stealing, he calls it muggling, geocaches. To retrieve your geocache, if the muggler decided not to destroy it, something else this man is advocating, you have to register with his site, Muggled Dot Net [MDN], which costs $10.00 annually. Comments are not allowed on the YouTube page, but you can like/dislike it. I would suggest visitors marking the video as Spam or misleading and then letting YouTube know the man is advocating stealing and through his policies, requires COs to either forfeit their property or pay $10.00 minimum to get it back, is promoting coercion. I could not find if someone stole your cache, if the thief would pay to have it mailed back to you, if the thief was from out of state or not near to go replace the cache. Here is the YouTube link: MDN VIDEO 2013 (www.muggled.net).

7.3k · June 21, 2013

already being discussed in this thread:

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=312401

although yours is the better thread title/subtitle.

B.

10.2k · June 21, 2013

Its garbage alright. Ticks and leeches trying to make money off of someone else in an antisocial and illegal way. We have his image from the video, so he doesn't seem to be too bright.

I also noticed this site and this site, which appear to be linked to this member, through location and a blog which I am not allowed to link to due to forum rules, but I don't think they are related to the OP.

Fine work 4WF. This guy is basically a crackpot, and no one is going to join this. Kind of reminds me of Geocheating.com, which was taken down within about 3 days. Don't try going to that, it's long since dead. We've already given him way too much publicity. Not that anyone reading these forums is all like, yeah, great idea, I'm going to send this k00k $10. :blink:

June 21, 2013

complaints about http://www.muggled.net/ should be sent to the company that they are hosted through.

Please address them to abuse@inmotionhosting.com and include as much detail as you can.

Here is a link to the Terms of Service that the owner of muggled.net agreed to to get internet hosting: http://www.inmotionhosting.com/terms-of-service.

It seems clear to me that several of the activities of muggled.net fall under their Right to Terminate (without refund).

The more email they get about this issue, the more likely something can be done to stop it.

June 21, 2013

I don't post on here much, but wanted to add something. I found out about this from a post on FB. I emailed a complaint to abuse@inmotionhosting.com. I also included a link to his YT video. Now, I agree, only a complete moron would sign up for this thief's site, but I still find it offensive. I hope it is taken down and plan to post in my other FB forums. I wonder if he steals other things? I hate thieves.

(Ha! Looks like Baggah beat me to the punch, great minds~~~)

Edited June 21, 2013 by TxVic

June 21, 2013

I see the video has 1 like and 44 dislikes. That's a good start. It also has at least one report (from me).

7.5k · June 21, 2013

already being discussed in this thread:

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=312401

Help! I'm in an infinite loop!

The actual link to the other thread is http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=312396.

June 21, 2013

I see the video has 1 like and 44 dislikes. That's a good start. It also has at least one report (from me).

And me as well.

June 21, 2013

Wow. What a great idea.

Stealing for profit.

I doubt it catches on.

Edited June 21, 2013 by EdwardnNC

5.7k · June 21, 2013

I see the video has 1 like and 44 dislikes. That's a good start. It also has at least one report (from me).

And me as well.

Same here. Thanks to the OP for posting this in more than one geocaching forums.

5.7k · June 21, 2013

complaints about http://www.muggled.net/ should be sent to the company that they are hosted through.

Please address them to abuse@inmotionhosting.com and include as much detail as you can.

Here is a link to the Terms of Service that the owner of muggled.net agreed to to get internet hosting: http://www.inmotionhosting.com/terms-of-service.

It seems clear to me that several of the activities of muggled.net fall under their Right to Terminate (without refund).

The more email they get about this issue, the more likely something can be done to stop it.

Does it help if more people report it? This seems to have made a big splat on all the geocaching services and FB group geocachers too. :unsure:

10.2k · June 21, 2013

complaints about http://www.muggled.net/ should be sent to the company that they are hosted through.

Please address them to abuse@inmotionhosting.com and include as much detail as you can.

Here is a link to the Terms of Service that the owner of muggled.net agreed to to get internet hosting: http://www.inmotionhosting.com/terms-of-service.

It seems clear to me that several of the activities of muggled.net fall under their Right to Terminate (without refund).

The more email they get about this issue, the more likely something can be done to stop it.

Does it help if more people report it? This seems to have made a big splat on all the geocaching services and FB group geocachers too.

I haven't done it, but I would think so. By the way, Domains by Proxy is a GoDaddy.com property. I would go ahead and report it to Danica Patrick, as well. Hey, wouldn't hurt.

4.2k · June 22, 2013

Also, the fact that they offer "Muggle Protection" for an additional fee, is EXTORTION!!! Since they are promoting this on a website (across state and international lines) it is a FEDERAL case!

It may not be supporting theft (that is far too complicated and fact-specific question to start to discuss here), but if it is serious, maybe attempted extortion (since I cannot imagine anyone paying for muggle protection). I would like to think this is someone's idea of a bad joke or even worse satire. But it is not worth the time it would take to look at the site and try to figure out if it is anything more than an attempt to needle cachers. . . . .

Okay, I could not restrain myself. Not on the level of Forest Defenders. Having a classified section that purports to offer caching containers was a nice touch -- not the place I would advertise for that. But other than that, a little bit of discordianism that is better left ignored.

7.8k · June 22, 2013

Another thought:

What about reporting him to PayPal? It sure sounds like he's violating their Acceptable Use Policy. The email address for reporting such violations is at the end of that document.

10.2k · June 22, 2013

Also, the fact that they offer "Muggle Protection" for an additional fee, is EXTORTION!!! Since they are promoting this on a website (across state and international lines) it is a FEDERAL case!

It may not be supporting theft (that is far too complicated and fact-specific question to start to discuss here), but if it is serious, maybe attempted extortion (since I cannot imagine anyone paying for muggle protection). I would like to think this is someone's idea of a bad joke or even worse satire. But it is not worth the time it would take to look at the site and try to figure out if it is anything more than an attempt to needle cachers. . . . .

Okay, I could not restrain myself. Not on the level of Forest Defenders. Having a classified section that purports to offer caching containers was a nice touch -- not the place I would advertise for that. But other than that, a little bit of discordianism that is better left ignored.

OK .net domains are cheap, especially for a first time buyer. And who the heck would have ever registered muggled.net? So he probably got it for $10 maximum, and being a GoDaddy.com user myself, the most basic "domains by proxy" level is another $10. And of course he's paying for web hosting. Maybe he expects it to get taken down due to complaints quickly. I suppose it's not a lot of money to troll the entire world-wide Geocaching community. Personally, I think he's serious, and whacked. Nice circa 1999 looking website too. Well, maybe except that YouTube didn't exist, and you couldn't embed a video in a website back then. :lol: Viewing source tells me it's made with Wordpress.

Edited June 22, 2013 by Mr.Yuck

1.2k · June 22, 2013

If I Paypal him soon I hope I can be a Platinum member! :unsure:

3.3k · June 22, 2013

I see the video has 1 like and 44 dislikes. That's a good start. It also has at least one report (from me).

And me as well.

Same here. Thanks to the OP for posting this in more than one geocaching forums.

Yes, there are three active forums now!

10.2k · June 22, 2013

If I Paypal him soon I hope I can be a Platinum member!

Pay pal tells me he's a registered LLC. Anyone want to check on that? :unsure: Again, a lot of work put in to this thing if he's just trolling the entire Geocaching populace on the whole planet. If he is, by they way, it's not funny. Last I checked, this is the first day of summer, not April 1st. :huh:

Edited June 22, 2013 by Mr.Yuck

22k · June 22, 2013

I merged together two threads about the same subject, choosing the one with the more descriptive topic title to survive the merge. I also hid a third thread about the same subject.

June 22, 2013

Thanks for merging Keystone!

7.9k · June 22, 2013

Is this an E-ticket ride?

5.7k · June 22, 2013

If I Paypal him soon I hope I can be a Platinum member!

Pay pal tells me he's a registered LLC. Anyone want to check on that? Again, a lot of work put in to this thing if he's just trolling the entire Geocaching populace on the whole planet. If he is, by they way, it's not funny. Last I checked, this is the first day of summer, not April 1st.

Did you use your real geocaching user name, or is it still open? :laughing:

Dang, Mr. Yuck! I hope Paypal can give me a refund. Someone pulled the plug on his website. Who got muggled now? :lol:

Edited June 22, 2013 by Manville Possum Hunters

June 22, 2013

The site is down right now. Hopefully it stays that way!

2k · June 22, 2013

*poof* ... it's gone.

June 22, 2013

The YouTube video is still up, but it now has 140+ dislikes, and still just 1 like.

3.7k · June 22, 2013

*poof* ... it's gone.

Bye bye!

2.8k · June 22, 2013

I registered mugglednetmuggler.net, a website devoted to muggling muggler websites and just for a mere $100 you can join and get your muggled muggling website back.

I'd finish of my post with a word that starts with D and ends with ouche and almost rhymes with pooch but I'm above that.

Edited June 22, 2013 by Roman!

7.8k · June 22, 2013

Wow, reporting a site actually works!

...and Roman!, "Donner la bouche"? I don't get it. :laughing:

6.1k · June 22, 2013

Its garbage alright. Ticks and leeches trying to make money off of someone else in an antisocial and illegal way. We have his image from the video, so he doesn't seem to be too bright.

I also noticed this site and this site, which appear to be linked to this member, through location and a blog which I am not allowed to link to due to forum rules, but I don't think they are related to the OP.

Fine work 4WF. This guy is basically a crackpot, and no one is going to join this. Kind of reminds me of Geocheating.com, which was taken down within about 3 days. Don't try going to that, it's long since dead. We've already given him way too much publicity. Not that anyone reading these forums is all like, yeah, great idea, I'm going to send this k00k $10.

Thanks for recognizing my search skills, but there haven't been any comments regarding conning a tow truck company into seizing his car, or causing him to crash and burn his retinas using nerd like devices. I'm not sure if that idiot selling the t-shirts is the same that posted the video, but it does seem to be associated with that username. Perhaps someone could break into his house and rearrange the furniture and not take anything. The police would respond and confirm he is a crackpot, while the high dose of L-Carnitine along with some of the juice of the flower "pheasants eye" placed into his food and drinks would surely cause a heart attack, and one not traceable by police testing. Revenge of the nerds, again..

3.7k · June 22, 2013

Edited June 22, 2013 by The_Incredibles_

June 22, 2013

Well....

Crowd Sourcing WORKS..... Social media at it's best...

Hosting provider killed the website. IT'S GONE.....

June 22, 2013

...and one more thumbs down on the youtube video, plus one more report.

I'm all for fun, and new ideas are great, however from what I can see this guy is trying to make money through theft and extortion or destruction of people's property. He's not even a kid ffs ... everyone knows that bored teenagers trash geocaches but he's twice their age.

If he loves geocaching as much as he says, then there is every chance that he is reading this forum thread, in which case I'd just like to say what a complete w****r you are mate, get a frikkin life, really.

I do admire the b@lls of appearing in the video though

3.7k · June 22, 2013

I watched the youtube video. What a moron!

June 22, 2013

This post from another online forum may have helped shut down the site:

I reported this dirtbag to PayPal to their abuse of policy email. Here is the text of the email I sent them (I removed my personal information from below):

I wanted to let you know that a website that is promoting theft, extortion and coercion is using PayPal to lure people into paying money to commit the same. I would like to recommend that you take a look at the people holding this account and terminate their account with you to stop this activity.

The website revolves around the sport of geocaching which is an activity that has been around for over 13 years. A container is hidden somewhere and the coordinates are posted to a website. Geocachers use a GPS or GPS enabled device to find the container and sign the log. Often times the owner of the geocache leaves items for other people to trade and share in the fun. This is an activity that is enjoyed by over 5 million geocachers worldwide and their families. You can learn more about it by visiting geocaching.com

The problem and the potential criminal activity revolves around a website called www.muggled.net. Muggles are a term adopted by geocachers that means someone that does not geocache or does not know about geocaching. Sometimes a muggle inadvertently finds a geocache and can carry it away or throw it away because they don't know what it is. This is called "muggling". Muggling is accepted as an occasional "occupational hazard" of a geocache container. This website, muggled.net, is encouraging people to purposely go and steal geocaches and then contact the geocache owner and get them to pay if they want the geocache returned. They also offer "protection" of your geocache from muggling if you pay this website. These transactions are made using PayPal. I seriously believe this is an infringment of your terms of use. Additionally, the "protection" is fraud because by promoting this muggling activity, they actually can offer no protection against people going to geocaching.com, finding geocaches and purposely going to steal them.

I am in the process of investigating the location of the owners of this website so that I can report the activity to their county District Attorney and submitting them to the Internet Fraud Association. I would kindly recommend that you investigate this website for yourself and determine if it is in line with your company mission and vision. Thank you so much for your attention.

For your information, the PayPal account name being used by this website is MUGGLED.NET, LLC.

Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

Thanks again,

<MY FULLNAME>

PayPal member: <MY EMAIL ADDRESS>

Technical Writer

Administrative Office of the Pennsylvania Courts

I also submitted a claim to the IC3.

Our voice will have more power if other people also send in complaints!

I noticed about 20 minutes after sending these complaints in that the site was taken down. But don't let that stop you from sending in a complaint. THIS IS CRIMINAL ACTIVITY!

To file a complaint with the IC3: https://www.ic3.gov/default.aspx (You do not need to be a victim to file a complaint, just write in the description that you are not a victim but just reporting criminal activity).

To file a complaint with PayPay: https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_contact-general (select "Report Fraud/Prohibit Use" and "High Risk Business/Prohibited Use Questions")

Edited June 22, 2013 by Great Scott!

Muggled Caches

Recommended Posts

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment

Link to comment