Forget about FTF's, what's about shared FTF's?

January 5, 2010

Can't there only be one First To Find on a cache?

Unless more than one cacher physically finds the cache at the exact same time, there is really only one who can claim being the 'first to find' it, no?

Or how do shared FTF's work?

5.7k · January 5, 2010

Can't there only be one First To Find on a cache?

Unless more than one cacher physically finds the cache at the exact same time, there is really only one who can claim being the 'first to find' it, no?

Or how do shared FTF's work?

If the CO wants to allow 14 FTF's, and there are 14 cachers that want to log FTF, then there will be 14 FTF's on his cache. There is no sharing, there is however, pigish behavior.

Edited January 5, 2010 by Team Cotati

3.3k · January 5, 2010

I have often seen a new cache with 2 or 3 people logging something like "...we were the FTF. Nice..."

Personaly, I wouldn't do that. My first search for an unfound cache, my 8 year old dauter made the find. She claimed FTF, and I logged something like "..Punked my my 8 year old Aggg..."

3.8k · January 5, 2010

I've logged many co-FTFs but you're right, it does sound cheesy. Explain that to my caching group though.. :-(

5.7k · January 5, 2010

I've logged many co-FTFs but you're right, it does sound cheesy. Explain that to my caching group though.. :-(

I won't be wasting my breath on your 'group' however you are more than welcome to quote me at your next meeting. :unsure:

3.8k · January 5, 2010

I've logged many co-FTFs but you're right, it does sound cheesy. Explain that to my caching group though.. :-(

I won't be wasting my breath on your 'group' however you are more than welcome to quote me at your next meeting.

You're too cool for me.. my group happens to be my family.

Edited January 5, 2010 by bflentje

2.2k · January 5, 2010

I have been caching in a group looking for a new cache. If I physically spot it first then I'll add it to my list of FTFs. If someone else in the group spots it first then I do not consider it a FTF for me.

If I spot it first and someone else in the group wants to count it as a FTF for themselves, they can do so as well since it doesn't affect me one bit.

5.7k · January 5, 2010

I've logged many co-FTFs but you're right, it does sound cheesy. Explain that to my caching group though.. :-(

I won't be wasting my breath on your 'group' however you are more than welcome to quote me at your next meeting.

You're too cool for me.. my group happens to be my family.

Oh I see, you meant to say:

"Explain that to the members of my family that I geocache with."

Got it thank you. And I'll even let you quote me to your family members that you go geocaching with.

January 5, 2010

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

January 5, 2010

Can't there only be one First To Find on a cache?

Unless more than one cacher physically finds the cache at the exact same time, there is really only one who can claim being the 'first to find' it, no?

Or how do shared FTF's work?

So I guess all the FTF's that I found first when we go out together are all mine then?!?

January 5, 2010

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

*cough* [Edited by Moderator] *cough*

Edited January 6, 2010 by Keystone

January 5, 2010

Can't there only be one First To Find on a cache?

Unless more than one cacher physically finds the cache at the exact same time, there is really only one who can claim being the 'first to find' it, no?

Or how do shared FTF's work?

So I guess all the FTF's that I found first when we go out together are all mine then?!?

Yep, except the ones I found first while you were deciding which flashlight you should bring.

6.5k · January 5, 2010

I'd suggest greco-roman wrestling at the spot of the cache. Best of three falls gets to claim the official FTF. :unsure:

January 5, 2010

Can't there only be one First To Find on a cache?

Unless more than one cacher physically finds the cache at the exact same time, there is really only one who can claim being the 'first to find' it, no?

Or how do shared FTF's work?

I've co-FTF'd before with my friend Pole Position. Whenever we're after an FTF together, we have a rule: "Whoever sees the cache first and yells 'Found It!' first gets the FTF. If we both spot it and yell 'Found It!' at the same time, we share the FTF."

Usually, however, only one of us wins the FTF.

Me.

:unsure:

January 5, 2010

If there's anything that makes someone a "D****e," (misogyny is so appropriate on a family forum, btw) it's making up arbitrary rules about things that don't really exist to begin with.

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

*cough* <snip> *cough*

Edited January 5, 2010 by Taoiseach

January 5, 2010

I'd suggest greco-roman wrestling at the spot of the cache. Best of three falls gets to claim the official FTF.

I couldn't agree more with you! I like the way you think.

10.1k · January 5, 2010

Whoever finds it first gets the FTF. The rest of us claim co-FTF (because we wre on the hunt), but don't count it as an actual FTF.

January 6, 2010

I'd suggest greco-roman wrestling at the spot of the cache. Best of three falls gets to claim the official FTF.

I couldn't agree more with you! I like the way you think.

They obviously must not cache with Flintstone5611 or Mare, or heck, even me!

January 6, 2010

Can't there only be one First To Find on a cache?

Unless more than one cacher physically finds the cache at the exact same time, there is really only one who can claim being the 'first to find' it, no?

Or how do shared FTF's work?

So I guess all the FTF's that I found first when we go out together are all mine then?!?

Yep, except the ones I found first while you were deciding which flashlight you should bring.

D'oh!

January 6, 2010

If there's anything that makes someone a "D****e," (misogyny is so appropriate on a family forum, btw) it's making up arbitrary rules about things that don't really exist to begin with.

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

*cough* <snip> *cough*

*cough* nozzle *cough*

January 6, 2010

If there's anything that makes someone a "D****e," (misogyny is so appropriate on a family forum, btw) it's making up arbitrary rules about things that don't really exist to begin with.

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

*cough* <snip> *cough*

*cough* nozzle *cough*

pretty weird that something that doesn't exist is listed in the glossary of terms!

"FTF

First to Find. An acronym written by geocachers in physical cache logbooks or online when logging cache finds to denote being the first to find a new geocache. "

19k · January 6, 2010

If the CO wants to allow 14 FTF's, and there are 14 cachers that want to log FTF, then there will be 14 FTF's on his cache.

I thought we've all agreed here before that the cache owner does not "allow", "assign", or "award" the FTF; that the first person to find the cache found the cache first.

There has been no 'agreement'.

Yeah... or "agreement".

(that's 4 "A" words in a row...wow! Alliteration. My 5th grade teacher would be in awe!)

Edited January 6, 2010 by knowschad

5.7k · January 6, 2010

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

Ain't that the truth.

5.7k · January 6, 2010

There has been no 'agreement'.

13.8k · January 6, 2010

Whoever finds it first gets the FTF. The rest of us claim co-FTF (because we wre on the hunt), but don't count it as an actual FTF.

For us, it depends on who we cache with...

Most, I claim a "shared" FTF and don't add it to our informal tally. Heck, it's just a matter of being in the right place. Usually micros, folks are just happy to have found it.

But if we're caching with one of the FTF madmen, whoever finds it is FTF - period.

January 6, 2010

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

*cough* snipped *cough*

Real classy there Fred.

4.7k · January 6, 2010

crashco and i work as a team. we do not compete against one another.

when we are looking for a firstfind, we search the same way we would for any other cache. we have a systematic way to search. while we both may KNOW the cache is probably over there, we each stick to our respective search procedures.

it is a division of labor. when we find it, WE have found it. we both know that if i'm searching the left side of the area and he searches the right side it is only our prior agreement as to zone that determines which of us gets the container.

the only concession we make to competing against one another is that first person to spot it gets first pick of trade items. most of the time we share that, too.

when i was sick and my mom needed a vacation, it was crashco who took me to the hospital for treatments. when i needed to be driven fifteen miles to extract money from an ATM to pay a tow truck, it was crashco who drove me. his money, too. when somebody needed to watch over me until an ambulance came, yep, crashco was there. furniture needs moving? crashco. in need of belay? crashco. unemployed and broke and someone has to pay for dinner? crashco.

our finds are just that: OUR finds. it makes no difference whether our find is the first one; it's still OURS.

9.3k · January 6, 2010

Whoever finds it first gets the FTF. The rest of us claim co-FTF (because we wre on the hunt), but don't count it as an actual FTF.

That's how most of the folks I cache with play the whole FTF thing. It works for us.

January 6, 2010

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

*cough* snipped *cough*

Real classy there Fred.

I can detect your sarcasm.

I would hesitate on drawing judgement just yet. My comment although not tactful, was honest! I can appreciate that a person says they don't pursue FTFs or that they aren't good at pursuing them. When some of these elite FTF Hunter Haters tell me that an FTF is not "a real thing", that is just thoughtless. Why is so much time devoted to the discussion of these non-things? It really bothers me when someone snobbishly denounces a thread, it really comes down to their option of joining it or not. Don't hate on the OP just because you have a problem!

6.1k · January 6, 2010

Or how do shared FTF's work?

On most logsheets everyone signs in from top to bottom, vertically.

To share the FTF the logsheet must be horizontal, so that way everyone that ever finds the cache can be FTF.

9.3k · January 6, 2010

When some of these elite FTF Hunter Haters tell me that an FTF is not "a real thing", that is just thoughtless.

Why do you suspect Taoisearch of being a FTF Hunter Hater? I certainly didn't get that impression from his post. What I picked up was more an apathy emotion than a hateful one. Since FTFs are not recognized, sanctioned or controlled by Groundspeak, many feel that they are not a legitimate part of the game. The FTF proponents have chimed in here several times, stating what the "FTF Rules" were, yet there are no FTF rules. The entire concept exists as a fiction between the cache owner and the person who locates the cache first. While it's true that for many, this fiction can add a tremendous thrill to the hunt, there is nothing official about it. Strictly a subset of the game, which many don't participate in. Typically, those who don't participate aren't haters. They just don't cache for the same reasons as the FTF players.

Don't confuse accuracy with thoughtlessness.

5.3k · January 6, 2010

When some of these elite FTF Hunter Haters tell me that an FTF is not "a real thing", that is just thoughtless.

OK, fine.

FTFs are real, but those who take them too seriously and who behave in a classless manner about them are doing damage to caching as a whole. A vast majority of the angst expressed in the forums is about FTFs.

Is that better?

January 6, 2010

Can't there only be one First To Find on a cache?

I hate when STF sneaks up on you as you're signing the log book.

In this case.... THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!

6.7k · January 6, 2010

I like it. But you should have gone with just the picture. The words didn't really help. Remember, sometimes less is more. Still, best post in thread award winner at this point.

January 7, 2010

pretty weird that something that doesn't exist is listed in the glossary of terms!

"FTF

First to Find. An acronym written by geocachers in physical cache logbooks or online when logging cache finds to denote being the first to find a new geocache. "

Does GC.com keep a stat on it? I can't find that stat bar anywhere...

January 7, 2010

When some of these elite FTF Hunter Haters tell me that an FTF is not "a real thing", that is just thoughtless.

Why do you suspect Taoisearch of being a FTF Hunter Hater? I certainly didn't get that impression from his post. What I picked up was more an apathy emotion than a hateful one. Since FTFs are not recognized, sanctioned or controlled by Groundspeak, many feel that they are not a legitimate part of the game. The FTF proponents have chimed in here several times, stating what the "FTF Rules" were, yet there are no FTF rules. The entire concept exists as a fiction between the cache owner and the person who locates the cache first. While it's true that for many, this fiction can add a tremendous thrill to the hunt, there is nothing official about it. Strictly a subset of the game, which many don't participate in. Typically, those who don't participate aren't haters. They just don't cache for the same reasons as the FTF players.

Don't confuse accuracy with thoughtlessness.

That sums it up nicely! :rolleyes:

January 7, 2010

I get to read about all kinds of entertaining co-ftf in/around my area. How about three guys all claiming ftf on a bison tube one of them pulls out of his pocket because the original was missing. Here are their logs on the same cache:

"WOOHOO FTF! We almost had to log a DNF on this one until someone spotted the hook. Some sort of critter must have made off with the original bison tube. Fresh one signed and replaced."

"woot ftf little late loging kinda forgot about this one better late than never TFTH"

"Well after a nice atv ride into this valley we spent some time looking for this bison tube, we were worried we were going to dnf when little gg found the hook it was supposed to be, we replaced the bison tube. Thanks for the cache and the fun ftf "

and all three of them added it to their "its all about the numbers ftf list"

:rolleyes:

or one where two teams race to a cache at the start of a weekend caching event. Team "A" beats Team "B" to the cache yet a member of team "B" claims co ftf and adds it to his visable ftf bookmark list

January 7, 2010

I get to read about all kinds of entertaining co-ftf in/around my area. How about three guys all claiming ftf on a bison tube one of them pulls out of his pocket because the original was missing. Here are their logs on the same cache:

"WOOHOO FTF! We almost had to log a DNF on this one until someone spotted the hook. Some sort of critter must have made off with the original bison tube. Fresh one signed and replaced."

"woot ftf little late loging kinda forgot about this one better late than never TFTH"

"Well after a nice atv ride into this valley we spent some time looking for this bison tube, we were worried we were going to dnf when little gg found the hook it was supposed to be, we replaced the bison tube. Thanks for the cache and the fun ftf "

and all three of them added it to their "its all about the numbers ftf list"

or one where two teams race to a cache at the start of a weekend caching event. Team "A" beats Team "B" to the cache yet a member of team "B" claims co ftf and adds it to his visable ftf bookmark list

Whatever keeps them happy, I guess. Are the FTF stats on someone's page more like a show-off stat to others, though most don't care about it anyhow?

In another story, I was "Last to Find in 2009" for a couple of caches in my area. I wish there was a stat bar for that on my page..... :wub:

19k · January 7, 2010

pretty weird that something that doesn't exist is listed in the glossary of terms!

"FTF

First to Find. An acronym written by geocachers in physical cache logbooks or online when logging cache finds to denote being the first to find a new geocache. "

The acronym does exist.

7.4k · January 7, 2010

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

*cough* snipped *cough*

Real classy there Fred.

I can detect your sarcasm.

I would hesitate on drawing judgement just yet. My comment although not tactful, was honest! I can appreciate that a person says they don't pursue FTFs or that they aren't good at pursuing them. When some of these elite FTF Hunter Haters tell me that an FTF is not "a real thing", that is just thoughtless. Why is so much time devoted to the discussion of these non-things? It really bothers me when someone snobbishly denounces a thread, it really comes down to their option of joining it or not. Don't hate on the OP just because you have a problem!

Geocaching.com does not keep stats on FTFs, so it is pointless to try to create rules to govern it. There's nothing wrong with racing to get a FTF on a cache, and there's nothing wrong with keeping your own statistics on it. For many cachers, that's a good part of the fun. However, stomping around the forums telling others how to play the game is obnoxious. If two or more cachers decide to share the FTF, it's between them (and maybe the cache owner, if he/she cares).

4.7k · January 7, 2010

somebody came and claimed firstfind on a cache i'd found twelve days earlier. their log looks a little funny there after mine, loudly proclaiming their firstfind.

some people will do that, i guess.

it ain't no skin offa my tail.

38.2k · January 8, 2010

somebody came and claimed firstfind on a cache i'd found twelve days earlier. their log looks a little funny there after mine, loudly proclaiming their firstfind.

some people will do that, i guess.

it ain't no skin offa my tail.

That sounds about as silly as when a cache owner takes a FTF away from the FTF and "awards" it to the 2nd to find.

January 12, 2010

Hi!

Can't there only be one First To Find on a cache?

Unless more than one cacher physically finds the cache at the exact same time, there is really only one who can claim being the 'first to find' it, no?

Or how do shared FTF's work?

Different countries, different "rules" ;-) Here in my country (Germany) we do share an FTF with all the geocachers being on site at the moment the cache was found.

Bye,

Christian

January 12, 2010

I figure if people are searching as a team then you claim the FTF as a team. After all, the other team members helped out, if only by eliminating other potential search spots. I found an unfound D4 after six of us were poking away at some vines for an hour or more. I think it was dumb luck that I was the one who found it and I'd have no problem if any of the others who were there claim FTF, like the couple who brought the flashlights or the guy who heaved up a pile of foliage so I could spot it.

Making FTF/co-FTF distinctions seems like too much work for a thing that doesn't exist anyway. The more FTFs, the merrier.

Reminds me of the "no-prizes" Marvel Comics fans used to get.

8k · January 12, 2010

pretty weird that something that doesn't exist is listed in the glossary of terms!

"FTF

First to Find. An acronym written by geocachers in physical cache logbooks or online when logging cache finds to denote being the first to find a new geocache. "

When I started caching FTF often meant something. Caches would sit for days before being found. And remote caches or tough puzzle caches might go unfound for weeks or months. People put first to find prizes in caches to encourage people to look for their cache. Cache owners have always wanted to see those logs on caches they put out.

Perhaps something changed as more caches became quick park and grabs at the local mall or other places that were easy to get to quickly. Somehow, what was a reasonable way to encourage new caches to get found, became a silly competition to see who could run out and find a cache five minutes after it was published. Perhaps some saw it a competition where, on a cache by cache basis, everyone had a fair chance to be FTF. (Competing to see who has the most finds is silly when someone has been caching for a few years and has thousands of finds competes with a newbie who has only been caching a few weeks). Of course if you want to compare who has the most FTFs you're back to making unfair comparisons. A person who is retired and has a lot of free time is likely to have a lot more FTFs than someone who has a regular job and can't just run out when they get an instant notify.

For those that want to have the FTF competition as some kind of incentive, fine. But don't go inventing rules to make this "fair". Simply accept that sometimes caches will be found by someone who got the coordinates pre-publication, or that several people who met at the cache site agree that all can claim a co-FTF. There are no rules to prevent this because Geocaching.com doesn't recognize any competitive aspect to geocaching. You should be having fun just going out and looking for caches and not worry about who claims a find or a FTF in some manner that you think is unfair.

Edited January 12, 2010 by tozainamboku

7.4k · January 12, 2010

But don't go inventing rules to make this "fair". Simply accept that sometimes caches will be found by someone who got the coordinates pre-publication, or that several people who met at the cache site agree that all can claim a co-FTF. There are no rules to prevent this because Geocaching.com doesn't recognize any competitive aspect to geocaching. You should be having fun just going out and looking for caches and not worry about who claims a find or a FTF in some manner that you think is unfair.

IAWTC

January 12, 2010

I keep a bookmark of all the Co-FTF I've been a part of. At the top of the page I state this:

"When searching for a FTF as a group, sometimes it's pure chance who will touch the cache first. This is a list of those that shared their FTF with us and ours with them. In a co-FTF it does not matter who touched if first, all that matters is that we did it as a group."

Even though my profile page has not been up dated in a week, here are some numbers.

FTF - 121, of those 30 have been a Co-FTF. Sometimes I touched it first, sometimes it was someone else.

FTF means it was just us who found it, and nobody else was around.

Co-FTF means it was found with a group and the person who touched it first chose to share the find.

For me, I'm in it for the race and more. But it is also about having fun. If there is a group looking, then each of us takes a spot to search. Maybe I will find it and maybe the person next to me will find it. The point is we searched as a group and found it as a group. But If I find the cache and there has been no one else around (or they went home) then it's an FTF. I wrote about this on the FTF run for GC22N6N.

To those that don't want to share the fun, then I guess that "Law And Order" episode is dedicated to you.

January 13, 2010

I'd care if 'First to Find' was a real thing...

EXACTLY! <_<

January 13, 2010

We went to an event near us on New Years Day. over 100 new caches were put out that day for the event. There was one group that had about 14 cachers in it and they did many FTF'c. They all claimed FTFs on those finds even though many times there were only 1 or 2 sets of footprints in the snow. I know this by being the second to find.

Two couples got together a while ago go together for a numbers run. Had all the puzzles in a large area ahead of time. As a group they were going to leave no cache behind.The lady's went in 1 car 1 direction and the men went another. all together they found over 100 caches that day. Some people in the area seem to have a problem with how they got their number of finds in one day. For me at least 1 member of each team was at every find. I don't see why there is an issue. Besides how others play the game is up to them. It sound like they had a lot of fun.

I recently went caching with a group to a large park and we signed the logsheets as 1 name that we gave ourselves for the day. We did log the cache pages individually. At one point we split up and 2 went one way and 3 went the other. I went along with the group and logged all cache pages as found. I have thought about this many times and have decided it bothers me to much to have 2 smileys I didn't even see and have deleted my logs on those. That is just how I chose to play the game. This dosn't mean I'm right and they are wrong. Everyone plays the game differently.

There is a cacher in my area who has decided he wants outta the numbers game and is no longer logging "found" on traditionals unless it is a FTF. He is instead logging "notes" that he found them. I asked him to log my caches as founds, not notes when he finds my caches. How many finds are on a cache plays a part in my decision to keep or archive a cache. I don't won't want to go through notes to see how many finds are on my caches. He said he understands that and won't hunt my caches. And that's OK with me. We agree to respect each other.

I look at it this way, I play the GAME my way and others play the GAME their way. As a CO, PLEASE respect my caches and me. Other than that, play the GAME as you see fit. Happy Caching.

January 13, 2010

My wife Ariana20 and I go out caching and if we get a FTF then we both count it becuase we were both on the same cache run. I see no problem with logging duel FTF's if you in the same group.

Forget about FTF's, what's about shared FTF's?

Recommended Posts

Join the conversation