Deleting Finds Because You Do Not Like Someone?

[w_a_m]

http://www.maritimegeocaching.com/forum/in...?showtopic=4638

[Keystone]

You've linked to a thread in a local forum that requires registration. Most of us won't bother.

 

If you'd like to have an independent discussion in *this* forum, please write a post summarizing what's happening locally, what your opinion is, what you would like to hear from others, etc.

 

Thanks.

[+jtbrady01]

You've linked to a thread in a local forum that requires registration. Most of us won't bother.

 

If you'd like to have an independent discussion in *this* forum, please write a post summarizing what's happening locally, what your opinion is, what you would like to hear from others, etc.

 

Thanks.

 

Yeah, what he said. This thread could sound interesting.

[+kit'n'kaboodle]

Well, if one in fact finds a cache and signs the log, I would think that the only valid reason to delete a log would be if the information provided in the log constituted a spoiler. I would contact an area administrator.

[+Misha]

Well, if one in fact finds a cache and signs the log, I would think that the only valid reason to delete a log would be if the information provided in the log constituted a spoiler. I would contact an area administrator.

The buggers deserved what they got

[+BlueDeuce]

Wow, overflow angst.

 

[Keystone]

Well, if one in fact finds a cache and signs the log, I would think that the only valid reason to delete a log would be if the information provided in the log constituted a spoiler. I would contact an area administrator.

I disagree with this advice. Cache reviewers are not the log police, unless there's a violation of the site terms of use, such as potty language or threats of physical violence. Generally speaking, a cache owner is in charge of their own listing and can delete logs if they feel like it. *Whether* they should delete logs is an issue for the community to discuss. Like in this thread.

[+BlueDeuce]

A cache owner has the ability to delete a find whenever and for whatever reason they choose. However, if they delete a find whenever and for whatever they are probably going to become very unpopular in the community.

 

I hope this isn't trying to get us to agree someone is a jerk and needs their logs deleted. If it's truly a bad situation then yes you need to get gc.com involved. If it's just personal, well then learn to play together.

[+stepshep]

This seems to be personal issue between Misha and El Nimrod. Not something to be brought into the forums.

[+~Hylife~]

That was a waste of 5 minutes of my life registering an account to read your flame war. Thank you.

[+CYBret]

From the guidelines:

 

The cache owner will assume all responsibility of their cache listings.

 

The responsibility of your listing includes quality control of posts to the cache page. Delete any logs that appear to be bogus, counterfeit, off topic, or not within the stated requirements.

 

I'd contact Groundspeak about any reason outside of those parameters.

[+stepshep]

That was a waste of 5 minutes of my life registering an account to read your flame war. Thank you.

 

Hmmm... I didn't even have to register, it was right there.

[+AB4N]

I've never deleted someone elses find on one of my caches. But I have deleted several of my finds of other peoples caches

[Keystone]

That was a waste of 5 minutes of my life registering an account to read your flame war. Thank you.

 

Hmmm... I didn't even have to register, it was right there.

Oops, my bad. When I followed the link, the language at the top of the screen said that the "Shoutbox" was viewable by validated members only. I failed to scroll down. I did so just now.

 

Warning, there is language in the linked thread that would not withstand the family-friendly meter for this forum.

[+~Hylife~]

Hmmm... I didn't even have to register, it was right there.

 

haha lol..

 

Oh well, that's what I get for my impatience..

Edited August 18, 2007 by ~Hylife~

[+brodiebunch]

Those wacky Atlantic Canadians.....................

[+briansnat]

Deleting legit found it logs for any reason other than inappropriate content is petty, small minded and just plain wrong.

[+stepshep]

Deleting legit found it logs for any reason other than inappropriate content is petty, small minded and just plain wrong.

 

The person deleting the logs doesn't seem to be very civil either.

[+Mudfrog]

Deleting legit found it logs for any reason other than inappropriate content is petty, small minded and just plain wrong.

 

IMO, deleting legitimate DNFs is just as bad! Can't for the life of me imagine why that person is doing that either.

[Trinity's Crew]

The buggers deserved what they got

 

I don't think so. As the cache owner you can do whatever you want, but that doesn't make it right. To paraphrase what Briansnat said, it comes across as petty, small minded and just plain wrong. Thank goodness that actions like yours are the VERY rare exception and not the general rule.

[+gnbrotz]

From the guidelines:

 

The cache owner will assume all responsibility of their cache listings.

 

The responsibility of your listing includes quality control of posts to the cache page. Delete any logs that appear to be bogus, counterfeit, off topic, or not within the stated requirements.

 

I'd contact Groundspeak about any reason outside of those parameters.

 

Been there, done that. The official response: "Unfortunatly it is within the owners right to be childish. If he wants to delete the logs he can."

 

And yes, I know 'unfortunately' is spelled wrong, but it's a direct quote, so I didn't fix it.

[+briansnat]

I just read the thread. How sad. There are many words I could use to describe what I feel about what that cache owner is doing, most of which would probably earn me a forum time-out.

 

I will say however that if a cache owner pulled that childish nonsense around here, nearly every local would put his caches on their ignore list.

[Trinity's Crew]

How sad. There are many words I could use to describe what I feel about what that cache owner is doing, most of which would probably earn me a forum time-out.

 

I agree completely. It is a real shame. Hopefully this pettiness will get this cacher shunned by the local community.

[+Rockin Roddy]

Maybe some day, this cacher will be given a dose of reality and others will start pulling the same stunt on him (would be a sad thing, but would definitely serve him right)! Yes, his caches should be put on every local's ignore list...maybe the lacking of traffic will get the point across!

 

Gee, a grown person acting so childish because they just don't like someone is pathetic IMHO. Also very bad for our sport! How will this play out if everyone shows up at an event?

 

edit to add: this is the one time I'd endorse claiming finds on my own caches...a good solution to keeping the count correct!

Edited August 19, 2007 by Rockin Roddy

[+briansnat]

<<<<<<< Explicit photos deleted >>>>>>>>>

Edited August 19, 2007 by briansnat

[+briansnat]

<<<<<shocking and thoroughly inappropriate language deleted >>>>>>>>

Edited August 19, 2007 by briansnat

[+jtbrady01]

I've only seen one log deleted. I have one hide on my watch list. Someone posted a hint to where to find the hide. The owner promptly deleted the post with a note that "due to a clue to being posted the log is being deleted". I think this was appropriate. Now for the record though the hint didn't help me at all to find the cache.

[Mr.Yuck]

<<<<<shocking and thoroughly inappropriate language deleted >>>>>>>>

 

You used to get me with that, but I know better by now.

 

This sounds good, but I'm not seeing any major flame wars at that forum. Has the thread been completely removed?

[+Markwell]

Deleting legit found it logs for any reason other than inappropriate content is petty, small minded and just plain wrong.

 

Yes: petty, small minded and just plain wrong - but not against the rules of the site. I know of a very prominent cacher that does this with another cacher. It doesn't seem right, but there's nothing against the rules.

 

In fact, if someone wanted to, they could place a cache that would say that they would only allow "notes" on their caches instead of "finds" to see how many people would still find the cache if they didn't get a found smiley. They could then say (and follow through) on the ability to delete all "Found" logs. I bet the cache would get found maybe 4 or 5 times. Be an interesting experiment.

 

I'd contact Groundspeak about any reason outside of those parameters.

Been there, done that. The official response: "Unfortunatly it is within the owners right to be childish. If he wants to delete the logs he can."

 

I'm not surprised by that answer at all. I don't think the reviewers OR Groundspeak will get involved in something like this. It's not a violation of the terms of use of the site, and no placement regulations have been violated.

[+Kit Fox]

Although I didn't get to read the banter in their forum, I think I found the "root" issue.

[+Ambrosia]

Yeah, there's nothing to see on that link, now.

 

edit: at least, it doesn't directly go to the thread from what I see, just the forums.

Edited August 19, 2007 by Ambrosia

[+stepshep]

Yeah, there's nothing to see on that link, now.

 

edit: at least, it doesn't directly go to the thread from what I see, just the forums.

 

And now we have to log in to read it.....

[Trinity's Crew]

Well I'm one of the morons who signed up prior to reading this whole thread. I was perusing the forums there and saw this post from Misha:

 

FYI

 

One simple click in a downloaded applet, (designed by a guy in Redlands, CA) deleted all logs, from 4 users. These cachers, I had saved this groups logs from when they had first logged my caches (I normally maintain logs for 4 to six months). Running the applet crashed the Microsoft server at GC least once on Thursday morning PDT (reboot was required). The server wes over welmed several times that day, says a contact at GC.com.

 

This applet will soon be availible to download from a site in California. It is not specifically designed for geocrashing, it I guss will work on other web sites too.

I have deleted my copy, I have no furthur nead for it.

 

Have a nice day

 

I am not completely sure what he means by this, but it sounds like he thinks he crashed the server at GC.com when he deleted the finds.

Edited August 19, 2007 by Trinity's Crew

[+cache_test_dummies]

In fact, if someone wanted to, they could place a cache that would say that they would only allow "notes" on their caches instead of "finds" to see how many people would still find the cache if they didn't get a found smiley. They could then say (and follow through) on the ability to delete all "Found" logs. I bet the cache would get found maybe 4 or 5 times. Be an interesting experiment.

This has been tried at least once that I know of. The reviewer allowed the listing at first, but almost immediately the reviewer required that the cache owner drop the no-find-logs-allowed policy under the 'promoting an agenda' guideline.

 

Here is the cache, and here is a forum discussion about it.

[+geomann1]

There is somethimg to be said about keeping a personal log of finds and find count outside of GC so that actions of petty owners becomes irrelevant.

[+benh57]

 

I am not completely sure what he means by this, but it sounds like he thinks he crashed the server at GC.com when he deleted the finds.

 

More likely, he was just throttled by the server. When it does its throttling it really appears like the site is down (to the person being throttled...)

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

You've linked to a thread in a local forum that requires registration. Most of us won't bother.

 

If you'd like to have an independent discussion in *this* forum, please write a post summarizing what's happening locally, what your opinion is, what you would like to hear from others, etc.

 

Thanks.

Thank you so much for setting such clear and explicit boundaries. It always bugs me when someone starts a new thread by offering only a link or just a few cryptic words. Thanks for managing this one...

[+Ma & Pa]

Although I didn't get to read the banter in their forum, I think I found the "root" issue.

 

Actually It is not the root of the problem, it is a similar but less disgusting action by the cache owner.

 

Before commenting I should mention that I started the thread on the MGA to bring to light Misha's action. It should also be noted that this thread was started by WAM which is the name that Misha's mother uses when she caches. It is likely that Misha himself started the topic here.

 

For those whe havent read the MGA thread, here is a summary

 

Misha was upset at El Nimrod because he had indicated that some of Misha's caches needed maintenance and Misha disagreed. They apparently had words about it at an event. (Misha has indicated lately that he found El Nimrod to be a shady individual)

 

Some time later El Nimrod and 3 caching friends did a power caching trip. Misha claims that they did not close containers properly and some were thrown in ditches. On a recent caching trip, Misha was confronted by a home owner who was upset because someone had walked over a newly sodded lawn, traipsed mud over a deck,, gone through a garden and broken through two fences. Misha assumed it was cachers and found that the 4 power cachers were the last to find the nearby cache.

 

He then decided to delete all finds of his caches by these individuals, in one case this amounted to about 140 caches. Note that there is no evidence of anything here. In any event one of the cachers has protested the attack on his character (Not the deletion of his caches). Misha has since advised the other 3 cachers that he shuld not have found them guilty by association and will allow them to relog their finds, but has stated that he will look at El Nimrod's case later.

 

I know that GC rules don't address this. Deletion of finds is at the discretion of the owner. But in my mind, such deletions should relate to the actual cache and not the person.

 

Pa

[Mr.Yuck]

Although I didn't get to read the banter in their forum, I think I found the "root" issue.

 

Actually It is not the root of the problem, it is a similar but less disgusting action by the cache owner.

 

Before commenting I should mention that I started the thread on the MGA to bring to light Misha's action. It should also be noted that this thread was started by WAM which is the name that Misha's mother uses when she caches. It is likely that Misha himself started the topic here.

 

For those whe havent read the MGA thread, here is a summary

 

Misha was upset at El Nimrod because he had indicated that some of Misha's caches needed maintenance and Misha disagreed. They apparently had words about it at an event. (Misha has indicated lately that he found El Nimrod to be a shady individual)

 

Some time later El Nimrod and 3 caching friends did a power caching trip. Misha claims that they did not close containers properly and some were thrown in ditches. On a recent caching trip, Misha was confronted by a home owner who was upset because someone had walked over a newly sodded lawn, traipsed mud over a deck,, gone through a garden and broken through two fences. Misha assumed it was cachers and found that the 4 power cachers were the last to find the nearby cache.

 

He then decided to delete all finds of his caches by these individuals, in one case this amounted to about 140 caches. Note that there is no evidence of anything here. In any event one of the cachers has protested the attack on his character (Not the deletion of his caches). Misha has since advised the other 3 cachers that he shuld not have found them guilty by association and will allow them to relog their finds, but has stated that he will look at El Nimrod's case later.

 

I know that GC rules don't address this. Deletion of finds is at the discretion of the owner. But in my mind, such deletions should relate to the actual cache and not the person.

 

Pa

 

Group hug?

[+sbell111]

... Deletion of finds is at the discretion of the owner. But in my mind, such deletions should relate to the actual cache and not the person.

Well put.

[+C&C+COMPANY]

Those wacky Atlantic Canadians.....................

 

It's the salt water......

[+Misha]

www.maritimegeocaching.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=4647

 

YIKES!!

[+Quiggle]

Seems to me there are issues in your local areas that are best resolved locally. Posting links back and forth to threads on other sites doesn't really appeal to pretty much everyone that will read this topic.

 

Thread closed.