Arrowheads as swag

[+Woodstramp]

If a cacher wanted to leave an arrowhead in a good cache as a reward to the owner (or as a FTF prize) would this be kosher with GC's "no weapons in a cache" rule?

 

I even ask because some lame, local school administrators won't allow an elderly fellow (with an extensive arrowhead collection - under glass cases, no less) to show his stuff to the children in school because of their "zero tolerance for weapons" policy. I'm not kidding.

 

Not sure how "zero tolerancy" Geocaching.com is so I thought I'd ask.

 

If I were to leave one I'd made, it would not be sharp.

[+m.austin]

As a teacher I am still in shock over the lengths some administrators will go to "protect" the students. Luckily it is more dependant on the administrators themselves and their interpretation rather than some blanket laws. Personally I would view finding an arrowhead as a really cool "artifact" (albeit a reproduction). But I'm no authority so don't go by what I say!

[jholly]

 

I even ask because some lame, local school administrators won't allow an elderly fellow (with an extensive arrowhead collection - under glass cases, no less) to show his stuff to the children in school because of their "zero tolerance for weapons" policy. I'm not kidding.

 

 

Do these same administrators allow the children to hold sharpened pencils? I'm sure they would never allow the students to wear belts or have socks on their feet. All good weapons.

 

Jim

[4wheelin_fool]

I would think that they are ok.

 

If some 9 year old finds one, makes a spear and attacks someone, maybe not, but I would think the probabilility of that happening is very small.

[+briansnat]

If this were the Paleo, Archaic or Woodland era, then I'd say projectile points would be verboten in stonecaches. Being that this is the 21st century, unless you're trying to leave a 125 grain steel broadhead, I think you're OK.

 

BTW, I think your local school administrators are fools.

Edited July 7, 2008 by briansnat

[+Bad_CRC]

if it's not sharp, I'd think it'd be ok.

 

I've been cut fairly badly by one before by someone who was screwing around with it and didn't realize they are extremely dangerous when sharp, they can be as sharp as razor blades. I could see someone easily injuring themselves digging around the bottom of a container if it was hidden.

[+briansnat]

if it's not sharp, I'd think it'd be ok.

 

I've been cut fairly badly by one before by someone who was screwing around with it and didn't realize they are extremely dangerous when sharp, they can be as sharp as razor blades. I could see someone easily injuring themselves digging around the bottom of a container if it was hidden.

 

Real projectile points are extremely sharp. I recall finding a 5,000 year old point and demonstrating to the students how sharp it still was by drawing it gently across my palm. It gave me a nice slice and drew a lot of blood.

I suggest placing them in plastic bags if you are going to put them in caches.

[+syfun]

I would think that they are ok.

 

If some 9 year old finds one, makes a spear and attacks someone, maybe not, but I would think the probabilility of that happening is very small.

 

We just found an arrowhead in a cache this weekend. It was plastic. But finding a real arrowhead would be really cool.

 

Oh and my 9 yr old loved the arrowhead and hasn't mentioned any ideas about making a spear with it (yet). He did comment on how it wouldn't work with the arrows he already has.

[+DaFunkyFrogs]

We have found arrowheads in caches and always trade for them. They are some of the best things we have found.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

I even ask because some lame, local school administrators won't allow an elderly fellow (with an extensive arrowhead collection - under glass cases, no less) to show his stuff to the children in school because of their "zero tolerance for weapons" policy. I'm not kidding.

That would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

 

I certainly can't speak for Groundspeak, but I would think arrowheads are cool swag and would bet that they do too.

[+KoosKoos]

I would think that they are ok.

 

If some 9 year old finds one, makes a spear and attacks someone, maybe not, but I would think the probabilility of that happening is very small.

 

And he'd really have an AWFUL spear as arrowheads are much to small. They're designed to be placed on arrows....now, if you were leaving spearheads in caches, the 9 year olds might have a field day!

[+Renegade Knight]

I would think that they are ok.

 

If some 9 year old finds one, makes a spear and attacks someone, maybe not, but I would think the probabilility of that happening is very small.

 

We used to make bloguns and darts out of the materials we had in class. More than one butt was targeted. Apparently we live in less civilized times where more draconian measures are required lest the administration get sued. Modern rules are as much CYA as an attempt to do the right thing.

[NoBetterName]

 

I even ask because some lame, local school administrators won't allow an elderly fellow (with an extensive arrowhead collection - under glass cases, no less) to show his stuff to the children in school because of their "zero tolerance for weapons" policy. I'm not kidding.

 

 

Do these same administrators allow the children to hold sharpened pencils? I'm sure they would never allow the students to wear belts or have socks on their feet. All good weapons.

 

Jim

 

I was stabbed with a pencil when I was in school. Had to go to the nurse so she could tell me that lead pencils aren't made with lead. Thought I was going to be cool and have lead poisoning, but Noooo.

[knowschad]

These "zero tolerance" policies are a great way of teaching our children tolerance, discretion, and shades of gray, aren't they? I can just imagine the world that generation will live in!!

 

As for the arrowheads, those are historic artifacts, not weapons, aren't they? But as others have pointed out, flaked obsidian and flint are actually sharper than razor blades. They have been used in the past as delicate surgical instruments. I've found some arrowheads though, and some were sharp and some were not particularily so.

Edited July 7, 2008 by knowschad

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

... some were sharp and some were not particularly so.

Much like school administrators!

 

I think the OP was talking about arrowheads that he makes, and mentions that they would not be sharp. I can't see any possible problem there.

[+Woodstramp]

... some were sharp and some were not particularly so.

Much like school administrators!

 

I think the OP was talking about arrowheads that he makes, and mentions that they would not be sharp. I can't see any possible problem there.

 

TAR,

 

That would be correct. They would be carefully dulled if left in a cache. I'm not real proficient at making stone points, but I do get lucky and manage to complete one from time to time. My current production ratio is 10lbs of stone = one complete arrowhead (and twenty broken ones). Just chunked some really nice Texas chert chips in the garbage after I butchered it.

 

The collector I mentioned was a nice old gent I met at a civil war/living history event. He told me that he'd been showing his collection to kids in several of county school systems for decades and the last time he wanted to have a show and tell at a school school near Gadsden they told him no (ZTP). Pathetically sad.

[+J-Way]

For more zero tolerance nonsense, check out Randy Cassingham's This Is True website. He also puts out a cool weekly newsletter about current real-life stupidity.

 

Now for a pre-zero tolerance story. When I was in junior high we had a "anti-drug" week. On Thursday we had a field trip to the local sherrif's office, where we saw the inside of a police car, watched a drug dog work, and saw a display with real examples of most common drugs at the time. On Friday we filled out a questionaire, which had as one of the questions something like "Have you ever seen drugs during any school function?" We had just seen drugs the day before during a school function, so of course we all put "Yes". We found out later that the administration almost collectively messed their pants when reviewing the results. They immediately started privately interviewing students until they figured out what had happened.

[+flask]

For more zero tolerance nonsense, check out Randy Cassingham's This Is True website. He also puts out a cool weekly newsletter about current real-life stupidity.

 

Now for a pre-zero tolerance story. When I was in junior high we had a "anti-drug" week. On Thursday we had a field trip to the local sherrif's office, where we saw the inside of a police car, watched a drug dog work, and saw a display with real examples of most common drugs at the time. On Friday we filled out a questionaire, which had as one of the questions something like "Have you ever seen drugs during any school function?" We had just seen drugs the day before during a school function, so of course we all put "Yes". We found out later that the administration almost collectively messed their pants when reviewing the results. They immediately started privately interviewing students until they figured out what had happened.

 

that is WAY funny.

 

i think i understand the zero-tolerance thing, if not support it: some people in schools are touchy about any actual weapons, as opposed to things you can use as a weapon. it has to do with intent and perception.

 

back in the day kids used to bring their guns to school; they were required to leave them in their lockers. then we got some teachers from away and this one woman noticed a guy outside the school with a rifle and we had to go into lockdown until somebody had the presence of mind to notice that it was the middle of rifle season and the guy was passing though on the way from his tree stand.

 

still, after that we had a lot more rules about it.

 

and then two years ago a guy walked into a school near us and shot three teachers. everybody got a lot more serious after that.

 

but if you're going to study history, you have to study period weapons. you just have to. unfortunately, teachers are often placed in situations where there are a few children in a class who are unusually inured to violence and weapons. often a school will move to a stupid zero-tolerance policy because they're faced with overly litigious parents of that one kid who falls on the other side of that grey area.

 

publicly, they make stupid rules and statements thereupon. in the faculty room they know EXACTLY why they're stuck with new and goofy rules.

 

i remember one of THOSE kids: my first memory was of him (age 4 1/2) beating with both fists on the teacher and screaming (and i'm cleaning and shortening this up considerably) "i'm gonna f'in blow your f'in head right off, you f'n SOB!"

 

my second memory of him is of him breaking my nose in front of the same kindergarten class. for that one kid, everything was a gun or a dart. he did not have any play vocabulary that did not include extreme violence. his parents were very handy with the lawyers.

 

so we had new rules that everybody had to follow. no guns, no darts, no arrows. no pretend guns or arrows, no drawings of guns or arrows.

 

last i heard of this kid, he tried to join the army to go fight in iraq, but washed out as being too scary to trust with a weapon.

[+burgessfour]

We have put real arrowheads in our cache GC1BTZ7, my husband collected a ton of them from when he lived in South Carolina. They aren't sharp though, so no danger of anyone getting hurt. I can't believe they wouldn't even let you bring them in their glass case, that's pretty odd! This is an important piece of history....

[+PlantAKiss]

Not quite the same thing but I left a civil war bullet as swag. It was a local bullet and I included a write-up about the skirmish at the battlefield where it was found and put it with the bullet in a baggie. It was gone within hours and the cacher that took it was thrilled at having gotten it and mentioned it in his log. People appreciate historical things like that. Even a "new" arrowhead can tell an historical story. Perhaps include a little write-up about arrowheads in general along with yours. Kids and adults alike would probably love it.

 

BTW...I saw someone fashion an awesome arrowhead out of glass within just minutes. He also worked some obsidian. Knapping is quite the art.

[+Logscaler and Red]

We have been leaving Arrowheads, Spear points and stone tools in caches for years.

 

Several hundred at least I would say. All broken or poor conditioned items but real anyway.

 

They don't stay long either.

 

Oh, before anyone ask. Yes, they are the real items that where legally found on private property with the land owners permission.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Oh, before anyone ask. Yes, they are the real items that where legally found on private property with the land owners permission.

I have a friend who is currently being banged about and may even be prosecuted by local amateur archaeologists, the local college, now even the state for collecting pot shards, arrowheads, implements and the like from the fields along a nearby river.

 

He's lived in the area all his life and, like many others, has been a casual collector for years.

 

Indians of various nature populated much of Alabama, there's not all that many places you can go where their artifacts can't be found if you are paying attention. Outside of a few feeble efforts like Moundville Archaeological Park there aren't many serious efforts at digs or protection, the history of these peoples is pretty well known.

 

Once he decided to sell a few of them on eBay however he drew attention and fire from all around, by folks who of course want to collect them for themselves!

 

Watch out next time you see an interesting rock that you think might be an arrowhead... picking it up could be a crime!

[+Logscaler and Red]

No much/any information to be gathered from a broken point from a plowed field the cows graze in.

 

Other then to say "Yea, someone was here and shot at a Duck on a pond. Missed it looks like."

 

Sell them? Why? The shipping and wrapping would cost more then the value of the items.

 

logscaler

Edited July 9, 2008 by logscaler & Red

[+plasmafamily]

No much/any information to be gathered from a broken point from a plowed field the cows graze in.

 

Other then to say "Yea, someone was here and shot at a Duck on a pond. Missed it looks like."

 

Sell them? Why? The shipping and wrapping would cost more then the value of the items.

 

logscaler

Actually you'd be surprised what can be learnt from things found laying about in a field.

[History-Cacher]

There was quite a large culture of natives living in the Moundville area. It is thought they even had copper

artifacts.

 

I am particularly interested in finding geocaches in these areas for my history caching page. I'd appreciate it

if you would let me know if you come across any.

 

-RKO

[hoosier guy]

If a cacher wanted to leave an arrowhead in a good cache as a reward to the owner (or as a FTF prize) would this be kosher with GC's "no weapons in a cache" rule?

 

I even ask because some lame, local school administrators won't allow an elderly fellow (with an extensive arrowhead collection - under glass cases, no less) to show his stuff to the children in school because of their "zero tolerance for weapons" policy. I'm not kidding.

 

Not sure how "zero tolerancy" Geocaching.com is so I thought I'd ask.

 

If I were to leave one I'd made, it would not be sharp.

 

How did you get involved in flint knapping?

 

I think most everyone would love to find something like that.

[+TerraViators]

If a cacher wanted to leave an arrowhead in a good cache as a reward to the owner (or as a FTF prize) would this be kosher with GC's "no weapons in a cache" rule?

 

I even ask because some lame, local school administrators won't allow an elderly fellow (with an extensive arrowhead collection - under glass cases, no less) to show his stuff to the children in school because of their "zero tolerance for weapons" policy. I'm not kidding.

 

Not sure how "zero tolerancy" Geocaching.com is so I thought I'd ask.

 

If I were to leave one I'd made, it would not be sharp.

I really loathe beureaucrats.

[+Manville Possum]

If this were the Paleo, Archaic or Woodland era, then I'd say projectile points would be verboten in stonecaches. Being that this is the 21st century, unless you're trying to leave a 125 grain steel broadhead, I think you're OK.

 

BTW, I think your local school administrators are fools.

I have to agree with this user, I am a artifact collector. I also could use some 95 grain broadheads too, but just mail them to me.

[+Majesty4]

I've hidden arrowheads and followed up on the geocache logs. Everyone who found them wrote they thought they were great. I'm thinking about putting some pocket knives, still in the plastic packaging, in geocaches. Young children will be with their parents when the geocache is found, and if the children are old enough to geocache on their own, they're probably responsible enough to handle with the appropriate respect. The packaging can't be opened without a knife or scissors.

[+Cpt.Blackbeard]

This thread is 2 and a half years old you all are replying to, Just so you know. I'd like to hear if the OP did it and how it went for them if they did.

I also have a cousin who is quite profecient at making them.

[+G & C]

I would be quite pleased to find something so interesting as an actual arrowhead in a cache. Can't say that I'd mind it at all.

[+johnsingleton1974]

What about shark teeth?