Cashay!?

[crtrue]

tangentially related, "forte", as in "it's not my forte" is properly pronounced "fort". NOT "for-tay". people who know this are so few that gradually most of us give up using the word altogether, just out of frustration with every bozo who tries to correct us. it is from the french "forte", meaning strong, and not the italian "forte", meaning loud.

 

Actually the dictionary I have says both are OK.

I've never heard the fort version. Only for tay.

 

The "fort" pronounciation would be correct if adopted directly from French. We have le français to thank for the silent "e" in a whole bunch of our words, due to its role in liaison, which essentially blurs the line between words to make the transition smoother. Then again, there are always exceptions ... I'm not going to claim to be the linguistic authority on French, considering my experience is essentially two years of high school learnin' and a couple of books on my shelf.

 

Anyway, I think the usage of the word "forte" in English is irreversibly corrupt, so it is essentially an English word at this point.

[+Renegade Knight]

...The "fort" pronounciation would be correct if adopted directly from French. ...

That explains it. Any word I screw up usually has French roots.

[Dinoprophet]

Yep, just like some people here on the East Coast love to pronounce the name of the international chain store known as Target as "tarr-sshA".

Nobody really thinks that's the pronunciation, do they? I always took it as humor -- making a discount store sound jokingly high-class and French. But I suppose it's possible.

[+Maeglin]

Yep, just like some people here on the East Coast love to pronounce the name of the international chain store known as Target as "tarr-sshA".

... I always took it as humor -- making a discount store sound jokingly high-class and French. But I suppose it's possible.

That's always been my impression.

[+Team LaLonde]

Just got home from work and checked this thread. WOW. I didn't realize so many people were in the same boat. I was just having a bad morning and needed to vent. Usually it doesn't bug me so much but someone this morning pushed the right button. Glad I'm not alone, though!

[+flask]

tangentially related, "forte", as in "it's not my forte" is properly pronounced "fort". NOT "for-tay". people who know this are so few that gradually most of us give up using the word altogether, just out of frustration with every bozo who tries to correct us. it is from the french "forte", meaning strong, and not the italian "forte", meaning loud.

 

Actually the dictionary I have says both are OK.

 

the reason it says that is the same reason it says the "nu-cu-lar" is acceptable. people have used it incorrectly both prominently and persistently. people of language, we must stand against this roiling rising tide of sloppy, sliding usage! we must not only stand our ground against the continuing relinquishment of intellectual standards, but we must insist firmly that our public figures and news outlets uphold the use of language that is lithe and elegant even though it is beyond the comprehension of a nine-year-old.

 

when we as a population do not rise beyond the capabilities of the average nine-year old, we fall dissolutely into a mire made only of lowest common denominators. we lose our collective heritage, our rightful claim to be a thinking people.

 

rise up! reclaim our birthright!

 

(for a price i will compose stirring speeches for your cause, too.)

 

(don't even get me started on punctuation or reflexive pronouns.)

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

Yep, just like some people here on the East Coast love to pronounce the name of the international chain store known as Target as "tarr-sshA".

Nobody really thinks that's the pronunciation, do they? I always took it as humor -- making a discount store sound jokingly high-class and French. But I suppose it's possible.

Yes, I agree -- that is my observation as well! I wrote my comment about the pronounciation of Target a bit tongue-in-cheek!

[Dinoprophet]

Yep, just like some people here on the East Coast love to pronounce the name of the international chain store known as Target as "tarr-sshA".

Nobody really thinks that's the pronunciation, do they? I always took it as humor -- making a discount store sound jokingly high-class and French. But I suppose it's possible.

Yes, I agree -- that is my observation as well! I wrote my comment about the pronounciation of Target a bit tongue-in-cheek!

Sorry for trampling on it, then. Though I come from the land of "Ford's" and "KMart's", so I wouldn't be surprised.

 

Anyway, "cash-ay", one of my pet peeves. Of course, when it comes up, the person I'm talking with is probably thinking, "Doesn't this fool know how to pronounce his own hobby?"

 

I've also occasionally heard "caysh".

Edited June 1, 2007 by Dinoprophet

[+Snoogans]

Fun thread.

 

 

Okay, I admit that I only clicked on this thread because I didn't want vtmtnman to hate me.

 

 

 

I gotta say that I guess I'm just not anal enough to care. I get both of those pronounciations from folks regularly and I have never once corrected anyone. I say cache. That's as far as my need to control goes.

 

 

NOW, someone mentioned the muggle/muggler thang on the first page..... The Snoogstress is a HUGE Harry Potter fan and she absolutely hates, hates, HATES that geocachers have "STOLEN" the term. I use it often just to annoy her.

Edited June 2, 2007 by Snoogans

[+BelKen]

I think the mistake with cache and forte is that people get confused when the french put a grave aboe the e's they wish to accent. As the US (101)keyboard cannot put the grave over the e a lot of people then assume all french words ending in e are accented. However in the case of cache and forte both from french origins the e is not graved and thus silent.

 

forte (fortay) is also a word but from italian origin that refers to music. As it gets used as (fortay) in music people do think they are one and the same. Forte (fortay) means loud or forceful, forte (fort) means something which you excel.

 

By the way not all Australians say Kaysh. Bel + Ken are both kashers.

Edited June 2, 2007 by BelKen

[+briansnat]

tangentially related, "forte", as in "it's not my forte" is properly pronounced "fort". NOT "for-tay". people who know this are so few that gradually most of us give up using the word altogether, just out of frustration with every bozo who tries to correct us. it is from the french "forte", meaning strong, and not the italian "forte", meaning loud.

 

Actually the dictionary I have says both are OK.

I've never heard the fort version. Only for tay.

 

The "fort" pronounciation would be correct if adopted directly from French. We have le français to thank for the silent "e" in a whole bunch of our words, due to its role in liaison, which essentially blurs the line between words to make the transition smoother. Then again, there are always exceptions ... I'm not going to claim to be the linguistic authority on French, considering my experience is essentially two years of high school learnin' and a couple of books on my shelf.

 

Anyway, I think the usage of the word "forte" in English is irreversibly corrupt, so it is essentially an English word at this point.

 

Here is what Answer.com says on the subject:

 

USAGE NOTE The word forte, coming from French fort, should properly be pronounced with one syllable, like the English word fort. Common usage, however, prefers the two-syllable pronunciation, (fôr'tā'), which has been influenced possibly by the music term forte borrowed from Italian. In a recent survey a strong majority of the Usage Panel, 74 percent, preferred the two-syllable pronunciation. The result is a delicate situation; speakers who are aware of the origin of the word may wish to continue to pronounce it as one syllable but at an increasing risk of puzzling their listeners.

[+Bundyrumandcoke]

Well, I am in the minority over here, as I pronounce it Cash, when most pronounce it Kay-sh. Each to his own. Now, if you guys could only spell aluminium correctly, the world would be perfect.

[Trinity's Crew]

Well, I am in the minority over here, as I pronounce it Cash, when most pronounce it Kay-sh. Each to his own. Now, if you guys could only spell aluminium correctly, the world would be perfect.

 

Al-oo-min-ee-um? That's bloody preposterous!

Edited June 2, 2007 by Trinity's Crew

[vtmtnman]

Fun thread.

 

 

Okay, I admit that I only clicked on this thread because I didn't want vtmtnman to hate me.

 

 

 

I gotta say that I guess I'm just not anal enough to care. I get both of those pronounciations from folks regularly and I have never once corrected anyone. I say cache. That's as far as my need to control goes.

 

 

NOW, someone mentioned the muggle/muggler thang on the first page..... The Snoogstress is a HUGE Harry Potter fan and she absolutely hates, hates, HATES that geocachers have "STOLEN" the term. I use it often just to annoy her.

Actually that was a stab at this thread and THIS one.

[Elaur]

I'm sure some of it is ignorance (which in this case is not a put down, I'm using it as the word is intended to be used - not knowing something) It is difficult to pronounce words that originate in French if you are not familiar with them.

 

I just taught the kids in school about Gauguin - if you aren't familiar with French pronunciations how would you know how to pronounce that.

 

I hope no one ever finds a cache in a niche with someone from London. My friend from London swears they say it "neesh" (nitch - here in ohio)

 

How about couching homemade paper when it's drying? Is that "couching" or "cooching" I only knew the right way to say it because someone was willing to tell me.

 

Now that being said, there is a difference between ignorance of the correct pronounciation and choosing to say it incorrectly even after someone explained how to say it. That probably would drive me bonkers.

[+alaska-1]

My personal forum peeves are people typing "your" instead of "you're" and "I could care less" instead of "I couldn't care less" as in "I could care less about what your saying" - but then again, that's just me!

 

Those are up there on my peeves, as well... but in speech, there is also "irregardless". Man that word drives me nuts!

 

Note: OMG! My spellcheck isn't even catching that word as wrong!!!!!!!

Edited June 2, 2007 by alaska-1

[JohnX]

to my way of thinking, if you are ignorant of the correct pronunciation, you should look it up. you should not fly blind and perpetuate the darkness. it isn't about whether or not people agree or not. it's not about opinion.

To my way of thinking, before you criticize someone else's pronunciation, you should learn how to use the shift key on your own computer.

[vtmtnman]

If you guys have a fit over irreguardless,'I could care less',and other commonly used phrases and words,you'll love the way I pronounce drawer(draw).Seems to me if things are commonly used and you're getting mad,perhaphs you should relax.I useta could not have to worry about this.

 

Isn't this thread supposed to be about cachays?

Edited June 2, 2007 by vtmtnman

[+boda]

If you have a question about how to pronounce a word, just ask me and I will tell you how to pronounce it. I am never wrong.

 

The same with spelling. If I spell the same word differently in a particular post—they are both correct.

 

We make a habit of the way we pronounce a word, and that habit is hard to overcome. I have some friends who pronounce a well-known author's name incorrectly. I heard two interviews where the author was asked for the correct pronounciation, and passed that on to my friends. They still insist on the wrong way.

 

In the long run, does it matter? No, unless the error changes the meaning of the word.

 

I think the mistake with cache and forte is that people get confused when the french put a grave aboe the e's they wish to accent. As the US (101)keyboard cannot put the grave over the e a lot of people then assume all french words ending in e are accented. However in the case of cache and forte both from french origins the e is not graved and thus silent.

 

è

[Elaur]

Hey you guys, regional dialects are neat.

[+Trucker Lee]

 

Just as annoying are cache owners who spell it "cash" or "cashe" on their cashay pages.

 

Consider this a slap "upside the head"

[+KBI]

Hey you guys y'all, regional dialects are neat.

[vtmtnman]

Hey you guys, regional dialects are neatwicked.

Come to New England sometime....we've got at least three different ones.Ahyup.

Edited June 2, 2007 by vtmtnman

[+JamGuys]

Isn't this thread supposed to be about cachays?

 

Nope, it's about cashays.

[vtmtnman]

Isn't this thread supposed to be about cachays?

 

Nope, it's about cashays.

Twoshay....

[+flask]

to my way of thinking, if you are ignorant of the correct pronunciation, you should look it up. you should not fly blind and perpetuate the darkness. it isn't about whether or not people agree or not. it's not about opinion.

To my way of thinking, before you criticize someone else's pronunciation, you should learn how to use the shift key on your own computer.

 

i have a very serious hand tremor and a very bad problem with right/left coordination. when my body stops shaking, i'll see if i can manage the shift key.

 

meanwwhilde, lit's hard for m to get my hansd tro be still over the spropers keys withouuata worrying abouit teo at once. i hope you have enjoyted this unditwd exsample of what amy typing looks likel if i don't keep backspeaning too correct.

 

i wish that had been a joke.

[+flask]

to my way of thinking, if you are ignorant of the correct pronunciation, you should look it up. you should not fly blind and perpetuate the darkness. it isn't about whether or not people agree or not. it's not about opinion.

To my way of thinking, before you criticize someone else's pronunciation, you should learn how to use the shift key on your own computer.

 

and as a very slowly, carefully typed afterthought:

 

this thread was about mispronunciation, was it not? does my specific disability disqualify me from having an opinion?

[+Grizzly Pair]

How do you pronounce "Porsche"?

 

por-shay

 

Is there any other way?

Porsh-uh.

 

That's the way the family that mde them says their name, anyway.

 

I'm one of the ones that calls it like it reads. After long runing debates with fans...I've realized that the uh ending was the right one, but old habits die hard. I'm still holindg out that Mazda has an a like o in Mod and not a like Math. But Maybe I'll lose that one too.

 

How do you get from mathematics to 'math' is there a mathematic? Do the maths!

[+Walt Jabsco]

All I can think of when I read this thread was the movie "Snatch" where Brad Pitt's character's accent was so bad, no one could understand him.

 

Try moving from Connecticut to Louisiana if you want a lesson in relearning a language. For the first year, I had no idea how anything was pronounced. Thankfully now I'm in northwest Florida where everyone is from somewhere else and we've all decided to limit ouselves to the common words that everyone knows. :-)

[uperdooper]

to my way of thinking, if you are ignorant of the correct pronunciation, you should look it up. you should not fly blind and perpetuate the darkness. it isn't about whether or not people agree or not. it's not about opinion.

To my way of thinking, before you criticize someone else's pronunciation, you should learn how to use the shift key on your own computer.

to my way of thinking. you should check to see if someone types without caps for a reason. i have lupus and it hurts to use them.

 

IF YOU LIKE CAPS SO MUCH I COULD JUST USE THE CAPS LOCK KEY.

 

you're also off-topic and so am i.

[+LaTuFu]

While I have enjoyed this discussion (and confess I pronounce it caysh) I now feel the need to go pottay.

[k8fearsnoart]

when my dad first started telling me about this last year, i honestly thought he was saying "geode cache"...dadgum my bad ears!!!

oops!

too late!

[+gh patriot]

Why is it that some people insist on pronouncing it 'cashay' instead of 'cash'?

 

 

 

Public schools.

[+Renegade Knight]

Well, I am in the minority over here, as I pronounce it Cash, when most pronounce it Kay-sh. Each to his own. Now, if you guys could only spell aluminium correctly, the world would be perfect.

 

I read a history of that once. Turns out that we say it like it used to be said. Then everone else in the english speaking world decided that it should be different.

 

The artical closed with pondering if we should be saying "Titanium or Ty-Tan-U-Me-In-E-Um.

[+TrailGators]

While I have enjoyed this discussion (and confess I pronounce it caysh) I now feel the need to go pottay.

[+Too Tall John]

to my way of thinking, if you are ignorant of the correct pronunciation, you should look it up. you should not fly blind and perpetuate the darkness. it isn't about whether or not people agree or not. it's not about opinion.

To my way of thinking, before you criticize someone else's pronunciation, you should learn how to use the shift key on your own computer.

and as a very slowly, carefully typed afterthought:

 

this thread was about mispronunciation, was it not? does my specific disability disqualify me from having an opinion?

I must say, I was struck with a similar thought as JohnX (in that it was ironic; anyone who has read any of flask's posts knows that she is intelligent enough to know how to use a shift key), but had always just thought that the use of no caps was just a personal choice or style, kind of like how some people always post with a certain color. (A certain smurfy mod comes to mind...) Hats off to ya, flask. Your example of unedited typing is kinda like what my unedited typing looks like, and I have pretty steady hands, just no skills, typing or spelling... (thank God for spellcheck... hmm... "spellcheck" apparently isn't a word... )

 

Back on topic:

• If you pronounce "cache" /kash-ay/, how do you pronounce "caching"? /Kash-ay-ing/?
  
• One advantage to pronouncing it /kash-ay/ would be that it would reduce the instant misconception that you're hunting for a box of money (cash) in the woods.
  

(Dadgum! I almost spelled "cash" "cache"... Just now, too... )

[BRTango]

I'm sure some of it is ignorance (which in this case is not a put down, I'm using it as the word is intended to be used - not knowing something) It is difficult to pronounce words that originate in French if you are not familiar with them.

 

I just taught the kids in school about Gauguin - if you aren't familiar with French pronunciations how would you know how to pronounce that.

 

I hope no one ever finds a cache in a niche with someone from London. My friend from London swears they say it "neesh" (nitch - here in ohio)

 

How about couching homemade paper when it's drying? Is that "couching" or "cooching" I only knew the right way to say it because someone was willing to tell me.

 

Now that being said, there is a difference between ignorance of the correct pronounciation and choosing to say it incorrectly even after someone explained how to say it. That probably would drive me bonkers.

 

Ha... vtmtnman and flask can probably back me up on this.

 

I used to live in NH and work in VT. I had a terrible time with names up there. So many people of French Canadian decent... but they all pronounce their names in bastardized english. My favorite was a guy that I worked with. His name was Benoit. Should be pronounced Ben-Wah if I understand correctly. I had only seen his name on paper and whenever I asked who this guy was or where he was everyone would look at me like I was nuts... they'd never heard of him.

 

Finally someone corrected me... "It's pronounced Ben-Oyt here!" they said. I got that several other times with other names as well!!

[vtmtnman]

I'm sure some of it is ignorance (which in this case is not a put down, I'm using it as the word is intended to be used - not knowing something) It is difficult to pronounce words that originate in French if you are not familiar with them.

 

I just taught the kids in school about Gauguin - if you aren't familiar with French pronunciations how would you know how to pronounce that.

 

I hope no one ever finds a cache in a niche with someone from London. My friend from London swears they say it "neesh" (nitch - here in ohio)

 

How about couching homemade paper when it's drying? Is that "couching" or "cooching" I only knew the right way to say it because someone was willing to tell me.

 

Now that being said, there is a difference between ignorance of the correct pronounciation and choosing to say it incorrectly even after someone explained how to say it. That probably would drive me bonkers.

 

Ha... vtmtnman and flask can probably back me up on this.

 

I used to live in NH and work in VT. I had a terrible time with names up there. So many people of French Canadian decent... but they all pronounce their names in bastardized english. My favorite was a guy that I worked with. His name was Benoit. Should be pronounced Ben-Wah if I understand correctly. I had only seen his name on paper and whenever I asked who this guy was or where he was everyone would look at me like I was nuts... they'd never heard of him.

 

Finally someone corrected me... "It's pronounced Ben-Oyt here!" they said. I got that several other times with other names as well!!

Heh...yup.Anybody familiar with the semi famous Benoit family(Famous hunters from VT that bag big deer/they wrote books on their techniques) and I'm sure they have had the same trouble.I've heard it ben-oit around my parts,but on TV it's ben-wah.

Edited June 5, 2007 by vtmtnman

[+bilbad]

I say "cash" unless I think I can get someone to correct the way I talk for humorous reasons... I always hated my english teacher correcting every word out of my mouth... On the other hand though I have switched sides.. one time a guy says to me " Be right back i am going to get a drink of weter" of course I had to correct him and said, " We say water (wah ter) around here. The only time we say Werter is like "Weter ya doin'"" I also leave the -uh off from porsche because it sounds soo..yuppie.

[+Goblin]

I didn't take the time to read all the way through the thread so don't know if this was explained. here is my take on why some people pronounce it that way. I looked up cache in my Webster. It says cache comes from the French word cacher which means to hide. Cacher has an er at the end which has the sound of an A. And when you congigate the verb cacher I believe the ending on one of the tenses has the e with the little slant on the top, I think it is called an acute e or accent acute. That e also has the shay sound.

 

Just my two cents word.

[+flask]

yes, when you conjugate the verb cacher it takes the accent aigu in some of the past tense forms.

[+ncfinn]

I am a foreign-born speaker of English, so every word I say sounds a little "off". I believe there definitely is a right way and a wrong way to pronounce words, you can not blame it all on an accent. Cash is right. Cashay is wrong. Kay-sh is an accent (not wrong).

 

I "love" it when Americans try to get fancy and give foreign names to products or places and then completely massacre the word. I live on a street with a German name. The word is not used in every-day English. I know how to pronounced it correctly. Locals pronounce it wrong. I refuse to say it that way so I always have to spell it.

[+flask]

how about catch? did we cover people who pronounce it that way?

[Uberquandary]

I am a foreign-born speaker of English, so every word I say sounds a little "off". I believe there definitely is a right way and a wrong way to pronounce words, you can not blame it all on an accent. Cash is right. Cashay is wrong. Kay-sh is an accent (not wrong).

 

I "love" it when Americans try to get fancy and give foreign names to products or places and then completely massacre the word. I live on a street with a German name. The word is not used in every-day English. I know how to pronounced it correctly. Locals pronounce it wrong. I refuse to say it that way so I always have to spell it.

What's your street's name?

 

And does this mean I can start correcting people's poor punctuation? I often have to fight the urge to correct cache descriptions and logs...

[+flask]

regional pronunciations may go far from the mark of what used to be correct in the original language.

 

i live in a state where we have caliss, monpeyer, snalbans, and barry.

 

calais, montpelier, saint albans, and barre respectively.

 

i live in west bolton, which is correctly pronounced "wes bol'n". you kind of swallow the "l" so it's not really there.

 

"hartford" is generally pronounced "white river junction".

[+ncfinn]

regional pronunciations may go far from the mark of what used to be correct in the original language.

 

 

Over many generations pronounciations change, but the person originally picking the name should at least know how to pronounce it. You want to sound fancy, come up with your own word.