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mshathaway
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Good evening, I guess I am what you call a Muggle, I never knew this "world" existed and find it quite interesting, with that said, I will get to the reason why I am here.

 

I walk my dog in area that for intents and purposes is an off leash dog park, we walk there at least twice a day, it is private land with public access. It is a long time poular spot for the local dog community, and an overall great spot.

 

I came across a cache a couple months back, while my dog was chasing rabbits, I opened the box, did not see the "instructions note", I felt I was invading someone's private stuff, and did not go through the box, and quickly closed it, and covered it back up. I thought it may have been the belongings of a local homeless person.

 

Last Sunday while walking in the woods with another dogwalker, we came around the corner to find (3) people, a family there, the box was open, we did not expect to see someone there and the dogs being off leash and running ahead approached them first. My friends dog jumped on the daughter, my friend apoligized and quickly corralled her dog. Her dog is very friendly. The family really had no reaction and were quite benign infact, we said our goodbyes and continued on. When we got to the parking lot however, the woman was behind us, completley hysterical, and screaming. Her husband was no where in sight, and my first thought was something happened to him. She then started screaming that my friend's dog had injured her daughter(@ 14 yrs of age), she lifted her shirt to reveal the injury and there was none, my friend continually apoligized, by this time other people had started to gather, one man commented to the fact that there was no mark or injury on the girl, the woman responed "that it had faded". The woman remained completley hysterical, threatened to call the police, making threats towards my friend and her dog.

 

We stood there stunned, my friend was completly shaken. I am a responsible dog owner, as is my friend. We were at a known off leash dog park, dogs jump, plan on encountering dogs, getting dirty, etc. my friend felt badly, but this woman completly overreacted, she took down people's licens plate numbers, it was just ridiculous and un-necessary.

 

In hindsight, there have been several people at the park in the past, that I now suspect were geo-cachers, they all took great exception to the presence of dogs.

 

The whole point of my diatribe is that, I know this park is for everyone, dog walkers, geo-cachers, everyone, but there needs to mutual consideration between all parties. If you visit a place have respect for the people that have been walking their dogs there for years.

 

That's all I have to say, I appreciate your hobby, it is not for me, I will respect your activities and hope you respect mine, which usually innvolves my dog. Thanks again.

Edited by mshathaway
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I love dogs! I hate even more being called a neo cacher. Do not lump every cacher you see into one group. There are over a million cachers worldwide that come from all walks in life. As in any group this size you will run across people that you my not want to encounter in the future. However I can attest that most are very nice people that you would enjoy meeting.

 

You might want to give our hobby/game/sport a try. It will lead you to a lot of places that you and your dog will enjoy.

 

El Diablo

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Whereas I agree that based on the facts presented, it appears the mother overreacted, I feel I must point out I disagree with the subtle implication that being in an off-leash dog park removes even a smidgeon of liability from a dog handler/owner. You wrote, "We were at a known off leash dog park, dogs jump, plan on encountering dogs, getting dirty..."

So long as someone doesn't contribute to a dog (or other pet) jumping on them or biting them (like pulling on the dog's tail; or gesturing to elicit a response), the dog handler is responsible for all liable actions performed by the dog. Prominently displayed signs indicating the area is intended for dogs and admonishing people to enter at their won risk will remove some of this responsibility. Private property is a non-issue in this case as there are no no-trespassing signs.

In this case, it appears the dog handler was negligent by not properly restraining the dog. I'm glad for both parties no one got hurt. Now having said all that, if I was the dog handler and the mother continued her tirade, I would point out the off-leash sign and take down her plate # as well.

 

Fyi, I cache with my dog and she is off the leash many a time. As Diablo pointed out, I think you, and certainly your dog, will enjoy caching. Give it a try!

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I'm sure you know irresponsible dog owners. As such, there are irresponsible geocachers as well. There are people who overreact to all kinds of different things, just b/c these people happened to be geocachers, doesn't mean all geocachers are that way.

 

I'd LOVE to find a cache in a dog park (actually, I did in Memphis when visiting family). Savannah's a very dog unfriendly town so our dog-cachers don't get to come with us often at all.

 

I'm sorry you had this experience, please don't think all geocachers are anti-dog or anti-sharing.

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Thanks guys I really appreciate your responses, I guess I already knew not to judge an entire group by the actions of one, just maybe had to see it in writing/hear it from others to remember.

 

Sorry about the "neo-cachers"/I went back and edited afterwards.

 

And If I intimated that as a dog owner I am not responsible for my dogs actions(jumping etc,), I fouled up, I am poor at articulating, I completley take responsibilty for my dog's actions as my friend does, I was just saying things hapen, even the best trained dogs are not robots and accidents happen, it is how they are handled by the dog owner that is the testament to their responsibilty.

 

As far as the sentiment in our park goes, at this point, the incident and geo-cachers are certainly the talk of the park . People are angry about the situation, as I was, but these people are intelligent common sense people, and I think soon enough they will realize the same as above.

 

Thanks again and happy geo-caching, (is that a correct term?) be safe and enjoy.

Edited by mshathaway
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Geocachers is the correct term. I'm happy that you modified your original post. :D I don't know about everyone else but when I see a dog running at me indicating that it's wanting to meet a new friend, I drop to my kneees and give it a big hug and play!

 

Unfortunately not all people feel this way. Like I said earlier try or game. I think you and your dog will find places to go that you never knew existed.

 

El Diablo

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I came across a cache a couple months back, while my dog was chasing rabbits, ...

So you take your dog to a park and let it loose to chase down, and if it were able, attack and kill rabbits. Is that not a correct statement? How cute and friendly your dog must be.

 

... , we did not expect to see someone there and the dogs being off leash and running ahead approached them first. My friends dog jumped on the daughter,

So essentially, the dog was unleased, running loose and beyond control of the owner, and then jumped on a child.

 

Her dog is very friendly.

Please explain how anyone can determine, in 5 seconds, if a running dog is friendly or not.

 

We stood there stunned, my friend was completly shaken. I am a responsible dog owner, as is my friend.

No. You are not responsible dog owners. You let your animals chase wildlife and can't prevent them from jumping on people.

 

The whole point of my diatribe is that, I know this park is for everyone, dog walkers, geo-cachers, everyone, but there needs to mutual consideration between all parties.
Keep that point in mind.

 

If you visit a place have respect for the people that have been walking their dogs there for years.
You are not walking dogs, you are letting them run uncontrolled to harass wildlife and jump on people.

 

I will respect your activities and hope you respect mine, which usually innvolves my dog.
Your claim of respect is false. If you respected other people, you would control your animals.
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I came across a cache a couple months back, while my dog was chasing rabbits, ...

So you take your dog to a park and let it loose to chase down, and if it were able, attack and kill rabbits. Is that not a correct statement? How cute and friendly your dog must be.

 

... , we did not expect to see someone there and the dogs being off leash and running ahead approached them first. My friends dog jumped on the daughter,

So essentially, the dog was unleased, running loose and beyond control of the owner, and then jumped on a child.

 

Her dog is very friendly.

Please explain how anyone can determine, in 5 seconds, if a running dog is friendly or not.

 

We stood there stunned, my friend was completly shaken. I am a responsible dog owner, as is my friend.

No. You are not responsible dog owners. You let your animals chase wildlife and can't prevent them from jumping on people.

 

The whole point of my diatribe is that, I know this park is for everyone, dog walkers, geo-cachers, everyone, but there needs to mutual consideration between all parties.
Keep that point in mind.

 

If you visit a place have respect for the people that have been walking their dogs there for years.
You are not walking dogs, you are letting them run uncontrolled to harass wildlife and jump on people.

 

I will respect your activities and hope you respect mine, which usually innvolves my dog.
Your claim of respect is false. If you respected other people, you would control your animals.

 

Spoken like someone who knows nothing about dogs or animals in general, and very little about people.

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Her dog is very friendly.

Please explain how anyone can determine, in 5 seconds, if a running dog is friendly or not.

 

We stood there stunned, my friend was completly shaken. I am a responsible dog owner, as is my friend.

No. You are not responsible dog owners. You let your animals chase wildlife and can't prevent them from jumping on people.

 

.

 

Well me personally I can decide in a split second if the dog coming towards me is friendly or not. Anyone that has been around dogs long enough can tell.

 

El Diablo

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after 2nd edit: removed for content, I respectfully disagree with you John X, and I will leave it at that.

 

After edit: My dog is a hound from rescue, his instinct is to drive rabbits, not catch them or kill them, for a hound, he has excellent recall, and repsonds, his previous home was 2'x3.1/2' cage made out of chicken wire, he was used as a hunting dog,his legs were broken from being kicked and went untreated, he had heartworm, he was set to be shot, and was forty pounds underweight when I got him. He was terrified of all men at first and would shake uncontrollably and pee in the presence of any man. I spent my entire savings getting him healthy, took a leave of absence from my work. He is now happy and healthy, it was a long road, but I would do it a million times over to have him. So John X, if my dog wants to chase rabbits in my community, and run and be free and be happy in a town where I pay taxes, in a place that I frequent everyday, a place that I am innvolved in extensively in terms of conservation, then that is our right.

Edited by mshathaway
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Wow, I guess we're proving there's all kinds of people out there! I usually go geocaching with my labradoodle, she loves it, chases the odd critter, gets burrs, usually ignores my cache finds, but otherwise has a great time doing dog things. I've noticed on this web site that there are some extensive threads of people posting pictures of their 'geodogs', so I think the intersection of geocachers and dog people is a large one.

 

I'm relatively new to the whole thing, but geocachers no doubt have the same cross section of jerks to good people as society at large.

 

I bet your hound is glad to have you!

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I have a Jack Russel that chases birds. It runs faster than the birds can fly, but the birds gain too much elevation too quickly. One day, there will be a bird that doesn't get a good start or for whatever reason does not gain altitude quickly enough. That probablility doesn't keep me from letting it off leash, and it's still a very friendly dog. My Beagle also chases birds and rabbits, but it never comes close.

 

To the issue at hand... I regret that the geocachers that you met in the field behaved in that fashion. I can assure you that most of us do not feel the same way. We feel the same way you do about dog parks and geocachers.

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I am 'a dog person', but not fanatical about it. I've had at least one house-dog all my life, have 2 now, a 12 y.o and 2 y.o, plus an 8 y.o. cat.

 

One of my biggest pet peeves is someone that thinks their dog is so freakin cute and lovable that EVERYBODY must love them.

 

I attend and host a lot of campout events. People bringing their dog and turning it loose is fortunately not common, but it happens, and always with unpleasant results... though the happy dog owner (acts) oblivious to the fact that some folks don't like their dogs. The dogs do unnacceptable things and the owners say 'oh isn't that cute!'.

 

Pets are near and dear, too dear, to some. I had several people refuse to leave the completely destroyed area of Biloxi after Katrina because they couldn't find or take their dog. Sorry, no dog is worth your life.

 

I saw teams from as far away as California show up in that disaster zone to rescue animals. They would completely ignore the human tragedy surrounding them in order to focus their time and resources on rescuing animals. Sorry, I can't comprehend that.

 

So, the delimma here is that you have folks who believe their animals have rights, free run and control of the park, and you have visitors to the park who come for other reasons who may not like dogs at all.

 

Unless there are signs posted that dogs are allowed to run unfettered in this park the other visitors can't know about loose dogs.

 

Geocachers won't know anything about the park at all; we are going to a set of coordinates and have no idea what we'll find there.

 

That a community has adopted a park for dog-owner use and that dogs are running freely is unknown to the geocacher drawn to the park to find the cache.

 

What geocachers do a lot of is travel, and in those travels we find that dogs must be controlled in most parks. Park visitors have come to expect that dogs must be controlled in public places.

 

So when geocachers come to this park we carry an expectation that other visitors will control their animals.

 

I expect that, if asked, the management of the park in question would say that animals should be controlled rather than say that visitors shuld expect to be confronted by animals.

 

I love my dogs, but I don't assume you will. You might do well to adopt that assumption.

 

Ed

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I came across a cache a couple months back, while my dog was chasing rabbits, ...

So you take your dog to a park and let it loose to chase down, and if it were able, attack and kill rabbits. Is that not a correct statement? How cute and friendly your dog must be.

 

... , we did not expect to see someone there and the dogs being off leash and running ahead approached them first. My friends dog jumped on the daughter,

So essentially, the dog was unleased, running loose and beyond control of the owner, and then jumped on a child.

 

Her dog is very friendly.

Please explain how anyone can determine, in 5 seconds, if a running dog is friendly or not.

 

We stood there stunned, my friend was completly shaken. I am a responsible dog owner, as is my friend.

No. You are not responsible dog owners. You let your animals chase wildlife and can't prevent them from jumping on people.

 

The whole point of my diatribe is that, I know this park is for everyone, dog walkers, geo-cachers, everyone, but there needs to mutual consideration between all parties.
Keep that point in mind.

 

If you visit a place have respect for the people that have been walking their dogs there for years.
You are not walking dogs, you are letting them run uncontrolled to harass wildlife and jump on people.

 

I will respect your activities and hope you respect mine, which usually innvolves my dog.
Your claim of respect is false. If you respected other people, you would control your animals.

 

Spoken like someone who knows nothing about dogs or animals in general, and very little about people.

 

JohnX, sounds like you don't get out much. Dog owners do have responsibilities of course but as stated, this is an off leash park and you would think that anyone going in would have an inkling that a dog might run up to say hi. Dogs love to run and play and thats what they do at this park. Sounds like the geocacher in question really overreacted, maybe because they havn't been around dogs too much or are overprotective of their child. For me personally, it really sounds to me like they were out for something. Either to just stir up a stink or that they were trying to figure out a way to make a fast buck with the help of a lawyer. Of course i'm only hearing the one side of the story here so my opinion is just that, an opinion.

 

Mshathaway,, like any other group, there will always be disagreements. I've been geocaching for over three years and i can certainly say that i have met alot of great people that participate in our hobby. Thank you for not categorizing all of us a certain way. :D

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I came across a cache a couple months back, while my dog was chasing rabbits, ...

So you take your dog to a park and let it loose to chase down, and if it were able, attack and kill rabbits. Is that not a correct statement? How cute and friendly your dog must be.

 

... , we did not expect to see someone there and the dogs being off leash and running ahead approached them first. My friends dog jumped on the daughter,

So essentially, the dog was unleased, running loose and beyond control of the owner, and then jumped on a child.

 

Her dog is very friendly.

Please explain how anyone can determine, in 5 seconds, if a running dog is friendly or not.

 

We stood there stunned, my friend was completly shaken. I am a responsible dog owner, as is my friend.

No. You are not responsible dog owners. You let your animals chase wildlife and can't prevent them from jumping on people.

 

The whole point of my diatribe is that, I know this park is for everyone, dog walkers, geo-cachers, everyone, but there needs to mutual consideration between all parties.
Keep that point in mind.

 

If you visit a place have respect for the people that have been walking their dogs there for years.
You are not walking dogs, you are letting them run uncontrolled to harass wildlife and jump on people.

 

I will respect your activities and hope you respect mine, which usually innvolves my dog.
Your claim of respect is false. If you respected other people, you would control your animals.

 

This response nearly knocked me out of my chair! :D

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FYI: Sigsn are posted everywhere that this is an off-leash dog park, there are few places other than one's own yard where dogs are allowed off leash in our state. I do not assume "everybody loves my dog" or "thinks he is cute" in fact quite the opposite. I am quite aware that not everyone is a dog person and do my best to not draw further barriers between dog people and non dog people.

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Sure would love to hear from the geocacher - sounds like this was a dog biting a child, though maybe a minor bite... Still as a father of five any dog biting my kid in a public park would certainly upset me.

 

Are there signs that say that this is an off-leash park? How are visitors to know?

 

Now that we do know, however, that dogs are allowed to run free here, legally, sign warnings or not, the geocache owner should post a warning in the cache page description so that geocachers who don't like animals don't go their unprepared..

 

Ed

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no dog bite, dog jumped on a 14 year old girl who was about 5'9, jumped for a split second, the family did not react or respond negatively at the time, and we said good bye, there was no mark on the girl, mother admitted it was faded, the woman was at best unstable, and her deuaghter seemed mortified, things like this do not happen at our park, that is why it is such a big deal. I agree with warning, or notifying I think is a better term that this cache is in a dog park, or remove it all together.

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Thanks for the clarification that it wasn't a bite.

 

I think you will find that it is a rare geocacher who doesn't enjoy the outdoors and understand that animals are to be expected there.

 

Next time you see the cache look at the log inside - I expect you will find that a lot of geocachers have visited it without incident!

 

I think a warning on the cache page is reasonable, removing the cache over one incident is likely not required.

 

I didn't get that this was on private property. If it is in fact on private property and permission was not obtained to put it there then you may have more reason to ask that it be removed.

 

Ed

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MSHATHAWAY---

Can I recommend getting in touch with the cache owner(s) of the cache(s) in this area and having them make a note on the cache page that these caches are in an OFF LEASH dog area and that the likelyhood of encountering a dog off leash is very high.

Perhaps some communication between the dog owners and cachers could help to make this a better situation for both groups. Thank you for taking the time to seek out this board.

 

If you need help there are plenty of people that can assist you, feel free to ask.

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Ms Hathaway, Thank you for taking your time to explore our game...hobby....obsesion.... Most of us are great folks. Some, as you've seen in one person's post, are not. You mentioned that this incident was the talk of the dog park, and that other folks were angry. Might I ask who those other folks are angry at? I'd hate to think folks were mad at us because one of our players went bonkers. Can you put in a good word for us?

-Sean-

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Being a military veterinary technician, working around dogs every day with hazards such as bites and scratches, and just finnishing work on a dog park project, I've looked into responible dog parks etiquet, rules, laws, et all. Most municipalities will post signs warning people entering, washing their hands of all liability. Responsible pet owners are not let off the hook, but responsibility also falls upon the person entering (because the've been warned). Most dog parks will rely upon peer presure to "regulate" the activities (sound familiar cachers?) an unrully dog will be shunned for causing trouble and as an outcast eventually not return. Dogs being dogs and doing what dogs do naturally leaves it to the responsible owner to "know their dog and know if he/ she will bite/ fight/ scratch. I think in this situation the dog owners were fine in what they were doing, the cachers were fine in what they were doing. Now the cachers may have entered unknowingly into an off-leash area (I enter from the wrong direction all the time when approaching a cache), I think it would be interesting to see the cache page, is it possible that the cache owner is responsible in some indirrect way for not posting in BIG BOLD RED LETTERS a warning about "hazards" found at the cache sight.

 

I think mshathaway's topic title says it all though she very well could muggle this cache or anyother cache in her area, if she wanted to. (she has an account) but she has chosen to take another route, to inform and educate the comunity as a whole.

Maybe we should "regulate" our own, educate people going to the cache and if Dogs are not your cup of tea... simply click ignore.

I won't make fun of you for not wanting to grab a cache with an insane JRT guarding it anymore than I would expect to be made fun of for not wanting to grab the cache being guarded by a mad cow (livestock atribute???) :D

 

Just my $0.02

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I'll tell you what, DOGS HATE ME and now vice versa!! And I have been bitten by "Friendly" dogs 3 times in off-leash parks (Caching, of course), the owners have giggled everytime, that was the only thing that erked me. Now I just stay out of those parks because I know better. I think mshathaway is being very upfront and civil about the situation. Non-snake people should know better than to go into the jungle! :D

Edited by .Mitch.
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So you take your dog to a park and let it loose to chase down, and if it were able, attack and kill rabbits. Is that not a correct statement? How cute and friendly your dog must be.

 

Chasing animals is part of the basic, fundamental nature of dogs. And cats. And countless other carnivores. They are the product of millions of years of evolution, which required that they hunt to eat. It has no bearing whatsoever on how cute or friendly the dog is. A dog may stalk and kill a rabbit, yet still love a hearty belly rub, and be a good and loyal companion.

 

I'm not sure what you were attempting to accomplish with this post, but all you've really managed to do is demonstrate really poor debating skills.

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So you take your dog to a park and let it loose to chase down, and if it were able, attack and kill rabbits. Is that not a correct statement? How cute and friendly your dog must be.

 

So essentially, the dog was unleased, running loose and beyond control of the owner, and then jumped on a child.

 

Please explain how anyone can determine, in 5 seconds, if a running dog is friendly or not.

 

No. You are not responsible dog owners. You let your animals chase wildlife and can't prevent them from jumping on people.

 

You are not walking dogs, you are letting them run uncontrolled to harass wildlife and jump on people.

 

Your claim of respect is false. If you respected other people, you would control your animals.

 

Wow... Just... wow. My first respone to this is full of such vitriol that I have to forcibly constrain my typing right now. If I were to see you tell somebody off like this in person, I can guarantee you would not have finished your first statement, never mind finished your entire response.

 

If a dog is running at me, I can tell you what that dog is looking to do when it reaches me. Furthermore, I can adequately protect myself if that dog is intending harm.

 

Here's a hint: If the dog is running at you, and its' muzzle is pulled back revealing teeth, it wants to do you harm. Your proper response is to ensure that your knee meets its nose. Hard. Second choice: Ram your knee into its chest (as it will very likely jump to bite you). It will harm you very mildly, and will completely stun the dog for a long enough time to put you in total mastery of the situation.

 

On the other hand, if it's tongue is flopping, you are unable to see more than the tips of teeth (they have long teeth, and are unable to completely hide them), its' muzzle is not pulled back, it wants to meet a new friend. Your proper response is to smile and laugh. It's likely to jump up. If you don't wish that, pick up one leg, and bend it at the knee. Worst case scenario: The dog bounces off your knee, and gets the wind knocked out of it. Pet the dog, play with the dog, and the owner will be by within a few moments to admonish the dog for jumping on you.

 

Notice the theme? If not, here it is: Use your knee! If you are worried about what a dog will to you, get that knee bent! Mean dogs try to hit the throat. Friendly dogs try to jump and play. In both cases, your knee will hit the chest, knocking it back and knocking the wind out of it.

 

As for the rest... You sir, are in desparate need of some social skills. I used to think I was bad at getting along with other people. Fortunately, I have people like you to remind me that, though I'm no social butterfly, I'm quite capable of getting along with many people.

 

Unfortunately for you, dunderheads are not people with whom I can get along.

 

EDIT: Ahh, quick note: My rules above are generalities for people who do not know how to deal with dogs. They will cover enough cases to allow you to protect yourself and judge the situation correctly well over 75% of the time. As any dog owner or lover will tell you, though, every rule has an exception. Some mean dogs may go for the feet, pulling you down and leaving you very vulnerable, for example. The ultimate rule, the one which has no exception, is always in play: Be careful. If you're unfamiliar with a dog, and too uncertain of intent, try your best to play with the dog without touch. Keep distance, but keep engaged. If it's a loved dog, the owner will be by shortly, almost guaranteed. If it's unloved, and/or mean, you need to keep that distance, and the focus, to make sure you don't get hurt. But, by no means should you freak out about the situation. A dog, mentally, will never be as intelligent as the average 6 year old child. Use your brain, not your fear, and you'll come (intact) out of any situation involving a dog.

Edited by m.pedersen
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you're right. as neocasher we are all exactly the same. Just a bunch of crazy people who hate dogs and want to destroy all dog parks.

 

 

:laughing: (obviously not)

 

 

Sounds a bit like you just have a bit of the "ban all outsiders" mentality, unfortunate. If not, you may want to contact the local geocaching group about your situation. My guess is they would be happy to come out with a bunch of less crazy people and their geodogs to demonstrate the hobby and fix any hard feelings caused by this woman.

 

 

blaming a group for the actions of an individual is always a bad idea.

Edited by Bad_CRC
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Sure would love to hear from the geocacher - sounds like this was a dog biting a child, though maybe a minor bite...

 

No, it doesn't sound like that at all. It sounds like either the dog did no harm whatsoever, OR that the dog accidentally scratched the kid with its nails - so lightly that the mark (if there ever was a mark) disappeared immediately.

 

 

Now that we do know, however, that dogs are allowed to run free here, legally, sign warnings or not, the geocache owner should post a warning in the cache page description so that geocachers who don't like animals don't go their unprepared..

 

Whether it's officially legal or not, it's completely irresponsible for the hider of the cache not to mention it on the cache page.

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Here's a hint: If the dog is running at you, and its' muzzle is pulled back revealing teeth, it wants to do you harm.

 

 

Sorry, but that's not necessarily the case.

 

1. Some dogs show their teeth when they're playing, so teeth showing don't automatically equate to "dog wants to do harm".

2. Dogs who show their teeth to menace don't usually do it when RUNNING; they approach slowly.

3. Many dogs DON'T show teeth when approaching with intent to do harm. I, personally, am far more concerned about a dog which approaches with an intent stare and hackles up than one which is showing teeth.

 

 

It's likely to jump up.

 

 

Not if it's a properly trained dog, it's not.

 

If you don't wish that, pick up one leg, and bend it at the knee. Worst case scenario: The dog bounces off your knee, and gets the wind knocked out of it. Pet the dog, play with the dog,

and the owner will be by within a few moments to admonish the dog for jumping on you.

 

While I agree that a hip-check or knee is the appropriate response to being charged and jumped on by an obnoxious dog, it's just as possible that the dog's owner will respond by screaming at you for "kicking their dog" because "he just wanted to play".

BTDT... and I'm a dog owner, who was walking my own dogs at the time. The fact that the dog outweighed me by about 35 lbs and would have knocked me flat (it was a Bernese Mountain Dog) didn't seem to make a difference to his irresponsible owner.

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]So you take your dog to a park and let it loose to chase down, and if it were able, attack and kill rabbits. Is that not a correct statement?

 

Since the dog had the legal right to be off leash there, whether the statement is correct or not is immaterial.

And unless you're a vegan who also wears and uses no leather, you have no room to talk.

 

How cute and friendly your dog must be.

 

Non-sequiter.

 

Cute and friendly have no relation to the level of the dog's prey drive. My Jack Russell Terrier was about the cutest AND about the friendliest dog you could ever meet. She adored children, the smaller the better- AND had very good manners when greeting them.

She was also a dedicated and skilled hunter and killer of vermin.

 

Conversely, many dogs which are dangerously aggressive towards humans have NO interest in hunting.

 

Aggression and prey drive are NOT the same thing.

 

 

So essentially, the dog was unleased, running loose and beyond control of the owner, and then jumped on a child.

 

Do you read for comprehension? The dog was off leash in a legal off-leash area, and the "child" was a teenager.

 

 

No. You are not responsible dog owners. You let your animals chase wildlife and can't prevent them from jumping on people.

 

 

Many responsible dog owners let their animals "chase wildlife" when and where it is appropriate. Chasing rabbits and squirrels while on an off-leash walk is not at all the same thing as running deer. And running deer a short way is not the same thing as hunting them.

 

And you can't draw the conclusion that they "can't prevent their dogs from jumping on people" from the facts presented. The OP clearly stated that they encountered the people unexpectedly, and that the dog was quickly controlled. Had they seen the people there, they might very well have been able to prevent the dog jumping.

 

In any case, once again, the dogs were LEGALLY off leash on private property, so you're doing nothing but making yourself look silly with this off-kilter rant.

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Nobody mentioned it, but the OP said the cache didn't have a "instructions note". It sounds to me like this cache owner should think about putting one in this cache.

 

Personally, I can't imagine putting out a cache without some kind of info for muggle finders (unless it's a micro, maybe). I know some people do it, but it just contributes to issues like this.

 

Had there been a note in the cache, the OP would have learned about the hobby from finding the cache, and not from a nasty encounter with cachers. (Or had the cache owner included a warning about the dog park in the cache page..) Perhaps her view of geocaching would have been more positive.

 

mshathaway, I'm sorry your introduction to geocaching was not a positive experience. That is a rare situation, but it was avoidable and I wish it had been avoided.

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As for the rest... You sir, are in desparate need of some social skills. I used to think I was bad at getting along with other people. Fortunately, I have people like you to remind me that, though I'm no social butterfly, I'm quite capable of getting along with many people.
Spoken like someone who knows nothing about dogs or animals in general, and very little about people.
JohnX, sounds like you don't get out much.
To JohnX---Don't you have anything useful to do?
Unfortunately for you, dunderheads are not people with whom I can get along.

 

How amusing. When you can't refute a statement, you attack the person who makes it.

 

I have to wonder how acceptable it would be if the jumping dog knocked over a elderly person who then broke a hip.

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I love dogs and have been owned by them for most of my life, but I've been bitten pretty severely by dogs that I didn't know whom I thought were friendly as they approached me.

 

You should never assume that an approaching dog you don't know will be friendly. That's a very dangerous thing to do. And as far as millions of years of evolution are concerned, that's a good reason to be wary around dogs you don't know.

 

- T of TandS

Edited by tands
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"The woman remained completley hysterical, threatened to call the police"

My response would be Yes Ma'm, that is a very good idea. They could then settle this once and for all. Since there were no marks, I think they would find the woman unreasonable.

PP

 

I also agree that this might be the best thing to happen. But I hate that police would have to deal with this, if the facts are as stated, when they have more important things to do.

 

- T of TandS

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I was bitten twice, once as a child and once as an adult.

 

I live in mortal fear of dogs. For some it is snakes, spider, heights. For me it is dogs.

 

Obviously I would avoid such a park but I have encounter aggressive dogs in the woods before. It was nice to learn of the knee trick, I'll try to remember that during my next encounter.

 

But for now, I carry a stick, hardwood about 4 feet long. It is good as a hiking pole, for looking in crevices and I hope to never have to use it to defend myself.

 

You see, I'm scared witless and and if you dog wants to jump up and lick me, I'll very likely react poorly.

 

So please, try to control your dogs both for my sake and for yours. I don't want to be injured nor do I want to injure but I don't know what would happen. I'm an animal lover (we have cats, birds, fish and reptiles at home) but I'm just dog-phobic.

 

Paul

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I feel that the woman whose teen was jumped upon, was being totally irrational. If her daughter was truly hurt, she would have noticed before she and the dog owners parted company.

 

There are many, many cachers who are dog owners. I think the cache owner should make a note on the cache page, that the cache is located in a dog park... not only to warn non-dog people, but to let cachers with geodogs know about the area. If I were visiting the area and saw that there were a cache in a dog park nearby, it would be on the top of our "must visit" list! :laughing:

 

We actually have a cache in a dog park. Moxie's Dog Lover's Cache

 

Edited to add-

I'm sorry you had such negative experiences with dogs Paul. We get concerned sometimes with off leash dogs because Moxie is a small dog, and to some big dogs, she looks like a snack. 99.9% of the time, the dogs are friendly and/or under control of the owners... but we do worry about that .1%. For the record, we always walk Moxie on a leash when on the trails.

Edited by team moxiepup
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I think the cache owner should make a note on the cache page, that the cache is located in a dog park... not only to warn non-dog people, but to let cachers with geodogs know about the area. If I were visiting the area and saw that there were a cache in a dog park nearby, it would be on the top of our "must visit" list! smile.gif

 

Perfect! This would be a win-win situation for everyone. Non dog-lovers, like the cachers encountered by the OP, would know to avoid this park, and the rest of us could use it if we visited the area.

Edited by denali7
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I think the cache owner should make a note on the cache page, that the cache is located in a dog park... not only to warn non-dog people, but to let cachers with geodogs know about the area. If I were visiting the area and saw that there were a cache in a dog park nearby, it would be on the top of our "must visit" list! smile.gif

 

Perfect! This would be a win-win situation for everyone. Non dog-lovers, like the cachers encountered by the OP, would know to avoid this park, and the rest of us could use it if we visited the area.

 

Sounds like a plan.

 

I'm not a dog lover at all, so I'd probably find myself avoiding this park. Child tragedy involving my dog being killed in front of me, and then I was bitten one too many times, and had my mom attacked in front of me. Also I tend to laugh at people who are out at 6am in their bathrobe in the rain/snow with their little dog and plastic bag full of dog poo, and at people in the grocery store spending $100 on dog food. Suckers if you ask me, not that anyone did. :laughing:

 

Still, it sounds like the lady over-reacted a bit, and after seeing she was writing down your license plate, I would have insisted on calling the cops right then and there.

 

Sorry your first run-in with geocachers was somewhat tainted, but as others have pointed out, there are all kinds of people involved in this activity (just like any other).

 

I wouldn't mind reading their log though if someone knows which cache it is...assuming of course they are geocachers and logged the cache online (didn't see it mentioned earlier)

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I love dogs -- we have three -- and the dogs like geocaching! When we find caches out in the woods, they are excited to look and smell what is inside (sorry to anyone out there who has discovered dog drool in their caches -- just kidding!). Anyway, consider combining the two. You and your dogs may have a great time at it.

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Also I tend to laugh at people who are out at 6am in their bathrobe in the rain/snow with their little dog and plastic bag full of dog poo, and at people in the grocery store spending $100 on dog food. Suckers if you ask me, not that anyone did.

 

 

Ha, but what do they think about 'people out at 5 AM in the woods with a flashlight looking for a little box full of junk from McDonalds using a $300 electronic gadget!' (i.e., someone like me -- with my dogs yet !)

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Also I tend to laugh at people who are out at 6am in their bathrobe in the rain/snow with their little dog and plastic bag full of dog poo, and at people in the grocery store spending $100 on dog food. Suckers if you ask me, not that anyone did.

 

<raises hand>

 

Although, it would be more like:

 

...at 10am in windproof fleece the rain/snow with my big, beautiful dog and spring-loaded scoop full of Nugget nuggets, and in the pet store spending $100 on high-protein, low-fat dog food, origionally formulated for Iditarod racing dogs. Sucker? You betcha! :laughing:

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Sure would love to hear from the geocacher - sounds like this was a dog biting a child, though maybe a minor bite...

 

No, it doesn't sound like that at all. It sounds like either the dog did no harm whatsoever, OR that the dog accidentally scratched the kid with its nails - so lightly that the mark (if there ever was a mark) disappeared immediately.

 

 

Now that we do know, however, that dogs are allowed to run free here, legally, sign warnings or not, the geocache owner should post a warning in the cache page description so that geocachers who don't like animals don't go their unprepared..

 

Whether it's officially legal or not, it's completely irresponsible for the hider of the cache not to mention it on the cache page.

 

I would still like to hear the cacher's explanation! The OP clarified that it wasn't a bite (thanks again).

 

I do believe the OP mentioned a bite, however, in the original post that has been edited - maybe I am just nuts, but I think it was in the original (unedited) post.

 

Some comments have tried to ameliorate the incident by mentioning the age and size of the child - my oldest is 32, married 10 years. a homeowner, owns a successful electrical contracting business, and is quite the adult - yet he's still my child and if he's bitten I will be just as upset!

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