WTF?

[+narcissa]

If anyone has moral objections to "WTF" because it may or may not be interpreted a certain way, I guess these two caches clearly will have the morality police in full march:

 

Cache 1 and Cache 2

 

Edit to add a third one that I thought was funny, but may be morally objectionable, apparently:

 

Cache 3

 

It's not unusual for non-English speakers to treat those words more mildly than Anglophones.

 

Anglos in turn often underestimate the severity of a swear word in another language.

 

This happens all the time with French and English in Canada. The really notorious English swear words are mostly about sex and/or bodily functions, but the worst French swear words are mostly about religion, so the words aren't directly analogous to each other. Anglos don't understand what is so bad about the French words and vice versa. The context and the power of the words are easily lost in translation.

 

Applying "morality" to any of this is a little heavy-handed.

No doubt the cache owner of the wf series knew what he was doing. He thought he was being clever and probably thinks it's funny. But he also had to know that it would be offensive to some. Sure there are plenty of people who aren't offended but i can't comprehend why someone purposely does things they know will cause angst for some. It just stands to reason that those offended will probably question a cache owner's morals.

 

Yes, obviously someone who jokingly riffs on an extremely common and overused swear is a person of low moral character.

 

Moving past the vicious characterizations, let's not forget that there is a giant filter for this sort of thing, i.e. our much beloved team of volunteer reviewers. I am fairly certain that their standard is high enough for reasonable people.

[+on4bam]

Great quote on all things offensive by Salman Rushdie

 

“Nobody has the right to not be offended. That right doesn't exist in any declaration I have ever read.

 

If you are offended it is your problem, and frankly lots of things offend lots of people.

[+J Grouchy]

Well...the coordinates tell the person Where To Find the cache. The description tells them What They'll Find. Cachers then log it to tell others When They Found the cache. So I guess my question is, WTF is the problem here?

[+Mudfrog]

If anyone has moral objections to "WTF" because it may or may not be interpreted a certain way, I guess these two caches clearly will have the morality police in full march:

 

Cache 1 and Cache 2

 

Edit to add a third one that I thought was funny, but may be morally objectionable, apparently:

 

Cache 3

 

It's not unusual for non-English speakers to treat those words more mildly than Anglophones.

 

Anglos in turn often underestimate the severity of a swear word in another language.

 

This happens all the time with French and English in Canada. The really notorious English swear words are mostly about sex and/or bodily functions, but the worst French swear words are mostly about religion, so the words aren't directly analogous to each other. Anglos don't understand what is so bad about the French words and vice versa. The context and the power of the words are easily lost in translation.

 

Applying "morality" to any of this is a little heavy-handed.

No doubt the cache owner of the wf series knew what he was doing. He thought he was being clever and probably thinks it's funny. But he also had to know that it would be offensive to some. Sure there are plenty of people who aren't offended but i can't comprehend why someone purposely does things they know will cause angst for some. It just stands to reason that those offended will probably question a cache owner's morals.

 

Yes, obviously someone who jokingly riffs on an extremely common and overused swear is a person of low moral character.

 

Moving past the vicious characterizations, let's not forget that there is a giant filter for this sort of thing, i.e. our much beloved team of volunteer reviewers. I am fairly certain that their standard is high enough for reasonable people.

Like i said, everyone has their own opinions. Is the CO immoral?,, we have no idea. I don't think it's unnatural for some of the offended ones to question this though. As a cache owner myself, it doesn't make any sense to me to place a cache that i know can cause controversy.

[+narcissa]

If anyone has moral objections to "WTF" because it may or may not be interpreted a certain way, I guess these two caches clearly will have the morality police in full march:

 

Cache 1 and Cache 2

 

Edit to add a third one that I thought was funny, but may be morally objectionable, apparently:

 

Cache 3

 

It's not unusual for non-English speakers to treat those words more mildly than Anglophones.

 

Anglos in turn often underestimate the severity of a swear word in another language.

 

This happens all the time with French and English in Canada. The really notorious English swear words are mostly about sex and/or bodily functions, but the worst French swear words are mostly about religion, so the words aren't directly analogous to each other. Anglos don't understand what is so bad about the French words and vice versa. The context and the power of the words are easily lost in translation.

 

Applying "morality" to any of this is a little heavy-handed.

No doubt the cache owner of the wf series knew what he was doing. He thought he was being clever and probably thinks it's funny. But he also had to know that it would be offensive to some. Sure there are plenty of people who aren't offended but i can't comprehend why someone purposely does things they know will cause angst for some. It just stands to reason that those offended will probably question a cache owner's morals.

 

Yes, obviously someone who jokingly riffs on an extremely common and overused swear is a person of low moral character.

 

Moving past the vicious characterizations, let's not forget that there is a giant filter for this sort of thing, i.e. our much beloved team of volunteer reviewers. I am fairly certain that their standard is high enough for reasonable people.

Like i said, everyone has their own opinions. Is the CO immoral?,, we have no idea. I don't think it's unnatural for some of the offended ones to question this though. As a cache owner myself, it doesn't make any sense to me to place a cache that i know can cause controversy.

 

Sense of humour is subjective and varied. I am not particularly amused by this particular play on words, but it "doesn't make sense to me" to be so exceedingly harsh and judgmental of other geocachers that I would call their morals into question because they find a swear word funny.

[+igator210]

01) Water Tower Find, North Carolina Link

02) Where's The Fire, Georgia Link

03) What the Fence, South Dakota Link

04) Where's the Flock, Nevada Link

05) Where's the Fish, Washington Link

06) Waste Treatment Facility, Alaska Link

07) Where to Focus, Ireland Link

08) Where's the Farm, Pennsylvania Link

09) Westerly Town Forest, Rhode Island Link

10) Waldoboro Town Forest, Maine Link

11) Water to Follow, United Kingdom Link

12) Well That's Fantastic, Latvia Link

 

Other caches just had WTF in their title and I didn't see a mention of what it stood for.

Edited October 5, 2016 by igator210

[cezanne]

As a cache owner myself, it doesn't make any sense to me to place a cache that i know can cause controversy.

 

That seems to be a very general and strict statement to me. Many caches will lead to controversy and some of them are among the best caches I have ever found.

Controversy is nothing bad in my eyes.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

If anyone has moral objections to "WTF" because it may or may not be interpreted a certain way, I guess these two caches clearly will have the morality police in full march:

 

Cache 1 and Cache 2

 

Edit to add a third one that I thought was funny, but may be morally objectionable, apparently:

 

Cache 3

 

It's not unusual for non-English speakers to treat those words more mildly than Anglophones.

 

Anglos in turn often underestimate the severity of a swear word in another language.

 

This happens all the time with French and English in Canada. The really notorious English swear words are mostly about sex and/or bodily functions, but the worst French swear words are mostly about religion, so the words aren't directly analogous to each other. Anglos don't understand what is so bad about the French words and vice versa. The context and the power of the words are easily lost in translation.

 

Applying "morality" to any of this is a little heavy-handed.

No doubt the cache owner of the wf series knew what he was doing. He thought he was being clever and probably thinks it's funny. But he also had to know that it would be offensive to some. Sure there are plenty of people who aren't offended but i can't comprehend why someone purposely does things they know will cause angst for some. It just stands to reason that those offended will probably question a cache owner's morals.

 

Yes, obviously someone who jokingly riffs on an extremely common and overused swear is a person of low moral character.

 

Moving past the vicious characterizations, let's not forget that there is a giant filter for this sort of thing, i.e. our much beloved team of volunteer reviewers. I am fairly certain that their standard is high enough for reasonable people.

Like i said, everyone has their own opinions. Is the CO immoral?,, we have no idea. I don't think it's unnatural for some of the offended ones to question this though. As a cache owner myself, it doesn't make any sense to me to place a cache that i know can cause controversy.

 

That's the way I see it as well. We are told time and time again that one of the beauties of this game is that everyone can play it differently like. If someone only wants to do puzzle caches, that's a valid way to play the game. If someone is all about the numbers, that's valid as well, but when it comes to morality, apparently some thinks it's "wrong" to be morally sensitive.

 

It doesn't matter what end of the spectrum one is on regarding their own morals, we should not be imposing our morals on others, which is basically what happens when someone knowingly places a cache which makes others morally uncomfortable.

Edited October 5, 2016 by NYPaddleCacher

[+hzoi]

If anyone has moral objections to "WTF" because it may or may not be interpreted a certain way, I guess these two caches clearly will have the morality police in full march:

 

Cache 1

The title is based on an audience line traditionally shouted after the singer of

sings "living next door to Alice." For some reason that song is huge in Germany. (I also don't get why "Last Christmas" by WHAM! is literally the number one song on the radio every winter in Germany. Chalk it up to my cultural insensitivity, or to the infusion of non-German genes by my mother's side of the family.)

[+Mudfrog]

As a cache owner myself, it doesn't make any sense to me to place a cache that i know can cause controversy.

 

That seems to be a very general and strict statement to me. Many caches will lead to controversy and some of them are among the best caches I have ever found.

Controversy is nothing bad in my eyes.

I do realize that just about any cache we place has the potential to cause controversy. But, controversy comes in many different forms. Some hate LPCs, some hate tree climbing, and i'm sure that some are offended by ammocan type hides. Unlike what we're talking about here, those are things we have no control over.

[+on4bam]

The title is based on an audience line traditionally shouted after the singer of

sings "living next door to Alice."

 

Alice? Who..... is Alice? Gets played on Belgian radio every once in a while.

[cezanne]

It doesn't matter what end of the spectrum one is on regarding their own morals, we should not be imposing our morals on others, which is basically what happens when someone knowingly places a cache which makes others morally uncomfortable.

 

What people feel morally uncomfortable with varies from person to person. I do not feel uncomfortable if a cache is named after an acronym that could mean a lot of things even if I had objections against one of the possible meanings.

I do however feel morally uncomfortable when a cache/cache series brings many cachers to drive around needlessly and excessively. Such caches get hidden nevertheless and I'm not expecting the hiders to change their approach.

In my moral context the environmental impact is so much more important than what someone believes a cache title could mean.

[+narcissa]

As a cache owner myself, it doesn't make any sense to me to place a cache that i know can cause controversy.

 

That seems to be a very general and strict statement to me. Many caches will lead to controversy and some of them are among the best caches I have ever found.

Controversy is nothing bad in my eyes.

I do realize that just about any cache we place has the potential to cause controversy. But, controversy comes in many different forms. Some hate LPCs, some hate tree climbing, and i'm sure that some are offended by ammocan type hides. Unlike what we're talking about here, those are things we have no control over.

 

If you're actually concerned that someone will consider you to be a moral degenerate because of an ammo can, you don't have to hide an ammo can, but on the whole, it's probably best to disregard an opinion from the sort of person who would make that a moral issue in the first place.

[+TheVoytekBear]

It doesn't matter what end of the spectrum one is on regarding their own morals, we should not be imposing our morals on others, which is basically what happens when someone knowingly places a cache which makes others morally uncomfortable.

 

You do understand this works both ways, right? Telling someone that they shouldn't use such a title (although it doesn't contain a swear word) is also imposing your morales on them.

[+Mudfrog]

01) Water Tower Find, North Carolina Link

02) Where's The Fire, Georgia Link

03) What the Fence, South Dakota Link

04) Where's the Flock, Nevada Link

05) Where's the Fish, Washington Link

06) Waste Treatment Facility, Alaska Link

07) Where to Focus, Ireland Link

08) Where's the Farm, Pennsylvania Link

09) Westerly Town Forest, Rhode Island Link

10) Waldoboro Town Forest, Maine Link

11) Water to Follow, United Kingdom Link

12) Well That's Fantastic, Latvia Link

 

Other caches just had WTF in their title and I didn't see a mention of what it stood for.

Not surprised and i'm sure there are more. As with the caches mentioned in the original post, the 3 initials were used in an effort to make those caches stand out.

[+Mama514]

01) Water Tower Find, North Carolina Link

02) Where's The Fire, Georgia Link

03) What the Fence, South Dakota Link

04) Where's the Flock, Nevada Link

05) Where's the Fish, Washington Link

06) Waste Treatment Facility, Alaska Link

07) Where to Focus, Ireland Link

08) Where's the Farm, Pennsylvania Link

09) Westerly Town Forest, Rhode Island Link

10) Waldoboro Town Forest, Maine Link

11) Water to Follow, United Kingdom Link

12) Well That's Fantastic, Latvia Link

 

Other caches just had WTF in their title and I didn't see a mention of what it stood for.

Not surprised and i'm sure there are more. As with the caches mentioned in the original post, the 3 initials were used in an effort to make those caches stand out.

Yep. Number 3 in that list of cache titles is the only one that makes no sense to me. I'm not even sure what point is being made with the list either. Anyhow, the ACRONYM in the cache title draws attention. I just think it's a matter of immaturity. Look at me! Look at me!

[+Thrak]

There was a cache called "Dirty Sanchez". Try explaining that to a young geocacher.

[+fuzziebear3]

There was a cache called "Dirty Sanchez". Try explaining that to a young geocacher.

 

Sure. I truly have no idea that there is anything illicit behind it. I would guess that it is hidden in the dirt. Or a little boy named Sanchez likes to play in the dirt. Or maybe its just nonsense. It could only be something nasty if you perceive it that way, and then the problem is on you.

[+narcissa]

There was a cache called "Dirty Sanchez". Try explaining that to a young geocacher.

 

Sure. I truly have no idea that there is anything illicit behind it. I would guess that it is hidden in the dirt. Or a little boy named Sanchez likes to play in the dirt. Or maybe its just nonsense. It could only be something nasty if you perceive it that way, and then the problem is on you.

 

Yeah, a young kid is only likely to know that it's some old-fashioned dirty term if you make a fuss about it. Has anybody earnestly used this term since 1988?

[+hzoi]

There was a cache called "Dirty Sanchez". Try explaining that to a young geocacher.

 

Sure. I truly have no idea that there is anything illicit behind it. I would guess that it is hidden in the dirt. Or a little boy named Sanchez likes to play in the dirt. Or maybe its just nonsense. It could only be something nasty if you perceive it that way, and then the problem is on you.

 

Yeah, a young kid is only likely to know that it's some old-fashioned dirty term if you make a fuss about it. Has anybody earnestly used this term since 1988?

 

Well, I'm sure as heck not going to (1) look for current examples from my office computer or (2) post them in the forums. But yes, it is most decidedly in circulation on the interwebs.

Edited October 21, 2016 by hzoi

[+colleda]

We've had a TV add for a store pop up recently. The store is called BCF (Boating Camping Fishing). The add has a catchy jingle that goes "Boating, Camping, effing fun"!

[+Tassie_Boy]

We've had a TV add for a store pop up recently. The store is called BCF (Boating Camping Fishing). The add has a catchy jingle that goes "Boating, Camping, effing fun"!

 

It's not quite that bad, it's "B C Fing fun"

[+usyoopers]

There was a cache called "Dirty Sanchez". Try explaining that to a young geocacher.

 

Sure. I truly have no idea that there is anything illicit behind it. I would guess that it is hidden in the dirt. Or a little boy named Sanchez likes to play in the dirt. Or maybe its just nonsense. It could only be something nasty if you perceive it that way, and then the problem is on you.

 

Yeah, a young kid is only likely to know that it's some old-fashioned dirty term if you make a fuss about it. Has anybody earnestly used this term since 1988?

 

Well, I'm sure as heck not going to (1) look for current examples from my office computer or (2) post them in the forums. But yes, it is most decidedly in circulation on the interwebs.

 

Had to look that one up myself..... goodness!

[+hzoi]

There was a cache called "Dirty Sanchez". Try explaining that to a young geocacher.

 

Sure. I truly have no idea that there is anything illicit behind it. I would guess that it is hidden in the dirt. Or a little boy named Sanchez likes to play in the dirt. Or maybe its just nonsense. It could only be something nasty if you perceive it that way, and then the problem is on you.

 

Yeah, a young kid is only likely to know that it's some old-fashioned dirty term if you make a fuss about it. Has anybody earnestly used this term since 1988?

 

Well, I'm sure as heck not going to (1) look for current examples from my office computer or (2) post them in the forums. But yes, it is most decidedly in circulation on the interwebs.

 

Had to look that one up myself..... goodness!

If you think that's bad, several years ago, a certain former Republican Senator from Pennsylvania (and 2-time Presidential candidate) got his last name re-purposed due to his stance on gay rights issues. I'll let you decide if you want to look it up.

 

edit to add: but we're getting adrift of the original topic here, so I'll stop digressing.

Edited October 25, 2016 by hzoi

[+Gill & Tony]

We've had a TV add for a store pop up recently. The store is called BCF (Boating Camping Fishing). The add has a catchy jingle that goes "Boating, Camping, effing fun"!

 

It's not quite that bad, it's "B C Fing fun"

And the Toyota Hilux advert from a few years ago, in which one word, probably obscene in the US but common in Oz, was repeated several times.

 

Plus Paul Hogan's "Where the .... .... are you?" advert.

[+Tassie_Boy]

We've had a TV add for a store pop up recently. The store is called BCF (Boating Camping Fishing). The add has a catchy jingle that goes "Boating, Camping, effing fun"!

 

It's not quite that bad, it's "B C Fing fun"

And the Toyota Hilux advert from a few years ago, in which one word, probably obscene in the US but common in Oz, was repeated several times.

 

Plus Paul Hogan's "Where the .... .... are you?" advert.

 

Definitely a regional thing, especially when you look at some of the words censored on these forums.

 

Completely relevant to the topic at hand...

 

F..k is no longer obscene

 

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/court-finds-f-fred-nile-not-offensive-language-at-marriage-equality-rally-20161025-gs9ymc.html

[+colleda]

OK. Is it possible that possibly offensive words (to some) may not be included in predictive text. I was sending a text (from W8 Nokia Lumia) today and started to type the word nipples. As I typed each letter possible words were eliminated until there were none left. No nipples in its dictionary. BTW I was texting a friend about my MTB spokes.

[+colleda]

We've had a TV add for a store pop up recently. The store is called BCF (Boating Camping Fishing). The add has a catchy jingle that goes "Boating, Camping, effing fun"!

 

It's not quite that bad, it's "B C Fing fun"

And the Toyota Hilux advert from a few years ago, in which one word, probably obscene in the US but common in Oz, was repeated several times.

 

Plus Paul Hogan's "Where the .... .... are you?" advert.

 

Definitely a regional thing, especially when you look at some of the words censored on these forums.

 

Completely relevant to the topic at hand...

 

F..k is no longer obscene

 

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/court-finds-f-fred-nile-not-offensive-language-at-marriage-equality-rally-20161025-gs9ymc.html

 

I agree it is no longer obscene in many situations, for example chatting among blokes or peers, but I find it very irritating when it is used consantly as it interupts the flow of dialog. Some people could get their message across in half the time by leaving out the expletives.

[+wmpastor]

There was a cache called "Dirty Sanchez". Try explaining that to a young geocacher.

 

Sure. I truly have no idea that there is anything illicit behind it. I would guess that it is hidden in the dirt. Or a little boy named Sanchez likes to play in the dirt. Or maybe its just nonsense. It could only be something nasty if you perceive it that way, and then the problem is on you.

 

Yeah, a young kid is only likely to know that it's some old-fashioned dirty term if you make a fuss about it. Has anybody earnestly used this term since 1988?

 

Well, I'm sure as heck not going to (1) look for current examples from my office computer or (2) post them in the forums. But yes, it is most decidedly in circulation on the interwebs.

 

Had to look that one up myself..... goodness!

 

I'm still trying to figure out the 1988 reference. Was there a cultural sea-change then (that I missed)? Did a foul-mouthed comic leave the scene? Is it a random year representing the approximate start of new and different off-color lingo? Or is it that post-1988 the term is no longer used "earnestly"??

 

[+Rebore]

There was a cache called "Dirty Sanchez". Try explaining that to a young geocacher.

 

Sure. I truly have no idea that there is anything illicit behind it. I would guess that it is hidden in the dirt. Or a little boy named Sanchez likes to play in the dirt. Or maybe its just nonsense. It could only be something nasty if you perceive it that way, and then the problem is on you.

 

Yeah, a young kid is only likely to know that it's some old-fashioned dirty term if you make a fuss about it. Has anybody earnestly used this term since 1988?

 

Well, I'm sure as heck not going to (1) look for current examples from my office computer or (2) post them in the forums. But yes, it is most decidedly in circulation on the interwebs.

 

Had to look that one up myself..... goodness!

 

I'm still trying to figure out the 1988 reference. Was there a cultural sea-change then (that I missed)? Did a foul-mouthed comic leave the scene? Is it a random year representing the approximate start of new and different off-color lingo? Or is it that post-1988 the term is no longer used "earnestly"??

 

 

Well I found that innocent pic regarding 1988:

 

[+searchjaunt]

Isn't censorship casu quo puritan moralism exaggerated in the context of geocaching?

The guidelines set by Groundspeak and the common sense judgement by the reviewer concerning this matter are i.m.o. clear enough, thus no need for extra (hypocritical political correct) policing.