Rhode Island Star Geo-Art

[+edexter]

I see that the latest power trail craze has arrived in the area. Instead of finding an interesting location in which to place a cache, recording the location and then publishing it, these "geo art designs" involve drawing a shape on a map, calculating the coordinates and then "linking" these meaningless coordinates to an actual series of physical caches along roads or trails by a series of "puzzles" (in this case mulitiple choice questions). First "identical" caches in a row along the road; now pretend caches to create a "virtual design" on a map. I'm sure it will be very popular for some reason...

 

and soon we can look forward to this....

Edited June 5, 2015 by edexter

[+GeoTrekker26]

With more to come. The Star, created by a sock puppet, has this quote in the description: "To honor Rhode Island’s 225th anniversary of statehood, the Rhode Island Star is presented as a part of "Stars Across America," which is an effort to have a geoart star placed in each of the fifty states."

 

Effort by whom? Why? (I hope Colorado isn't on the list!) As much as I personally do not care for challenge caches, perhaps the temporary-for-one-year ban should be lifted on them and placed on "geoart" instead.

[+cerberus1]

Around for some time now, one's kinda close by me.

I think it's silly, but some seem to like it (for the numbers I guess).

- But what bug report or feature are you discussing?

[+GeoTrekker26]

Since this has nothing to do with bug reports nor site features, and there is an attempt to replicate one of the designs in all states, this thread probably should be moved to the general geocaching topic.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

I came across in interesting piece of geo-art the other day. It made up entirely from Wherigo caches. From what I could tell, like geo-art created using puzzle caches, the published waypoint (used to create the art) had nothing to do with the actual location of the cache. In this case, the first location of the cartridge for each cache was not at the published coordinates either. With puzzle caches the final coordinates are supposed to be within 2 miles of the published coordinates. I did some poking around and couldn't find anything which stipulated how far the cache or any of it's stages had to be from the published coordinates. I had assumed that the published coordinates were supposed to be the location of first location in cartridge. Does this mean I could place 50 Wherigo caches in my town, but have published coordinates in each 50 different states? Do all my Wherigo caches and collect 50 souvenirs.

 

 

[Keystone]

As there's no website bug or feature request raised in the OP, I am moving this thread from the Geocaching.com Web Site forum to the Geocaching Topics forum.

[+Adventure.AS]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but if these geo "art" projects use "Puzzle" as the cache type, once you solve each of the puzzles doesn't the "art" disappear from map and the smilie appears at the actual cache location?

Edited June 6, 2015 by Nonsuch30

[+Pork King]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but if these geo "art" projects use "Puzzle" as the cache type, once you solve each of the puzzles doesn't the "art" disappear from map and the smilie appears at the actual cache location?

 

I think that only happens if you enter the "solved" coordinates in the cache page.

 

I just went back and tried this... If you edit the coordinates on a puzzle cache to show the solved coordinates, the new location shows up on the cache page map, but the smiley stays in it's original location on the main geocache map.

Edited June 6, 2015 by Pork King

[knowschad]

Geo"Art" created using mystery hides...

[+Castle Mischief]

Geo"Art" created using mystery hides...

 

I see your and raise you one .

[+coachstahly]

I came across in interesting piece of geo-art the other day. It made up entirely from Wherigo caches. From what I could tell, like geo-art created using puzzle caches, the published waypoint (used to create the art) had nothing to do with the actual location of the cache. In this case, the first location of the cartridge for each cache was not at the published coordinates either. With puzzle caches the final coordinates are supposed to be within 2 miles of the published coordinates. I did some poking around and couldn't find anything which stipulated how far the cache or any of it's stages had to be from the published coordinates. I had assumed that the published coordinates were supposed to be the location of first location in cartridge. Does this mean I could place 50 Wherigo caches in my town, but have published coordinates in each 50 different states? Do all my Wherigo caches and collect 50 souvenirs.

Conceivably you could do it this way, using the play anywhere feature of Wherigo, but I don't know if you could sell it to the reviewers! Maintenance would be interesting, to say the least!

[+Isonzo Karst]

With more to come. The Star, created by a sock puppet, has this quote in the description: "To honor Rhode Island’s 225th anniversary of statehood, the Rhode Island Star is presented as a part of "Stars Across America," which is an effort to have a geoart star placed in each of the fifty states."

 

Effort by whom? Why? (I hope Colorado isn't on the list!) As much as I personally do not care for challenge caches, perhaps the temporary-for-one-year ban should be lifted on them and placed on "geoart" instead.

 

Colorado's star was done a while back.

https://www.geocaching.com/map/default.aspx?lat=40.87897&lng=-104.56828#?ll=40.87897,-104.56828&z=14

[+fizzymagic]

If the puzzles were interesting it would be a great thing. However, most of the time the puzzles are in name only; they are trivial, mindless, and tedious.

[+AustinMN]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

[+QuiltinNana]

If the puzzles were interesting it would be a great thing. However, most of the time the puzzles are in name only; they are trivial, mindless, and tedious.

We have done a few of the geoart in PA. One involves 63 questions all about the history of the Pittsburgh Pirates, they were quite interesting and took quite awhile to get all the correct answers. This one gives you the shape of the Pirates "P".

The second was all about the Jeep, which was originally developed in Butler, PA. I think it was 93 or 94 caches and all the questions were interesting and again were something that took time to solve. This one made the shape of a Jeep. The actual hides were varied.

We also did the PA state star and what I enjoyed about this series, was that the hides were extremely varied, in size and style.

[knowschad]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

 

No, not at all. And it isn't new. The recently archived Colorado Geo"Art" was also made up of mystery caches. The point isn't that "it must be wrong". The point is that it is a no-brainer to make a picture of something when you can make up the coordinates to be whatever you need them to be in order to make your picture. Now, the old steam locomotive geoArt... that, as I recall, was all or mostly all regular caches, and placed in very hilly terrain at that. THAT got my respect. This does not. This has all the creativity of playing Chopin on a player piano.

[jholly]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

 

No, not at all. And it isn't new. The recently archived Colorado Geo"Art" was also made up of mystery caches. The point isn't that "it must be wrong". The point is that it is a no-brainer to make a picture of something when you can make up the coordinates to be whatever you need them to be in order to make your picture. Now, the old steam locomotive geoArt... that, as I recall, was all or mostly all regular caches, and placed in very hilly terrain at that. THAT got my respect. This does not. This has all the creativity of playing Chopin on a player piano.

You would probably like the thunderbird. Mostly traditions but a nice mix Wherigo's, letterboxes and multis. It's near the train.

Edited June 6, 2015 by jholly

[+Wet Pancake Touring Club]

WSU logo outside of Pullman, WA. At least there, the containers were all along the Bill Chipman rail-trail, and you had to walk or bike. However, the answer to every two-choice question was always A. The coords for answer B were all the same, and took you to the WSU football stadium.

 

Skye.

[knowschad]

WSU logo outside of Pullman, WA. At least there, the containers were all along the Bill Chipman rail-trail, and you had to walk or bike. However, the answer to every two-choice question was always A. The coords for answer B were all the same, and took you to the WSU football stadium.

 

Skye.

 

Too tough for me. Maybe somebody can come up with a GSAK macro that will pick A every time.

[knowschad]

I'm thinking about creating a geo-Art series of a straight line. Wouldn't that be cool?

[+GeoTrekker26]

I'm thinking about creating a geo-Art series of a straight line. Wouldn't that be cool?

 

I'd vote for a point.

[+lamoracke]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

 

No, not at all. And it isn't new. The recently archived Colorado Geo"Art" was also made up of mystery caches. The point isn't that "it must be wrong". The point is that it is a no-brainer to make a picture of something when you can make up the coordinates to be whatever you need them to be in order to make your picture. Now, the old steam locomotive geoArt... that, as I recall, was all or mostly all regular caches, and placed in very hilly terrain at that. THAT got my respect. This does not. This has all the creativity of playing Chopin on a player piano.

You would probably like the thunderbird. Mostly traditions but a nice mix Wherigo's, letterboxes and multis. It's near the train.

 

I like the art, but the Wherigo was basically an ethics test questionnaire based on the philosophies of a certain group. Not my favorite kind of Wherigo am sorry to say.

[+Path Pacer]

I don't think Colorado's all that keen on geo-art at the moment. We got burned pretty badly recently, even had death threats.

[JASTA 11]

Another power trail of uninspired hides that make a virtual geometric shape on a map, published under a sock-puppet account.

 

Oh boy!

 

(Squeezing fifty-one more listings into the ignore list)

[+Cankid]

Geoart isn't as big in Australia although there are still a few around. There are a few basic ones (like love hearts made out of puzzles) but there are also some really great Traditional cache geoart. One was published close to home recently, a large kangaroo. Puzzles are only used where forestry operations are occurring. You can only walk the trail and while it can be done over 25 km walking straight between each cache, is more realistically done on the trails for a 75 km route which takes 3 days. There is some real elevation changes in there. Some serious effort was put into this one...

 

 

(Yes, there is a star as well which is a separate geoart)

[+NYPaddleCacher]

I came across in interesting piece of geo-art the other day. It made up entirely from Wherigo caches. From what I could tell, like geo-art created using puzzle caches, the published waypoint (used to create the art) had nothing to do with the actual location of the cache. In this case, the first location of the cartridge for each cache was not at the published coordinates either. With puzzle caches the final coordinates are supposed to be within 2 miles of the published coordinates. I did some poking around and couldn't find anything which stipulated how far the cache or any of it's stages had to be from the published coordinates. I had assumed that the published coordinates were supposed to be the location of first location in cartridge. Does this mean I could place 50 Wherigo caches in my town, but have published coordinates in each 50 different states? Do all my Wherigo caches and collect 50 souvenirs.

Conceivably you could do it this way, using the play anywhere feature of Wherigo, but I don't know if you could sell it to the reviewers! Maintenance would be interesting, to say the least!

 

How would that be a maintenance issue? The physical stages for all 50 wherigos could be in the same area where there could be maintained. I didn't see anything in the guidelines which indications that the published coordinates had to be anywhere near the first stage of a Wherigo.

 

 

[+NYPaddleCacher]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

 

I'm not saying it's wrong, but geo-art made up of puzzle can have a negative impact on those that are not interested in doing them. A potential cache owner that wants to place a cache within 2 miles of the art has to solve all the puzzles (even if they don't find the caches) in order to determine if there are proximity issues for a cache they want to place.

[+edexter]

One perspective is that everyone caches for a different reason. If the reason you cache is to get to an interesting location by an interesting route only a small number of caches are going to be appealing. Puzzle geoart appears to "confuse" the map with reality: the design exists only on the map, and is imposed on the physical world: shape on the map matters much more than the physical setting . The cache goes where the coords say it should. Your route does not trace a similar path in the real world and the aesthetic seems highly abstract. While some of the doodles are cool (the kangaroo made primarily of caches at the actual locations, for instance), they seem to be power trails that disguise their shape. Not that there's anything wrong with that...

[+KatnissRue]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

 

No, not at all. And it isn't new. The recently archived Colorado Geo"Art" was also made up of mystery caches. The point isn't that "it must be wrong". The point is that it is a no-brainer to make a picture of something when you can make up the coordinates to be whatever you need them to be in order to make your picture. Now, the old steam locomotive geoArt... that, as I recall, was all or mostly all regular caches, and placed in very hilly terrain at that. THAT got my respect. This does not. This has all the creativity of playing Chopin on a player piano.

How is this one? https://www.geocaching.com/map/default.aspx#?ll=38.77456,-97.07983&z=12

[+cerberus1]

Puzzle geoart appears to "confuse" the map with reality: the design exists only on the map...

+1

We just looked at a couple that though still there, by the map are no longer visable as "art".

Caches have been placed on all the trails surrounding and through the "art", and it now looks like every-other numbers area on the map.

[knowschad]

Geoart isn't as big in Australia although there are still a few around. There are a few basic ones (like love hearts made out of puzzles) but there are also some really great Traditional cache geoart. One was published close to home recently, a large kangaroo. Puzzles are only used where forestry operations are occurring. You can only walk the trail and while it can be done over 25 km walking straight between each cache, is more realistically done on the trails for a 75 km route which takes 3 days. There is some real elevation changes in there. Some serious effort was put into this one...

 

 

(Yes, there is a star as well which is a separate geoart)

 

Now, that's what I'm talking about. Takes some real skill and planning to create something like that.

 

Now, what *would* be cool, I think, would be a geoArt that was a shape at both levels... maybe the unsolved, puzzle-cache "art" was, say, a circle, while the solved caches formed, say... a square. (simplified example). Or, a kangaroo as the unsolved portion that turned into a platypus once solved.

 

Edit: Or a frownie-face that turned into a smiley face when solved!

Edited June 7, 2015 by knowschad

[+narcissa]

I see that the latest power trail craze has arrived in the area. Instead of finding an interesting location in which to place a cache, recording the location and then publishing it, these "geo art designs" involve drawing a shape on a map, calculating the coordinates and then "linking" these meaningless coordinates to an actual series of physical caches along roads or trails by a series of "puzzles" (in this case mulitiple choice questions). First "identical" caches in a row along the road; now pretend caches to create a "virtual design" on a map. I'm sure it will be very popular for some reason...

 

Sorry to hear that.

 

I believe that the best way to combat this kind of thing is to set a good example by placing more of the caches you like finding, and by finding more of them as well.

 

On good caches (i.e. the caches that you like), leave detailed logs, add photos, give favourite points, and take any opportunity to mention what a great experience it was to find them (this is especially important with new cachers who are easily turned off from the game by these boring series - help them know where to find good ones).

 

Ignore the junk caches. Don't badmouth them, just ignore them. If you go on a cache outing to an area that has these caches, avoid them and spend your time on the good ones. If someone invites you on an outing to find them, politely decline or suggest a better cache outing. All you need to say is "That type of geocaching isn't really for me."

[+wimseyguy]

Geo"Art" created using mystery hides...

 

I see your and raise you one .

 

I've been calling these geo-graffiti for a while. Geo-art uses icons where you actually find caches at those waypoints.

Edited June 8, 2015 by wimseyguy

[+briansnat]

If the puzzles were interesting it would be a great thing. However, most of the time the puzzles are in name only; they are trivial, mindless, and tedious.

 

They are not tedious at all, in fact you don't even need to solve most. People readily pass out the solutions to geoart puzzles so the power cachers don't even need to bother with the solving step

[+AustinMN]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

 

No, not at all. And it isn't new. The recently archived Colorado Geo"Art" was also made up of mystery caches. The point isn't that "it must be wrong". The point is that it is a no-brainer to make a picture of something when you can make up the coordinates to be whatever you need them to be in order to make your picture. Now, the old steam locomotive geoArt... that, as I recall, was all or mostly all regular caches, and placed in very hilly terrain at that. THAT got my respect. This does not. This has all the creativity of playing Chopin on a player piano.

 

Read your own post. Think about what you are really saying. It comes down to "I don't like it." So what? I don't like it, but I don't complain about it. The only reason to make a stink about things you don't like is because you think it is wrong or should be changed. The fact that there are things that are more creative or more interesting is totally irrelevant. You (or the OP) could have posted "hey this geo-art of traditional caches deep in the mountians is really cool." Instead, he decided a complaint about something that is not wrong and is not bad and is not harmful to anyone. Am I going to chase these? No. Am I going to complain about them? No.

[+Walts Hunting]

If the puzzles were interesting it would be a great thing. However, most of the time the puzzles are in name only; they are trivial, mindless, and tedious.

 

They are not tedious at all, in fact you don't even need to solve most. People readily pass out the solutions to geoart puzzles so the power cachers don't even need to bother with the solving step

 

Plus some aren't really that difficult. There is one outside Yuma done by the local group that is S*W*A*G. Forget how many but the solution was add .001 to the latitude so in fact you didn't really have to solve them at all just wonder in a northerly direction. I did part of it on foot and had a nice several mile hike. The power trails I do I do on foot of bike since i enjoy the exercise. The whole vehicle thing I tried once and after an hour quit. To boring.

 

Hiking or biking in the sand is way more fun.

[+AustinMN]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

 

I'm not saying it's wrong, but geo-art made up of puzzle can have a negative impact on those that are not interested in doing them. A potential cache owner that wants to place a cache within 2 miles of the art has to solve all the puzzles (even if they don't find the caches) in order to determine if there are proximity issues for a cache they want to place.

 

Nonsense.

 

Reviewers will check coordinates for a new cache before publication...as long as you ask them to.

Edited June 8, 2015 by AustinMN

[+edexter]

"Nonsense.

 

Reviewers will check coordinates for a new cache before publication...as long as you ask them to."

 

Really? They will tell you if it's "too close" to another cache, but they won't tell you where a puzzle cache is located. The same issue comes up with multi-cache stages...You need to know where things are before you head out to place a cache and 51 puzzles in a small area make that problematic. With a power trail of physical caches you can tell where the .1m limits are, but with "geoart" can't tell actual locations unless you solve all the "puzzles"

Edited June 8, 2015 by edexter

[+NYPaddleCacher]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

 

I'm not saying it's wrong, but geo-art made up of puzzle can have a negative impact on those that are not interested in doing them. A potential cache owner that wants to place a cache within 2 miles of the art has to solve all the puzzles (even if they don't find the caches) in order to determine if there are proximity issues for a cache they want to place.

 

Nonsense.

 

Reviewers will check coordinates for a new cache before publication...as long as you ask them to.

 

That still creates a burden on cache owner and reviewers. The reviewer will only give you a yes/no answer and maybe the general direction to try.

 

A while back a someone local cache said that he was considering creating a geo-art in my area with the artwork located in the lake next to the town I live in. A two mile radius would pretty much cover most of that town, thus anyone considering placing a cache in town would either have to solve the puzzle for most of the caches in the artwork or contact their reviewer to determine if there are proximity issues caused by the art work.

 

 

[knowschad]

Once again someone discovers that some cachers are doing something different, and therefore it must be wrong.

 

No, not at all. And it isn't new. The recently archived Colorado Geo"Art" was also made up of mystery caches. The point isn't that "it must be wrong". The point is that it is a no-brainer to make a picture of something when you can make up the coordinates to be whatever you need them to be in order to make your picture. Now, the old steam locomotive geoArt... that, as I recall, was all or mostly all regular caches, and placed in very hilly terrain at that. THAT got my respect. This does not. This has all the creativity of playing Chopin on a player piano.

 

Read your own post. Think about what you are really saying. It comes down to "I don't like it." So what? I don't like it, but I don't complain about it. The only reason to make a stink about things you don't like is because you think it is wrong or should be changed. The fact that there are things that are more creative or more interesting is totally irrelevant. You (or the OP) could have posted "hey this geo-art of traditional caches deep in the mountians is really cool." Instead, he decided a complaint about something that is not wrong and is not bad and is not harmful to anyone. Am I going to chase these? No. Am I going to complain about them? No.

 

Please don't be telling me to read my own post and to think about what I am really saying, OK? I wrote it, and I know exactly what I said.

[+edexter]

I've been caching in Florida for a while, and power trails and geo-art abound. Taking it one step further, the fake coordinates are now linked to fake puzzles: while listed as a "?" cache, to get the coordinates you answer a true false question of a two choice "multiple choice" question with everything linked to an answer key geo-checker. As always the shapes have nothing to do with the actual cache layout which follows the road. As an added insult they are rated as t2.5 and somethings higher though they are all 50 foot or less P&Gs to identical cache containers. I have no interest in doing any of these map doodles but in order to place an individual cache anywhere in the area you need to solve all the fake puzzles beforehand or else risk violating the "too close" rule. I think it's time to "suspend" the power trail drawings before the entire map is tattooed.

edexter

[+Team Hugs]

The 50 State Star project is organizing stars like this in many states. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/nearest.aspx?u=50+State+Star

 

I did the Michigan star last September (centerpoint here: http://coord.info/GC4WG16). The Michigan star is situated along five miles of a ten-mile "rails-to-trails" trailway. It's not exactly a "power trail"; the trail is non-motorized and has few entry points, so you've got to do the trail by bicycle or on foot. (The other five miles of the trail also hosts a bunch of caches ... not exactly a "power trail", but still a lot of caches for those hiking the trail.)

 

I had a fantastic time doing the trail, and then running around for some P&Gs later to hit my statistical goals for the day. I'd recommend the trail to anyone --- even the most cynical of cachers --- anytime.