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angelsfan33

Cops called on on me while hiking with daughter!

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I hope your dd is feeling less anxious
Maybe your DD was frowning at the bones
What does DD or dd mean? The obvious answer doesn't really fit the context.

It's internet shorthand for "dear daughter." "DH" is "dear hubby", not "designated hitter" despite what the guy in the next cube running 3 fantasy baseball leagues might tell you.

I consider myself to be tech savey, but have never heard either of those. Maybe it is a face book thing. (I am anti facebook. Speaking of dangerous...face book anyone?)

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I hope your dd is feeling less anxious
Maybe your DD was frowning at the bones
What does DD or dd mean? The obvious answer doesn't really fit the context.

Dearest Daughter. It's one of the more annoying forumisms, in my opinion. Edited by sbell111

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I hope your dd is feeling less anxious
Maybe your DD was frowning at the bones
What does DD or dd mean? The obvious answer doesn't really fit the context.

It's internet shorthand for "dear daughter." "DH" is "dear hubby", not "designated hitter" despite what the guy in the next cube running 3 fantasy baseball leagues might tell you.

I consider myself to be tech savey, but have never heard either of those. Maybe it is a face book thing. (I am anti facebook. Speaking of dangerous...face book anyone?)

It predates Facebook by a very wide margin. Like sbell, I find it annoying, and fortunately for me it's not used commonly on any forum I frequent.

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FYI: Alkhalikoi is a police officer.

 

Just to clarify: I'm an attorney, not an LEO, but I've dealt with some of this stuff in my career that I think I'm not far off the mark.

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FYI: Alkhalikoi is a police officer.

 

Just to clarify: I'm an attorney, not an LEO, but I've dealt with some of this stuff in my career that I think I'm not far off the mark.

Whoops... that's right. My mistake.

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From the OP

 

then am walking my daughter to the truck to head home and another police car drives by very slow looking at us.

Read the call log and the op carefully.

 

The description of the truck and license plate number were not called in until after they left. The police officer in the vehicle may have looked at them but at the moment had no way of knowing they were the 2 the police were searching for. You gotta assume the police still thought the people they were looking for were on the trail.

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From the OP

 

then am walking my daughter to the truck to head home and another police car drives by very slow looking at us.

Read the call log and the op carefully.

 

The description of the truck and license plate number were not called in until after they left. The police officer in the vehicle may have looked at them but at the moment had no way of knowing they were the 2 the police were searching for. You gotta assume the police still thought the people they were looking for were on the trail.

They had a pretty good description. They just had no RAS.

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From the OP

 

then am walking my daughter to the truck to head home and another police car drives by very slow looking at us.

Read the call log and the op carefully.

 

The description of the truck and license plate number were not called in until after they left. The police officer in the vehicle may have looked at them but at the moment had no way of knowing they were the 2 the police were searching for. You gotta assume the police still thought the people they were looking for were on the trail.

 

So, father and daughter looked suspicious to the couple that called it in, but not to the police driving by, and yet the police went to their home and questioned both father and daughter based on the couple's suspicions, despite the fact that the trained observers spotted nothing out of the ordinary. Remember, license plate number was irrelevant at this time, since the OP had not yet reached their vehicle anyway.

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I'd like to see this law. No offense but until I see it, I am going to doubt that such a blatantly unconstitutional law exists.

 

Social workers do interview suspected child abuse victims at their schools. Is that unconstitutional? We may find out soon:

 

 

Ok, but that's got nothing to do with students "must" answer police questions.

Really?

 

You think an eight year old being interviewed by a police officer and a social worker in her school's principal's office is going to refuse to answer questions?

 

Really?

Whether a student refuses or not has nothing to do with MUST answer. Again, I'd like to see a law that a student must answer police questions.

There doesn't need to be a law.

If it's legal for the questioning to take place, there is, in effect, a law requiring her to answer.

 

No there is no law that compels a student to answer LE questions. Show it to me. There is "in effect" no such law. Simply because a police officer can ask a question doesn't mean anyone is "in effect" obliged to answer.

I'll type slower. Try to get it this time.

 

You are correct. There is no law that compels a student to answer these questions.

 

That is irrelevant. The law allows authority figures to question children at school without the presence of a parent, or anyone who is advocating for the child. A child does not have the capacity to understand her rights, and will answer, even though the law does not compel it. In the absence of a law that prohibits the questioning, there might as well be a law that compels a student to answer.

 

The end result is the same.

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It's never going to cross her mind to refuse; everything in her young life has conditioned her to respond when confronted by authority symbols.

That's a question of how she was taught by her parents, isn't it?

 

If it's legal for the questioning to take place, there is, in effect, a law requiring her to answer.
So you're going to ignore Miranda rights and the 5th Amendment?

 

 

Children in school don't have Miranda rights, according to the supreme court.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/opinionla/la-ed-miranda-20110329,0,5661437.story

 

Also, Miranda only applies once a person is under arrest. A child, being questioned about potential abuse by her parent, does not have Miranda rights.

 

I ask again -- what eight year old, being questioned at school in the presence of several authority figures, is going to refuse to answer? If you are going to allow the questioning, whether the child can be forced to answer or not is a moot point. The child will answer the questions.

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It's never going to cross her mind to refuse; everything in her young life has conditioned her to respond when confronted by authority symbols.

That's a question of how she was taught by her parents, isn't it?

 

If it's legal for the questioning to take place, there is, in effect, a law requiring her to answer.
So you're going to ignore Miranda rights and the 5th Amendment?

 

 

Children in school don't have Miranda rights, according to the supreme court.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/opinionla/la-ed-miranda-20110329,0,5661437.story

 

Also, Miranda only applies once a person is under arrest. A child, being questioned about potential abuse by her parent, does not have Miranda rights.

 

I ask again -- what eight year old, being questioned at school in the presence of several authority figures, is going to refuse to answer? If you are going to allow the questioning, whether the child can be forced to answer or not is a moot point. The child will answer the questions.

 

Maybe your child would. Where's the law that says students MUST answer?

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I then look over and see the couple standing behind some trees on the trail with their dog watching us? I didn't really give it any thought at that time. I then started to think they were acting very suspicious after about 2 minutes, and I started to think they must think WE are up to something. They then come out into the open in the clearing and walk around slowly at a distance with the dog about 100 feet from us. They then go back and go down the trail out of sight. I didn't give it another thought.

 

This is where your mistake was. I wouldn't have given these idiots time to call on me before they would have been doing the "wow that hood is hot" two handed tap slap on the local PD's car. Moron's wanna skulk around peeping on me and my kid, they are gonna hate it.

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Maybe your child would. Where's the law that says students MUST answer?

Again... he is NOT saying that! You two are basically agreeing with that. Argue with the Texan that said that in the first place (TXHooligans) Edited by knowschad

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It's never going to cross her mind to refuse; everything in her young life has conditioned her to respond when confronted by authority symbols.

That's a question of how she was taught by her parents, isn't it?

 

If it's legal for the questioning to take place, there is, in effect, a law requiring her to answer.
So you're going to ignore Miranda rights and the 5th Amendment?

 

 

Children in school don't have Miranda rights, according to the supreme court.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/opinionla/la-ed-miranda-20110329,0,5661437.story

 

Also, Miranda only applies once a person is under arrest. A child, being questioned about potential abuse by her parent, does not have Miranda rights.

 

I ask again -- what eight year old, being questioned at school in the presence of several authority figures, is going to refuse to answer? If you are going to allow the questioning, whether the child can be forced to answer or not is a moot point. The child will answer the questions.

 

Maybe your child would. Where's the law that says students MUST answer?

 

pulling-my-hair-out.gif

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The law allows authority figures to question children at school without the presence of a parent, or anyone who is advocating for the child. A child does not have the capacity to understand her rights, and will answer, even though the law does not compel it. In the absence of a law that prohibits the questioning, there might as well be a law that compels a student to answer.

 

The end result is the same.

The end result being flawed and misinterpreted answers being given by a frightened 8 year old who doesn't understand what she's being asked, with no one there to protect her or her guardians from leading questions.

 

The absence of a law prohibiting an act does not translate to a requirement that the act be performed.

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So, father and daughter looked suspicious to the couple that called it in, but not to the police driving by, and yet the police went to their home and questioned both father and daughter based on the couple's suspicions, despite the fact that the trained observers spotted nothing out of the ordinary. Remember, license plate number was irrelevant at this time, since the OP had not yet reached their vehicle anyway.

Actually, looking at the call log (have to read it in reverse order), the plate was called in after the op left.

 

But I agree with EagleRiver that the description they had was enough to stop him there rather than waiting until he got home. I just reread it and a little girl in all pink is going to be pretty easy to spot.

 

What puzzles me is why someone suspecting murder or molestation or whatever was going through their heads would just walk on past you and let you out of their sight. If they were that concerned, they should have continued to huddle cowardly behind the tree until the police showed up. At least then they would know you couldn't do anything to the little girl with you. What good is it to call the police because you think something might happen if you are going to then give the person an opportunity to do whatever you think they were going to do.

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The law allows authority figures to question children at school without the presence of a parent, or anyone who is advocating for the child. A child does not have the capacity to understand her rights, and will answer, even though the law does not compel it. In the absence of a law that prohibits the questioning, there might as well be a law that compels a student to answer.

 

The end result is the same.

The end result being flawed and misinterpreted answers being given by a frightened 8 year old who doesn't understand what she's being asked, with no one there to protect her or her guardians from leading questions.

 

The absence of a law prohibiting an act does not translate to a requirement that the act be performed.

But it happens, all the time.

 

In the OP's case, he allowed the police to talk to his daughter out of his presence. It appears that she said the right things, and they are done.

 

If he had NOT allowed them to talk to her, she would probably have been visited at school the next day by a social worker. And there's not a thing anyone could do to stop that.

 

I'm not saying it's right, I'm not saying it's wrong. I don't want to hear about Miranda, or children being taught to demand their rights. I'm just saying that this is what happens in the real world.

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If I was in that park and happened to see that same couple there I might be tempted to call the police to report potential prostitution activity in progress. After all, a man and a woman together in a park... mighty suspicious. I wonder how they would enjoy the experience of being questioned by police.

 

But maybe it would be more productive to tell them that they were completely wrong and that the incident caused some distress.

Edited by sdarken

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If I was in that park and happened to see that same couple there I might be tempted to call the police to report potential prostitution activity in progress. After all, a man and a woman together in a park... mighty suspicious. I wonder how they would enjoy the experience of being questioned by police.

 

But maybe it would be more productive to tell them that they were completely wrong and that the incident caused some distress.

 

They obviously were anarchists, since their dog appears to have been off leash in clear violation of the law.

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This a bummer that this has happened to you a your daughter. I have a 7 yr old daughter that has been caching since she was 4. She LOVES to go hiking and boulder hopping. I don't think I've ever had anyone look at me wierd when it's just two of us caching.

 

I wouldn't mind the police coming to ask questions and following up on the report by the two paranoid people in the park. I'm on the side that the police would NEVER question my daughter without someone there as a witness.

 

Hope you don't let this get you down. Maybe get a shirt that says, "This is my daughter and we are GEOCACHING." for the next time your in that area. :laughing: On a good note, the police already know that your not a bad person and where you live, so when they run your plates again they will know your o.k. :)

 

Get back out there and have some fun geocaching with your daughter.

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A couple years ago, I was walking along a very popular path on a weekend and came upon a 6ish-year-old girl. She was alone, apparently lost, and crying loudly. Dozens of people walked by. I knelt beside her, calmed her a bit, and tried to figure out the situation.

 

Before too long, her parents came running up, grabbed her, glared at me, and led her away. I guess I should be thankful that they didn't call the police.

I would be conflicted in that situation. On the one hand, a crying, lost girl should get help finding her family.

 

On the other hand, she is in no immediate danger and I do not want to appear like a child abductor. That is what those dozens of people were thinking as they walked on by.

 

I wonder if this is an American problem. I think other cultures are more trusting.

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A couple years ago, I was walking along a very popular path on a weekend and came upon a 6ish-year-old girl. She was alone, apparently lost, and crying loudly. Dozens of people walked by. I knelt beside her, calmed her a bit, and tried to figure out the situation.

 

Before too long, her parents came running up, grabbed her, glared at me, and led her away. I guess I should be thankful that they didn't call the police.

I would be conflicted in that situation. On the one hand, a crying, lost girl should get help finding her family.

 

On the other hand, she is in no immediate danger and I do not want to appear like a child abductor. That is what those dozens of people were thinking as they walked on by.

 

I wonder if this is an American problem. I think other cultures are more trusting.

 

I've been in that situation where I'm trying to figure out what's going on with a lost kid a couple of times. One time, the parents were grateful and kind, the other time I got a glare. It bugged me for a while, but then I realized it was the parents who were embarrassed about losing their kid and are so mad at themselves they can't think straight and so project it onto whoever they can.

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A couple years ago, I was walking along a very popular path on a weekend and came upon a 6ish-year-old girl. She was alone, apparently lost, and crying loudly. Dozens of people walked by. I knelt beside her, calmed her a bit, and tried to figure out the situation.

 

Before too long, her parents came running up, grabbed her, glared at me, and led her away. I guess I should be thankful that they didn't call the police.

I would be conflicted in that situation. On the one hand, a crying, lost girl should get help finding her family.

 

On the other hand, she is in no immediate danger and I do not want to appear like a child abductor. That is what those dozens of people were thinking as they walked on by.

 

I wonder if this is an American problem. I think other cultures are more trusting.

This incident did occur in Minneapolis, Minnesota, while I was visiting family.

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A couple years ago, I was walking along a very popular path on a weekend and came upon a 6ish-year-old girl. She was alone, apparently lost, and crying loudly. Dozens of people walked by. I knelt beside her, calmed her a bit, and tried to figure out the situation.

 

Before too long, her parents came running up, grabbed her, glared at me, and led her away. I guess I should be thankful that they didn't call the police.

I would be conflicted in that situation. On the one hand, a crying, lost girl should get help finding her family.

 

On the other hand, she is in no immediate danger and I do not want to appear like a child abductor. That is what those dozens of people were thinking as they walked on by.

 

I wonder if this is an American problem. I think other cultures are more trusting.

This incident did occur in Minneapolis, Minnesota, while I was visiting family.

 

I had a similar thing happen once. I called a woman who was near by over explaining that I think that kid is lost and I am not comfortable approaching alone. I still got the dirty look. Damned if you do. Damned if you don't.

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As a female I don't have as much of an issue with the profiling thing. But I'm still cautious. I'll usually stand back away from the lone child and observe from a small distance instead of approach. Parents do odd things when they freak out.

 

On the other hand I was at Yellowstone last summer. It was stupid busy in the tourist areas like always. i was standing and waiting for a friend near the entrance to a trail. Some lady walked up to me started talking about having to run somewhere for a minute. I wasn't really listening because I didn't know her and the next thing I know this woman left her kids with me. Honest to goodness. Two young kids. Next thing I know some group of children and adults comes by, pauses and one of the kids was absorbed into that crowd and off he went. I had this moment of panic of do I leave this other kid alone to find the woman to say I lost one. Do I say anything? Am I going to be blamed if the child is picked up lost or wanders off the cliff? Who will be blamed? eventually the child came back with another parent and family was reunited and I vanished shortly after that.

 

But really I could be anyone. We've had kids get kidnapped here because parents just let them wander around town with no supervision. Kids have been molested here in stores and the community for the same reason. If no one is watching no one knows.

 

While I think the police were out of hand I think it's worth being vigilant. I wouldn't call the police on every man with a child but if something was sending off warning flags to me I would certainly say something.

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i could be mistaken abotu my placement of the word MUST.... This happened to a friend of mine, not to me.. but i did get the story first person..

 

either the kid must answer or you must let them ask the kid.. you aren't allowed to be present (if you are the possible offender of course)

 

in either case the MUST is very uncomfortable... just the idea that someone could question one of my kids about me... is just too unnerving to think about.

 

The case i mentioned just above went all the way to the grand jury and tossed out. all his savings went to defend and ramain bonded out of jail. the cops thought something was awry, social services said it was fine, but the cop still pressed it and he lost all that money fighting a stupid cop.. now he can't pass a background check to go on field trips with his church's youth group..

 

this all means that things can and do go horribly awry someitmes... you can defend yourself if you have an extra 100grand laying around to stay out of jail and employed and pay your attorney.

 

sorry to add to the horrible mess discussed in this thread..

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i also have to add.. if it is funny.. make the call or confront someone.. do something! strike up a conversation.. you might be instantly put at ease.. or have your fears confirmed.

 

remember in the news? i think elizabeth smart was led all over the place... no one said anything and looking back on it things werent' right.. (maybe i'm getting my news crossed a bit) at any rate, i'd rather be safe than sorry.

 

yes... cops can be over zelous.. that can and usually does suck. Most of them are great and do a good job.

 

I'm really sorry the OP had all the problems.. but he slept that night in the same house as his daughter.. shook up, but home. right where they should have been.

 

it's a tough situation..

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This is the reason I almost never look for caches in playgrounds anymore. As a 61-year-old single male, I just don't feel comfortable looking around and "acting suspicious" in an area like that.

 

Some women will just hit you on the head with a rock for being a lone male over 40.

 

A couple years ago, I was walking along a very popular path on a weekend and came upon a 6ish-year-old girl. She was alone, apparently lost, and crying loudly. Dozens of people walked by. I knelt beside her, calmed her a bit, and tried to figure out the situation.

 

Before too long, her parents came running up, grabbed her, glared at me, and led her away. I guess I should be thankful that they didn't call the police.

I would be conflicted in that situation. On the one hand, a crying, lost girl should get help finding her family.

 

On the other hand, she is in no immediate danger and I do not want to appear like a child abductor. That is what those dozens of people were thinking as they walked on by.

 

I wonder if this is an American problem. I think other cultures are more trusting.

 

I've been in that situation where I'm trying to figure out what's going on with a lost kid a couple of times. One time, the parents were grateful and kind, the other time I got a glare. It bugged me for a while, but then I realized it was the parents who were embarrassed about losing their kid and are so mad at themselves they can't think straight and so project it onto whoever they can.

 

Unfortunately in today's society, I would likely be one of those to give the kids a wide berth and keep walking. I would put a call in to the local police to pick up the kid.

I know that is a cold hearted response, and I would hope that someone would help me in that situation, but this is 2011 America.

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Comtemplating this one long and hard. A couple called the police because a man was walking off the trail in a park with a young girl???? Has our world become this psychotic? Very sad. Abuse of the police system. The couple should be warned against abusing the system. There does not seem to be anything to cause suspicion that there was anything wrong. I'd be willing to sue that couple for 'causing pain and suffering'.

I do like Jennifer and Dean's suggestion. Keep going back to that park, point out the obnoxious couple, and laugh at them. They might well be trying to keep a public park as their private area. Would they report the OP for walking down the street with his daughter? Playing with her at the playground?

Personally, I think that couple need psychiatric help.

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Comtemplating this one long and hard. A couple called the police because a man was walking off the trail in a park with a young girl???? Has our world become this psychotic? Very sad. Abuse of the police system. The couple should be warned against abusing the system. There does not seem to be anything to cause suspicion that there was anything wrong. I'd be willing to sue that couple for 'causing pain and suffering'.

I do like Jennifer and Dean's suggestion. Keep going back to that park, point out the obnoxious couple, and laugh at them. They might well be trying to keep a public park as their private area. Would they report the OP for walking down the street with his daughter? Playing with her at the playground?

Personally, I think that couple need psychiatric help.

Sad indeed!

 

If they really really thought the OP was a child molester, why the heck did they let him out of their sight? Seems they obviously knew the truth of the matter or they have no common sense. Either way, I think your sig line is an appropriate statement for the situation. :ph34r:

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I think that what happened is a shame. You were totally innocent, but made to feel guilty. However, if your daughter had been encouraged to go with a stranger, I know you would be grateful to who ever called the cops to make sure she came home safely. Maybe there is someone at the police department who can explain why (in non-threatening child friendly terms) why they took the actions they took. You deserve an explanation too! They also need to reassure your daughter that geocaching is legal, and no arrests will be made. I feel the police need to make amends to your daughter, but in the meantime, can you take Mom along for a couple of trips? Maybe a nice police officer should go caching with you too.

Wishing you all the best, and don't apologise for venting...you needed to share this.

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YEP. Not sure what you'll find if you Google the following terms; Jordan, MN, Kathleen Morris. Back in the 80's, Scott County Attorney's Office darn near had an entire community ready to be arrested for child molestation and child abuse. After a lengthy investigation by higher powers, it turns out that the prosecutor, Kathleen Morris, had essentially led questioning of these children down the wrong path, basically convincing the kids that they had been molested, when in fact they weren't.

 

Interesting, the #1 hit Googling "scott county kathleen morris" yielded a People Magazine article about the woman. http://www.people.co...0089593,00.html

That situation has been on my mind throughout this conversation. I agree... anybody that thinks for one second that it just might be OK to let the police or social worker speak privately to your child had better take a look at the Jordan, MN "Sex Scandal" case before taking another breath. That case rocked the world.

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I know what you're getting at, but my problem with how the cops handled the situation lies with the fact that they didn't do anything when they were in the parking lot with the car that had been reported. If I read the story right, there were cops right there in the park as the suspect was leaving with the child. Why didn't they stop the situation right then and there and ask their questions?
The problem I have is that the cops didn't check it out right there at the park. What is with that? Why would they let you drive away like that?

You are both misreading the call log. Read it from bottom to top.

  • 6:14p Someone called the police to advise that man and child were seen off trail at park. The caller was unsure if child 'belonged' to the adult male. A description of what they were wearing was given. An officer was dispatched to the park.
  • 6:34p Officer arrived at park. Left his vehicle in the lot and started looking for the subject.
  • 6:57p Officer walked to the trailhead.
  • 7:12p The caller called back to advise the police that the people in question had just left the park.

The officer couldn't have stopped them from leaving because he wasn't in the parking lot. He was back at the trail looking for them.

 

From the OP

 

then am walking my daughter to the truck to head home and another police car drives by very slow looking at us.

 

I guess you missed that and the part about that said "My daughter asks why all of the police are there, and I tell her it is probably because something happened nearby."

 

So yes there was someone who could have kept him from driving off with her if there was any question. What good would a tag number be if he had stolen the truck and kidnapped the girl? Really the whole thing was odd.

 

Sorry about the DD confusion. Yes it means dear daughter. Years of habit from infertility boards where it's just a quick way to type Daughter and I really don't think of it in the cutsie way. I try to remember that in the real world it's not used often but sometimes my fingers just type it without any help from me. (Smile)

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They wouldn't have talked to my daughter away from me. They wouldn't have been let in my house. Not without a lawyer present first. Sounds like very shady, suspect police work to me.

+1

 

I was hunting a night cache with another couple and their two children. Two cops showed up and said someone called because they saw people walking the trails with flashlights. The cops were even put out by it. The trails are open until 11 PM. We were back at the vehicles in the 9 o'clock hour. The cops apologized and even noted that we were welcome to stay until 11 PM. Some people are just nosey, paranoid or both.

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I wonder if that couple would have been upset if you reported suspicious activity with an animal on the nature trails?

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Those cops had no business (no reasonable suspicion) to do anything.

I'll have to disagree with you on this one. The cops went to a house and had a conversation. Nothing more. I would have done the same. No threats of arrest. No chest puffing. Just talk. If I come to your house and explain my concerns regarding a call I received, then ask if you'll speak with me about these concerns, I don't consider that to be an abuse of power. If you think otherwise, that's OK. I still respect your opinion. I just happen to disagree with it. Of the half dozen or so folks I do this with every day, (insert imaginary statistic) 95% are perfectly willing to speak with me. The other (again, with the imaginary statistics) 5% tell me to pound sand. At that point, if I have no probable cause to take the situation further, I bid them "Good Day" and leave. We already know, from reading the OP, that the writer likes to add a bit of hype to his tales. Where the hype ends and the reality starts is what I'm curious about.

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I find the OP very interesting, hopefully the experience hasnt left a negative mark on those involved. I think it is about time this post was closed as the comments being made are going away from the original post.

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Those cops had no business (no reasonable suspicion) to do anything.

...., if I have no probable cause to take the situation further, I bid them "Good Day" and leave. ...

 

Yes.

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Those cops had no business (no reasonable suspicion) to do anything.

I'll have to disagree with you on this one. The cops went to a house and had a conversation. Nothing more. I would have done the same. No threats of arrest. No chest puffing. Just talk. If I come to your house and explain my concerns regarding a call I received, then ask if you'll speak with me about these concerns, I don't consider that to be an abuse of power. If you think otherwise, that's OK. I still respect your opinion. I just happen to disagree with it. Of the half dozen or so folks I do this with every day, (insert imaginary statistic) 95% are perfectly willing to speak with me. The other (again, with the imaginary statistics) 5% tell me to pound sand. At that point, if I have no probable cause to take the situation further, I bid them "Good Day" and leave. We already know, from reading the OP, that the writer likes to add a bit of hype to his tales. Where the hype ends and the reality starts is what I'm curious about.

 

I am curious about what you mean by "where the hype ends and the reality starts"? This series of events is completely true, and yes I did insert a little hyperbole into it because it was a situation that happened and I was upset about. I added some of my own feelings (not hype) about the situation and series of events, because I was telling the story from my point of view. I have no ill will towards the police officers. They were great. Even in my original post I did not say the LEO's were bad to me or made me feel like a molester. I think the idea of any police make an 8 year old think something is wrong. The questions they asked me were the same they asked my daughter. It was like you said, no threats of arrest, no chest puffing, just talk. They only asked what we were up to down there that would make the couple think we seemed suspicious. I told them we were hiking the trail and looking for geocaches. They knew what geocaches were and said they understood we may have looked suspicious to some in the park or trail. The only things they asked my daughter was if we were hiking together and what we saw and she told them all about the geocaches we found. I actually have no problems with how the LEO's handled it. It came off like they were just talking to us making sure all was well and did not come off in a bad way at all. I did not intend for this to becoe a post about bashing LEO's or amendment rights. I was upset with the couple who did this all in the first place. I agree with all that said they could have come close to us and said hello or even asked "What are you up to"? I would have said geocaching and asked if they would like to join us. My daughter and I will continue to geocache without a doubt. We will just be more aware that paraniod people are out there that can't handle a father walking with his daughter without becoming suspicious.

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We already know, from reading the OP, that the writer likes to add a bit of hype to his tales. Where the hype ends and the reality starts is what I'm curious about.

 

I can't imagine why the OP might have been a bit hyped up. You know, with the fact that the cops are at his door and wanting to question him and his young daughter and all.

 

Hyped up wouldn't begin to describe what I'd have been in that situation.

 

The whole OP sounded pretty realistic to me.

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Question:

I am curious about what you mean by "where the hype ends and the reality starts"?

Answer:

and yes I did insert a little hyperbole into it

 

I can't imagine why the OP might have been a bit hyped up.

Don't feel bad. I can't figure it out either.

For most folks, when an officer approaches and asks, "May I speak with you?" the response is reasoned.

For the OP, facing this same scenario, it's mental anguish and trauma.

Go figure... <_<:unsure:

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Maybe a nice police officer should go caching with you too.

 

Seriously?

I've been caching with a nice police officer. And had a great time. Thanks again, Frank!

 

--Larry

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A couple years ago, I was walking along a very popular path on a weekend and came upon a 6ish-year-old girl. She was alone, apparently lost, and crying loudly. Dozens of people walked by. I knelt beside her, calmed her a bit, and tried to figure out the situation.

 

Before too long, her parents came running up, grabbed her, glared at me, and led her away. I guess I should be thankful that they didn't call the police.

I would be conflicted in that situation. On the one hand, a crying, lost girl should get help finding her family.

 

On the other hand, she is in no immediate danger and I do not want to appear like a child abductor. That is what those dozens of people were thinking as they walked on by.

 

I wonder if this is an American problem. I think other cultures are more trusting.

This incident did occur in Minneapolis, Minnesota, while I was visiting family.

 

I had a similar thing happen once. I called a woman who was near by over explaining that I think that kid is lost and I am not comfortable approaching alone. I still got the dirty look. Damned if you do. Damned if you don't.

The average guy, me included, probably wouldn't think of it at the moment, but using hindsight I think the thing to do might be to call 911 and tell the operator what's going on and that you will try and console the girl until the police show up. It would cover your a** in case someone tried to accuse you of something.

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I can't fault the cops here at all. They were given a call to investigate and they did. As someone noted, being a father or family member does not automatically exempt one from being a molester since most children are abused by a trusted family member rather than a complete stranger. (No, I'm not going to bother looking up the numbers on it.)

 

I also don't fault the couple who called in the complaint for failing to stop or approach the father/daughter. Really now, if you thought someone had abducted a child would you really trust that person to not be a violent offender? In that sense they did the right thing -- call it in and let the professionals handle it.

 

The only part of this whole story that leaves me shaking my head is what the couple thought they saw that set off alarm bells in their heads in the first place. I have already passed judgement on them for being paranoid nervous nellies but I'd like to know what their mindeset was that made them think a call to the cops was needed in the first place. I can't believe what society has become.

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It's never going to cross her mind to refuse; everything in her young life has conditioned her to respond when confronted by authority symbols.

That's a question of how she was taught by her parents, isn't it?

 

If it's legal for the questioning to take place, there is, in effect, a law requiring her to answer.
So you're going to ignore Miranda rights and the 5th Amendment?

 

 

Children in school don't have Miranda rights, according to the supreme court.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/opinionla/la-ed-miranda-20110329,0,5661437.story

 

Also, Miranda only applies once a person is under arrest. A child, being questioned about potential abuse by her parent, does not have Miranda rights.

 

I ask again -- what eight year old, being questioned at school in the presence of several authority figures, is going to refuse to answer? If you are going to allow the questioning, whether the child can be forced to answer or not is a moot point. The child will answer the questions.

 

Maybe your child would. Where's the law that says students MUST answer?

 

Children are conditioned by every interaction within the public school system to respond when asked a question. Does your child pull out a copy of the constitution and request a lawyer every time a member of the school staff asks them why they are in the hallway? Seriously?

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Question:

I am curious about what you mean by "where the hype ends and the reality starts"?

Answer:

and yes I did insert a little hyperbole into it

 

I can't imagine why the OP might have been a bit hyped up.

Don't feel bad. I can't figure it out either.

For most folks, when an officer approaches and asks, "May I speak with you?" the response is reasoned.

For the OP, facing this same scenario, it's mental anguish and trauma.

Go figure... <_<:unsure:

As a police officer, you might not understand that when a police officer knocks on someones door and starts asking questions, that person experiences an increase in stress. I suspect that you do realize this as it actually helps you in your job, but who knows, you may not.

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For those who are still going on about LEO's and whether they were overstepping or not:

Even in my original post I did not say the LEO's were bad to me or made me feel like a molester... I actually have no problems with how the LEO's handled it... I did not intend for this to becoe a post about bashing LEO's or amendment rights. I was upset with the couple who did this all in the first place. I agree with all that said they could have come close to us and said hello or even asked "What are you up to"?...

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It really sucks that this happened.

 

It's kind of like the film cans getting blown up by the bomb squad: once that couple called the police, they HAD to respond.

The police at that point would have no probable cause to detain/question the father and daughter. As such, I seriously doubt that they would have forced them to go anywhere.

 

I am neither an attorney nor a police officer, but I think you are wrong. They had a phone call from an informant who said that they thought a child was being molested. That is probable cause, and at that point, they have a duty to investigate. I suspect that refusing them entry to your home, and refusing to allow them to speak to your daughter, is NOT going to convince them that everything is ok. In fact, I suspect that if one did that, one would find the police quickly returning with a social worker and a warrant.

Where in the OP does it say that anyone thought that the child was being molested?

 

Sounds like Dad blew getting checked out WAY overboard. Extreme reactions to questions when no such reaction is normal will always get a cop's attention.

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