Geocaching Responsibly

[knowschad]

I would like to redirect traffic from another thread before it derails a useful topic. Below is a good starting point for discussions, I guess:

 

Geocache - Responsibly

http://www.geocacheresponsibly.info

Huh, interesting link.

Small membership at the present time, but its a positive step.

 

Its a start. Thank You.

[+bflentje]

Seems like a nice idea on the surface. But if you're (the site owner) going to try and sell an idea that is so important to you, ditch the ads and let it be a REAL cause.

[+narcissa]

Sorry, lost me at swag.

[+fizzymagic]

I tend to find nanny-like things of this ilk annoying.

[+narcissa]

I tend to find nanny-like things of this ilk annoying.

 

Me too. I guess it could be worse though... it could be called the Geocacher's Doctrine or some other heavy-handed relig... er, nevermind.

[knowschad]

Wow! Mr bradleyhenley sure left in a hurry when I gave him his own soapbox! I thought for sure he would be here, talking about his website and its user group and its beliefs.

[+StarBrand]

Wow! Mr bradleyhenley sure left in a hurry when I gave him his own soapbox! I thought for sure he would be here, talking about his website and its user group and its beliefs.

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

[GOF and Bacall]

Wow! Mr bradleyhenley sure left in a hurry when I gave him his own soapbox! I thought for sure he would be here, talking about his website and its user group and its beliefs.

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

 

That.

[+geodarts]

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

 

I don't think he created the federal rules for the national forests in his area, which are also used by a few other national forest areas. Other forests, of course, have their own rules -- some of which, like the Daniel Boone or the Alleghaney require geocaches to be moved or removed within a year (which does not seem to be followed). Some require permits. Others have no restrictions. So I can agree to the extent that he advises people to be familiar with the rules in their own area,.

Edited March 2, 2011 by mulvaney

[knowschad]

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

 

I don't think he created the federal rules for the national forests in his area. Other forests, of course, have their own rules -- some of which, like the Daniel Boone or the Alleghaney require geocaches to be moved or removed within a year (which does not seem to be followed). Others have no restrictions. So I can agree to the extent that he advises people to be familiar with the rules in their own area,.

 

I agree that the links on his one-man group were important to caching. It was his ad hoc opinions in the E.T. Archival thread that bothered me.

Edited March 2, 2011 by knowschad

[+bradleyhenley]

I would like to redirect traffic from another thread before it derails a useful topic. Below is a good starting point for discussions, I guess:

 

Geocache - Responsibly

http://www.geocacheresponsibly.info

Huh, interesting link.

Small membership at the present time, but its a positive step.

 

Its a start. Thank You.

 

Sorry took so long to get here. Just received your email.

 

Ha, Look I have my own thread on geocaching.com.

 

Tell me what you think so far. I just received the email.

 

 

From: Geocaching <noreply@geocaching.com>

To: bradleyhenley@yahoo.com

Sent: Tue, March 1, 2011 11:28:00 PM

Subject: [GEO] knowschad contacting bradleyhenley from Geocaching.com

 

I'm inviting you, if you wish, to post to a thread that I created on the forums to discuss your website. I just didn't want that discussion getting in the way of the E.T. Highway thread. See the thread about your website here: http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=269575

 

User's Profile:

http://www.geocaching.com/profile/?guid=eb1885f1-429c-4f18-88e5-8935a341f289

 

------------------------------------------------------------

Forward abuse complaints to: contact@geocaching.com

[+bradleyhenley]

Seems like a nice idea on the surface. But if you're (the site owner) going to try and sell an idea that is so important to you, ditch the ads and let it be a REAL cause.

 

The ads are from godaddy the host company. They will be removed when I update the site and purchase hosting.

[+bradleyhenley]

[#103128] The administrator has limited the number of new posts you can submit within a short time frame. Please wait 15 seconds before replying or posting a new topic.

 

Thats new. Strange.

[+bradleyhenley]

Sorry, lost me at swag.

 

SWAG stands for:

 

S-stuff

W-we

A-all

G-get

 

that inculdes but not limited to childrens toys

[+bradleyhenley]

I tend to find nanny-like things of this ilk annoying.

 

How is this a "nanny like thing"?

 

I am trying to bring awareness to the state and federal laws that everyone should follow.

When this game was young the idea was to keep it quiet, and secret.

Now with over 5 million cachers It is impossiable to keep the game secret.

With all the bomb scares and the like we should think pro-active, be the solution not the continued cause.

By being informative and pro-active we could stop a lot of unwanted negitivism toward the sport.

[+bradleyhenley]

I tend to find nanny-like things of this ilk annoying.

 

Me too. I guess it could be worse though... it could be called the Geocacher's Doctrine or some other heavy-handed relig... er, nevermind.

 

Geocache - Responsibly

Came from the thinking of a Responsible Geocacher.

 

Geocache - Responsibly is a movement to inform geocacher and muggle alike.

[+Sol seaker]

On the first page your site blames veteran geocachers for abandoned caches.

The fact is that it's quite common for new cachers to start out by placing caches early in their caching career, say they have less than 100 finds, then they decide it's really not for them.

That is at least as common as "veteran" cachers "getting tired" of the game.

 

I appreciate your enthusiasm.

Just remember, we don't all need or want to be policed. Neither do all of us need policing.

You've found 167 caches. Seriously, how many of those were abandoned caches?

There is a whole lot you will learn as you go from less than a couple hundred caches to a couple of thousand caches. Take it easy for a while, learn the game. HAVE FUN.

 

Mark caches that need maintenance with a NM log

When the cachers ignore that for a few months, then you can mark them with Need Archiving (if it's not something simple like replacing a log, which anyone can do).

Live longer, have more fun- RELAX a bit

[+bradleyhenley]

Wow! Mr bradleyhenley sure left in a hurry when I gave him his own soapbox! I thought for sure he would be here, talking about his website and its user group and its beliefs.

 

I got the e-mail about midnight. Untill then I did not even know this thread existed.

 

Funny I received the e-mail form you at 11.28p.m. and your bashing me at 8.55p.m.

 

States alot about you.

[+bradleyhenley]

Wow! Mr bradleyhenley sure left in a hurry when I gave him his own soapbox! I thought for sure he would be here, talking about his website and its user group and its beliefs.

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

 

Re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules. HAHA

 

Please Refer to (http://www.fs.fed.us/r8/texas/recreation/policy/geo_cache_regional_policy_fs_manual.pdf)

 

If I created the Federal Rules then I must also work for the Federal Forest Service in Texas HMMM.

[+bradleyhenley]

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

 

I don't think he created the federal rules for the national forests in his area, which are also used by a few other national forest areas. Other forests, of course, have their own rules -- some of which, like the Daniel Boone or the Alleghaney require geocaches to be moved or removed within a year (which does not seem to be followed). Some require permits. Others have no restrictions. So I can agree to the extent that he advises people to be familiar with the rules in their own area,.

 

Geocache - Responsibly is a movement stressing the need to inform ones self with all the information associated with the sport.

 

You have rules and guidelines of geocaching. Then you have City, State, and Federal laws to adbide by also.

Please inform yourself.

[+bradleyhenley]

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

 

I don't think he created the federal rules for the national forests in his area. Other forests, of course, have their own rules -- some of which, like the Daniel Boone or the Alleghaney require geocaches to be moved or removed within a year (which does not seem to be followed). Others have no restrictions. So I can agree to the extent that he advises people to be familiar with the rules in their own area,.

 

I agree that the links on his one-man group were important to caching. It was his ad hoc opinions in the E.T. Archival thread that bothered me.

 

I am sorry I got off topic.

 

I just saw another example where the informed Geocacher could have been pro-active and contacted the NDOT and met with and made an arangement long before this drastic archivel of the E.T. Highway.

[+Sol seaker]

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

 

I don't think he created the federal rules for the national forests in his area. Other forests, of course, have their own rules -- some of which, like the Daniel Boone or the Alleghaney require geocaches to be moved or removed within a year (which does not seem to be followed). Others have no restrictions. So I can agree to the extent that he advises people to be familiar with the rules in their own area,.

 

I agree that the links on his one-man group were important to caching. It was his ad hoc opinions in the E.T. Archival thread that bothered me.

 

I am sorry I got off topic.

 

I just saw another example where the informed Geocacher could have been pro-active and contacted the NDOT and met with and made an arangement long before this drastic archivel of the E.T. Highway.

 

You sure think you've got all the answers for someone who is so new here.

 

BTW no arrangement could have been made to make that highway a safer place to cache.

It was unsafe. They NDOT would not have added turn-outs for the caches, so no, I don't think a meeting would have helped in that case.

[+bradleyhenley]

On the first page your site blames veteran geocachers for abandoned caches.

The fact is that it's quite common for new cachers to start out by placing caches early in their caching career, say they have less than 100 finds, then they decide it's really not for them.

That is at least as common as "veteran" cachers "getting tired" of the game.

 

I appreciate your enthusiasm.

Just remember, we don't all need or want to be policed. Neither do all of us need policing.

You've found 167 caches. Seriously, how many of those were abandoned caches?

There is a whole lot you will learn as you go from less than a couple hundred caches to a couple of thousand caches. Take it easy for a while, learn the game. HAVE FUN.

 

Mark caches that need maintenance with a NM log

When the cachers ignore that for a few months, then you can mark them with Need Archiving (if it's not something simple like replacing a log, which anyone can do).

Live longer, have more fun- RELAX a bit

 

I'm not saying that veteran cachers world wide are the issue. But here in my neck of the woods veteran cachers are an issue.

 

Of my 167 I have found all 167. I have searched for over 300 and placed NM logs then after some time NA. Prime has archived over 100 caches for the issue of abandonment.

 

When I started the process I was contacted by multiple veteran cachers that stated "that cacher does not live here anymore just put all caches from 'said' cacher on your ignore list."

 

When I started posting NM and NA logs I was told by the local veterans that the reviewer will not do anything stop wasting your time.

 

And in the year or so I have been caching I have found many former cachers sick of the game because of the massive amounts of DNF's and the cache owners non responce.

[+bradleyhenley]

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

 

I don't think he created the federal rules for the national forests in his area. Other forests, of course, have their own rules -- some of which, like the Daniel Boone or the Alleghaney require geocaches to be moved or removed within a year (which does not seem to be followed). Others have no restrictions. So I can agree to the extent that he advises people to be familiar with the rules in their own area,.

 

I agree that the links on his one-man group were important to caching. It was his ad hoc opinions in the E.T. Archival thread that bothered me.

 

I am sorry I got off topic.

 

I just saw another example where the informed Geocacher could have been pro-active and contacted the NDOT and met with and made an arangement long before this drastic archivel of the E.T. Highway.

 

You sure think you've got all the answers for someone who is so new here.

 

BTW no arrangement could have been made to make that highway a safer place to cache.

It was unsafe. They NDOT would not have added turn-outs for the caches, so no, I don't think a meeting would have helped in that case.

 

Since I have never been to Navada I could not have known that. But it was an option.

[+Mark+Karen]

And in the year or so I have been caching I have found many former cachers sick of the game because of the massive amounts of DNF's and the cache owners non responce.

 

Which is why IMO it's important that caches which are no longer there and abandoned by the cache owner get archived.

 

When I'm having trouble finding a cache I always have at the back of my mind that it may no longer be there, so usually prefer to wait a while to see if any more finds appear rather than tearing up GZ looking.

[+bradleyhenley]

And in the year or so I have been caching I have found many former cachers sick of the game because of the massive amounts of DNF's and the cache owners non responce.

 

Which is why IMO it's important that caches which are no longer there and abandoned by the cache owner get archived.

 

When I'm having trouble finding a cache I always have at the back of my mind that it may no longer be there, so usually prefer to wait a while to see if any more finds appear rather than tearing up GZ looking.

 

Yes, abandoned geocaches should be archived.

 

The issue here is that when you place a geocache about 5-10 cachers max hit the cache within 2 weeks then it is forgotten.

[+narcissa]

Um, I know what swag is, thanks. I can't endorse a site that places importance on it like yours does.

 

Sorry, lost me at swag.

 

SWAG stands for:

 

S-stuff

W-we

A-all

G-get

 

that inculdes but not limited to childrens toys

[+briansnat]

I found the site to be rambling and somewhat incoherent.

 

I think the site owner's intentions are good, but I'm skeptical when someone who has been caching a little over a year tries to present himself as some sort of expert, offering "sage" advice.

Edited March 2, 2011 by briansnat

[+Ike 13]

I'm not saying that veteran cachers world wide are the issue. But here in my neck of the woods veteran cachers are an issue.

 

Of my 167 I have found all 167. I have searched for over 300 and placed NM logs then after some time NA. Prime has archived over 100 caches for the issue of abandonment.

 

When I started the process I was contacted by multiple veteran cachers that stated "that cacher does not live here anymore just put all caches from 'said' cacher on your ignore list."

 

When I started posting NM and NA logs I was told by the local veterans that the reviewer will not do anything stop wasting your time.

 

And in the year or so I have been caching I have found many former cachers sick of the game because of the massive amounts of DNF's and the cache owners non responce.

 

Well that's disappointing that the local community is so apathetic. Using the ignore list instead of reporting issues is sad. Hopefully you can work with them and show them the benefits of reporting issues (using NM and NA) and how this leads to new cache placements.

 

I think trying to educate the locals on being responsible is great. But as a teacher I know the way you come at someone you're trying to educate is very important. Making someone feel dumb or irresponsible is not going to get great results. You may have an uphill battle since you're the new guy with only 167 finds. You can easily earn respect (even with low numbers) and then start educating the locals at events.

Edited March 2, 2011 by IkeHurley13

[Mr.Yuck]

I tend to find nanny-like things of this ilk annoying.

 

How is this a "nanny like thing"?

 

I am trying to bring awareness to the state and federal laws that everyone should follow.

When this game was young the idea was to keep it quiet, and secret.

Now with over 5 million cachers It is impossiable to keep the game secret.

With all the bomb scares and the like we should think pro-active, be the solution not the continued cause.

By being informative and pro-active we could stop a lot of unwanted negitivism toward the sport.

 

Nanny like thing? I'll just say I feel you are way overstepping your bounds as just a player out in the field. Man, the Texas reviewer sure gets a lot of help, or offers for it.

 

There aren't really 5 million cachers, about half of them are 0 find 0 hide accounts who just signed up for an account on a website on the internet. Still, 2.5 million is a lot.

[+JBnW]

I found the site to be rambling and somewhat incoherent.

 

I think the site owner's intentions are good, but I'm skeptical when someone who has been caching a little over a year tries to present himself as some sort of expert, offering "sage" advice.

I flipped through several of the pages, and think the one compiling caching regulations in TX was pretty good. Or at least a start; I'd bet that there are several more in TX that could get added to the list, even to mention those that have no written regulations. However, I would think that posting this list to an established geocaching group would have been a better choice. I would think that the TXGA might be happy to have such a list developed on their page. The compilation of caching resources was very good; short and sweet and well-described...at least the ones that work.

 

The text pages; however, need work. IMHO.

 

Edit: spellun

Edited March 2, 2011 by JBnW

[+StarBrand]

Not to mention his re-write of the guidelines and self created federal rules.

 

I don't think he created the federal rules for the national forests in his area, which are also used by a few other national forest areas. Other forests, of course, have their own rules -- some of which, like the Daniel Boone or the Alleghaney require geocaches to be moved or removed within a year (which does not seem to be followed). Some require permits. Others have no restrictions. So I can agree to the extent that he advises people to be familiar with the rules in their own area,.

 

The permit option is true but he tried (in the other thread) to extend that same rule to all National Forests, state parks and the like everywhere. Also the rules cited do not ban "plastic" boxes as he asserted.

[+sbell111]

I tend to find nanny-like things of this ilk annoying.

 

I found the site to be rambling and somewhat incoherent.

 

I think the site owner's intentions are good, but I'm skeptical when someone who has been caching a little over a year tries to present himself as some sort of expert, offering "sage" advice.

When was the last time that fizzy, BS, and myself all agreed with one another on an issue???

 

Another thing that bugged me about this site is that I couldn't figure out who was behind it. I'm not very impressed when someone wants to preach to me from behind a curtain.

[+mlomeli]

I feel as if I'm watching a reality show where they choose a side, for whatever reason and fight...over what again?

 

So you don't like some words on a website. So it isn't the way you'd do it. So what other people have found more caches. Insert whatever you don't like/difference of opinion, etc...

 

Are the intentions of what is being done, meant well? Did the website directly affect you, your family, your immediate safety?

 

There are sooooo many websites out their, that I'd rather slap the snot out of the owner, but it's their money spent. I say out loud "what an idiot" and press the red x button. (this isn't one of those sites, I'm just saying).

 

Get over it or create your own website.

Edited March 2, 2011 by mlomeli

[+bflentje]

Another thing that bugged me about this site is that I couldn't figure out who was behind it. I'm not very impressed when someone wants to preach to me from behind a curtain.

 

ditto ditto ditto.

[+knabino]

I'm sorry but I have a hard time reading about responsibility from someone who 1) has under 200 finds and 2) has only found 1 cache outside of his home state. I am more incline to listen to someone who has a) a few thousand finds cached all over and has seen how other states/communities cache.

 

While you are correct, there are cachers who will place caches and then forget about them, IMO that is a relatively small number of folks. In the 4+ years I have been caching, I have only found 4 that were abandoned and left as geotrash. 2 were owned by seasoned cachers and 2 were placed by newbies who never logged in to GC after they placed their hides.

 

Perhaps a better way of making this site work out for what you are intending is to limit it to your general area and not go so broad until you have a greater range of experience in other areas.

[+geodarts]

The permit option is true but he tried (in the other thread) to extend that same rule to all National Forests, state parks and the like everywhere. Also the rules cited do not ban "plastic" boxes as he asserted.

 

As with any set of rules there are some things that are straight forward (forests that require permits or set a year-long time span) and other things that are a matter of interpretatiom. Certainly, part of wisdom is recognizing the difference.

[Mr.Yuck]

I feel as if I'm watching a reality show where they choose a side, for whatever reason and fight...over what again?

 

So you don't like some words on a website. So it isn't the way you'd do it. So what other people have found more caches. Insert whatever you don't like/difference of opinion, etc...

 

Are the intentions of what is being done, meant well? Did the website directly affect you, your family, your immediate safety?

 

There are sooooo many websites out their, that I'd rather slap the snot out of the owner, but it's their money spent. I say out loud "what an idiot" and press the red x button. (this isn't one of those sites, I'm just saying).

 

Get over it or create your own website.

 

OK, now I know to a casual observer this might seem like people are piling on the poor guy, and with a holier-than-thou "you don't have enough experience" type attitude. But this whole thing just isn't something an individual who is just a regular rank and file member of a hobby dives into. And I'm not just talking about this website, there are several alternative Geocaching websites all over the world.

 

So no, none of us need to start our own websites. As a matter of fact, someone did start one years ago, much better equiped to deal with these issues, real or imagined: TexasGeocaching.com

[knowschad]

Wow! Mr bradleyhenley sure left in a hurry when I gave him his own soapbox! I thought for sure he would be here, talking about his website and its user group and its beliefs.

 

I got the e-mail about midnight. Untill then I did not even know this thread existed.

 

Funny I received the e-mail form you at 11.28p.m. and your bashing me at 8.55p.m.

 

States alot about you.

If you consider that to be bashing you, then that states a lot about you as well. Do not judge me based on one posting and I will try to do the same toward you.

 

I wrote that because you were posting almost continually at the time to the E.T. thread. I created this thread while you were still posting there, or very shortly afterward, so it surprised me that you didn't jump right into this thread.

[+Sol seaker]

I tried to register at Texas geocaching, but it kept coming up with ERROR.

Maybe because I was registering from a different time zone than Texas.

 

I find it amazing that people have left caches that have been abandoned to that extent.

I've come across a few, maybe 20 at most, in the course of the 1200 caches I've found.

It is great that you're taking care of this problem. Those before you should have. I'm sorry they didn't.

 

I got jumped on for one post that I made when I had found 300 caches, people telling me I knew nothing. Then again when I had found 500 caches the same thing.

The fact is the more you cache the more you learn about this game. Those who play know this and generally don't like being told how to do things by a newcomer.

If you had of cached more out-of-state, as someone else suggested, you would know that they don't have the same problem with dead caches everywhere else. I've only caches in four states myself, but in those four states I've never seen this problem as bad as you've encountered it there.

 

I do applaud you for taking on this problem in your own state. Sounds like something that really needs cleaning up. This is great you've taken that on.

[+knabino]

 

I find it amazing that people have left caches that have been abandoned to that extent.

I've come across a few, maybe 20 at most, in the course of the 1200 caches I've found.

 

 

I find it somewhat amazing too. I did some very minor caching in SE TX in 2008, shortly after Hurricane Ike while working on the clean-up. I managed to have 1 full afternoon/evening to cache and only came across 2 caches that I had to DNF due to them being lost to the hurricane. I was watching the caches in the area every day for the 20 days I was there and the COs were out replacing those that had gone MIA, even if they had not been found in months.

[Pup Patrol]

I tried to register at Texas geocaching, but it kept coming up with ERROR.

Maybe because I was registering from a different time zone than Texas.

 

Check again...."The newest member is Sol Seaker"...

[+bradleyhenley]

Um, I know what swag is, thanks. I can't endorse a site that places importance on it like yours does.

 

Sorry, lost me at swag.

 

SWAG stands for:

 

S-stuff

W-we

A-all

G-get

 

that inculdes but not limited to childrens toys

 

Sad, The only thing I state about swag is that, As being a perpaired cacher you being swag as part of your repair items. the swag is for the children. Remeber this is a family sport and children enjoy finding trinkets.

[GOF and Bacall]

I was poking around your home area. I am not seeing any major problems. Am I missing something?

[+Chrysalides]

Me too. I guess it could be worse though... it could be called the Geocacher's Doctrine or some other heavy-handed relig... er, nevermind.

Other candidates : manifesto, commandments.

 

On a sort of related topic, I do occasionally answer the call of nature when out geocaching. Does that count?

 

If you are willing to answer the calling of Mother Nature by informing yourself about the proper procedures to geocache.

[+bradleyhenley]

I found the site to be rambling and somewhat incoherent.

 

I think the site owner's intentions are good, but I'm skeptical when someone who has been caching a little over a year tries to present himself as some sort of expert, offering "sage" advice.

 

The intro page is a little long winded. I will be changing this upon update.

 

As far as the "expert" I never claimed to be.

 

I want fellow geocachers to investigate further into the state and federal laws.

 

when the sport was young it was to be hidden/ secert. now there are too many people involved to keep it quiet.

[+roziecakes]

I found the site to be rambling and somewhat incoherent.

 

I think the site owner's intentions are good, but I'm skeptical when someone who has been caching a little over a year tries to present himself as some sort of expert, offering "sage" advice.

 

+1

 

This is exactly what I was going to say. I do appreciate the intentions because I try to advocate caching responsibly, but I do find it to be a little preachy to create a whole site about it, especially when I don't think you quite have enough caching experience to profess to be an expert at it. I know that I certainly don't, and I've been caching just about five years.

 

I think that all of the information that a person needs is already available on geocaching.com, and the rest is common sense things that folks would do if they were doing any activity in sensitive areas or parks.

[+StarBrand]

...

when the sport was young it was to be hidden/ secert. now there are too many people involved to keep it quiet.

Citation?? Timeframe??

 

I've never known it to be a game of cloak and dagger.

[+Panther&Pine]

Citation?? Timeframe??

 

I've never known it to be a game of cloak and dagger.

No no, just cloak. For we are Caching Ninjas (I'm going to go try to buy that domain name now) Daggers are dangerous!

 

 

I really need to cut back on the soda pop during lunch.

[+roziecakes]

At least as long as I have been caching, which as I mentioned above is just about five years, caching itself wasn't kept secret. The only thing "secretive" if you want to use that word is the stealth that we use when avoiding the muggling of caches, which still is in practice today. I wouldn't necessarily say that geocaching has ever been kept 'hidden' or 'secret' though... especially since geocaching.com is a publicly available website. Nothing on the internet is hidden or secret.