Paying for both Premium Membership AND Iphone?

[+salome000]

Minutes ago, I just purchased the premium membership. Then I find it's 10 dollars to have the iphone app. Doesn't the premium membership include both? If not, is there a way to send info to my iphone without having to drop another 10?

[+Bear and Ragged]

I've paid the money for my motorcar... Why should I now have to pay for the fuel?

 

I don't cache with an iPhone, why should I have to pay for an app I don't/won't use?

 

Go on, pay up, you won't regret it!

 

Edited January 8, 2011 by Bear and Ragged

[+salome000]

I've paid the money for my motorcar... Why should I now have to pay for the fuel?

 

I don't cache with an iPhone, why should I have to pay for an app I don't/won't use?

 

Go on, pay up, you won't regret it!

 

 

That's not the point. Your GPS is included...I don't use a GPS so why should I have to pay for it? I feel it should be made clear that everything is included EXCEPT the iphone. Then, I have a choice of which to purchase. I'm sure I'll have no regrets...but, in reality, I just spent 30 I didn't have to.

[+Touchstone]

List of Premium Member Features

 

I'm not seeing the app as part of the benefits.

 

If not, is there a way to send info to my iphone without having to drop another 10?

 

In all honesty, you'll probably be disappointed with the alternatives. It really is worth the $10.

[+mpilchfamily]

That $10 isn't allot to ask. You are spending a one time fee to have the ability to do paperless caching. Or you can download any of a number of free apps that gives you GPS navigation and type in the cord manually. I don't have an iPhone but i do have an iPod Touch. The $10 was well worth it to give me the ability to go paperless. I use the iTouch in conjunction with my GPS. Its a heck of allot better then spending the $300+ on a GPSr that can do paperless caching.

 

The reason a standalone GPS is "included", as you say, is they are built for that purpose. The iPhone isn't built to be a stand alone GPSr. Yes it has that feature but you need additional apps to take advantage of it. GS isn't the problem here. Its Apple for not making the iPhone compatible with the GS site. Early GPSrs didn't have the ability for cords to be downloaded to them.

 

Here is a decent list of your alternatives for the iPhone.

http://gigaom.com/apple/eleven-geocaching-iphone-apps-worth-finding/

[+BCandMsKitty]

I've paid the money for my motorcar... Why should I now have to pay for the fuel?

 

I don't cache with an iPhone, why should I have to pay for an app I don't/won't use?

 

Go on, pay up, you won't regret it!

 

 

That's not the point. Your GPS is included...I don't use a GPS so why should I have to pay for it? I feel it should be made clear that everything is included EXCEPT the iphone. Then, I have a choice of which to purchase. I'm sure I'll have no regrets...but, in reality, I just spent 30 I didn't have to.

 

That exactly IS the point!

Everything is included. Complain to Iphone that their app isn't free for you. it has nothing to do with Groundspeak.

[+Flintstone5611]

So here is my question: Who forced you to buy either in order to play?

[+J the Goat]

Sounds like you didn't do quite enough research regarding what you were buying. At least both costs are pretty low, and the premium membership has a lot of features that are wonderful to use. I'm not sure what features the iphone app has beyond allowing you to use your phone to find caches, but I'd bet that it doesn't include all the PM features is you haven't paid the 30 bucks.

[+Chokecherry]

I didn't buy a premium membership for awhile. I had the Iphone application first and because it met all my needs at that time I didn't feel a need to get the premium membership until I had a specific use for it.

 

The app is a one time purchase. Premium membership is a yearly deal. I would think it would be hard for Groundspeak to include the app with the premium membership because really they can't suck it back off the phone when you don't pay your next membership fee the next time around.

[knowschad]

That's not the point. Your GPS is included...I don't use a GPS so why should I have to pay for it?

Sorry, but what you said there makes no sense to me at all. I paid hundreds of dollars for my current GPS, and I have owned three other handhelds and two NUVIs for geocaching since I began. My GPS is hardly "included", and it cost a lot more than your iPhone plus the app.

[+dfx]

That's not the point. Your GPS is included...I don't use a GPS so why should I have to pay for it? I feel it should be made clear that everything is included EXCEPT the iphone. Then, I have a choice of which to purchase. I'm sure I'll have no regrets...but, in reality, I just spent 30 I didn't have to.

 

i did not get a GPS when i upgraded to premium. did you?

 

btw, there's plenty of smartphone applications that will work with the premium features (i.e. GPX downloads) just like a GPS handheld. why not use those?

[knowschad]

That's not the point. Your GPS is included...I don't use a GPS so why should I have to pay for it? I feel it should be made clear that everything is included EXCEPT the iphone. Then, I have a choice of which to purchase. I'm sure I'll have no regrets...but, in reality, I just spent 30 I didn't have to.

 

i did not get a GPS when i upgraded to premium. did you?

 

btw, there's plenty of smartphone applications that will work with the premium features (i.e. GPX downloads) just like a GPS handheld. why not use those?

 

You, either, huh? Say, you don't suppose its just the two of us that didn't get a free GPS when we signed up, do you?

[+Cpt.Blackbeard]

I bought my Premium Membership as soon as I started caching, it had nothing to do with the benefits, many of them weren't even included in 2005, I bought it it was the right thing to do, supporting the site that provides the service. I never felt at anytime that I was entitled to anything along with it, though I do appreciate them for what they offer.

[knowschad]

I bought my Premium Membership as soon as I started caching, it had nothing to do with the benefits, many of them weren't even included in 2005, I bought it it was the right thing to do, supporting the site that provides the service. I never felt at anytime that I was entitled to anything along with it, though I do appreciate them for what they offer.

What kind of GPS did they give you?

[+Cpt.Blackbeard]

I bought my Premium Membership as soon as I started caching, it had nothing to do with the benefits, many of them weren't even included in 2005, I bought it it was the right thing to do, supporting the site that provides the service. I never felt at anytime that I was entitled to anything along with it, though I do appreciate them for what they offer.

What kind of GPS did they give you?

None, in fact I hunted for my first cache without one, failed to find it, (No Google Maps then either) and bought one off ebay for $15.00 until I could afford a new one. Currently use a GPSMap 60CSx, but paid for it to.

[+dfx]

Everything is included. Complain to Iphone that their app isn't free for you. it has nothing to do with Groundspeak.

 

somehow i don't think this is really true. but i don't really know, so i could be wrong.

[knowschad]

Everything is included. Complain to Iphone that their app isn't free for you. it has nothing to do with Groundspeak.

 

somehow i don't think this is really true. but i don't really know, so i could be wrong.

I think you probably misunderstood what MC & MsKitty was saying. I believe they were saying that everything promised was included, but that the iPhone was not in that promise. Complain to iPhone about that.

[+Tequila]

I bought my Premium Membership as soon as I started caching, it had nothing to do with the benefits, many of them weren't even included in 2005, I bought it it was the right thing to do, supporting the site that provides the service. I never felt at anytime that I was entitled to anything along with it, though I do appreciate them for what they offer.

What kind of GPS did they give you?

 

I got one. Oh no. Sorry. It was a Colorado. That doesn't really count as a GPS.

[+addisonbr]

Minutes ago, I just purchased the premium membership. Then I find it's 10 dollars to have the iphone app. Doesn't the premium membership include both? If not, is there a way to send info to my iphone without having to drop another 10?

Hi there. The short answer, is that no, the premium membership doesn't include the iPhone app.

 

To answer your second question, it depends on what you want to do. You can access many of the premium member services from the web (like being able to access premium member only caches, create bookmarks, vote for favorites, etc.), and can also get to them by using the built-in browser on your phone. GC.com uses very little Adobe Flash, and so there isn't much you can do on your desktop browser that you can't do on your phone's browser.

 

In terms of reading GPX files, that gets a little tougher. There are other applications in the App Store that can interact with GPX files, but they typically aren't free either. I would guess those that are free (I couldn't find any) are probably not very good.

 

So I'm in the position where I'm going to suggest the same thing that a lot of other folks have in this thread, but hopefully with less snark. I'd go ahead and get the iPhone app. As Chokecherry mentioned, it's a $10, one-time charge for the app vs. a $30 annual fee for the premium membership. If that's spread out over three years, that's only $3 a year.

 

I'm not saying that the premium membership is a bad deal by any stretch, but in terms of value for the dollar I think the iPhone app delivers a lot more punch. I believe I "use" my iPhone app on a daily basis a lot more than I "use" my premium membership. So while I can understand being a little bummed at the surprise that easy integration with the iPhone wasn't bundled with the premium membership, I still think you'll be very happy with purchase. I don't blindly agree with every product Groundspeak introduces, and some of them are overpriced, but the iPhone app is in my recommended column.

[+dfx]

I think you probably misunderstood what MC & MsKitty was saying. I believe they were saying that everything promised was included, but that the iPhone was not in that promise. Complain to iPhone about that.

 

but it's not iphone's fault that the app isn't free. there's plenty of free apps (or at least cost 99 cents only or so), so it obviously was Groundspeak's decision to make it cost something.

[+addisonbr]

That's not the point. Your GPS is included...

Sorry, but what you said there makes no sense to me at all. I paid hundreds of dollars for my current GPS, and I have owned three other handhelds and two NUVIs for geocaching since I began. My GPS is hardly "included", and it cost a lot more than your iPhone plus the app.

I think that salome is trying to say is not that the GPS unit itself is included, but that integration with the GPS is. In other words, when you generate a PQ with your premium membership, you don't have to buy a $10 application in order to load a GPX file onto your Garmin, Magellan or DeLorme GPSr. If your GPSr is made by Apple, you do. (At least, I think you do - I haven't found another way to do it.)

 

I'm not saying that the iPhone isn't a good purchase - I think it's a very good value. Nor am I saying that Groundspeak broke any promises by not bundling the iPhone app with the premium membership. But I don't think that characterizing salome's point as saying she expected to receive a free GPSr unit with her premium membership is accurate. She wasn't asking for free hardware; she was comparing integration capabilities.

[+dfx]

I think that salome is trying to say is not that the GPS unit itself is included, but that integration with the GPS is. In other words, when you generate a PQ with your premium membership, you don't have to buy a $10 application in order to load a GPX file onto your Garmin, Magellan or DeLorme GPSr. If your GPSr is made by Apple, you do.

 

even with a garmin/delorme/etc GPS, you still have to pay for the software to integrate the PQs with the device. the only difference is that with those devices, the software (the firmware) comes bundled with the device, so you already paid for it when you bought the device, which makes sense because that's part of the intended use of the device. not so with a smartphone, which is after all just a phone and so obviously doesn't come bundled with GPS software, because it wouldn't make sense to make customers automatically pay for that.

Edited January 8, 2011 by dfx

[+geodarts]

I became a premium member before I had a gpsr. Long after getting a gps unit, I purchased the Groundspeak app because it gave me some extra flexability, but I do not think it replaces premium membership in any way. The pqs, for instance, offer much greater capabilities when focusong on cache types, planning routes, and doing wider searches. To me, the Groundspeak app is great for caching on the fly, but is very limiting compared to a handheld and premium membership.

 

The geosphere app is a great complement to my membership because it has features not included in either my gpsr or the Groundspeak app. It makes my premium membership work even better through its ability to filter pqs, map the results, and display the cache pages and graphics in html.

 

Ultimately, I don't think it is either/or - each one can complement the other. All 3 make caching better. Premium membership remains a terrific bargain that makes caching easier, with or without an iphone. And the apps can help get the most out of it.

Edited January 8, 2011 by mulvaney

[+Flintstone5611]

 

I got one. Oh no. Sorry. It was a Colorado. That doesn't really count as a GPS.

Bwahahahaahahaha!!

[+addisonbr]

even with a garmin/delorme/etc GPS, you still have to pay for the software to integrate the PQs with the device. the only difference is that with those devices, the software (the firmware) comes bundled with the device, so you already paid for it when you bought the device, which makes sense because that's part of the intended use of the device. not so with a smartphone, which is after all just a phone and so obviously doesn't come bundled with GPS software, because it wouldn't make sense to make customers automatically pay for that.

All I'm saying is that I can understand salome's surprise. Over time, as Groundspeak and its partners have introduced more and better ways to integrate the GPX data with stand-alone GPSr units, they haven't charged extra for any of that. The "Send directly to my GPS" button for example, wasn't a patch that cost $10 to download (at least I don't think so - when I downloaded it when it first became available, it was free). I'm not saying it's right, wrong, legal, illegal, moral, immoral, economically justified or gouging. I'm just saying that I can understand a new cacher being a little bummed to discover that her choice of GPSr isn't fully supported without having to pay extra. I'm happy to walk her through her choices moving forward, including giving her my opinion that the iPhone app delivers more than $10 in value.

 

As an aside, I'm not really sure that a smartphone is just a phone - they cost about 10x as much as things that are just phones anyway. I think folks are paying up for them because of everything else they can do with them, including location-based stuff. I bought mine precisely because it offered GPS (I had passed on earlier models that didn't). The smartphone-as-GPSr segment of the market is growing, much as the using-a-GPSr-to-play-a-silly-game market grew in the first half of the last decade.

[+BCandMsKitty]

I think you probably misunderstood what MC & MsKitty was saying. I believe they were saying that everything promised was included, but that the iPhone was not in that promise. Complain to iPhone about that.

 

but it's not iphone's fault that the app isn't free. there's plenty of free apps (or at least cost 99 cents only or so), so it obviously was Groundspeak's decision to make it cost something.

 

That may be true, but GS doesn't claim to offer software apps for every device out there to make them compatible with geocaching when you purchase the premium membership, if the manufacturer doesn't give the capability to you when you buy it.

Premium membership gives you more features for geocaching, it doesn't have anything to do with whether or not your device can use those features!

Come on ... $10 isn't much for a one time software bundle that makes your device work like a dedicated GPSr, is it?

[+Flintstone5611]

Come on ... $10 isn't much for a one time software bundle that makes your device work like a dedicated GPSr, is it?

100% true. There is a BB app (by Trimble) that asks for 40$/year and after a buddy got the app I realized that I thought it sucked compared to the Groundspeak app which only cost me 10$ one time!

[g_o_caching]

You could have asked here in the forums about the iphone and if anything else was needed to use it for caching before you bought a premium membership. You had the option to pay $10 for 4 months of membership instead of $30 for the year. The answers to your questions would have let you join for $10 and buy a app for $10 and only have $20 invested until you decided if this was what you wanted. Hindsight is 20/20 but questions are free.

[+pppingme]

Its all about money to GS.

 

With the iphone app there's a whole new arena of potential customers that most likely won't pay for premium memberships, so may as well try to get 10 bucks out of them.

 

The sad thing (and a slap in the face to premium members) is that with the iphone app (as long as you're in cell range), you get what essentially is similar benefits as a premium membership, you can see all the caches in the area, something that used to take pq's loaded to your device to do.

[+addisonbr]

The sad thing (and a slap in the face to premium members) is that with the iphone app (as long as you're in cell range), you get what essentially is similar benefits as a premium membership, you can see all the caches in the area, something that used to take pq's loaded to your device to do.

FWIW, that's no different than what you can do with any smartphone with a web browser. Before the iPhone app came out, anyone could simply call up GC.com from their phone's browser, enter their cross-streets into the map and get a list of the nearest caches, 20 at a time. The iPhone app saves me a step or two, but if it went away I'd just do the same thing through the browser.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

That's not the point. Your GPS is included...I don't use a GPS so why should I have to pay for it? I feel it should be made clear that everything is included EXCEPT the iphone. Then, I have a choice of which to purchase. I'm sure I'll have no regrets...but, in reality, I just spent 30 I didn't have to.

 

i did not get a GPS when i upgraded to premium. did you?

 

btw, there's plenty of smartphone applications that will work with the premium features (i.e. GPX downloads) just like a GPS handheld. why not use those?

 

You, either, huh? Say, you don't suppose its just the two of us that didn't get a free GPS when we signed up, do you?

 

What? You mean some people *didn't* get a free GPS when the got a premium membership? I got mine, but it was several days after I got the email notification that I earned a GPS.

[+WhoDis]

I bought my Premium Membership as soon as I started caching, it had nothing to do with the benefits, many of them weren't even included in 2005, I bought it it was the right thing to do, supporting the site that provides the service. I never felt at anytime that I was entitled to anything along with it, though I do appreciate them for what they offer.

What kind of GPS did they give you?

He's only slightly mistaken, you get the free GPSr with your Platinum membership. I'm not allowed to say anymore than that though.

[+briansnat]

I bought my Premium Membership as soon as I started caching, it had nothing to do with the benefits, many of them weren't even included in 2005, I bought it it was the right thing to do, supporting the site that provides the service. I never felt at anytime that I was entitled to anything along with it, though I do appreciate them for what they offer.

 

Exactly. I purchased my premium membership to support this site. I know what it takes to run a website like this and wanted to do my part to help it stay alive. I didn't use any premium features for several years. If they took all the premium features away tomorrow, or made them free with a basic membership I'd still pay up.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Its all about money to GS.

Well, yes, it is! They are a business! Businesses are by definition in the business of making money. Businesses do not exist to spend money developing products to give away. That's why I remain amazed by Groundspeak's free membership and the enormous capability they give away to all comers.

 

With the iphone app there's a whole new arena of potential customers that most likely won't pay for premium memberships, so may as well try to get 10 bucks out of them.

 

The sad thing (and a slap in the face to premium members) is that with the iphone app (as long as you're in cell range), you get what essentially is similar benefits as a premium membership, you can see all the caches in the area, something that used to take pq's loaded to your device to do.

You obviously don't know the full value of PQs if you compare them to seeing a few caches around you when you have cell service.

 

My take is that if someone won't pay for a $30 yearly membership and $10 one-time software license then they likely won't spend money to stock, hide and maintain caches either.

[+WhoDis]

GS does provide a free version of the app, it's very limited though. I never actually used it, I just paid the $10, never even considered the fact that GS should give me something for free. When you bought your iPhone and paid for your AT&T service, did you consider that AT&T should give you the data for free?

[+The Blorenges]

I bought my Premium Membership as soon as I started caching, it had nothing to do with the benefits, many of them weren't even included in 2005, I bought it it was the right thing to do, supporting the site that provides the service. I never felt at anytime that I was entitled to anything along with it, though I do appreciate them for what they offer.

What kind of GPS did they give you?

None, in fact I hunted for my first cache without one, failed to find it, (No Google Maps then either) and bought one off ebay for $15.00 until I could afford a new one. Currently use a GPSMap 60CSx, but paid for it to.

 

Heck...

 

back in 2001 we got issued with the Official Groundspeak Forked Stick. You just had to hold it loosely in both hands, walk around a bit and wait until it started twitching... Yeah, things were pretty basic back then...

 

MrsB

[+keehotee]

I bought my Premium Membership as soon as I started caching, it had nothing to do with the benefits, many of them weren't even included in 2005, I bought it it was the right thing to do, supporting the site that provides the service. I never felt at anytime that I was entitled to anything along with it, though I do appreciate them for what they offer.

What kind of GPS did they give you?

None, in fact I hunted for my first cache without one, failed to find it, (No Google Maps then either) and bought one off ebay for $15.00 until I could afford a new one. Currently use a GPSMap 60CSx, but paid for it to.

 

Heck...

 

back in 2001 we got issued with the Official Groundspeak Forked Stick. You just had to hold it loosely in both hands, walk around a bit and wait until it started twitching... Yeah, things were pretty basic back then...

 

MrsB

 

Yep - three years to find a cache with a forked stick's more than my patience would bear......

[+The Blorenges]

I bought my Premium Membership as soon as I started caching, it had nothing to do with the benefits, many of them weren't even included in 2005, I bought it it was the right thing to do, supporting the site that provides the service. I never felt at anytime that I was entitled to anything along with it, though I do appreciate them for what they offer.

What kind of GPS did they give you?

None, in fact I hunted for my first cache without one, failed to find it, (No Google Maps then either) and bought one off ebay for $15.00 until I could afford a new one. Currently use a GPSMap 60CSx, but paid for it to.

 

Heck...

 

back in 2001 we got issued with the Official Groundspeak Forked Stick. You just had to hold it loosely in both hands, walk around a bit and wait until it started twitching... Yeah, things were pretty basic back then...

 

MrsB

 

Yep - three years to find a cache with a forked stick's more than my patience would bear......

 

Exactly! - That's why we didn't find our first one until 2004.

 

MrsB

[+tozainamboku]

The sad thing (and a slap in the face to premium members) is that with the iphone app (as long as you're in cell range), you get what essentially is similar benefits as a premium membership, you can see all the caches in the area, something that used to take pq's loaded to your device to do.

Does the iPhone app let you find premium member only caches without a a premium membership?

Does the iPhone app let you create premium member caches and view the audit log for these cache pages?

Does the iPhone app let you create bookmark lists?

Does the iPhone app let you nominate your favorite caches?

Does the iPhone app let you store the PQ results on offline database and manipulate them with 3rd party tools?

Does the iPhone app provide instant notifications?

Does the iPhone app give you access to the off-topic forum?

Does the iPhone app let you specify your title in the forums?

 

I don't think the iPhone app gives anything near similar benefits as a premium membership. The fact that you can get all nearby caches in the field and can store a limited number on the phone for when you have no internet connection, doesn't even seem to be similar to the PQ feature where you can download thousands of caches which you can process with 3rd party tools. Even if you are only loading the PQs directly to your GPS, the PQ query lets you select caches on far more criteria than the iPhone app does - particularly caches along a route. As a premium member without an iPhone, I don't feel that iPhone users are getting anything they shouldn't be getting.

 

Geomate Jr. users...?

[+pppingme]

Its all about money to GS.

Well, yes, it is! They are a business! Businesses are by definition in the business of making money. Businesses do not exist to spend money developing products to give away. That's why I remain amazed by Groundspeak's free membership and the enormous capability they give away to all comers.

But the one thing non-prem's have never been able to do (without scraping anyway) is bulk download of caches, essentially, thats what the iphone app is doing, with a very distinct advantage of being real time, so more current logs, etc.

 

How is it smart from a business perspective to piss off your more lucrative customers?

 

As far as being a basic member (aside from the whole iphone scam) thats a fairly smart decision, sort of like a teaser, once you get hooked, then you want to start bulk downloading instead of taking a long time to key in individual coordinates and print pages.

 

With the iphone app there's a whole new arena of potential customers that most likely won't pay for premium memberships, so may as well try to get 10 bucks out of them.

 

The sad thing (and a slap in the face to premium members) is that with the iphone app (as long as you're in cell range), you get what essentially is similar benefits as a premium membership, you can see all the caches in the area, something that used to take pq's loaded to your device to do.

You obviously don't know the full value of PQs if you compare them to seeing a few caches around you when you have cell service.

 

My take is that if someone won't pay for a $30 yearly membership and $10 one-time software license then they likely won't spend money to stock, hide and maintain caches either.

 

I very much understand the value of premium membership, its that I can bulk download caches (via pq's), load it on my gps, then go stand anywhere in town and hit nearest on my gps. As of now, so can any iphone user, and they have fresher data than me, all without paying an ongoing fee.

 

My take is that if someone won't pay for a $30 yearly membership and $10 one-time software license then they likely won't spend money to stock, hide and maintain caches either.

I do agree with you here, to a point, they don't not place caches, they place low quality caches. There have been a ton of new caches hidden by iphone users (no, they aren't pm's), that have horrible coordinates (I've helped some of these by giving real coordinates) very low grade containers that probably won't survive a month or two, no or low grade swag, etc.

[+roziecakes]

That's not the point. Your GPS is included...I don't use a GPS so why should I have to pay for it? I feel it should be made clear that everything is included EXCEPT the iphone. Then, I have a choice of which to purchase. I'm sure I'll have no regrets...but, in reality, I just spent 30 I didn't have to.

 

i did not get a GPS when i upgraded to premium. did you?

 

btw, there's plenty of smartphone applications that will work with the premium features (i.e. GPX downloads) just like a GPS handheld. why not use those?

 

You, either, huh? Say, you don't suppose its just the two of us that didn't get a free GPS when we signed up, do you?

 

I think that's a Platinum Member Only feature...

[+pppingme]

Does the iPhone app let you find premium member only caches without a a premium membership?

Who wants to find caches hidden by snobs? Also, non PM's can log pm caches just fine.

 

Does the iPhone app let you create premium member caches and view the audit log for these cache pages?

A pointless feature, audit logs have done nothing helpful and only cause conflict between CO's and viewers, oh, and I don't think your little audit logs show iphone users anyway.

 

Does the iPhone app let you create bookmark lists?

Pointless feature.

 

Does the iPhone app let you nominate your favorite caches?

Nominate for what? You mean give favorite points? I'm still not sure I even get the point of this feature.

 

Does the iPhone app let you store the PQ results on offline database and manipulate them with 3rd party tools?

Does someone standing in middle of the city and says, hey, I wonder what the nearest cache is, even care about this? Probably not.

 

Does the iPhone app provide instant notifications?

Who cares about a cache 50 miles away, the typical iphone user is an impulse user, and cares only about the nearest cache they can find.

 

Does the iPhone app give you access to the off-topic forum?

Again, who cares? I'm a PM and could care less about the off-topic forum, if I want conversation unrelated to geocaching, there are a ton better places to go.

 

Does the iPhone app let you specify your title in the forums?

Most of them probably aren't forum users anyway, so a pointless feature, even for those that are. Forum titles don't really mean a lot.

 

Geomate Jr. users...?

This is even worse, a list of out of date caches, with no clear indication of what caching is all about, these devices have resulted in more missing caches than any other single factor. New geomate users think its ok to take the cache, they think thats what its all about.

[+addisonbr]

How is it smart from a business perspective to piss off your more lucrative customers?

...

I very much understand the value of premium membership, its that I can bulk download caches (via pq's), load it on my gps, then go stand anywhere in town and hit nearest on my gps. As of now, so can any iphone user, and they have fresher data than me, all without paying an ongoing fee.

It sounds like you have a lot of good reasons to feel that the iPhone app is a better deal than the Premium Membership.

 

My suggestion is that if you do ultimately decide to let your Premium Membership lapse because the iPhone app gives a better deal for the money, to send Groundspeak a polite but clear email outlining your reasoning. It's good feedback for them to hear from customers who cancel their service, why they're leaving - it would be a waste if you downgraded to basic without telling them why.

Edited January 9, 2011 by addisonbr

[ao318]

As both an iPhone app user and a PM user with a dedicated GPS that does paperless, I use the app (with PM benefits) to find real time info about a specific cache or I use it if and when I'm about and my kids ask, "Dad, you think there is a cache around here?"

 

The App does not allow a basic user to see caches near them that are PM caches. It does not allow the basic user to load all their PQ's in it for use when you are out of cell range. These are just a couple of things the app does not allow the basic member to do vs a PM.

 

There are only a few Apps out there that you can download for free and then utilize your enhanced site membership to access their app. One that I do know of and use is the "Netflix" app, but I pay a "monthly" fee to access this app and service. If I stop or cancel my membership I can no longer access the app. With my GC.com app I can continue to utilize it no matter if I remain a PM or a Basic Member, just like the website. So, paying a one time fee for something that makes things easier for me in the field is no big deal.

[+Chokecherry]

I have to say as an iphone user and premium member the only reason I ever did the premium membership is because I wanted to create 2 pq's for a trip I was on. To me it is not a feature that I ever use as I don't bulk down load. I load the caches I specifically want to find into my unit. Even after I ran the PQ's I hand picked the caches I wanted to do. The only reason I'm keeping my premium membership is because I like the stats and occasionally the book mark feature.

 

But really one should investigate the bells and whistles of the premium membership before they invest in it and see if it's something that actually poses some use to them. For the way I cache it offers very little in the way of usefulness for me. But that's ok. I still got it and I still use my application.

[+tozainamboku]

How is it smart from a business perspective to piss off your more lucrative customers?

...

I very much understand the value of premium membership, its that I can bulk download caches (via pq's), load it on my gps, then go stand anywhere in town and hit nearest on my gps. As of now, so can any iphone user, and they have fresher data than me, all without paying an ongoing fee.

It sounds like you have a lot of good reasons to feel that the iPhone app is a better deal than the Premium Membership.

 

My suggestion is that if you do ultimately decide to let your Premium Membership lapse because the iPhone app gives a better deal for the money, to send Groundspeak a polite but clear email outlining your reasoning. It's good feedback for them to hear from customers who cancel their service, why they're leaving - it would be a waste if you downgraded to basic without telling them why.

I suppose Potato Finder's issue is that a non-premium iPhone user can access the Geocaching.com database while in the field to find nearby caches so long as they have cell coverage, while a GPSr users has to pay for a premium membership in order to go paperless caching. Since this is the only use he has for a premium membership, I suppose I can see where it seems a little unfair.

 

I agree with him to a point.

 

I suspect that this is the issue that caused Garmin to start their own opengeocaching site. It would seem clear that if someone wanted to start geocaching, they would be better off getting an iPhone (or other smart phone with a geoaching app) then to buy a Garmin (or other) GPS with GPX capability. For $10 the smartphone user can have access to the Groundspeak database for the life of their phone; while if they purchase a Garmin unit it will cost them $30 per year just to get the GPX files to load on their unit. The Garmin opengeocaching.com site provides GPX files for free. There is no premium membership. If you have a Garmin unit that supports paperless caching, you can use all the capabilities on the Garmin site without paying anything else. (And, by the way, if you have an iPhone, because they have a public API, there is now a iPhone app for opengeocaching and it is free).

 

In order to compete, I believe that Groundspeak will have to provide some GPX capability for basic members. Perhaps basic members should be allowed 1 PQ per day, instead of the 5 per day that premium members get. Perhaps the filtering would not be as sophisticated as well. Then non-premium members could download 1000 caches to their GPS before heading out and be as well off as iPhone users, at least so long as they stay in the area they covered with their PQ.

[+addisonbr]

I suppose Potato Finder's issue is that a non-premium iPhone user can access the Geocaching.com database while in the field to find nearby caches so long as they have cell coverage, while a GPSr users has to pay for a premium membership in order to go paperless caching.

FWIW, I was using a phone to go paperless caching as far back as 2006. Well before the iPhone app, any phone with Internet capabilities could access the web site and pull up the nearest caches. I did this routinely with my Treo.

 

It's not entirely clear to me how much effort Groundspeak is supposed to put into crippling their product to protect a subset of their subscribers in some way (the subset being those who get no value out of premium memberships except for paperless caching). They could instruct their web site to refuse any connections with mobile browsers, to make sure that only Colorado and Oregon users get to cache on the fly. But I think that would be pretty short-sighted.

[+johnsingleton1974]

Groundspeak +40, n00b -40

 

FAIL

Edited January 9, 2011 by johnsingleton1974

[knowschad]

Does the iPhone app let you find premium member only caches without a a premium membership?

Who wants to find caches hidden by snobs?

OK, you lost me right there, Seeker of Spuds. Surely you aren't saying that cachers that make their hides PM only are snobs? (Rhetorical question... I think it has been answered already)

[+DanOCan]

To answer your second question, it depends on what you want to do. You can access many of the premium member services from the web (like being able to access premium member only caches, create bookmarks, vote for favorites, etc.), and can also get to them by using the built-in browser on your phone. GC.com uses very little Adobe Flash, and so there isn't much you can do on your desktop browser that you can't do on your phone's browser.

 

In terms of reading GPX files, that gets a little tougher. There are other applications in the App Store that can interact with GPX files, but they typically aren't free either. I would guess those that are free (I couldn't find any) are probably not very good.

 

So I'm in the position where I'm going to suggest the same thing that a lot of other folks have in this thread, but hopefully with less snark.

 

Too bad more forum users didn't take this approach. The OP made a statement about thinking the iPhone app would be included and then asked if there were other alternatives. You actually took the time to answer the question and not sit back and make judgements about how the OP was wrong to think such a thing and get all snarky.

 

To get back on topic, I'll add my voice by saying I purchased the iPhone app and I use it for paperless caching on a regular basis, both when I have cell coverage, and more often, when I do not have cell coverage and it works wonderfully. In a world where $0.99 seems to be the standard price for an app, it seems expensive but it has proven to be good value for me.