Request To Be Archived

1.2k · February 15, 2006

Why has someone named zensunni made a request for one of my Temporarily disabled - due to building works - caches to be archived?

The building works are almost finished and the cache can go live again. I'm on top of the situation and archive when needed.

February 15, 2006

Why are you asking the forum, when only zensunni can answer your question?

February 15, 2006

Have seen this person do that on another cache also. Not sure why they need to get involved, thats what Laco & Ecky are there for.

Pete

1.2k · February 15, 2006

"Why are you asking the forum, when only zensunni can answer your question?"

Because I don't understand the process - I'm used to dealing with Eckington and Lactodorum - I wondered why a stranger was trying to get my cache archived??

1.1k · February 15, 2006

Zensunni looks like Harold Shipman - I'd be careful..... :D

Edited February 15, 2006 by The Golem

February 15, 2006

Because I don't understand the process - I'm used to dealing with Eckington and Lactodorum - I wondered why a stranger was trying to get my cache archived??

Email them and ask them then.

Edit - by them I mean Zensunni, not E&L...

Edited February 15, 2006 by Cryptik Souls Crew

1.6k · February 15, 2006

Obviously Zensunni has their reasons.

Lacto & Ecky would not be aware of the situation unless;

They looked at EVERY cache in the UK on a daily basis
Somebody informs them of it by requesting a SBA report

The latter draws the attention of the reviewers, the cache owners and other cachers to a possible/potential problem.

Down to you to sort out with Zensunni I'm afraid.

Oss!

3.9k · February 15, 2006

It has been unavailable for almost four months, maybe a personal approach would have been better.

Oh the flip side, maybe a person approache from the cache owner to the SBA logger would have been better too?

February 15, 2006

"Why are you asking the forum, when only zensunni can answer your question?"

Because I don't understand the process - I'm used to dealing with Eckington and Lactodorum - I wondered why a stranger was trying to get my cache archived??

Lactodorum or Eckington will explain the process to you, if you ask one of them. It's their role to review caches which have been disabled for an unusual length of time, not the Forum's.

If there's a valid reason for the cache being disabled, you can tell them what it is. Unless that procedure has been exhausted, there's no point in raising the matter here.

-Wlw

1.2k · February 15, 2006

Obviously Zensunni has their reasons.

Lacto & Ecky would not be aware of the situation unless;

They looked at EVERY cache in the UK on a daily basis

Somebody informs them of it by requesting a SBA report

The latter draws the attention of the reviewers, the cache owners and other cachers to a possible/potential problem.

Down to you to sort out with Zensunni I'm afraid.

Oss!

OK I think this is of a more general interest than just my one cache that I'l happily remove.

Whats a SBA report?

Can anybody file a Request to Archive on anybody elses cache?

Email on it's way to Zensunni

Steve/Birdman of Liskatraz

February 15, 2006

Funnily enough, I had an archive request today, from the same guy.... and I decided that it probably WAS time to archive "Along the Canal" in Newbury.

Paul

February 15, 2006

SBA = Should Be Archived

Anyone can post one, its another option like "Found it" when you log a visit on a cache page

1.2k · February 15, 2006

Apologies.. it's wasn't intended to be a get at zensunni post... However its not happened before and I didn't understand the process.

The field where the cache was hidden was "removed" to a depth of 50 feet for a major underground sewage works!

Its been filled in and should be back to normal very shortly at which point the cache will go live again.

February 16, 2006

Whats a SBA report?

It just highlights your opinion that the cache in question Should Be Archived.

For example, suppose someone's left the game (no longer logs onto geocaching.com) and one of their caches has been trashed or is otherwise in a parlous state. An SBA log is a convenient way to report this situation to the powers that be.

Can anybody file a Request to Archive on anybody elses cache?

Yes.

Without any comment on the current situation: it's almost certainly appropriate to attempt to contact the owner before making an SBA log. But it's perfectly understandable that some people (perhaps less aware of the nuances) may omit to do that.

SBA logs are a useful mechanism to highlight caches which you think Should Be Archived, if you can't get any response from the owner. (Or, I guess, if there's a genuine dispute over the legitimacy of a cache. No idea how common that is.)

1.1k · February 16, 2006

I had an SBA log on one of my caches. My initial reaction was "Cheeky #'#@er! I'll decide when my cache should be archived!", but then after a few seconds reflection, it had been disabled for 2 months while I looked for a new location after it had been muggled, so the SBA was right. As it happened, when it was logged, I had just finished preparing the new container and was checking the co-ordinates for its new location, so I posted a note explaining the situation, and activated the new cache a few days later. I guess if I'd done nothing, I'd shortly have received an email from L or E asking what I was going to do.

I think that the SBA log is useful if a cache place is not contactable, but from the receiver's point of view, a personal email is less 'aggressive' - a week before my SBA, another local cacher emailed me saying "So, when are you going to re-activate your cache then?", which made me think "Oh yes, I must get around to that!", and actually get out there and do it.

2.5k · February 16, 2006

Doesnt even look like he was actually in the area, so how can he pass a judgment?

8.6k · February 16, 2006

I agree that it would have been better if Zensunni had emailed Birdman about his disabled cache , to enquire whether it was getting better, or still limping painfully, before issuing a SBA directive to have it put down.

If a cache is disabled for a considerable time, I think it's a good idea to issue a "progress report" every month, in the form of a note on the cache page. This lets cachers know that you haven't forgotten about it! :anibad:

MrsB

February 16, 2006

Zensunni identified one for archiving in Bristol as well. I got the email alert as I have been watching it for the last 5 months waiting for it to be reactivated.

1.1k · February 16, 2006

Doesnt even look like he was actually in the area, so how can he pass a judgment?

I seem to recall recently a few treads along the lines of "How many disabled caches are there near you?" "Isn't it annoying when there's loads of disabled caches?" "Why are some caches disabled for months on end? - Shouldn't they be archived."

Perhaps Zensunni thought that people wanted something done about it, so he's done a search for caches disabled for more than 2 months, and logged SBA for them.

You could think about this in 2 ways:

1- Who made him the 'Cache Police'?

2- It's good to see someone helping out the reviewers by highlighting inactive caches.

As I said earlier, my initial reactiion was 1, followed shortly by 2. (Although I must point out that it wasn't Zensunni who SBAd mine, but somone else, again not local to me).

I'd agree with MrsB's idea that if you've got a disabled cache waiting for roadworks etc, add a note each month jsut to show that you haven't forgotten about it.

Another point I'd like to make - "It's just a hunt for a lunch box, why be so serious!?! © Dan."

1.7k · February 16, 2006

I think the process of posting SBA's (or "Needs Archived") has been nicely explained by a number of people in this thread. Thanks.

Perhaps it would be useful if I added a few words on what happens when I receive them. As has been pointed out, I don't have the wherewithall to constantly monitor all 9-10000 caches in the UK so I rely on you folks to let me know of problems. When a SBA is logged a copy goes to the cache owner and I get one too. I will have a look at the cache concerned and see what the problem is. Most often it is because the cache has been "Temporarily Disabled" for an extended time. The operative word is "Temporarily" and this should not normally be longer than a month or two. Such caches appear in searches, lists and PQ's and it can be annoying for people to keep seeing them when they can't be hunted.

I also look at when the cache owner last logged onto the site. Based on these coniderations I may leave things for a few days to see whether the owner does anything about it or I might decide to archive the cache there and then. If a cache owner sees one of these logs they are free to post a note on their own cache explaining the delay or they can (and do sometimes) e-mail me with the reason. In many cases I am happy to let the situation drift for a while.

Also bear in mind that even if I, or the owner, archive the cache I can easily and quickly unarchive it.

I'd like to emphasis that this is a normal "housekeeping" function and in no way reflects badly on the owner or the poster of the SBA log :anibad: .

As for the latest list of SBA's by zensunni, it is possible and quite legitimate to request a list of Disabled caches and go through them without visiting the caches concerned. I would like to thank zensunni and all the other people who help me out in this way.

2.5k · February 16, 2006

We are ALL the cache police! It's up to all of us to love and nuture, and yes, sometimes humanely put down too, the caches in our area, in order to support our hobby.

The SBA note is an option by which we can quickly flag up any caches that we have concerns about. If there is no problem with your cache, then there should be no problem from the SBA. If it comes across as offensive to post them, then I guess people will be reluctant to do so and caches that require attention will get left. If people were to post them maliciously, then I guess our mods would spot their game soon enough.

E-nagging NickPick seemed to do the job quite nicely for me... before they invented SBAs!! LOL

1.8k · February 16, 2006

I think one problem is the language used by the system. Because it says "Should be archived" it looks like an instruction, hence the cache police accusation. It is also an inappropriate message if the logger has not actually seen the cache and has no idea why the cache has not been replaced. If instead it said "consider archiving" it would be a more accurate prompt and far less confrontational as it raises a question for others rather than making a direct judgement.

February 16, 2006

Perhaps the use of the new "Needs Maintenance" log is a new option that people could use.

Maybe if the Maintenance isn’t done let say in 30 days then a SBA should be placed.

I feel if a cacher can’t maintain the caches they have placed, then they should be either adopted or archived to give others a chance to place a new cache in the area.

As for temporary disabled caches, how many have you seen written five months ago that say “The cache is missing, I will replace it next week”. I agree with the idea if the owner puts regular updates on the cache page, then this would solve the issue.

I have used a SBA in the past if its obvious the owner has given up the game, and never responds to logs or emails.

See ya…Gary

February 16, 2006

I think one problem is the language used by the system.

Agree entirely. How about renaming it "what's going on with this cache?". (or WGOWTC if you like)

2.9k · February 16, 2006

There is another option the needs maintainance post type.

A sort of less severe SBA log.

1.6k · February 16, 2006

How about renaming it "what's going on with this cache?". (or *WGOWTC if you like)

Careful Barry, I nearly logged on to GC.com and logged that cache before ARCHAIC CHARMER did!!!

:anibad:

February 17, 2006

quote

"If it comes across as offensive to post them, then I guess people will be reluctant to do so and caches that require attention will get left"

Yeap!

This thread has put me off posting any S.B.A.'s .

Edited February 17, 2006 by t.a.folk

February 17, 2006

I was unable to read the forum yesterday and was unaware of this thread tilll this morning.

I think others have explained my position very clearly and further comment from me is unnecessary

Ken

February 17, 2006

Zensunni identified one for archiving in Bristol as well. I got the email alert as I have been watching it for the last 5 months waiting for it to be reactivated.

Zensunni, to be honest as I was the last visitor to the Bristol one I was going to suggest the same course of action when it hit 6 months disabled status (which I consider an acceptable period of time with the particular circumstances of this cache) and it was only a couple of weeks away anyway so youve done me a favour - :huh:

Cheers

Mark

1.7k · February 17, 2006

quote
"If it comes across as offensive to post them, then I guess people will be reluctant to do so and caches that require attention will get left"

Yeap!

This thread has put me off posting any S.B.A.'s .

Shame! I need all the help I can get and SBA's are a useful way everyone can help me here. I for one certainly don't find them offensive.

1.8k · February 17, 2006

quote
"If it comes across as offensive to post them, then I guess people will be reluctant to do so and caches that require attention will get left"

Yeap!

This thread has put me off posting any S.B.A.'s .

Shame! I need all the help I can get and SBA's are a useful way everyone can help me here. I for one certainly don't find them offensive.

I have no problem with the concept, I just think the way the system handles it is not optimal in terms of language. I presume the "needs maintenance" doesn't inform the reviewers?

1.7k · February 17, 2006

I have no problem with the concept, I just think the way the system handles it is not optimal in terms of language. I presume the "needs maintenance" doesn't inform the reviewers?

True :laughing:

Edited February 17, 2006 by Lactodorum

1.2k · February 18, 2006

I think the concept is great - no problems at all.

If the SBA had come from Eckington or Lactodorum then I would have no problem with that.

If it had come as a question from a local cacher I could accept that quite easily.

It just comes as a bit of a shock when a total stranger (and honestly I mean no offence to anyone) suddenly pops up suggesting you archive your cache...

Maybe either - the system needs looking at - and/or When a SBA is posted then a note explaining why is attached.

2.5k · February 18, 2006

Opinion

I think that some people are obsessed with keeping their own full UK database, and keeping it updated, attempting to almost mirror the UK part of the site.

Surely the only time you require an accurate picture of an area is when you are thinking of visiting; after all an unavailable cache in Cornwall is not going to upset my trip around Manchester tomorrow, is it?

OK if I'm going to Cornwall then knowing the status of the cache is important, but it is clear that it is unavailable so I would not attempt to do it anyway; it was clear that there was an issue and you correctly placed the cache on hold until the situation resolved.

I think that some are just trying to maintain data which is predominantly out of data the second you receive it.

When I plan a trip I do use GSAK for the initial planning but I always refer back to GC.com for the more accurate picture and also to check if any new caches have been placed, If there has been changes, I just bring in each single GPX record from GC.com into GSAK

Moote

February 18, 2006

Opinion

I think that some people are obsessed with keeping their own full UK database, and keeping it updated, attempting to almost mirror the UK part of the site.

Surely the only time you require an accurate picture of an area is when you are thinking of visiting; after all an unavailable cache in Cornwall is not going to upset my trip around Manchester tomorrow, is it?

Moote

I used to be obsessed with keeping an up-to-date DB of all UK caches - and then I realised that I didn't need them - I now keep it to within 200 miles from home - and even then I sometimes feel it's overkill.

As Moote says, if I go away from home, then I'll need a current list of caches for where I'm going.

civilised

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