In The Interest Of Accuracy...

[Fledermaus]

Dearest "Pepper" and anyone else who might be concered,

 

It saddens me to think that I have to sink so low as to do this, but here it is anyway:

 

In the interest of accuracy, when quoting someone elses private E-Mail in public, which is sort of a dispicable act IMHO, you should present it with all of it's parts. You failed to mention that you used the following subject matter in your initial message, stating that my message to you was "Spam".

 

Here are both messages intact:

======================================================

Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 22:59:24 -0700 (PDT)

From: "Fledermaus" <derfledermaus2003@yahoo.com>

Subject: Re: Spam!

To: [Pepper - name and e-mail address removed by moderator]

 

As per your requested, you are no longer within my address book. In fact, you are now on My Spam List.

 

What I don't understand is the fact that I was simply informing you of the existance of other caching systems. But if you don't care about that, then that's your choice.

 

I am not selling a product nor am I sponsoring one or any organization.

 

/\**/\

 

[Pepper - name and e-mail address removed by moderator] wrote:

 

Do me a favor and remove me from your email list.

 

Thank you

 

Pepper

 

 

Visit My Personal Webpage: www.geocities.com/kd7krh/index.html

======================================================

 

My response was simple and straight forward. You considered my message, regarding the other caching sites, as "SPAM"(implying that I am selling something) and I informed you otherwise. You block me, I block you, it's as simple as that. My actions and reply were in kind, but you felt that they were inappropriate. SAD!

 

What's even sadder is when I, or anyone else for that matter, gets falsely accused of action(s) that were not commited. In fact, I was simply trying to be helpful to a fellow geocacher by letting her know that GC.COM is not the only "Fish In The Sea". Fun comes in many forms and with many names, i.e. GC, LBNA, NC, TC and a couple others I don't recall.

 

Next time I have information, whether it be about geocaching or that which might be associated with it, to share with others, maybe I should just keep my &$#@ mouth shut and let others find their own way in the dark.

 

Imply what you will to this public message, but be careful not to read between the lines of things not said. Sorry, No batteries included!

 

How long shall this post stay on the system is anyones guess.

 

/\**/\

Edited April 27, 2005 by Keystone Approver

[+travisl]

As long as we're venting...

 

Sending out a blanket e-mail to dozens of people which lists everyone's e-mail address clearly in the "to:" line, is also "sort of a dispicable act in some circles." I've no doubt that some of the real spam I've been receiving has been the result of malicious software harvesting my e-mail address off of messages like yours.

 

In the future, it'd be best to list all the recipients in the bcc: line of your broadcast e-mails.

 

And, for the record, I've known of the other geocaching sites for years, and found them lacking. Your blanket e-mail taught me nothing I didn't already know, except for a few e-mail addresses of other cachers.

[Fledermaus]

Appologies to those who's E-Mail address were inadvertanly publicized! That was my very first "Blanket E-Mail" and I did it incorrectly.

 

I was unaware that all the address were sent out to everybody, as they apparently were. As for the use of the "BCC" function, I shall keep that in mind, if I should ever choose to inform multiple persons about anything in the future.

 

The sending of those address was purely unintentional and it shall not happen again, now that I know the consequences. I shall keep information to myself in the future and visit the forums less often.

 

BTW, how are the plans fore the "Bremerton Cache Machine II" coming along? I haven't heard from your regarding that activity, not have I been on the forums much to read whatever might be there.

 

I have been wanting to simplify/shorten/changed my E-Mail address in the past and have now done so, which by the way, is unrelated to the previous incident.

 

/\**/\

[+Renegade Knight]

...As per your requested, you are no longer within my address book. In fact, you are now on My Spam List.

 

What I don't understand is the fact that I was simply informing you of the existance of other caching systems. But if you don't care about that, then that's your choice.

 

I am not selling a product nor am I sponsoring one or any organization....

Peppers email was short and to the point. They were obviously annoyed but not rude either. They did not ban communications, just requested to not be included in mass mailings.

 

Your response however was interesting. First you retaliated by blocking all communications, or at least saying you did. So you got in the last word on a person who you clearly thought was important enough to email to begin with. Hopefully that was just a knee jerk reaction that you reconsidered and not an indication of being superficial.

 

Next we have the statement that you are not selling or sponsoring any other organization. Technically true. I'd say you were promoting them which isn't much of a stretch from selling.

 

If you come to the forums you will get opinions. I agree that Pepper should not of made the private emails public, but now you both have and that's that. Pepper didn't need to get bent, but they did learn in that thread and said as much. They got over it. Are you going to do the same?

Edited April 27, 2005 by Renegade Knight

[+Bull Moose]

I saw "Spam and Pepper" and thought maybe this was a thread about sandwiches.

I'm so hungry.

[Fledermaus]

By not responding with complications, the answer shall be obvious. I speak without frills, bells and whistles, leaving my remarks to sound as "cold as ice" and often misinterpreted. I shall speak no more of this subject and perhaps of few others in the future. It's time to fly back to my cave, lick my wounds and return quietly another day.

 

If someone else should choose to close this topic, be my guest. However, I wonder what other responses will occure. I have said my last and someone else may have the last word(s)

 

Spam & Pepper Jack Cheese, with lots of Horse-Radish and Onions!

 

/\**/\

Edited April 27, 2005 by Fledermaus

[+NomadRaven]

Ewww, canned meat. I just had the most delicious bruschetta!

 

I will never understand why some people feel the need to make such a big deal out of spam. It's so much easier just to hit the delete key a few* times each morning than to write long rants in the forums in an attempt to make someone look bad. You will get "spam." I'm sorry, but it's going to happen. You will also get cut off by other drivers in traffic and people with 13 items will go in front of you at the 12 items or less stand at the grocery store. Puppies grow up, get old, and die. People will trade down at geocaches sometimes.

 

Geocachers in this area used to be so friendly. What happened?

 

I hate how people feel like it's ok to berate someone at the other end of a computer when they wouldn't do the same in person. I've been guilty of the same thing myself, but always regretted it later.

 

It's been such nice weather and the days are getting so much longer. I can't wait until my workload calms down so I can go geocaching again!

 

NR

 

*Or a few hundred, for those of us with our own domains.

[Keystone]

Appologies to those who's E-Mail address were inadvertanly publicized! That was my very first "Blanket E-Mail" and I did it incorrectly.

 

I was unaware that all the address were sent out to everybody, as they apparently were. As for the use of the "BCC" function, I shall keep that in mind, if I should ever choose to inform multiple persons about anything in the future.

 

The sending of those address was purely unintentional and it shall not happen again, now that I know the consequences. I shall keep information to myself in the future and visit the forums less often.

You should also refrain from posting a geocacher's e-mail address, and their real name, here in a public forum where it can be harvested by spammers and others. I have edited your post to remove Pepper's information. You may wish to consider removing your own information; I did not do so on the grounds that you posted it voluntarily. See the Forum Guidelines that are linked at the top left corner of the forum page.

[+Pepper]

Geocachers in this area used to be so friendly.  What happened?

 

I hate how people feel like it's ok to berate someone at the other end of a computer when they wouldn't do the same in person. 

NR

NR, first off everybody is still friendly, nothing happen I just made a bad judgement.

 

If i've (berated)? somebody I'm sorry!

 

Fledermaus,

 

Here’s a public apology!

 

I’m not so savvy when it comes to anything computer related, I truly did think that SPAM meant something bad was fixin’ to start happen to me. To be honest I don’t even know what the acronym for SPAM is, obviously I need to be informed.

 

I said it before “I could be dead wrong” in posting this in the [Pepper is boiling mad thread] and I will say it now I was wrong!

 

I had no idea it was gonna come to this, so I’m sorry you got offended by my actions.

 

I have no problems admitting when I’m WRONG.

 

Pepper

 

**Bad qouting fixed by moderator**

Edited April 27, 2005 by Team Misguided

[+Pepper]

dern it see i can't even do a quote properly! Dohhh.....

 

Pepepr

[+Stump]

Peppers email was short and to the point. They were obviously annoyed but not rude either. They did not ban communications, just requested to not be included in mass mailings.

We have to refer to Pepper in the plural tense now? I think she's great but she's not quite royalty yet.

 

FWIW, spam is any unsolicited e-mail. It's often commercial but it doesn't have to be. Fledermaus' e-mail was by definition, spam.

 

NR, I just went to two events last weekend (4 this month!) and can assure you geocachers are still very friendly in this area.

[+Ambrosia]

Hear, hear!

[+Stump]

To be honest I don’t even know what the acronym for SPAM is, obviously I need to be informed.

There is some debate about the source of the term, but the generally accepted version is that it comes from the Monty Python song, "Spam spam spam spam, spam spam spam spam, lovely spam, wonderful spam…" Like the song, spam is an endless repetition of worthless text.

 

Another school of thought maintains that it comes from the computer group lab at the University of Southern California who gave it that name because it has many of the same characteristics as the lunch meat, SPAM:

 

Nobody wants it or ever asks for it.

No one ever eats it; it is the first item to be pushed to the side when eating the entree.

Sometimes it is actually tasty, like 1% of junk mail that is really useful to some people.

 

Where did the name "SPAM" come from?

[+paul2tele]

I just got back from Hawaii, where you can order a breakfast sandwich at Burger King with spam, sausage, or ham. Spam is BIG in Hawaii!

[+Renegade Knight]

...We have to refer to Pepper in the plural tense now? I think she's great but she's not quite royalty yet. ...

Not so much royalty as I try not to identify women as women on the internet. Not unless I know it's ok. It's a habit I picked up from working with people who had been targeted with unwanted attention that men can direct liberally if they choose.

 

Men in general are less sensative to this (and women less likey to direct unwated attention to begin with).

[+The Navigatorz]

Hey, let's all go geocaching!!

[+shunra]

Sending out a blanket e-mail to dozens of people which lists everyone's e-mail address clearly in the "to:" line, is also "sort of a dispicable act in some circles."  I've no doubt that some of the real spam I've been receiving has been the result of malicious software harvesting my e-mail address off of messages like yours.

 

In the future, it'd be best to list all the recipients in the bcc: line of your broadcast e-mails.

 

And, for the record, I've known of the other geocaching sites for years, and found them lacking.

Travis,

 

I don't know how your "for the record" statement is relevant, and it is certainly just a personal opinion. TC (existing since last November, not "for years") is a different game; it doesn't compete with GC, and many people play on both sites. This includes many GC approvers.

 

As to the rest of your message, you're totally right, of course, and no sensible person would disagree with you. Indeed, Terracaching has just updated its FAQ to say exactly that.

 

You can read it here.

 

(Registration required)

Edited April 28, 2005 by shunra

[+justybug]

might as well throw my .02 in here as well.

i've managed to refrain from emailing folks about TC, even though i'd love to get more GC cachers involved than we've already got.

i don't feel that spamming ANYONE is ever the way to get something done.

Fledermaus, there's plenty of folks that know about the other games that can be played. if someone is interested, it's probably a better topic to discuss in person, at an event perhaps? being able to notice someone's reaction, and responding appropriately, will likely get you closer to the results you're seeking.

there's also a lot of, misunderstanding i guess, about TC that seems to be fairly prevalent here. which is why, unless it's in a topic such as this, i'm not trying to sway anyone on Geocaching.com's forums to play a different game. not the place, or the audience really.

to the rest of the forum members, please rest assured i have no intention of surprising your mailboxes with an email singing the praises of Terracaching, or any other site.

If you meet me at an event, i may bring it up, but i'm just as happy to talk about Geocaching, which is what got me started in all this lunacy anyway!!

the badge of "disgruntled ex-geocachers" still seems to be pinned on most of the membership at terracaching, and from what i've seen and know from dealing with folks there, it's just not true (at least in washington, or the seattle metro locals etc...)

so, enough with the rambling..

[+Cav Scout]

Does anyone remember the words to Monty Pythons SPAM, SPAM, SPAM song? Maybe there is not a song but just a bunch of Vikings in a restaurant singing SPAM! SPAM! SPAM!

[+Prying Pandora]

Does anyone remember the words to Monty Pythons SPAM, SPAM, SPAM song? Maybe there is not a song but just a bunch of Vikings in a restaurant singing SPAM! SPAM! SPAM!

Lovely spam, wonderful spa-a-m,

Lovely spam, wonderful S Spam,

Spa-a-a-a-a-a-a-am,

Spa-a-a-a-a-a-a-am,

SPA-A-A-A-A-A-A-AM,

SPA-A-A-A-A-A-A-AM,

LOVELY SPAM, LOVELY SPAM,

LOVELY SPAM, LOVELY SPAM,

LOVELY SPA-A-A-A-AM...

SPA-AM, SPA-AM, SPA-AM, SPA-A-A-AM!

 

(Some of them were chanting SPAM, SPAM, SPAM, SPAM in the background during all that)

Edited April 28, 2005 by Phil & Cathy

[+Stump]

Does anyone remember the words to Monty Pythons SPAM, SPAM, SPAM song? Maybe there is not a song but just a bunch of Vikings in a restaurant singing SPAM! SPAM! SPAM!

The Spam Song (.wav 644k)

 

Scene: A cafe. One table is occupied by a group of Vikings wearing horned helmets. Whenever the word "spam" is repeated, they begin singing and/or chanting. A man and his wife enter. The man is played by Eric Idle, the wife is played by Graham Chapman (in drag), and the waitress is played by Terry Jones, also in drag.

 

Man: You sit here, dear.

Wife: All right.

Man: Morning!

Waitress: Morning!

Man: Well, what've you got?

Waitress: Well, there's egg and bacon; egg sausage and bacon; egg and spam; egg bacon and spam; egg bacon sausage and spam; spam bacon sausage and spam; spam egg spam spam bacon and spam; spam sausage spam spam bacon spam tomato and spam;

Vikings: Spam spam spam spam...

Waitress: ...spam spam spam egg and spam; spam spam spam spam spam spam baked beans spam spam spam...

Vikings: Spam! Lovely spam! Lovely spam!

Waitress: ...or Lobster Thermidor a Crevette with a mornay sauce served in a Provencale manner with shallots and aubergines garnished with truffle pate, brandy and with a fried egg on top and spam.

Wife: Have you got anything without spam?

Waitress: Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.

Wife: I don't want ANY spam!

Man: Why can't she have egg bacon spam and sausage?

Wife: THAT'S got spam in it!

Man: Hasn't got as much spam in it as spam egg sausage and spam, has it?

Vikings: Spam spam spam spam... (Crescendo through next few lines...)

Wife: Could you do the egg bacon spam and sausage without the spam then?

Waitress: Urgghh!

Wife: What do you mean 'Urgghh'? I don't like spam!

Vikings: Lovely spam! Wonderful spam!

Waitress: Shut up!

Vikings: Lovely spam! Wonderful spam!

Waitress: Shut up! (Vikings stop) Bloody Vikings! You can't have egg bacon spam and sausage without the spam.

Wife: I don't like spam!

Man: Sshh, dear, don't cause a fuss. I'll have your spam. I love it. I'm having spam spam spam spam spam spam spam beaked beans spam spam spam and spam!

Vikings: Spam spam spam spam. Lovely spam! Wonderful spam!

Waitress: Shut up!! Baked beans are off.

Man: Well could I have her spam instead of the baked beans then?

Waitress: You mean spam spam spam spam spam spam... (but it is too late and the Vikings drown her words)

Vikings: Spam spam spam spam. Lovely spam! Wonderful spam! Spam spa-a-a-a-a-am spam spa-a-a-a-a-am spam. Lovely spam! Lovely spam! Lovely spam! Lovely spam! Lovely spam! Spam spam spam spam!

[+WeightMan]

I don't think I have seen this much Spam on the forum in quite a while. Isn't there something the mods can do about that?

[Team Misguided]

While I love Monty Python, and will likely download that .wav when I get home, I don't see where this has much to do with geocaching any longer.

 

To sum up, an email was sent to many people and some of those people did not find the email to be of interest. There were misunderstandings on both sides of the email and apologies have been made for those misunderstandings. I think we can safely let this topic slide off the page now.

[+OldBaldEagle]

Pepper is obviously Peppers as her avatar clearly indicates.

 

What is the problem here?

[+Criminal]

Well frankly, the fact that I was not spammed causes me to feel as though I’m not welcome on those other sites. When that happens, I grab a bottle of vodka out of the cupboard and crawl in behind the couch in the dark. I’m not coming back out either.

[+SeabeckTribe]

For every one that wants to know. --- S.P.A.M --- Sales . Promotions . Advertisements . Marketing

 

Hyass tyee of SeabeckTribe