Would you pay?

[+Cushie Butterfield]

If a multi cache was set up in the grounds of somewhere with an entrance fee (eg £5 - £10 for adults and £2.50 - £5 for children) would you pay to get in and combine the cache with a day out to the attraction or avoid it?

Would you be more inclined to visit an attraction if there was a decent geocache in the grounds?

 

We were looking at days out for half term and thought it would be good if we could visit castles etc AND look for caches.

Edited February 16, 2008 by Team Skully

[+JustAlan]

I thought the rules of the game were that caches couldn't be placed in places where an admission fee was payable. I could be wrong though.

 

My personal opinion is that I would be unlikely to go for a cache in a paying attraction, unless it was something I specifically wanted to see, and then the cache would be a bonus. But generally, no, I wouldn't pay to get a cache.

 

Not sure what the attraction owners would be thinking when you asked them if you could hide an ammo box in an area likely to have a lot of visitors in. You would only need one muggle to think you were doing something suspicious and report it to security, and there could be all sorts of problems.

[Alan White]

I too thought that caches inside areas with an entrance fee weren't permitted, especially if the purpose of the cache is to encourage visitors to the attraction. No doubt a reviewer will be along shortly to clarify.

 

To answer your question: I would be no more or less likely to pay the prices you suggest to visit the attraction if it had a cache there. If I were visiting the attraction anyway then I'd certainly do the cache at the same time. Example: Golden Gallery Virtual Cache requires paying the admission to St Pauls Cathedral (£7 adult when I last looked). One day we'll visit the cathedral, but not specifically for the cache.

[+Cushie Butterfield]

Oh well if it's against the rules then there wont be any. I was hoping there would be some puzzle type caches set in grounds of castles and stately homes rather than just wandering around gardens looking at flowers.

If we were looking at two possibles and one had a cache and the other didn't we would go for the one with a cache. Probably the best idea is to look on the map facility and find a cache near an attraction and make a day of it that way.

Thanks for answering.

[Alan White]

If you're looking for places to visit near you and do caches at, Swine, Bovine, Equine is on a public right of way just outside the grounds of the excellent Bodiam Castle.

 

There were/are? a few around Dover Castle and Richborough Roman fort, too.

[+Bill D (wwh)]

I stand to be corrected, but I believe there are some caches where the entrance charge is to maintain the property, not for commercial gain. I think they're grandfathered in, and new caches like that are no longer allowed.

[+HazelS]

I once had a cache archived for having to pay an entrance fee.

 

We were aware we had to pay for entrance, and when we got there, we were told yes, you havwe to pay, but you also have to buy a drink at the bar. The cache was in the grounds of a pub. We decided against it and contacted our friendly reviewers to check if this is ok...

 

Next thing I know, the cache had been archived by them for this reason, so I wasn't too bothered that we hadn't managed a find on it!!!

[+Cushie Butterfield]

We haven't been to Bodium, I'll bear that one in mind, thank you

[+Rubarbb]

Our 50th Find Cache Afternoon Ty had a car parking fee but was well worth it. I think it would depend on how small a charge and the place.

[+SidAndBob]

Our 50th Find Cache Afternoon Ty had a car parking fee but was well worth it. I think it would depend on how small a charge and the place.

We were the last visitors to that cache and would agree it is an excellent way to spend a day.

Well worth the parking fee too.

[+MartyBartfast]

Our 50th Find Cache Afternoon Ty had a car parking fee but was well worth it. I think it would depend on how small a charge and the place.

 

I think fees for car parking are different, if you choose to walk/cycle then you don't have to pay.

[+*mouse*]

A way around this might be to create a multi or puzzle cache where you need to answer questions to find the final hide. This would then be hidden somewhere outside which is free to visit.

The answers would have to be available outside the visitor attraction (eg on their website) but also inside the attraction. This way people would have a choice to pay or not and therefore keep the cache available to everyone.

[+perth pathfinders]

If a multi cache was set up in the grounds of somewhere with an entrance fee (eg £5 - £10 for adults and £2.50 - £5 for children) would you pay to get in and combine the cache with a day out to the attraction or avoid it?

Would you be more inclined to visit an attraction if there was a decent geocache in the grounds?

 

We were looking at days out for half term and thought it would be good if we could visit castles etc AND look for caches.

 

A couple of pounds entrance, or carparking sounds Ok to me.

 

Anything more, I wouldn't want to pay unless it was a place I had really wanted to visit for some time.

 

Locals have probably already visited and paid their fee, those travelling further will have enough travelling expenses without any added extras.

 

Is there not a spot outside, where you get a good view of any castles from a distance, away from muggles? Then if you want to make it a multi, make it a googlable quiz where people can find out info about the castle?

 

For all your hard work setting up a multi, I don't think you will get many hits?

 

Sorry to be so negative.

[+Cushie Butterfield]

I wasn't setting one up, I just wondered why there weren't any but didn't realise that it was against the rules which answered my question. We were looking at the likes of Hever castle, Hampton court etc and trying to weigh up a day there or caching. We were hoping to find somewhere with both.

We are lucky because there are a lot of historical multi caches around our area, we have already learned a lot and visited places we didn't know about.

I was looking at those type of sights to tie in with history at school, I thought the kids would learn more about the tudors on a treasure hunt than they would being told or by reading.

[+Orchards Finest]

We did the two virtual caches in Kew gardens. I believe these caches are grandfathered in. It cost us £18 for the two of us to get in but we had planned to go to Kew anyway and the fact that there were caches there was a bonus. We wouldn't have paid admission just to get the caches.

We also have NT membership so any caches on NT property (such as Bodiam Castle) where admission is charged are 'free' for us so are no problem. We also don't have to pay to park in their car parks!

[+scottpa100]

I did a virtual at Blarney Castle in Ireland. The virt was located in the grounds and the grounds have an entrance fee.

[Alan White]

I wasn't setting one up, I just wondered why there weren't any but didn't realise that it was against the rules which answered my question.

In that case I (and I think everyone else ) misunderstood your OP, for which I apologise. So to answer the question you didn't ask , yes, there are caches which are inside fee-paying areas. Such caches tend to be old and grandfathered according to the rules in place at the time. Other than local knowledge I'm not aware of any way you could easily identify them. You'd need to plot the caches on a map then compare them with other places you'd like to visit.

 

It's a great idea using caching as an educational tool. We've done the same thing and we sometimes think that James has learned far more while out caching with us than he has while at school .

[+Eclectic Penguin]

Bodiam's grounds are free to access - or were free the last time I visited. It used to be my first National Trust visit of the year for several years running as it opens a couple of months before most NT properties. There is a parking fee but this is waived for NT members - and also if you visit by foot as a lot of people do via the Kent & East Sussex Railway which terminates a few hundred yards down the road.

 

Afternoon Ty is another good example of a free location that has parking fees. It's in the St Fagans National History Museum of Wales near Cardiff and is a fabulous multi that'll take you almost to every location in the outdoor museum. You do however have to ask for the cache container in Welsh at the end though! Also, the usual person wasn't there when I asked for it so I was met with a blank expression until my friend mentioned a "tupperware container" full of "trinkets"! Again, you can get there by public transport or by foot.

[+Eclectic Penguin]

I forgot to add one of my caches the main example I was going to use to illustrate!

 

HoW: Llanelli to Llandovery is designed to be completed by taking a train along the Heart of Wales Line from the two towns mentioned in the title, with clues located in stations along the way.

 

Of course, this would mean having to buy a ticket (which is very cheap as the line I believe is subsidized) However, it's perfectly possible to do the multi by car, stopping at each station along the way. This is indeed how most people have completed it to date - and this way is almost certainly easier as you can take your time trying to see the clues rather than spot them from a moving train (it sometimes doesn't even stop at stations not listed as halts).

Edited February 18, 2008 by Eclectic Penguin

[+currykev]

We were looking at the likes of Hever castle, Hampton court etc and trying to weigh up a day there or caching. We were hoping to find somewhere with both.

 

I can assure you if it was possible I'd have beaten you to Hampton Court before now!

[+Happy Humphrey]

It's a great idea using caching as an educational tool. We've done the same thing and we sometimes think that James has learned far more while out caching with us than he has while at school .

I recently set up a "virtual" which takes you on a tour of a local folk village open-air museum. To get the most out of the village you have to pay an entrance fee (to enter the cottages), but I designed it so that this is not essential.

 

You simply read the information boards scattered around and answer questions in the cache description, finally deriving a code-number once you've collected all the answers. You can log the "cache" at that point. You can also use the code number (after extra research) to help solve a puzzle and find a physical cache nearby.

 

Seems to work, no fee necessary and very educational to boot.

[+Accolaidia]

FROM THE GOECACHING CACHE PLACEMENT GUIDELINES

 

"Commercial geocaches are disallowed.

 

Cache listings perceived as commercial will not be published. A commercial cache listing has one or more of the following characteristics:

 

It has overtones of advertising, marketing or promotion.

It suggests or requires that the finder go inside a business, interact with employees and/or purchase a product or service.

It contains links to businesses, agencies, commercial advertisers, charities, or political or social agendas.

It contains the logo of a business or organization, including non-profit organizations.

It contains the name of a business or commercial product."

[+milvus-milvus]

Have you been trawling through some rather old messages?

[+Seaglass Pirates]

FROM THE GOECACHING CACHE PLACEMENT GUIDELINES

 

"Commercial geocaches are disallowed.

 

Cache listings perceived as commercial will not be published. A commercial cache listing has one or more of the following characteristics:

 

It has overtones of advertising, marketing or promotion.

It suggests or requires that the finder go inside a business, interact with employees and/or purchase a product or service.

It contains links to businesses, agencies, commercial advertisers, charities, or political or social agendas.

It contains the logo of a business or organization, including non-profit organizations.

It contains the name of a business or commercial product."

 

They published this and it's in the Arthurian Centre in slaughterbridge. http://coord.info/GC4FQB4

[+MartyBartfast]

 

They published this and it's in the Arthurian Centre in slaughterbridge. http://coord.info/GC4FQB4

 

Is it? the cache page says it's at the base of a flagpole, and Google Streetmap is pointing at a flagpole just by the roadside, so I wouldn't expect to have to pay anything.

[+Pja_cz]

Just as a side-note, my impression is that whether cache can be considered commercial is reviewer's decision - and reviewers' definitions differ by country, and at least in the case of UK have also changed over time. I contacted a reviewer lately because I was thinking of a cache in the London ZOO, and was told this would not be possible because of the admission fee. Strangely enough, caches with entry fee used to be published even in the UK (Golden Galery in St. Pauls, The London Monument or Isle of Wight ... The Lord Palmerston), and in some countries do get published to this date (have a look at the Prague ZOO on the map for instance). There is even an attribute on the GC.com website that literally says: "Access or Parking Fee." In other words, Groundspeak does not forbid caches where you'd need to pay access fee. It is the UK reviewers' (mis)interpretation of the rules that does.

Edited August 5, 2013 by Pja_cz

[+Seaglass Pirates]

 

They published this and it's in the Arthurian Centre in slaughterbridge. http://coord.info/GC4FQB4

 

Is it? the cache page says it's at the base of a flagpole, and Google Streetmap is pointing at a flagpole just by the roadside, so I wouldn't expect to have to pay anything.

 

Is it? The Arrow for the coordinates says something different to the picture and the hint then doesnt it? The flag pole is one of three "St Piran" ones. And unless they built a cyst in the middle of a dense bush,or at the entrance its the one further along, inside the Arthurian Centre by the cafe.

 

Street View Says Linky

 

And I guess you dont have to pay to get it, but as there is no parking along that road, which I know well, you are invited to use the commercial properties car park. But ....

 

"but if you use their carpark please be considerate and consider at least buying a drink to say thanks for the parking."

 

... and as I was referring to, but did not make clear, the rule about no commercial caches etc - from the reference quoted previously, I am surprised this one got published. But there we are .... guidelines not rules. And given the latest post, maybe anything is fair game.

Edited August 5, 2013 by Seaglass Pirates

[Deceangi]

The cache idea in London Zoo, was rejected after discussion by the UK Reviewers, because the entry fee, is well above the Guidance given by Groundspeak to "All" Reviewers. If you would care to look, you'd find the cheapest Adult entry is £23.

 

If either of the posters, above my post, have a issue, please take them directly to Groundspeak. And let they make a decision!

 

Deci

[+MartyBartfast]

 

Is it? The Arrow for the coordinates says something different to the picture and the hint then doesnt it? The flag pole is one of three "St Piran" ones. And unless they built a cyst in the middle of a dense bush,or at the entrance its the one further along, inside the Arthurian Centre by the cafe.

 

No the arrow for the coordinates points at exactly the same spot as StreetView, a small bit of hedge/shrubbery between the entrance to the Arthurian Centre, and what looks like a private house next door, where there is also a flagpole which is accessible from the road without needing to enter either of the premises, so why do you assume that the cache can't be there and must be inside the centre? The cache page specifically states that out of season be careful not to block the private drive when parking, suggesting that the centre is locked up off season, so it would be a strange place to put it. Several people seem to have done it as a cache and dash and I bet a few of them parked off the road on the pull in/verge for the house.

 

Why not have a go next time you're passing and then we'll know for sure.

[+Seaglass Pirates]

Lol - sigh. I didn't know you lived where I live Marty.

[+Pja_cz]

The cache idea in London Zoo, was rejected after discussion by the UK Reviewers, because the entry fee, is well above the Guidance given by Groundspeak to "All" Reviewers. If you would care to look, you'd find the cheapest Adult entry is £23.

 

If either of the posters, above my post, have a issue, please take them directly to Groundspeak. And let they make a decision!

 

Deci

 

It seems that my last post has not come across as intended. I wasn't being spiteful nor was I complaining. I was merely making a point about how things seem to differ between countries and how they have changed over time. The aforementioned Kew Gardens and St. Paul's for instance have caches even though the admission fee is £14.50 and £16 respectively. If my understanding is correct that means those caches wouldn't be published today, and if you ask me, it would be real shame, as many people seem to enjoy them every year despite the admission fee. Of course I will not go out of my way and pay £20 just to find a micro under a bench (and I suspect no one would, really), but if I am visiting a place and paying anyway, finding a cache there is a welcome bonus. That said, I have paid admissions solely to get to caches in the past (both in the UK and abroad), and rarely regretted - visited couple of places I would have ignored otherwise, and it would have been a mistake.

 

I feel no desire to bring anything up with Groundspeak, I guess it's just that my way of looking at this is simply slightly different. If you're paying anyway, why not find a cache. If you have no interest in going there, no one expects you to go and pay just in order to find the cache.

[+Simply Paul]

I got into London Zoo for free (Oct 31st, 2010), but I did have to win a competition to see a screening of An American Werewolf in London there, so that probably doesn't help. Disguising yourself as an escaped Orangutan may not be the safest way of gaining free entry either...

 

Pay-to-Play areas are not my favourite, but I do have a (granfathered) cache at Bekonscot, the world's oldest model village. It was passed because the entrance fee isn't daft, it goes to charity and this was a long time ago. I've no doubt it would be near impossible to get a cache approved there now, even though it 'may' be possible to find the answers to the questions I pose to find the final, online.

 

A recent series placed around Stowe House gardens (a NT property) had to be gathered up as while the National Trust is not-for-profit, it wasn't felt their status (and the high cost of entry?) was appropriate for a series on their pay-to-enter land. The series was relocated into the surrounding land and remains good fun

 

Pubs (and pub events) are an odd one, but where there's a will there's usually a way to make a cache at/near/event in one ok for both the Reviewers and Landlord/lady. Nice to see an old thread revived. I may go looking for a one too; who doesn't love a blast from the past?

 

Edit: If I wanted to place a cache based on London Zoo, this is how I'd do it: Put the Puzzle co-ords within the pay-to-enter area of the zoo by all means, but have the box outside. Give clear instruction that while the easy way to find the cache is to visit the location and pick-up info - multi-style - it would also be possible to get the info required online, by visiting a reference library, etc etc and demonstrate this to the reviewer with appropriate links. Bob is your (monkey's) Uncle!

Edited August 7, 2013 by Simply Paul

[+The Bongtwashes]

The cache idea in London Zoo, was rejected after discussion by the UK Reviewers, because the entry fee, is well above the Guidance given by Groundspeak to "All" Reviewers. If you would care to look, you'd find the cheapest Adult entry is £23.

 

If either of the posters, above my post, have a issue, please take them directly to Groundspeak. And let they make a decision!

 

Deci

Of course a cache wouldn't be allowed in London Zoo as it is in Regent's Park, and caches aren't allowed in Royal Parks, but that's another story.

[Eorthdraca]

I went to Blickling Hall yesterday with a friend. I was fully prepared to pay the entrance price for the grounds of the hall in order to do the caches (and admire the gardens of course). But we took the dog and when I went in to pay, found out that the dog wouldn't have been allowed in any of the pay to enter parts anyway, and then discovered that all the caches are in the park, not in the actual grounds of the house. It's free to walk around the park, so we did that, and found a few. I paid the £3 for parking. If I go there again just for caches, I think I'll park in the free car park and use the £3 that I would have spent on parking, to get a drink at the NT cafe.

 

I would pay if the caches are well maintained and lots of people have posted them as found, otherwise, it can be a bit frustrating going round and not finding the caches, or finding that they're damaged.