Clan Riffster Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 Borrowing an idea from Snoogans..... Try to mentally fast forward a couple years to a completely hypothetical future.... It's 2008. George W has been voted out of office. The new political power needs lots of $$$ to either, finance their Socialized Medicine plan, or, (depending on your party preference) finance their war with Canada. (Sorry Canada! Had to pick on somebody. Nuttin' but love!) In the infinite wisdom of politicians everywhere, they construct a means to make money off of our favorite hobby. Loading caches would then be akin to downloading music. Pay X amount of $$$ for X amount of .gpx files, with the proceeds taxed heavily. You could browse the site, and read basic cache info, but to view the coords or even see a map would cost you $$$. How much would you pay to hunt for a cache described as a film canister hidden in a Wally World lamp post? Micro? What Micro? Those are all in my "Ignore" file. I would only pay for finding caches that seemed interesting to me. That one doesn't. If I could only hunt 1/1 caches due to a disability or transportation issues, I would. I would pay the going rate. Gotta have my fix! I love all caches, even the lame ones. No problem! Where do I send the check? None of the above. I'd wait for CYBrett to develop a hacker program & do it for free. Yeah, I know there are a zillion reasons this could never happen. It's strictly a hypothetical debate. (man, I wish that black helicopter would stop hovering over my house!) Quote Link to comment
+mgbmusic Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 Borrowing an idea from Snoogans..... Try to mentally fast forward a couple years to a completely hypothetical future.... It's 2008. George W has been voted out of office. The new political power needs lots of $$$ to either, finance their Socialized Medicine plan, or, (depending on your party preference) finance their war with Canada. (Sorry Canada! Had to pick on somebody. Nuttin' but love!) In the infinite wisdom of politicians everywhere, they construct a means to make money off of our favorite hobby. Loading caches would then be akin to downloading music. Pay X amount of $$$ for X amount of .gpx files, with the proceeds taxed heavily. You could browse the site, and read basic cache info, but to view the coords or even see a map would cost you $$$. How much would you pay to hunt for a cache described as a film canister hidden in a Wally World lamp post? Micro? What Micro? Those are all in my "Ignore" file. I would only pay for finding caches that seemed interesting to me. That one doesn't. If I could only hunt 1/1 caches due to a disability or transportation issues, I would. I would pay the going rate. Gotta have my fix! I love all caches, even the lame ones. No problem! Where do I send the check? None of the above. I'd wait for CYBrett to develop a hacker program & do it for free. Yeah, I know there are a zillion reasons this could never happen. It's strictly a hypothetical debate. (man, I wish that black helicopter would stop hovering over my house!) Not a dime for any cache ever, except possibly members only caches, which i may or may not sign up for... --MGb Quote Link to comment
+KBI Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 Try to mentally fast forward a couple years to a completely hypothetical future....It's 2008. George W has been voted out of office. Hypothetical is right. What kind of chances do you think George W will have in the non-hypothetical 2008 presidential election? Quote Link to comment
+mgbmusic Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 Try to mentally fast forward a couple years to a completely hypothetical future....It's 2008. George W has been voted out of office. Hypothetical is right. What kind of chances do you think George W will have in the non-hypothetical 2008 presidential election? A great chance as long as they decide to trim a little fat off the constitution...But my answer still stands... --MGb Quote Link to comment
+j_czerwin Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 You couldn't hide the coordinates from a geocacher -- they would hide and find them where the government wouldn't look!! Then there is the same arguement for online gambling and downloading mp3s -- like the government will ever be as fast as new technologies on the internet... It reminds me of a scene in Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy where they keep having to fill out paperwork to do anything -- too slow of a system we have. "Don't Panic" Quote Link to comment
CoyoteRed Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 A great chance as long as they decide to trim a little fat off the constitution...But my answer still stands... I'm thinking a large number of folks will feel outrage, but little surprise. I'm going with a variant of #6. Geocaching would simply go underground. Complete with grand caches being passed around for free, worthless caches passed off as quality stuff, gangland killings over turf, organized crime stepping in to control said underground, underground cache dens, a new cabinet-level department called AGE (Agency for Geocache Enforcement), public advocacy groups will pop up to lobby for the free flow of cache information, ultra-conservative groups will pop up to proclaim the activity sinful and lobby for the outright ban of this lascivious activity as it saps money from household expenses... Umm... You were talking hypothetical, right? Quote Link to comment
Clan Riffster Posted December 17, 2006 Author Share Posted December 17, 2006 a new cabinet-level department called AGE (Agency for Geocache Enforcement) Something I learned decades ago is, the best way to screw something up is to let the Federal Government assume control of it. Think IRS, TSA, etc. If they bungle AGE as bad as they mess up everything else they touch, we should have no problem working our way around their perimeters. I'm imagining having to fill out a questionnaire prior to asking for used film canisters; Are you now, or have you ever been, a cacher? Are you affiliated with any underground caching groups? Will this film canister be used for lawful purposes? Have you ever been convicted of felonious caching? Have you ever had impure thoughts about Wally World light poles? Quote Link to comment
+nekom Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 I'd simply hide my geocaching activities from the government, just like I've been doing for years with my secret underground emu farm. Quote Link to comment
+TrailGators Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 a new cabinet-level department called AGE (Agency for Geocache Enforcement) Something I learned decades ago is, the best way to screw something up is to let the Federal Government assume control of it. Isn't that the truth! It's amazing how many people think giving the Feds more money will solve all our problems. All it does is employ a larger workforce of unmotivated employees. Anyhow, I would revert to hiking and simply finding (but not logging) any caches. Certainly they couldn't tax you for "accidentally" finding at a cache......Right?! Quote Link to comment
+budd-rdc Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 If it's $30 a year to do the same thing I'm doing now, I'm indifferent as to who's administering Geocaching. Maybe a disgruntled Geocacher can argue for "taxation without representation." Maybe we'll have a Supreme Court decision on "Geocaching lameness." People can argue for precedents. The change in the game (and the resulting inefficiencies) might spark a new renaissance. Quote Link to comment
+j_czerwin Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 a new cabinet-level department called AGE (Agency for Geocache Enforcement) Something I learned decades ago is, the best way to screw something up is to let the Federal Government assume control of it. Think IRS, TSA, etc. If they bungle AGE as bad as they mess up everything else they touch, we should have no problem working our way around their perimeters. I'm imagining having to fill out a questionnaire prior to asking for used film canisters; Are you now, or have you ever been, a cacher? Are you affiliated with any underground caching groups? Will this film canister be used for lawful purposes? Have you ever been convicted of felonious caching? Have you ever had impure thoughts about Wally World light poles? Very Funny! Now, the profiling would be an interesting description of people too.... What would the commonality be? Quote Link to comment
+New England n00b Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 Wow. What an... odd... topic. The only people I give money to for this are the guys operating this website. Of course, there are the peripheral beneficiaries - Garmin, local restaurants, various 'pay' parks (though few and far between), gas stations... A geotax would reduce caching overall, therefore those other taxable income sources I have cited above would see less income, and thus pay less into the federal gov. In order to compensate for that loss, they'd have to increase the geotax. Fewer cache outings would occur. This would create an endless loop with no real benefit. So such a tax would be a completely moronic maneuver. And would make me a felon, because there is no way I am going to pay a direct geocaching tax. Quote Link to comment
+KBI Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 So such a tax would be a completely moronic maneuver. And would make me a felon, because there is no way I am going to pay a direct geocaching tax. Hear hear! It's too bad more people don't get that defiant about all the other moronic taxes. Quote Link to comment
+DocDiTTo Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 (edited) [*]Have you ever had impure thoughts about Wally World light poles? Impure thoughts about a lamp post? Funny you should ask... I guess there'd be no film cannisters for me. That's a shame too, cause while they make crappy caches, they're great for holding a pair of AA batteries. Edited December 17, 2006 by DocDiTTo Quote Link to comment
+evelbug Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 I would think if the G-man wanted to get into the pocket of geocachers, the way he would do it would not be by trying to control the game, but by controling the sattelites. The DoD owns the sattelites, so there's nothing saying they couldn't require a fee to use them. It would devistate the industry (espically with all the car nav units that are being pusshed this Christmas) but it could be done... Quote Link to comment
+icefall5 Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 I pick #6. Just wait for CYBrett. Paying for geocaching is stupid, unless it's for a premium membership. Then it's great. That's as long and philosophical of an answer I can give after 2 hours of homework. Quote Link to comment
+horsegeeks Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 Where do I send the check? Quote Link to comment
+DSine Posted December 17, 2006 Share Posted December 17, 2006 Borrowing an idea from Snoogans..... Try to mentally fast forward a couple years to a completely hypothetical future.... It's 2008. George W has been voted out of office. The new political power needs lots of $$$ to either, finance their Socialized Medicine plan, or, (depending on your party preference) finance their war with Canada. (Sorry Canada! Had to pick on somebody. Nuttin' but love!) In the infinite wisdom of politicians everywhere, they construct a means to make money off of our favorite hobby. Loading caches would then be akin to downloading music. Pay X amount of $$$ for X amount of .gpx files, with the proceeds taxed heavily. You could browse the site, and read basic cache info, but to view the coords or even see a map would cost you $$$. How much would you pay to hunt for a cache described as a film canister hidden in a Wally World lamp post? Micro? What Micro? Those are all in my "Ignore" file. I would only pay for finding caches that seemed interesting to me. That one doesn't. If I could only hunt 1/1 caches due to a disability or transportation issues, I would. I would pay the going rate. Gotta have my fix! I love all caches, even the lame ones. No problem! Where do I send the check? None of the above. I'd wait for CYBrett to develop a hacker program & do it for free. Yeah, I know there are a zillion reasons this could never happen. It's strictly a hypothetical debate. (man, I wish that black helicopter would stop hovering over my house!) Hey!! Why is Canada being picked on???? Anyway, don't give your government any ideas, there are probably spies everywhere figuring out what people will pay for and not pay for. Anyway, I think my hubby and I would become felons if we had to pay tax on geocaching, I think our answer would be the last answer With me in law enforcement that is pretty bad Oh well, let's hope it never happens, I would hate to actually really think about it. Quote Link to comment
+thedeadpirate Posted December 18, 2006 Share Posted December 18, 2006 It sounds to me like this hypothetical is really asking if you would pay money to find lamppost caches or would you save it and spend it on cool regular caches. Well, I already pay $30/yr to support this site and find all the lamppost micros my heart desires. Would I pay the same as a tax, no; not for any caches. Well, I guess if the govt was to do as evelbug suggested and tax the gps manufacturers then I would pay the tax when I purchase my next unit. Other than that, I wouldn't pay a special tax for any caches. Quote Link to comment
+Renegade Knight Posted December 18, 2006 Share Posted December 18, 2006 Tax my membership fee. Tax my access to the GPS system. Tax my ability to get an accurate signal instead of that old degraded one. Tax my gas to get to the cache. Tax my food I buy and the soda I drink while out caching. Make me buy a "geocaching license" that gives me park access for free. Put a tax on finding a cache and that's all she wrote. I'll sign up for geo-dashing, or go find land marks, or flashmob, or take up bird watching or get back to fishing and pay for my licence. Quote Link to comment
+TrailGators Posted December 18, 2006 Share Posted December 18, 2006 Tax my membership fee.Tax my access to the GPS system. Tax my ability to get an accurate signal instead of that old degraded one. Tax my gas to get to the cache. Tax my food I buy and the soda I drink while out caching. Make me buy a "geocaching license" that gives me park access for free. Put a tax on finding a cache and that's all she wrote. I'll sign up for geo-dashing, or go find land marks, or flashmob, or take up bird watching or get back to fishing and pay for my licence. Quote Link to comment
+citonyc Posted December 19, 2006 Share Posted December 19, 2006 i wouldnt pay a dime... and would post my gps on ebay.. if paying for caches was the only option it would be like another monthly bill but just to have fun..and we all know how we hate to pay those already.. but it is an interesting topic... and who knows.. you might be right anything could happen!!!! Quote Link to comment
+Wayfinders Posted December 19, 2006 Share Posted December 19, 2006 I try to deal in cache as much as possible, avoiding taxes all together. "Don't ask me what I want it for..... If you don't want to pay some more....." Taxman!! (insert Wicked cool Beatles lead here) Quote Link to comment
+Frumious Jane Posted December 19, 2006 Share Posted December 19, 2006 I hope we never come to this sort of reality. Sign me up for the first shuttle to Mars, man. As soon as they have satellites orbiting over Mars, I'll set up a few rockin' caches. First log: T- false-color red Mars-rock. L- alien head. (they're everywhere) Quote Link to comment
+CYBret Posted December 19, 2006 Share Posted December 19, 2006 I pick #6. Just wait for CYBrett. Paying for geocaching is stupid, unless it's for a premium membership. Then it's great. That's as long and philosophical of an answer I can give after 2 hours of homework. That's a LONG wait...unless this really is some other CYBretT you're talking about. I paid a lot of money in taxes to go caching last Saturday...but that was all gasoline tax. Still, 200 miles worth of driving...about 30 bucks in gas....really, the $30.00 a year membership is the least of my expenses when it comes to this game. Besides, if the government really did get their hand into geocaching they'd just round up all the caches out there in the wild and put them in a "Cache Preserve" and then charge us to come in and look at them (do NOT touch!). There'd probably be some government regulation on cache containers....safety latches on rubberized ammo cans...rollbars....stuff like that. Bret Quote Link to comment
Luckless Posted December 19, 2006 Share Posted December 19, 2006 (edited) Clan man You have way too much free time on your hands. Edited December 19, 2006 by Luckless Quote Link to comment
+Glenn Posted December 20, 2006 Share Posted December 20, 2006 This reminds me of the modem tax hoax then the Internet tax hoax. Quote Link to comment
+gof1 Posted December 20, 2006 Share Posted December 20, 2006 I will NOT pay for lamppost micros. 'Sides, check out the lampposts behind the casino on the reservation. Quote Link to comment
+cachenut06 Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 I will only pay for my premium membership, never would i pay a tax to uncle sam. If i had to, id just look for a hack like people have to get free music from napster today, to get the cordinates to find a cache. Quote Link to comment
+GPSOkie Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Hmmm...in recent history, my other hobby, has actually fallen into a similar situation. I used to have to pay a nominal fee to the BATF to store rocket motors (about what I pay to be a premium member here) and the government decided to run the fee for the license through the roof. My $30 a year hobby now cost several hundred just for the license. So, as hypothetical goes, you never know. Currently, we are in the midst of a lawsuit to resolve the issue. Ironically, there are a lot of parallels between the hobbies. Geocaches being blown up due to security concerns and rocket motors that are considered low-end explosives the require a LEUP permit to store. Actually, I can see the government requiring some type of license or permit to place geocaches since the unsuspecting public occasionally reports or caches as possible weapons. Very thought provoking post!! I truly hope it never comes to that. Quote Link to comment
+DcCow Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Snip.. In the infinite wisdom of politicians everywhere, they construct a means to make money off of our favorite hobby. Loading caches would then be akin to downloading music. Pay X amount of $$$ for X amount of .gpx files, with the proceeds taxed heavily. You could browse the site, and read basic cache info, but to view the coords or even see a map would cost you $$$. How much would you pay to hunt for a cache described as a film canister hidden in a Wally World lamp post? Micro? What Micro? Those are all in my "Ignore" file. I would only pay for finding caches that seemed interesting to me. That one doesn't. If I could only hunt 1/1 caches due to a disability or transportation issues, I would. I would pay the going rate. Gotta have my fix! I love all caches, even the lame ones. No problem! Where do I send the check? None of the above. I'd wait for CYBrett to develop a hacker program & do it for free. Yeah, I know there are a zillion reasons this could never happen. It's strictly a hypothetical debate. (man, I wish that black helicopter would stop hovering over my house!) Great Idea... I'll run it up through the boss! We can call it the Riffster GeoTax! Quote Link to comment
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