Jump to content

Misclassifed Caches


rutson

Recommended Posts

OK, I'm determined NOT to rant, but there seems to be more and more caches which are classified wrongly.

 

I have found two 'unknown' caches in the last week of so which are tricky trads, one of which I spent several hours trying to solve the non-existant puzzle.

 

Then there's trads which turn out to be multis etc. etc.

 

Can I make a plea, if you see a misclassified cache, please let our esteemed moderators know.

 

Sermon over, normality will be resumed in 5......4.......3......2......1.......

Link to comment

I'm glad you started the rant, because it's something that annoyed me a while ago when looking for half a dozen or so traditional caches, found a nice cluster in the index but then discovered that while all listed as trads, you actually had to visit several sites to collect clues before you could find the cache. ;)

Link to comment

OK, I'm determined NOT to rant, but there seems to be more and more caches which are classified wrongly.

 

I have found two 'unknown' caches in the last week of so which are tricky trads, one of which I spent several hours trying to solve the non-existant puzzle.

 

Then there's trads which turn out to be multis etc. etc.

 

Can I make a plea, if you see a misclassified cache, please let our esteemed moderators know.

 

Sermon over, normality will be resumed in 5......4.......3......2......1.......

 

We once did a cache in Greenwich Park, which was classified as a virtual. The cache was in fact a regular, and the posted co-ords were about 200-300' off! GPS was sending us into the middle of a house, which we circled 3 or 4 times!

 

The said cache has since been adopted and rectified.

Link to comment

My pet hate is the Multi which actually has an Offsite puzzle to solve it. No problem with a Multi that says something like "How many gates at this location" but ones that have some form of General Knowledge question are puzzles / mystery in my eyes.

Link to comment

I'm glad you started the rant, because it's something that annoyed me a while ago when looking for half a dozen or so traditional caches, found a nice cluster in the index but then discovered that while all listed as trads, you actually had to visit several sites to collect clues before you could find the cache. ;)

 

Yep, I've been 'caught out like that too :tired:

Link to comment

I can think of more than one "Ofset" cache that the owner did not feel were multis under the guidelines and listed them as "Other". I agree that the listing needs to be correct and if we are not careful the "Other/Puzzle" category will be overloaded. Perhaps some more pondering over the working of the guidelines is needed for this.

Link to comment

I think the guidelines are prefectly clear.

The guidelines list "Offset" caches as a variation on multi-caches but does not make it clear that they should be listed as a "Multi". Looking at it literally it is actually saying that an offset is actually NOT a multi. It also has it's own heading unlike the other milti type caches in the guidelines. Go on, take a fresh look at them.

Link to comment

My pet hate is the Multi which actually has an Offsite puzzle to solve it. No problem with a Multi that says something like "How many gates at this location" but ones that have some form of General Knowledge question are puzzles / mystery in my eyes.

 

*cough* Sensei *cough* Simply Paul *cough*

 

;):tired:

Link to comment

I agree with with the main thrust of the OP. I am not too bothered about straight multis that are listed as puzzles (of which I have done a few) but can understand why someone who isn't interested in puzzles would be miffed at being presented with one in the middle of a multi.

 

The definitions do not cover all scenarios, however. I have a couple of caches which are at the listed coordinates but involve solving a puzzle. According to the rules for puzzle/mystery caches: "The only commonality of this cache type is that the coordinates listed are not of the actual cache location ". I've taken it upon myself to class them as puzzles even though on this definition they should be trads.

Link to comment

My pet hate is the Multi which actually has an Offsite puzzle to solve it. No problem with a Multi that says something like "How many gates at this location" but ones that have some form of General Knowledge question are puzzles / mystery in my eyes.

 

*cough* Sensei *cough* Simply Paul *cough*

 

:) :)

 

Clue?

Link to comment

Another Thing that gets my goat up is misleading by not giving warnings of possible dangers on a cache page, and up or down grading caches, we should remember the Geocaching Code

 

...Not endanger myself or others.

  • Like any outdoor activity, geocaching involves some inherent risk and many geocachers enjoy manageable risks. Minimize inordinate risks.
  • When creating a cache, describe any hidden dangers and, if possible, arrange the hunt to minimize these dangers.
  • When seeking a cache, know your limitations and be aware of your surroundings. Don't attempt anything beyond your abilities.
  • A cache you own, or one you're trading out of, could be found by children or even a prisoner work crew - consider the location of the cache and those likely to find it when deciding what to leave as a trade item.

And consider the Clayjar system to guide us on difficulty / terrain gradings

Link to comment

My pet hate is the Multi which actually has an Offsite puzzle to solve it. No problem with a Multi that says something like "How many gates at this location" but ones that have some form of General Knowledge question are puzzles / mystery in my eyes.

*cough* Sensei *cough* Simply Paul *cough*

:) :)

Clue?

I'm also calling Piddi Bear's bluff. I know which of Sensei's are dodgy (or were, they may have been fixed - sorry mate, there's no solidarity here!) but as far as I know, or have been told, or had suggested, mine are all perfectly described. I wait for you to prove me wrong :)

Link to comment

My pet hate is the Multi which actually has an Offsite puzzle to solve it. No problem with a Multi that says something like "How many gates at this location" but ones that have some form of General Knowledge question are puzzles / mystery in my eyes.

*cough* Sensei *cough* Simply Paul *cough*

:) :)

Clue?

I'm also calling Piddi Bear's bluff. I know which of Sensei's are dodgy (or were, they may have been fixed - sorry mate, there's no solidarity here!) but as far as I know, or have been told, or had suggested, mine are all perfectly described. I wait for you to prove me wrong :)

I take it you are referring to Poker Hand Series. Well, I looked at these at the time comments were made and some changes were made although one may be controversial. :)

Link to comment

Agree with that one. I have one of these in planning and I intend to classify it as a Mystery/Puzzle cache. I can see how someone could classify it as a Multi though in error.

 

As pointed out in another thread (about caches being enabled and then disabled) I think part of the problem lies with the default settings in the cache reporting page. If there was no default option and you had to choose a cache type from the list then possibly fewer caches would be misclassified as Traditionals.

Link to comment

Agree with that one. I have one of these in planning and I intend to classify it as a Mystery/Puzzle cache. I can see how someone could classify it as a Multi though in error.

 

 

Is it necesarily wrong? You have to find various stages to find the final cache, and there's isn't a 'mystery' as such. I agree that the coordinates for each 'stage' aren't on the cahe page itself, but the details of which cache you need to find usually are.

 

I must confess that I haven't actually put one of these out yet, but I think I would be inclined to classify it as a multi. Happy to change my mind though! :)

 

Dave

Link to comment

I have just had Bill & Ben published as a letterbox cache.

 

The GC.com description for a letterbox is - 'A letterbox is another form of treasure hunting using clues instead of coordinates. In some cases, however, a letterbox has coordinates, and the owner has made it a letterbox and a geocache.'

 

I believe that I have met the description as far as it is a treasure hunt using clues instead of co-ordinates, but I got this email today -

 

I wonder, with all the debate about Puzzles at the mo if there will be complaints

So should the cache be a Letterbox, Multi or Puzzle?

 

My apologies to non premium members you won't be able to see the cache just yet. It will however be available for all in a couple of weeks.

 

Oh by the way, I won't be changing it, just wanted to hear opinions. :)

Link to comment

Is it necesarily wrong? You have to find various stages to find the final cache, and there's isn't a 'mystery' as such. I agree that the coordinates for each 'stage' aren't on the cahe page itself, but the details of which cache you need to find usually are.

 

I must confess that I haven't actually put one of these out yet, but I think I would be inclined to classify it as a multi. Happy to change my mind though! :)

Here's my plan:

 

Hide 7 caches, each with a clue inside

Hide an 8th cache but don't post the coords.

To find the 8th cache you must find the other seven, gather the clues and work out the coords.

 

That to me is a Puzzle/Mystery cache but I can see how it could be confused as a multi :(

Link to comment

I have just had Bill & Ben published as a letterbox cache.

 

The GC.com description for a letterbox is - 'A letterbox is another form of treasure hunting using clues instead of coordinates. In some cases, however, a letterbox has coordinates, and the owner has made it a letterbox and a geocache.'

 

I believe that I have met the description as far as it is a treasure hunt using clues instead of co-ordinates, but I got this email today -

 

I wonder, with all the debate about Puzzles at the mo if there will be complaints

So should the cache be a Letterbox, Multi or Puzzle?

 

My apologies to non premium members you won't be able to see the cache just yet. It will however be available for all in a couple of weeks.

 

Oh by the way, I won't be changing it, just wanted to hear opinions. :)

It's a Letterbox cache. The stamp inside is what makes it unique and differentiates it from a Puzzle/Mystery. If the stamp wasn't there then it couldn't be a Letterbox cache.

 

The GC.com definition doesn't mention a stamp though and that leaves it open to debate and could be why you got the email

Link to comment

 

Here's my plan:

 

Hide 7 caches, each with a clue inside

Hide an 8th cache but don't post the coords.

To find the 8th cache you must find the other seven, gather the clues and work out the coords.

 

That to me is a Puzzle/Mystery cache but I can see how it could be confused as a multi :)

 

:( And if I did the same, I think I'd classify it as a multi! :) I expect you're right, but it still strikes me as being more multi than mystery.

 

I suppose I generally (although am open to correction) classify a mystery if some degree of 'additional thought' is involved, be it to the high degree of some of pieman's caches, or merely having to find out where a certain object is before heading there. If all the required coordinates are explicitly available either on the page or via other caches, then I interpret that as a multi. If more than just following the arrow is needed to get the coordinates, then its a mystery.

 

Just my interpretation is all, and for the bonus caches, I'm not sure it makes a great deal of difference! :)

 

Dave

Link to comment

I have just had Bill & Ben published as a letterbox cache.

 

The GC.com description for a letterbox is - 'A letterbox is another form of treasure hunting using clues instead of coordinates. In some cases, however, a letterbox has coordinates, and the owner has made it a letterbox and a geocache.'

 

I believe that I have met the description as far as it is a treasure hunt using clues instead of co-ordinates, but I got this email today -

 

I wonder, with all the debate about Puzzles at the mo if there will be complaints

So should the cache be a Letterbox, Multi or Puzzle?

 

My apologies to non premium members you won't be able to see the cache just yet. It will however be available for all in a couple of weeks.

 

Oh by the way, I won't be changing it, just wanted to hear opinions. :(

It's a Letterbox cache. The stamp inside is what makes it unique and differentiates it from a Puzzle/Mystery. If the stamp wasn't there then it couldn't be a Letterbox cache.

 

The GC.com definition doesn't mention a stamp though and that leaves it open to debate and could be why you got the email

 

I agree with Dino-Irl which is why I left the cache type as it was when I reviewed it. So often when reviewing caches Eckington and I have to change the type to something more appropriate. Although we try and catch them at this stage we sometimes miss which is why we're happy to hear from you about them at any time. It's a moment's job to correct and it saves a lot of hassle. :)

Link to comment

I did a cache recently that was listed as an unknown cache where you had to find 5 other caches that had elements of the co-ords in them.

 

There was no real puzzle element involved as all you had to do was insert the appropriate numbers.

 

Is that not a Multi-cache ??

 

happy caching

 

Gazooks/Graeme :)

Link to comment

From the GC.com website:

Mystery or Puzzle Caches

The “catch-all” of cache types, this form of cache often involves complicated puzzles that you will first need to solve in order to determine the coordinates [....] The only commonality of this cache type is that the coordinates listed are not of the actual cache location but a general reference point, such as a nearby parking location.

 

Multi-Caches

There are many variations to multi-stage caches. The most common is that in which the first cache or waypoint contains or provides coordinates to the next location. Another popular variant is a series of multiple waypoints, each of which provide partial coordinates for the final cache’s position.

It's the coordinate part that decided me that it's a Mystery/Puzzle rather than a Multi

 

edit to say:

 

In my case the other caches are all loggable. The 8 caches will all fit a theme and the 8th will be a "bonus" cache

Edited by dino-irl
Link to comment

From the GC.com website:

 

Multi-Caches

There are many variations to multi-stage caches. <b>The most common is that in which the first cache or waypoint contains or provides coordinates to the next location. </b> Another popular variant is a series of multiple waypoints, each of which provide partial coordinates for the final cache’s position.

It's the coordinate part that decided me that it's a Mystery/Puzzle rather than a Multi

 

edit to say:

 

In my case the other caches are all loggable. The 8 caches will all fit a theme and the 8th will be a "bonus" cache

 

But doesn't the above bit mean that if one cache provides the coordinates to the next, then its a multi?

 

I do like a good debate! :) wonder what the opinion of our mods are? any preferences L & E?

 

Edit to say the tags in the quote didn't work, but you know what i mean!

Edited by purple_pineapple
Link to comment

I have just had Bill & Ben published as a letterbox cache.

 

The GC.com description for a letterbox is - 'A letterbox is another form of treasure hunting using clues instead of coordinates. In some cases, however, a letterbox has coordinates, and the owner has made it a letterbox and a geocache.'

 

I believe that I have met the description as far as it is a treasure hunt using clues instead of co-ordinates, but I got this email today -

 

I wonder, with all the debate about Puzzles at the mo if there will be complaints

So should the cache be a Letterbox, Multi or Puzzle?

 

My apologies to non premium members you won't be able to see the cache just yet. It will however be available for all in a couple of weeks.

 

Oh by the way, I won't be changing it, just wanted to hear opinions. :)

 

Like the setup HH but I would put it down as a puzzle, but its touch and go. The letterbox 'stamp' signature on the log is purely incidential.

Link to comment

Always a difficult one :) !!

 

My usual take on it is that if the co-ordinates can be gathered "in the field" i.e. from other caches or from waymarked clues then it's a multi. If it needs research that is best done elsewhere such as online searches, libraries, books etc. then it's a puzzle.

 

That being said there is often a large margin of interpretation so it's more of an art than a science in deciding so please forgive us if we get it wrong occasionally :(:)

 

Edit to add: If there's a stamp and the owner states it's a letterbox, then a letterbox it is! Single or multi, clues or no clues.

Edited by Lactodorum
Link to comment

<snip>

But doesn't the above bit mean that if one cache provides the coordinates to the next, then its a multi?

</snip>

No, those are all elements of the same cache, and could be co-ords or other info in a micro, or numbers to be take (or calculated from) virtual stages. If it's self-contained, it's a multi. If you need to get info from other 'actual' caches, it's a puzzle. If there's general knowledge questions, or info that can't be gathered while doing the cache, it's a puzzle. If the co-ords are where the main cache with a log book is, it's a traditional. if it's a separately loggable virtual stage of a multi-cache it's actually a virtual leading to a puzzle. If you have to be photographed by a webcam...etc :)

Link to comment

Just been browsing through the german speaking forum (who's the clever one :D ) and they seem to have the same problem with misclassification :D . The way they are attempting to deal with them there is that they have started a pinned topic where people can post links to caches they believe to be mislabeled.

 

Thought that might be an option (if at all possible due to extra workload)?

Link to comment

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...