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It seems that here locally there are a few that don't log a DNF for caches they don't find. Granted, there are only a few but, isn't this a common courtesy? It lets a cache owner know if that difficult micro they placed is getting any hits and it can also lets a cache owner know if one of their caches has gone missing without waiting through a long period of no hits.

 

I'm not necessarily talking about folks that just started Geocaching. What's the general consensus?

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For the caches close to me, I log a note questioning whether it's missing or not. I'll go back to it over and over until I find it or it's confirmed missing.

 

For caches I would do out of state that I might not be able to get back to, if I couldn't find it, I would log it as DNF since there's little chance I would get back to it.

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I usually log a decent number of DNFs. However I've failed to log DNFs on the following occasions:

 

1) When I wasn't actually done searching for the cache, but I was going home before continuing the hunt some future date. I've taken months to find a local multi-cache that involved trips all over town.

2) When I felt there was no story to tell, no photos to upload, and honestly didn't think there was a problem with my not finding the cache.

3) When I completely forgot.

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If I'm working on a multi that takes several visit/days I'll post a note. If I can't find the final stage, I'll post a DNF.

 

My thoughts are: If i looked for the cache and didn't find it, I should post a DNF.

 

Does it mean the cache is missing? Maybe

Does it mean I won't find it on a future visit? Maybe

Does it mean I didn't find it on this visit? Yes!

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If I make it to the coordinates and look for even a minute, I log the DNF if I don't find the cache. If I never even make it to the coordinates for some dumb reason, I may post a note if it is a story worth telling. I don't like to log a DNF in those situations where I never even had a chance to look for the cache because it may appear to somebody glancing through the logs that the cache might be missing when that probably isn't the case.

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Many newbie cachers learn by example. When I started caching in June 2002, I noticed that Quest Master wrote great logs for the great caches, constructive logs for caches that needed just a bit of work, short logs on forgettable caches, and DNF logs on caches he couldn't find. So, I did the same.

 

I think my DNF logs are among the most entertaining to read. And I'm proud enough of my efforts to feature them in my

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Edited by The Leprechauns
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Yep, no ifs, buts, or any other excuse. As others have said, DNFs are usually the best reads. I was at a cache site today, looking at exactly where the cache was for 30 minutes, but couldn't risk walking the 10 feet to get it - too many others around. I set a time limit on when I was going to leave. I finally got my opportunity. Had I not got to it - it would have been a DNF.

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Always, sometimes, and never.

 

Always if I actually get to the coords and make a thorough but fruitless search.

 

Sometimes if I abort before getting to the area if there is a story behind it or if the cache area is inaccessible.

 

Never if I actually FIND a cache.

Edited by ChurchCampDave
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I usually do. If I suspect the cache has disappeared. I post a note about the DNF. If it turns out the cache really was there, I change it to a real DNF.

Yep....that's how I do it but not always because I will often make more than one trip to find a cache.

 

I posted a DNF on one recently that I made three trips to find. I logged the DNF because I thought it had me stumped. Found out later that its possibly missing. If it's confirmed missing by the owner and they plan on replacing it, I will change the DNF to a note and make another trip out there to find it after it's been replaced. If they archive it instead, I will leave it as a DNF. I always leave a note when I make a trip out to a cache but don't log it as Found or DNF until I give up on looking for it. I shouldn't have to log a DNF for a cache that wasn't even there to begin with, no matter how many times I was there and especially if I plan on going back to find it later. Only when I give up on it, will I "officially" log it as a DNF.

 

Also, if this one just happened to be out of the 200 mile radius I have set for myself and I didn't find it, I would log it as a permanent DNF because chances are I wouldn't be back to find it later.

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If it got dark I didn't have a light, or I only had a limited amount of time, or there were just too many darn muggles around to do anything but try my best to look casual, I don't post a DNF. Then I'll come back and keep trying until I know that I've given the cache enough search time to really, honestly say I've looked everywhere and come up empty. If I have to come back a few times in order to do that, I will. Usually when I log I'll mention if it took me more than one attempt. However, if a cache is a long way from home and doubtful that I'll return anytime soon, I usually will go ahead and log the DNF. I think this method gives the cache owner and other cachers good feedback on the cache without un-necessary posts.

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DNF's are sort of like hemorroids...lots of people get them, most don't like to talk about them, and they are a pain in the butt - but ( :) ) they happen! I posted a DNF yesterday on a cache that I could not find, but also feel may have been destroyed or stolen. I sent the owner an e-mail letting them know my suspicions, and described the cache location - asking for confirmation. I plan on going back out to that same area today to hunt a couple other caches...and will swing by the "missing" cache location again for another search. If I do end up finding it, the DNF will stay in the log...if I am unsuccessful I'll just post a note and hope the owner replies to my e-mail. So, in closing, if you get a hemorr...er, DNF then post it...if may help your friends/fellow Geocachers understand why you're so grumpy :ph34r: .

Regards,

Bill

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DNF's are sort of like hemorroids...lots of people get them, most don't like to talk about them, and they are a pain in the butt - but ( :ph34r: ) they happen!

Not me....I talk about mine ALL the time. When a group of us get together, we talk about our latest and compare them. There's always a good story or two, and the more painful the more loudly it's told.

 

There are some that especially irritate me. I get this nagging feeling that I really need to go back and probe around over and over again until I've found it. This is going to sound silly, but I've actually lost sleep over them.

 

I don't know...maybe it's just me.

 

Bret

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I log my DNFs unless I ran out of time and couldn't give it a good effort (happened once or twice). Also, when finding the DNF in a subsequent visit, I leave the DNF in the online log.

 

I think DNFs are important to other cachers and to the cache owner. What if 3 people before me went, didn't find it and never logged? If they did, the cache owner might suspect a problem and check on it. Instead, I go, can't find it, and it looks like only 1 person couldn't do it which likely doesn't send up much of a flag to the cache owner.

 

If it's a drive-by cache it's less of a big deal, but if you're hiking to one, I'd rather hike to something that is likely there.

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DNF's are sort of like hemorroids...lots of people get them, most don't like to talk about them, and they are a pain in the butt - but ( :ph34r: ) they happen!

Not me....I talk about mine ALL the time. When a group of us get together, we talk about our latest and compare them. There's always a good story or two, and the more painful the more loudly it's told.

 

There are some that especially irritate me. I get this nagging feeling that I really need to go back and probe around over and over again until I've found it. This is going to sound silly, but I've actually lost sleep over them.

 

I don't know...maybe it's just me.

 

Bret

Maybe you should try some fiber. :)

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We post our DNF's and we use them as a goal for ourselves to go back and get the darn smiley! Thankfully, we don't have that many but I think it's just b/c we're too dang stubborn to leave if we're pretty sure we're just 'missing it'. :)

 

We've actually gotten a couple nice emails from the cache owners after a DNF or two encouraging us and offering hints if we wanted them. We certainly TRY not to take the hints though. :ph34r:

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I usually do. If I suspect the cache has disappeared. I post a note about the DNF. If it turns out the cache really was there, I change it to a real DNF.

One of the functions of the DNF is to alert others about the possible lack of the cache. A string of DNFs is a much better indicator of the cache not being there. In fact, some programs use the recent DNFs and Finds in a quick visual display.

 

I don't really see why a confirmed missing cache would be posted as a note. It wasn't your fault that the cache wasn't there, but regardless, you didn't find it.

 

But, as they say, to each his own, it's just the way that I would do it.

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If I look, and don't find, it's a DNF.

 

Two scenarios where I won't log a DNF:

  • If I don't get there, and it's because of me (not because of a trail being closed, washout of area, etc... something that another person would want to know), I won't log anything. I didn't look, and my experience adds no value to others looking for the cache, so why log?
  • If I get there and say "Why bother!?!?" as I did this week-end at one cache (tons of ivy, didn't want to even try...) I won't log, because again, I didn't look, and I have nothing useful to say to anyone else.

-J

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If I really look and did not find then I post a DNF. I have been known to do a quick drive-by on my morning commute as preparation for the real hunt at lunch or if necessary on the way home!

 

If I am in the middle of a multi I may or may not post some notes along the way but I do not post a DNF because I am in the middle of the hunt! If I get to the final stage and look and can not find the cache then I post a DNF.

 

I never go back and edit a DNF to a note or Find. Those are part of the cache history and as noted above usually some of the most amuseing posts to read.

 

I have an experienced out of town cacher (way over 1000 finds) who is desperately trying to locate a mystry cache of mine and has visited the site no less than 5 times and given it a serious look and has not posted at all!

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I appreciate the responses. We failed to log a DNF on our third trip out. Didn't find the offset coords so we didn't log the cache at all, note or otherwise. Later on, maybe four or five weeks later, we came upon another group of cachers that had been doing this for a while (Team Bert) After mentioning, this particular cache, they convinced us that logging a visit no matter what the outcome was a good thing. Now as a cache owner, I can see the point(s) they were making. Anyone with a cache out wants hits. What would be the purpose if you didn't want to see folks have fun hunting for your cache. If someone gets a DNF on one of our caches, I send an e-mail offering another hint if they want it after I've made sure the cache is still in place.

Reading notes, finds, or DNF's on cache pages is another fun part of this game/ hobby/ addiction. :grin:

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I logged the DNF because I thought it had me stumped. Found out later that its possibly missing. If it's confirmed missing by the owner and they plan on replacing it, I will change the DNF to a note and make another trip out there to find it after it's been replaced.

 

Why? You went to look for it and didn't find it. Whether it was because you just couldn't spot it, or it was stolen, you still didn't find it. That is what a DNF is. I don't see the point of changing it to a note. You had a DNF, its a part of the cache's history, so just let it be.

 

Now as a cache owner, I can see the point(s) they were making. Anyone with a cache out wants hits. What would be the purpose if you didn't want to see folks have fun hunting for your cache. If someone gets a DNF on one of our caches, I send an e-mail offering another hint if they want it after I've made sure the cache is still in place.

Reading notes, finds, or DNF's on cache pages is another fun part of this game/ hobby/ addiction.

 

I'm glad to see you got the point! A lot of people don't. Even in this thread I read some people who say they log DNF though it "kills them" or they have to "swallow the bile". What's with that? There is no shame in it. DNF's are a part of the sport. If you found it EVERY time, then where would the challenge be?

Edited by briansnat
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i almost always log a DNF. here are the reasons i don't when i don't:

 

1)i have not finished the search AND i'm coming back in a timely fashion. (e.g., tomorrow morning at first light, after lunch, what-have-you.) if i don't return in a timely fashion, i log the DNF.

 

2)i have aborted the search early. (e.g., i started to look for the park but at some point i decided that i'd rather go home because i've had enough.) this is not the same as looking for the container and giving up. i do not log these because "i came to the park entrance but didn't go in because it was raining and i forgot my headlamp" does not enrich anybody's experience. when somebody logs one of those DNF's on one of my caches, i wonder why they bothered. it also reflects poorly on the cache for those who filter by recent DNF's.

 

if i have a story about not being ABLE to find the park, or the forgotten headlamp forms part of a larger, amusing story, i will log it.

 

3)i am working on a FF and do not wish to alert other players that this cache is on my radar. if i am working on a stealth DNF, i will email the cache owner as a courtesy and tell all the adventures later in my found log.

 

4)it is a multiple DNF of the same cache with no additional story to tell. unless i have something to say about the search, "still can't find it" does not an interesting log make. if i have already logged DNF a couple times and there is no subsequent found log, you can bet that i still can't find it.

 

5)if the lameness of the cache area or other parts of the hunt are unsatisfactory but not unsatisfactory enough for me to complain in a public forum, i may neglect to log it. i sometimes neglect to log caches i have FOUND for this same reason.

 

i never delete my DNF logs. and if i have anything interesting to say (even if interesting only to me) i will say volumes of it. DNF's are often much more entertaining.

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A lot of people don't. Even in this thread I read some people who say they log DNF though it "kills them" or they have to "swallow the bile". What's with that? There is no shame in it. DNF's are a part of the sport.

As usual, you misread my post. Most of the time, I am happy to log DNFs. Sometimes, however, when it is clear that the hide is obnoxious or inappropriate, and I am annoyed by it, making a gracious DNF log can be a little difficult. But I always log my DNFs, no matter how I feel about the hide. And I try never to blame my DNF on anybody else.

 

I am certain you have never been annoyed by a cache hide, because, as you are wont to point out, you are in fact a great deal better than the rest of us. So I hope I was able to help your understanding of my post.

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I am certain you have never been annoyed by a cache hide, because, as you are wont to point out, you are in fact a great deal better than the rest of us. So I hope I was able to help your understanding of my post.

 

God's gift to geocaching needs no clarification, thank you.

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I logged the DNF because I thought it had me stumped. Found out later that its possibly missing. If it's confirmed missing by the owner and they plan on replacing it, I will change the DNF to a note and make another trip out there to find it after it's been replaced.

 

Why? You went to look for it and didn't find it. Whether it was because you just couldn't spot it, or it was stolen, you still didn't find it. That is what a DNF is. I don't see the point of changing it to a note. You had a DNF, its a part of the cache's history, so just let it be.

 

Now as a cache owner, I can see the point(s) they were making. Anyone with a cache out wants hits. What would be the purpose if you didn't want to see folks have fun hunting for your cache. If someone gets a DNF on one of our caches, I send an e-mail offering another hint if they want it after I've made sure the cache is still in place.

Reading notes, finds, or DNF's on cache pages is another fun part of this game/ hobby/ addiction.

 

I'm glad to see you got the point! A lot of people don't. Even in this thread I read some people who say they log DNF though it "kills them" or they have to "swallow the bile". What's with that? There is no shame in it. DNF's are a part of the sport. If you found it EVERY time, then where would the challenge be?

How can you find something that is not there to begin with? I would rather leave a note about the cache possibly missing rather than leave a DNF for every trip that I make out there to find it. Eventually, I WILL go back and find it. That's how I play the game. Some people go out once, don't find it and never plan on going back. Those people should log a DNF.

I try to "journalize" my adventures with each cache by posting a little note about it for the cache owner after every trip to find their cache. So it would be misleading others to see a bunch of DNF's for every trip that I made out to the cache. They would automatically assume that the cache is not there and not go after it, when in fact it very well could still be there.

 

It's either a FOUND or DNF...pretty cut and dry for me. Leaving a DNF means I give up, you stumped me and I am not coming back to find it later. Writing the notes in between is just a journal of my adventures in trying to find the cache.

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If I look, and don't find, it's a DNF.

 

Two scenarios where I won't log a DNF:

  • If I get there and say "Why bother!?!?" as I did this week-end at one cache (tons of ivy, didn't want to even try...) I won't log, because again, I didn't look, and I have nothing useful to say to anyone else.

-J

If by ivy, you mean poison ivy, wouldn't it be best to post a DNF or at least a Note so that others can be warned and bring gloves or the owner can take care of the cache maybe by moving it a few feet from the poison ivy and updating the coords?

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I keep a running log of each time I go looking for a cache and mark it as a DNF until I find it. I keep the whole history of my search as part of the log (as an inspiration to those who want to show their mentally challenged friends that anyone can do this. . . ) I am unable to include my "Longshoreman-speak" utterances as part of the log but they are inferred.

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It's either a FOUND or DNF...pretty cut and dry for me. Leaving a DNF means I give up, you stumped me and I am not coming back to find it later. Writing the notes in between is just a journal of my adventures in trying to find the cache.

I think a DNF is you looked for it and Did Not Find it. I don't think it it means you'll never come back. I'm not embarrassed by a DNF and it doesn't mean I've given up.

 

I think a note is appropriate in a multi if you haven't gotten to the final cache yet, if you went out for a regular cache and just ran out of time, even if you got to the final location but don't feel you could search adequately, subsequent visits to a cache, etc.

 

If you really searched for it and could not locate the cache, I think that's the definition of Did Not Find. Like others posted, it's not some sort of black mark against you, or at least I don't look at it that way.

 

Logging a find is obvious to everyone. I guess logging a DNF is very subjective.

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<SNIP>

Logging a find is obvious to everyone.

<SNIP>

Oh really??

Ok, I can further qualify my comment as:

 

When you actually find a cache and sign the logbook (assuming it's not a virtual or locationless cache), we all know you to create a "Found it" log entry.

 

----

 

No need to cloud the issue with those that might cheat, those that don't log at all online, or those that still haven't figured out what geocaching is yet.

 

I think this discussion is about the majority of geocachers that log their finds appropriately and how we do/don't log DNFs.

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If you really searched for it and could not locate the cache, I think that's the definition of Did Not Find. Like others posted, it's not some sort of black mark against you, or at least I don't look at it that way.

Please...I am not embarrassed about a DNF. I know it's not a black mark against anyones stats. If it was, no one would leave a DNF. :grin:

 

I don't know if anyone else plays like this but I started geocaching by doing the ones closest to my home and working my way out, mileage-wise. I am able to make several trips to a cache if it's close to home. As I get to those caches that are farther away, I will have to decide if I would be able to go back if I didn't find them the first time. If I didn't find the cache and decide not to go back, then I will log a DNF for it and be done with it. My DNF's are going to show up more often as I do those caches farther from home because there's a better chance of me not getting to go back to them in the future. I see no point in logging a note for a cache that I didn't find and that I have no plans of going back to in the future. I would mark it as a DNF. I also see no point in logging a DNF for every attempt at a cache, which misleads the people that only look at the smileys or frowns as a indication of whether a cache is still there or not.

 

Basically what I am saying is, a DNF is a finality to the cache adventure......for me. If I've done all I could do to find the cache and ultimately couldn't find it, I would log a DNF and be done with it. Anything in between (writing notes) is just my story about my adventures in finding the cache.

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If I think the cache may have been compromised I'll post my DNF as a courtesy to the owner.

 

If I think I can't find it due to my own weaknesses or bad weather, canopy, etc., I MIGHT post if it's an amusing story.

 

If I think the location is stupid, lame , dangerous, illegal or immoral I MIGHT post just to be a jerk.

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And when I find it later, I leave the DNF.

I am trying to decide whether to change my "DNF" to "Find" (adding to the existing log with the new info about finding it) or to create a new log as a Find, leaving the DNF there. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance.

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I am trying to decide whether to change my "DNF" to "Find" (adding to the existing log with the new info about finding it) or to create a new log as a Find, leaving the DNF there. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance.

 

Leave your DNF and post a Found it. Why would you just change it? Its part of the history of the cache and your personal history.

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For one thing, if you just change your DNF log, the owner won't get an e-mail informing him of your find.

 

You should log each time you visit the cache. The first time is a Found It. After that its a note. If you happen to be passing by again and decide to check on it, log a note. If you bring your friends and show it to them, log a note. If you drop off a TB, yep another note.

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I am trying to decide whether to change my "DNF" to "Find" (adding to the existing log with the new info about finding it) or to create a new log as a Find, leaving the DNF there. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance.

 

Leave your DNF and post a Found it. Why would you just change it? Its part of the history of the cache and your personal history.

 

I change mine to Found and make a note in the log about the history of not finding it on the first (or sometimes even second) attempt. I don't like to leave a DNF in my cache history because I did eventually find the cache. If I never go back to the cache the DNF remains in my record. It's a personal choice.

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