Rechargeable Battery Question

[otterbuff]

In the old forums I remember a long post (old) on rechargeable batteries. I am searching the new forums for "rechargeable battery" and I am not coming up with anything. Permutations of the search don't bring me anything either :-(. So, my question is, what are the GREAT/GOOD AA rechargers out there? Both in charge speed and charge longevity?

Thanks.

[+nincehelser]

Rayovac recently introduced a "15-minute" rechargable system. I haven't seen any reviews about their quality.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by longevity. Rechargables self-discharge very quickly compared to disposable alkalines...something along the lines of 5% or so per day depending on things like temperature. So their longevity "on the shelf" is pretty short...months or even days. Alkalines will hold a charge for several years.

 

If you're talking about how many charge cycles it can handle, that does vary quite a bit depending on the particular battery chemistry, usage patterns, and charge patterns (ie...the charger). I've never had a good experience with rechargables in this regard...they always seem to completely die on me too soon, especially if they are in my laptop and cost hundreds of dollars to replace

 

George

[oddsock]

Hi here is a link to some tests you may find usefull http://www.tracklogs.co.uk/cgi-bin/publ/us...age=news&id=143 ....

I bought my Uniross 2300mAh batteries off ebay in the UK.. maybe ebay.com has them as well ..this is their site.. www.uniross.com Uniross are launching a new Ultra fast Switch mode charger at the end of the month that works off 240/110 Mains and 12volt DC and will charge batteries in 1.5 to 2 hours The product code here is...RC103152 I think it will include 4 x 2300mAh batteries as well

Regards.. dave

Edited November 22, 2003 by oddsock

[Boromir]

I have a Maha 204F and it has worked well for me for a few years. The maha batteries I have are still going strong as well, but then so are the other various ones I have. The charger is available with a car adapter as well, which is a nice bonus when traveling. This charger can also cycle NiCDs, but there is no reason not to use NiMH which don't need to be cycled. This charger also takes both AA and AAA batteries. This unit only has a 3 hour quick charge, which does not seem to hurt the batteries so far, but they do get pretty warm sometimes.

 

The new Maha MH-C401FS looks even better. Both quick 100 min charge and a more gentle 5 hour charge available.

 

http://www.mahaenergy.com

[+BAMBOOZLE]

Sometime ago I did extensive research on the web and the result was MAHA charger and batteries.

I bought two chargers and a pile of batteries that I use for my GPS units (3) and my Dig. camera.....everything works great.

[+ohgr]

My father has been recommending the MaHa batteries to me also.. He uses them in his digital cameras and says they're the best. And he does his research before buying ANYTHING....

 

Ohgr

[+Cooter13]

I have Maha and for around $60 you get 8 AA and a charger for DC and AC. Use them in the digi cam and everything else that I can think of. Very nice to have.

[spyder40]

Greetings,

 

I went through the same research earlier this summer and ended up buying a Maha 201/Maha401/Maha Powerex 2000mah AA's. So far they have worked out great. There are quite a few posts regarding Rayovac chargers with most of them bad (very hot batteries and sometimes blown batteries). I get the same/better runtime in my Rino 120's as alkalines (Duracell, hate Energizers from my caving days). The real killer was when I started using them in the flash/strobe for my Nikonos underwater camera. Alkalines would take several seconds to recycle the strobe after the first couple of flashes, the NiMh's recycle in under a second for at least 36 exposures. Try the following forum, tons of good information on batteries, flashlights, etc.

 

www.candlepowerforums.com

[+NimravusHSSR]

For all your battery questions, look no further:

 

Candlpower Forums

just search or ask!

[+Quoddy]

It looks as you are going "upscale" on your choice. I use The POWEREX MH-C401FS with the 2200 mAh POWEREX batteries to power my Mericolor. I get long hours from even this power-hungry unit. http://www.thomas-distributing.com/mhc401fs.htm

[+PastorDIC]

I use the Monster Powercells (AA)(Ni-MN) and Monster Ultra-High Capacity Rapid Recharger.

 

Batteries are supposed to last for 1000 recharges, don't need to be completely drained before recharging, lose 5% a day if I remember right. 1st charge 24 hours, then only takes 4 hours to charge 4 AA batteries. I get them at GoodGuys.

 

I have 2 of the rechargers and 12 AA batteries, needing at least 8 more batteries. (4 for the digital camera, 2 for GPSr with 2 backup, 4 for minimal power booklites. Need 4 more for the 2 booklites and 4 so I can have some recharging all the time.) This has only happened to me in the last month, but I can see these rechargeables will be saving me a LOT of money once I get enough.

[+Desert_Warrior]

I got a new E-Trex Vista a few weeks ago. It seemed to use up batteries faster than the Venture I had which is now on its way to Iraq.

 

Sooo... I did some quick testing over the last few days. Not "LAB QUALITY" testing, but rather "FIELD CONDITION" testing. GPS running, tracking satellites but not moving. Display light off. Electronic compass off.

 

Here is what I did. Over a few days I would set the Vista on the window sill and set the trip computer to record elapsed time. I also set VisualGPS on the computer to average my position fix.

 

Using 1800 mah Ni-MH radio shack batteries, I averaged about 8.25 hours of operation for three runs.

 

My order for 8 MAHA 2200 mah Ni-MH batteries arrived. I charged them up and started testing. I averaged 11.75 hours with the MAHA batteries.

 

This is about a 30-% increase in mattery life. Well, not LAB QUALITY TESTING because of:

 

1. The radio shack batteries are over a year old, and may be getting weak.

 

2. The MAHA batteries are new, and -MAY IMPROVE- after a few cycles.

 

In any case, it was worth the change for me.

 

I will start a new thread soon with the current drain on my Vista, which will help in determining how long various batteries will last. If others do the same, perhaps we can come up with a database of GPS unit battery drain.

[+out4awalk+B]

I'd like to add a question here if I may. I'll start a new topic if people think that's more appropriate.

 

Does anyone have experience with re-chargeable lithium batteries in cold weather? I understand that standard lithium batteries will give better service than alkaline batteries generally, and in the cold, but does this also pertain to rechargeable lithium batteries?

 

Thanks.

[+whereRU]

I have used rechargeable Energizers for quite some time. A fellow cacher just told me last week about the new 2100mah Energizers. The new 2100s last very very nearly equal to good alkalines. Charger runs around $24-$29, batteries $9.00 for a 4-pack

[+Prime Suspect]

Rayovac recently introduced a "15-minute" rechargable system. I haven't seen any reviews about their quality.

The 15 min charge only applies to their special (and expensive) batteries designed specifically for that charger. If you want to recharge standard NiMHs, it takes several hours. Unless you really want to spend the money for the batteries, you're better off with a 1-hr charger.

[+Halden]

I have the Panasonic NiMHs. Take about 8 hrs for a full charge but I have 2 sets of 4 AA. Great for my Digital Camera and GPSr. Life expectency is a little shorter than alkaline but I have had them for a year and a half and they still get adn hold a nice healty charge.

[+st_richardson]

Rayovac recently introduced a "15-minute" rechargable system.  I haven't seen any reviews about their quality.

The 15 min charge only applies to their special (and expensive) batteries designed specifically for that charger. If you want to recharge standard NiMHs, it takes several hours. Unless you really want to spend the money for the batteries, you're better off with a 1-hr charger.

I also don’t recommend the RCA 15 min charger. I don’t know how they do it but it only charges their NiMH in 15 min. All other NiMH batteries take much longer. I recommend the Energizer unit. It charges all NiMH batteries in about 30 min.

 

I’m a strong believer in NiMH batteries. With my cameras, 3 GPS units, and other miscellaneous items, I have over 50 batteries now. Be sure and get a unit that charges the batteries individually not in pairs. i.e. 1-4 cells at a time.

[+Semi-Hex]

I'm very happy now that I use nimh's in my digital camera (aa) etrex vista (aa) and pda (aaa) I bought the maha charger (c401sf) from thomas dist. along with 20 some odd batteries. We did a overnighter snow campout stayed in igloos with no problem and a week long trip where I had the gps on the entire time without trouble.

[+Cachew]

This link will get you to an independent reviewer of NiMH batteries. This led me to the MAHA purchase and I've been happy.

 

http://www.imaging-resource.com/ACCS/BATTS/BATTS.HTM

[Grimmy]

I'm using a set up that is branded Xtreme that I picked up from Batteries Plus. I have seen this same charger with several brand names on it including Energizer. Also picked up 8 NiMh 2200ma batteries for around $45 out the door. I'm happy with them. They give me about a weeks worth of use between charges on both my digital camera and my V.

 

In the grand scheme of things a PROPERLY treated NiCad will have a longer useful life time then NiMh or LiIon or LiPolymer. The key here is the "Properly Treated" part. That means the battery is properly formed when it';s first put into service. That basicly means full charge and full discharge the first three charges this applies to NiMh as well). If the NiCad is fully discharged and fully charged each cycle it will be better

 

The problem is nobody does that. Your always worried about running out of Juice so they get partly discharged and you throw them on the charger. This forms a memory and if not conditioned this memory will be perment.

 

In comes NiMh. It does not have as many potential charge cycles as NiCad BUT is is not nearly as prone to "Memory" as the NiCad. You can form a Memory if your repetative enough in poor charge habbits.

 

Li Ion batteries have no memory as long as they are formed the first few charges. They howver have up to 40% less available charge cycles over a NiCad. In real world use by the average consumer they have better luck with the Li batteries so they are percieved as "better than".

 

I personnaly don't like rapid charging. Most rapid chargers do not give the battery a full charge. A good charger will but your talking a lot more cash for a battery that monitors Delta V and resitance and adjusts it's charge rate to accomidate.

 

A slow over night trickle charge in most instances is a better charge and you will get more use out of the battery in both over all life and how long the charge will last. Fast charging just boils the chemicals out. I recomend to my customers to use cig charges as an emergency item and not a primary charger. People who listen to that advice usualy get 2-2.5 years of usefull life out of the batteries. Those that don't listen are usualy on their second battery at about 13-17 months.

 

Most people don't realize that there is only 3 main battery manufactures in the world. There are smaller manufactures but I'm talking companies that Supply cells for Energizer, Duracel etc.

 

They make over 80% of the Materials for batteries sold each year.

They build to spec for Energizer, Duracel, Radio shack etc. So yes your getting a different battery but it's still manufactured by one of the 3. They will adjust the amount and quality of the chemicals and purity of the metals used and this effects the cost of manufacture. So yes you are getting a better battery when you buy Duracel over a Radio shack branded battery and the price reflects that.

Edited December 10, 2003 by Grimmy

[+GeckoGeek]

I personnaly don't like rapid charging. Most rapid chargers do not give the battery a full charge. A good charger will but your talking a lot more cash for a battery that monitors Delta V and resitance and adjusts it's charge rate to accomidate.

 

A slow over night trickle charge in most instances is a better charge and you will get more use out of the battery in both over all life and how long the charge will last. Fast charging just boils the chemicals out.

 

I hear where you're coming from, but I disagree. As long as you have a fast charger that is not "timed" it will treat the batteries OK.

 

The downside of the overnight charger is that nearly all of them are "dumb". They keep packing the charge into the batteries regardless of their charge state. They count on the battery to be able to safely dissipate the heat of overcharge for an extended period. As a result, they boil the batteries. While a fast charger may be a bit harsher, at least it knows when to stop!

 

I think the real problem with fast chargers comes when you're using larger battery packs. When charged as a pack, one cell will get fully charged before the rest of the cells. That cell will end up taking a beating until enough other cells becomes charged so that the charger will stop. After enough beatings, that cell goes bad and there goes the whole pack. With the kind of chargers we're talking about here, the cells will be charged as pairs not as 6 - 10 cell packs so this shouldn't be as big a problem. If you want, MAHA has a charger that will charge individual cell. Great for units that take 3 AA or AAA batteries.

Edited December 10, 2003 by GeckoGeek

[Grimmy]

GeckoGeek:

 

Yeah I am kind of narrow in what I'm looking at I supose. I run a repair shop for a Major US wireless carrier. I have a lot of dealing with the clueless that do stupid things like leave their phone plugged into a Cig plug for a month. Charge every nite even if it shows a for nearly full charge.

 

A quality charger for the average products I deal with out there is non existant. Most come with a trickle charger. The ones that don't have inferior rapid chargers that beat the snot out of the batteries. Most batteries for phones are multi cell and subjected to the problems you pointed out. Most Cig chargers are cheap junk that charge WAY too fast and are not regulated in any way. As a result I see a LOT more problems with rapid chargers and Cig chargers then I ever do on the home trickle charger. The difference is we are talking about people that are clueless to how things work. They plug it in till they tear it up then they come to me and complain about how bad the product performs.

[+GOT GPS?]

I do much better with charging my Nokia 6340i phone, than the batteries for my GPS units and camera. I let my phone go all the way to about dead, then charge for 4 hours, whereas my GPS batteries are getting topped off all the time. I wish that I had a GPS that lasted a week to 10 days like my Nokia 6340i phone does.

 

probably it's best to have a couple GPS units, and let one run all the way to shutoff, charge those batts, and use another GPS to finish your caching for the day, then rinse and repeat. OPPS, I mean that you would run each GPS toward shutoff, and this way, you would extend the life of the batts. Another way would be to have freshly charges batts in your pocket, then change them when the GPS shuts off. This way, you get the most run-time from your batts, that you can, for their usefull life.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------

 

http://www.candlepower.com interesting site, then I ran into this site:

http://www.halfbakery.com

[dudeman]

I've been using the Rayovac 15 minute rechargeables since August and have had excellent success with them. They do tend to get hot when charging, but I've had no problems.

 

I found mine at Walmart, similar price compared to the 1 hour rechargers. It came with 2 AA's. I bought 8 more AA's for about the same price as other AA rechargeables. I use them for my digital camera and my GPS.

 

I have had very good results so far, and have done many recharges. I haven't timed the batteries life, but Rayovac claims 1000 recharges and 4x life compared to Alkalines.

 

-Robert

-MeriGold

Edited December 10, 2003 by dudeman

[+GeckoGeek]

I run a repair shop for a Major US wireless carrier. ....

A quality charger for the average products I deal with out there is non existant.

I was close, I was guessing you worked in a radio shop

 

Sheesh, what phones are you working with? I've only had/used 3 different ones. The old Moto classic "brick" had a horrid constant current charger that would toast the battery in under a year's time.

 

My next two phones, a Radio Shack Nokia 232 clone and a Moto StarTac seems to do OK. (Although I didn't put a lot of millage on the clone due to air time costs.) I think the charger is in the phone and the cig adapter is just to get power. Of course the phone can't charge any faster the the power supply can deliver so a cig adapter could charger faster then normal. Not that I would leave a phone on a charger forever - after all the point of the phone is to be portable - not tethered.