Liar's Cache

[+geocat_]

Can't seem to find anything on gc.com about whether or not these are still allowed. I thought I remembered that they were not but I could be wrong.

[+Touchstone]

I think your mileage may vary on the subject. If the Description is pushing some sort of agenda, I imagine it could get some pushback from the Reviewer. The once occasional abuse of the D/T rating on Event Listings came to a somewhat abrupt end with the following guidance:

 

Event caches should always have a 1-star difficulty rating because it is easy for geocachers to “find” events. They are in plain sight or can be found in a few minutes of searching. It does not matter how difficult the event activities may be.

 

Link for reference:

 

http://support.Groundspeak.com/index.php?pg=kb.page&id=82

 

Otherwise, your question isn't specific enough to really know what your concern is. There's a fine line between "liars cache" and tongue and cheek.

[+wmpastor]

I was watching one where the CO invited finders to post a fictitious story about their find. Some posts were quite entertaining and humorous (fighting off tigers, swimming across an alligator-infested river, etc.). Sounds like okay fun to me.

[+The A-Team]

I think they're generally frowned upon these days, but I don't think there's anything in the guidelines other than the Event-related guidance posted by Touchstone. Whether one gets published or not probably depends on the specific reviewer and local customs.

[Keystone]

I was watching one where the CO invited finders to post a fictitious story about their find. Some posts were quite entertaining and humorous (fighting off tigers, swimming across an alligator-infested river, etc.). Sounds like okay fun to me.

With the key word being "invites." If someone doesn't want to play along by weaving a tall tale about using scuba gear and climbing ropes to reach the cache, they can log their smiley with a "TFTC for the quick park and grab at this nice shopping center." The owner cannot delete that log. Requiring the tall tale would constitute an Additional Logging Requirement (ALR) and these were prohibited in 2009 or so.

[+wmpastor]

I was watching one where the CO invited finders to post a fictitious story about their find. Some posts were quite entertaining and humorous (fighting off tigers, swimming across an alligator-infested river, etc.). Sounds like okay fun to me.

With the key word being "invites." If someone doesn't want to play along by weaving a tall tale about using scuba gear and climbing ropes to reach the cache, they can log their smiley with a "TFTC for the quick park and grab at this nice shopping center." The owner cannot delete that log. Requiring the tall tale would constitute an Additional Logging Requirement (ALR) and these were prohibited in 2009 or so.

Totally agreed. In fact, as I looked over the "found" posts, there were a few very short, matter-of-fact posts.

[+briansnat]

As Keystone mentioned it would be an ALR to require a fake log. Liars caches also generally have unrealistically high terrain and difficulty levels. Some geocachers are upset when they make plans to hunt an "amazing" and difficult cache, only to find something quite the opposite. In several cases cachers made long weekend road trips, including booking hotel rooms, only to find what turned out to be liars caches. They were understandably quite angry.

 

Unless your goal is to anger a segment of the geocaching community, it's best to accurately rate the D/T of your cache and not try to present it as something it isn't.

[+geocat_]

Thanks for all the feedback. I have no intention of placing a liar's cache but someone commented to me the other day that they did. I personally think they are pretty silly although the logs could be somewhat entertaining to read. ALso agree that using this type of cache to manipulate the D/T for Fizzy Challenges or not disclosing that the cache is a liar's cache are more ridiculous for the reasons stated.

[+hal-an-tow]

I've seen an angry set of logs by folk annoyed at a high D/T liar's cache sufficiently subtle to have fooled them into a weekend trip, it did made me think about the value of caches and the strange lengths some folk go to when they get a little too obsessive, and cannot step back and laugh at theselves. And it helped me to understand why so many muggles look at you as if you are barking mad when you tell them about caching. (Muggle "What do you get for finding it?", me "Er, nothing , except you get to type a log about the experience ... um ... sometimes there may be things to swap .... " Muggle shakes head and changes subject .)

 

The only liar's cache I've logged is this one https://www.geocaching.com/geocache/GC2C7TX_pinocchios-predicament?guid=4ba9816e-127b-4330-9526-dc291928bb4b which has pretty accurate D/T ratings, many clearly ludicrous but entertaining logs (which I doubt anyone would think were truthful) and is well recieved, as shown by the favourite points it has been awarded. There are logs which have no embellishment, but most folk enter into the fun. I wonder if it being a puzzle cache selects for people willing to spend more time on it, and therefore to enjoy it ?

 

I'd say a well done liars cache like this is the caching equivalent of a fancy dress party, there's always someone sat in the corner in jeans and a tee-shirtn who didn't want to make a fool of themselves. They could always have opted to stay at home .

[+hzoi]

I have found a couple liar caches. The first one was labeled as a liar's cache and didn't have exorbitant ratings, so all was well. The second one didn't tell you it was a liar's cache and had a 4.5 5/4.5. I was prepared for a cool hunt and was a little disappointed to find an ammo can stashed behind a guardrail on a dead end road, but I was new to the community, so I played along. But I wasn't lying in my log when I said I didn't want to repeat the experience -- I really meant I didn't want to hunt another liar's cache. (Cache is now archived, so not a spoiler.)

Edited March 30, 2017 by hzoi

[+niraD]

But I wasn't lying in my log

That's another approach I've taken (and have seen others take) when logging a liar's cache. It can be interesting to stick to the literal truth, but to express it in a way that makes your log seem as outrageous as all the others.

[+TeamRabbitRun]

I like this one: https://coord.info/GC3GCP9

 

But of course, I would.

[+bflentje]

I was watching one where the CO invited finders to post a fictitious story about their find. Some posts were quite entertaining and humorous (fighting off tigers, swimming across an alligator-infested river, etc.). Sounds like okay fun to me.

With the key word being "invites." If someone doesn't want to play along by weaving a tall tale about using scuba gear and climbing ropes to reach the cache, they can log their smiley with a "TFTC for the quick park and grab at this nice shopping center." The owner cannot delete that log. Requiring the tall tale would constitute an Additional Logging Requirement (ALR) and these were prohibited in 2009 or so.

 

This. And I will always "out" liars caches. I saw many people get burned by the one that used to be near Lake Delton (Wisconsin Dells). For the record, I was NOT one of those.

[+jellis]

I heard of a Liars cache that the CO refused to abide by the ALR rule by telling cachers they have to log a liar's log or their log will be deleted.

[+geocat_]

I heard of a Liars cache that the CO refused to abide by the ALR rule by telling cachers they have to log a liar's log or their log will be deleted.

 

Hopefully they accepted the flogging they received from HQ for doing this

[+wimseyguy]

I've found several liar's caches over the years. For the most part it was always clear to me what type of hunt I was in for, and I came prepared both mentally and physically. Several have been listed as underwater, and in fact they were. I generally enjoy writing better than average logs, so I'm happy to play along with a bit of fiction. Once I found one that was a mere LPC. My log on that one was simply "this is the best cache I have found all weekend". Was I playing along with the request for a lie, or simply stating the plain truth?

[+GBandBob]

I dislike liar's caches because often it's not clear in the description that the D/T rating and/or attributes are all fake. I prefer geocaching to be a real adventure and not some fantasy.

 

I recently found a liar's cache, and I didn't even realize it was one until I found the container itself. Went back home and left the log "Things got pretty dicey, but we found it". Even this short statement is more than I would like to place in my log, because nothing really did get dicey at all. I want my log to be a real representation of what I went through to get the cache.

 

The CO emailed me later, threatening to delete my log if I didn't rewrite it to talk about all the "crazy danger" associated with this cache.

[+kunarion]

I dislike liar's caches because often it's not clear in the description that the D/T rating and/or attributes are all fake. I prefer geocaching to be a real adventure and not some fantasy.

 

I recently found a liar's cache, and I didn't even realize it was one until I found the container itself. Went back home and left the log "Things got pretty dicey, but we found it". Even this short statement is more than I would like to place in my log, because nothing really did get dicey at all. I want my log to be a real representation of what I went through to get the cache.

 

The CO emailed me later, threatening to delete my log if I didn't rewrite it to talk about all the "crazy danger" associated with this cache.

When I encounter an uber-controlling cache owner, I may restore my deleted log, but I will avoid his caches from now on. No lie.

Edited April 30, 2017 by kunarion

[+bflentje]

I dislike liar's caches because often it's not clear in the description that the D/T rating and/or attributes are all fake. I prefer geocaching to be a real adventure and not some fantasy.

 

I recently found a liar's cache, and I didn't even realize it was one until I found the container itself. Went back home and left the log "Things got pretty dicey, but we found it". Even this short statement is more than I would like to place in my log, because nothing really did get dicey at all. I want my log to be a real representation of what I went through to get the cache.

 

The CO emailed me later, threatening to delete my log if I didn't rewrite it to talk about all the "crazy danger" associated with this cache.

When I encounter an uber-controlling cache owner, I may restore my deleted log, but I will avoid his caches from now on. No lie.

 

For me, not "may" restore my log. But everything in my power to actually restore my log. Liars caches are lame, particularly if it's listed as traditional.

[+cerberus1]

The CO emailed me later, threatening to delete my log if I didn't rewrite it to talk about all the "crazy danger" associated with this cache.

That's odd, as they should know that Additional Logging Requirements haven't been allowed for some time.

 

Similar to bflentje I guess...

I search for caches by terrain mostly, so I will make life interesting for a liar.

[+dprovan]

The CO emailed me later, threatening to delete my log if I didn't rewrite it to talk about all the "crazy danger" associated with this cache.

I understand if you feel differently, but the more unreasonable a CO is, the less I care whether my find of his cache stands. So if I didn't want to meet his demands, I'd just forget about it and let him delete it if he wants. In this case, it sounds like it would be easy for you to go to GS to get your find restored, and I doubt anyone (except the CO) would think there was anything wrong with you doing it, but if it were me, I wouldn't bother.

 

In this specific case, I don't mind liar caches -- although I might think differently about one I was seeking under false pretenses -- so I'll typically spin my own tale just for fun. (It helps that no liar cache in my area ever requires a lying log, they're just encouraged.) If you don't want to lie, I sometimes spin a tale that's technically true but over blowing the actual effort, such as a description of my battle with two gnats or the bird sitting in a tree doing surveillance or the grueling 100' hike to GZ. The idea of a liar cache, at least to my mind, is to be silly, so it's not that hard to write up a silly interpretation of the actual trip. If you want to be really clever, make your silly yet factual presentation into a parable underscoring how dumb liar caches are.

[+Manville Possum]

The CO emailed me later, threatening to delete my log if I didn't rewrite it to talk about all the "crazy danger" associated with this cache.

That's odd, as they should know that Additional Logging Requirements haven't been allowed for some time.

 

I would make sure that they know I would appeal to HQ if my log was deleted because of an ALR. Maybe they don't know and think it's allowed?

[+cerberus1]

The CO emailed me later, threatening to delete my log if I didn't rewrite it to talk about all the "crazy danger" associated with this cache.

That's odd, as they should know that Additional Logging Requirements haven't been allowed for some time.

 

I would make sure that they know I would appeal to HQ if my log was deleted because of an ALR. Maybe they don't know and think it's allowed?

May have gotten away with this behavior of micro-managing and bullying others for a while ... and it will now become my goal to test him on it.

Unlike some, this type of CO drive me to be sure my find stands.

 

We did a couple caches with odd requests, "talk like a pirate" is one, but all were a fun option.

[+Manville Possum]

The CO emailed me later, threatening to delete my log if I didn't rewrite it to talk about all the "crazy danger" associated with this cache.

That's odd, as they should know that Additional Logging Requirements haven't been allowed for some time.

 

I would make sure that they know I would appeal to HQ if my log was deleted because of an ALR. Maybe they don't know and think it's allowed?

May have gotten away with this behavior of micro-managing and bullying others for a while ... and it will now become my goal to test him on it.

Unlike some, this type of CO drive me to be sure my find stands.

 

We did a couple caches with odd requests, "talk like a pirate" is one, but all were a fun option.

 

I actually had one CO believing I had been arrested while attempting their cache. The last EarthCache that I logged I wore a Pikachu hat in my visit photo. I have logged caches that were nanos tied around feral cat's necks and you had to run them down and catch them in a briar patch in a homeless camp by the river.