Okay, now what do we talk about?

[+T0SHEA]

Let's talk, you pick the subject.

 

You will get our two cents worth...

 

and take it with a grain of salt...

 

oops, should have said: Open topic about Waymarking.

Edited October 14, 2016 by BK-Hunters

[+The Leprechauns]

I suggest brainstorming more synonyms for "stagnate," "dormant" and "inactive." That way you can have more forum threads (one thread per synonym) and more opportunities for takeovers and revamps of Waymarking categories.

[+jhuoni]

Sense of humor and movie trivia check.

 

Morty: Hey, gang, come on! Look it, just `cause we're losing doesn't mean it's all over.

 

Phil: Cut the crap, Morty. I mean, the Mohawks have beaten us the last 12 years, they're gonna beat us again.

 

Tripper: That's just the attitude we don't need, Phil. Sure, Mohawk has beaten us 12 years in a row. Sure, they're terrific athletes. They've got the best equipment that money can buy. Hell, every team they're sending over here has their own personal masseuse. Not masseur. Masseuse. But, it doesn't matter. Do you know that every Mohawk competitor has electrocardiogram, blood and urine tests every 48 hours to see if there's any change in his physical condition. Do you know that they use the most sophisticated training methods from the Soviet Union, East and West Germany, and the newest Olympic power, Trinidad Tobago. But, it doesn't matter. It just doesn't matter. It just doesn't matter! I tell you it just doesn't matter! It just doesn't matter!

 

The group: IT JUST DOESN'T MATTER! IT JUST DOESN'T MATTER...

 

Tripper: And Even...and even if we win...if we win... Ha! Even if we win. Even if we play so far over our heads that our noses bleed for a week to ten days. Even if God in Heaven above comes down and points His hand at our side of the field. Even if everyman woman and child held hands together and prayed for us to win. It just wouldn't matter because all the really good looking girls would still go out with the guy from Mohawk cause they've got all the money. It just doesn't matter if we win or we lose. It just doesn't matter! It just doesn't matter! It just doesn't matter!

 

The group: IT JUST DOESN'T MATTER! IT JUST DOESN'T MATTER...

 

Source: Meatballs (the movie)

 

Geocaching: Camp Mohawk

Waymarking: Camp North Star.

Edited October 14, 2016 by jhuoni

[+T0SHEA]

oops, should have said: Open topic about Waymarking.

 

Guess I got the cart before the horse, or inserted foot.

[+jhuoni]

I was talking about Waymarking.

[+elyob]

He was definitely talking about Waymarking.

[+T0SHEA]

I suggest brainstorming more synonyms for "stagnate," "dormant" and "inactive." That way you can have more forum threads (one thread per synonym) and more opportunities for takeovers and revamps of Waymarking categories.

 

BK-Hunters quote from Stagnate Categories: An ongoing problem Posted 24 September 2016 - 07:10 AM:

 

"There are 100s of adjectives to describe this ongoing unresolved problem. It does not matter what the name of the thread is in this forum the dilemma still remains the same: Waymarkers are not being reviewed in a timely manner."

 

We could post a 100 threads all with different adjectives, it still does not change anything.

 

What is your solution?

[+jhuoni]

He was definitely talking about Waymarking.

 

Thank you for seeing that!

[+T0SHEA]

He was definitely talking about Waymarking.

 

Being vegetarian, I missed the meatball reference. Don't do movies either.

[+T0SHEA]

Okay, I got derailed about the movie dialogue... I get it.

 

Two topics that have surfaced on other threads:

 

What to say when you have nothing to say in the long description.

 

Premium Membership, do you renew because of Waymarking or Geocaching? Which one do you devote the most time?

[+T0SHEA]

We could discuss: Requiring three photographs and three sentences in the long description.

 

At least one comment was made during the last peer review. However these requirements were in the proposal, and no discussion in the forum.

[+elyob]

My Waymarking is much much more important than the geocaching. I feel the stress when I sense the demise of Waymarking, for example, when the e-mailer breaks down.

 

Next week, I hope to be hunting benchmarks in Picardie et Nord-Pas-de-Calais.

 

I am a premium member but I do like to see how many weeks I can go before I pay for the next year of membership.

[+Alfouine]

in Picardie et Nord-Pas-de-Calais.

 

Are you punished ? Is it your choice ?

[+fi67]

in Picardie et Nord-Pas-de-Calais.

 

Are you punished ? Is it your choice ?

Stop, not another movie dialogue!

[+fi67]

What to say when you have nothing to say in the long description.

There is always something to say about a location. If there is some documentation you can use this. If there is not you can describe the location: How does it look like? What can you do/see/enjoy/buy etc. there? How do you get there? What is the surroundings area like?

Easy, and you already have four original sentences. Even works for chain stores.

 

So the three sentences requirement is a perfectly valid limit.

 

But there are two sub-topics (and both are not touched by the three sentences requirement alone):

 

1. Long text is completely cited from other web sites.

 

My personal opinion, I don not really like that too much, but I do not see a problem as long as the original sources are correctly attributed and is clearly labeled as a citation.

 

2. There is some long text, but it does not say anything about the subject of the waymark.

 

Like some object in a museum and there is a lenghy description of the museum, but the real subject does not even appear in the text. I have even weirder examples, like several different waymarks in different categories all give a short overview of the city where they are, nothing else.

 

Now, this is something I cannot understand, but when the category description does not even explicitly require a long text at all, I cannot find any valid justification for denial.

 

For the three picture requirement: I am fine with it and I do not have to change my posting habits, but for an officer in several categories it can become increasingly difficult to keep all those special requirements in mind.

 

Premium Membership, do you renew because of Waymarking or Geocaching? Which one do you devote the most time?

This is easy to answer for me. I have never played Geocaching at all, and I have no plans to start with it. So my 30 bucks are supposed to go totally to Waymarking. How many minutes of bug fixing does this make?

[+elyob]

in Picardie et Nord-Pas-de-Calais.

 

Are you punished ? Is it your choice ?

I will be part of a Newfoundlanders' pilgrimage to Beaumont-Hamel.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaumont-Hamel_Newfoundland_Memorial

 

http://www.Waymarking.com/waymarks/WMHQVK_Newfoundland_Battlefield_Memorial_Gueudecourt_France

 

http://www.Waymarking.com/waymarks/WMCQ6T_Newfoundland_Memorial_Kortrijk_Belgium

Edited October 15, 2016 by elyob

[+Alfouine]

It was just a french joke and it refers also to a movie.

 

Thank you for the links, really interesting, i am a great fan of war cemeteries, i discovered a lot of litle one in Normandy this summer, and most of them have a geocache, that's why i practive both games, very complementary.

[+T0SHEA]

Here is an interesting dilemma:

 

As an officer, do you approve your own waymarks?

 

As an officer, if one of your waymarks is put to a vote, do you vote; if so yea or abstain.

 

Also, do you visit your own waymarks?

Edited October 16, 2016 by BK-Hunters

[+Tuena]

Here is an interesting dilemma:

 

As an officer, do you approve your own waymarks?

 

As an officer, if one of your waymarks is put to a vote, do you vote; if so yea or abstain.

 

Also, do you visit your own waymarks?

 

First Qt - No.

 

Second Qt - have already voted yea in this situ.

 

Also - very seldom.

[+Alfouine]

Here is an interesting dilemma:

 

As an officer, do you approve your own waymarks?

 

As an officer, if one of your waymarks is put to a vote, do you vote; if so yea or abstain.

 

Also, do you visit your own waymarks?

 

First : No

Second : It never happened but i will choose abstain

Third : Only if i have no waymark in the category

[+fi67]

Here is an interesting dilemma:

 

As an officer, do you approve your own waymarks?

 

As an officer, if one of your waymarks is put to a vote, do you vote; if so yea or abstain.

 

Also, do you visit your own waymarks?

I don't approve and I don't visit my own waymarks. No exceptions yet, but maybe some day there might be a reason for it.

 

I might vote for my own submissions, it depends on the case. If I am sure that my opinion is correct, then yes. When I already knew, that this is a borderline case, then abstain. But I don't think this has ever happened to me before.

[+T0SHEA]

The reason for the question about voting, we recently submitted a WM (also officer), and it was put to vote. Never even questioned its acceptability to the category when it was posted.

 

It was in the queue and disappeared. I knew it was not approved. Checked the "group link" on the menu bar and saw it was up for vote. Looked at the comment made and wondered why it was even put to vote. I then did a reach of the category and found approximately 40 other approved waymarks for very, very similar WMS. (PARK) it was not submitted in any of the parks categories, just want to make this very clear.

 

With the mailer down, can not contact the leader and ask "why the vote?"

[+T0SHEA]

Okay, how about exchanges?

 

We received an email back in 2014 with an offer to send us WMs for categories we needed. No strings attached. He was not particularly interested in what we could offer, so we proceeded to receive several very nice additions to our grid.

 

Since then we have exchanged with a few others.

 

We realize that some waymarkers are purist and it seems they are fortunate to travel worldwide so they ONLY post WMs they actually visited.

 

I can only speak for ourselves, we do not have that opportunity or the luxury.

 

Exchanges seems the only solution.

 

Do you or have you exchanged?

[Bon Echo]

Here is an interesting dilemma:

 

As an officer, do you approve your own waymarks?

 

As an officer, if one of your waymarks is put to a vote, do you vote; if so yea or abstain.

 

Also, do you visit your own waymarks?

 

No^3, I also do not log Attended on any Event that I host. Seems obvious to me. Same way I don't send myself a birthday card.

Edited October 16, 2016 by Bon Echo

[+elyob]

I love doing exchanges and I am willing to do any with anyone for any reason.

 

I would NOT review or vote on my own waymark. I would sooner edit such a waymark, placing it in a different category.

 

As a newb, I visited many but not all of my own waymarks. I now wish that I had not done that.

[+T0SHEA]

As a newb, I visited many but not all of my own waymarks. I now wish that I had not done that.

 

Been there, done that...

 

At first, I did not even know you could visit your own waymarks. Must have read something about it on the forum.

 

Well I was on a mission to fill the calendar grid. After months, and several mishaps (missed days) I finally stopped. That was over 5000 visits later. This year I started deleting them, took me longer to do this then actually posting them. Now the visits that are still recorded are only those that are posted by other waymarkers and none of our own waymarks.

 

It takes a lot of time and work, but you can delete them. Just go to my visits and review from there and delete the one you want removed.

[+Manville Possum]

Here is an interesting dilemma:

 

As an officer, do you approve your own waymarks?

 

As an officer, if one of your waymarks is put to a vote, do you vote; if so yea or abstain.

 

Also, do you visit your own waymarks?

 

Yes, yes, and no.

[+Benchmark Blasterz]

I do not approve my own waymarks.

 

I have not ever voted to approve one of my own waymarks.

 

I visit all my waymarks to track my trips.

 

I am willing to exchange with other WMers who may need a TX or US-based icon.

[+T0SHEA]

I visit all my waymarks to track my trips.

 

That sounds like an interesting, yet inscrutable (to me) concept. We track our trips with our waymarks, much like leaving a trail of bread crumbs. Could you explain how you track your trips with visits, as opposed to waymarks? I'm obviously on a different channel than are you.

 

K.

[+T0SHEA]

Here's a pertinent thought - if there were as many Waymarkers as there are Geocachers, we would all be visiting by now. The only unwaymarked sites left would be in that strange and mysterious land to which I'm transported with Google Maps when I forget the minus sign in the longitude.

 

K.

Edited October 17, 2016 by BK-Hunters

[+fi67]

Okay, how about exchanges?

 

We received an email back in 2014 with an offer to send us WMs for categories we needed. No strings attached. He was not particularly interested in what we could offer, so we proceeded to receive several very nice additions to our grid.

 

Since then we have exchanged with a few others.

 

We realize that some waymarkers are purist and it seems they are fortunate to travel worldwide so they ONLY post WMs they actually visited.

 

I can only speak for ourselves, we do not have that opportunity or the luxury.

 

Exchanges seems the only solution.

 

Do you or have you exchanged?

 

No problem with exchanges, but I don't do them. One of my main motivations for Waymarking is to track where I've been and what I have seen and learned in these areas. This is for both, posts and visits. Exchanges would contradict this objective. Icon hunting is less important to me and there are still quite a few to get without assistance. For the same reason I am very reserved with visits to "locationless" Waymarks like Bloggers or Photo Goals.

 

When someone has other goals, then that's fine.

[+BruceS]

I will try to answer all the questions in one post.

 

Do I approve my own waymarks: No

 

Do I vote for my own: Yes

 

Do I visit my own: No

 

Do I do exchanges: No If I have not been to the location I will not waymark it. (With the exception of the couple categories that are set up as exchanges) For this reason I do not like how the uncategorized waymarks ended up being set up. Originally the concept was it for more experienced waymarkers to help out newer waymarkers to get a waymark posted and the waymark was going to belong to the original poster. This was changed at the last minute before they went live with uncategorized waymarks. This is not to say that I won't ask another waymarker to get me a certain type of photo of a location that I failed to get when I was at the location myself (I have done that a couple times). I will also ask a local waymarker where I may find an unwaymarked item for a category if I am in their area, particularly if it is an item not easily found on an internet search.

[+T0SHEA]

I do not like how the uncategorized waymarks ended up being set up. Originally the concept was it for more experienced waymarkers to help out newer waymarkers to get a waymark posted and the waymark was going to belong to the original poster. This was changed at the last minute before they went live with uncategorized waymarks.

 

I agree, there are currently 74 uncategorized waymarks that are useless. The earliest one dates back Feb. 2010. All but the latest 6 the rest are from 2010 to 2013.

 

Of those (approximately) 20 have no picture, and 25 of them are Little Minnesota.

 

So what is the point, if they have not been categorized in six years: it just is NOT going to happen.

 

Wonder if they can be deleted?

Edited October 17, 2016 by BK-Hunters

[Bon Echo]

Here's a pertinent thought - if there were as many Waymarkers as there are Geocachers, we would all be visiting by now. The only unwaymarked sites left would be in that strange and mysterious land to which I'm transported with Google Maps when I forget the minus sign in the longitude.

 

K.

 

Or when a new [insert location name here] opens up, then there would be a race to get out the door and get the images to get FTW (First to Waymark).

[+Benchmark Blasterz]

I do not like how the uncategorized waymarks ended up being set up. Originally the concept was it for more experienced waymarkers to help out newer waymarkers to get a waymark posted and the waymark was going to belong to the original poster. This was changed at the last minute before they went live with uncategorized waymarks.

 

I agree, there are currently 74 uncategorized waymarks that are useless. The earliest one dates back Feb. 2010. All but the latest 6 the rest are from 2010 to 2013.

 

Of those (approximately) 20 have no picture, and 25 of them are Little Minnesota.

 

So what is the point, if they have not been categorized in six years: it just is NOT going to happen.

 

Wonder if they can be deleted?

 

They CAN be deleted. Visit Uncat, select, then assign a category to the waymark. Save it, and then you can delete it.

 

The Little Minnesota waymarks have had a lot of work put into them, and so while I see no future for them right now, I personally would not feel right deleting them. Others are clearly never going to be able to be able to fit into a category, but it feels rude to me to delete them.

 

I have had some success rescuing and creating waymarks from Uncats, but the Uncats that can be fashioned into a viable WM are pretty rare.

[+T0SHEA]

Help, I would like to know what those three columns are named and the significance in front of Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

 

[+elyob]

It is often thought significant that our chapels have on them a steeple, with spires toward the heavens symbolic of how our lives ought to be ever moving upward toward God.

 

https://www.lds.org/manual/teachings-of-presidents-of-the-church-ezra-taft-benson/chapter-23-strengthen-thy-stakes?lang=eng

[+T0SHEA]

9,516 approved waymarks is the minimum magic number to turn your calendar that medium dark maroon. This requires that the 366 calendar days are recorded with a minimum of 26 approved waymarks on each of the 366 days = 9,516 approved waymarks.

 

There are currently 9 waymarkers with more than the required number of approved waymarks to fill the calendar 26 x 366 = 9,516.

 

No one has accomplished this until now...

 

Next goal turn the calendar that darkest maroon which is 101 x 366 = 36,966 approved waymarks.

[+elyob]

It is so pretty. I'm working on getting one single square to be medium dark maroon. Well done.

[+T0SHEA]

It is so pretty. I'm working on getting one single square to be medium dark maroon. Well done.

 

Hey, you have your calendar filled, love the pink. Looking at it, where do you plan to start?

[+elyob]

My posting focus is to keep the Longest Slump at a bare minimum.

[+T0SHEA]

Read the Forum Guidelines link is at the top of the main page and provided and created by Groundspeak.

 

Just a reminder to the terms and conditions we all agreed in order to use this forum. http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?app=forums&module=extras&section=boardrules

[+BruceS]

Read the Forum Guidelines link is at the top of the main page and provided and created by Groundspeak.

 

Just a reminder to the terms and conditions we all agreed in order to use this forum. http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?app=forums&module=extras&section=boardrules

 

Thank you.

[+TerraViators]

Here is an interesting dilemma:

 

As an officer, do you approve your own waymarks?

 

As an officer, if one of your waymarks is put to a vote, do you vote; if so yea or abstain.

 

Also, do you visit your own waymarks?

I would not approve my own waymarks. I would vote on my own waymark.

[+T0SHEA]

Happy Holidays.

 

The New Year is almost here, do you have any Waymarking goals or wishes for the 2017?

 

On a positive note: Glad to see the statistics are working, the email is working and...

[+jhuoni]

Happy Holidays.

 

The New Year is almost here, do you have any Waymarking goals or wishes for the 2017?

 

On a positive note: Glad to see the statistics are working, the email is working and...

 

Talk?

 

We Do The Dance Of JOY!

 

The stats are working again!

 

Thanks Groundspeak

[+lumbricus]

...We Do The Dance Of JOY!...

 

2017 will be the Waymarking year!

 

[+T0SHEA]

How about the issue of redundant: Open discussion

 

According to the peer review guidelines: Redundant - Could this category be included as a variable in an existing category? For instance, let's say this new category is called "Blue Lighthouses". But, wait! There may already be a "Lighthouses category". Would it make more sense to add a variable for different colors in the "Lighthouses" details?

 

This definition of redundant is well defined, however this issue of redundancy comes up quite often during discussions on the forum and during peer review.

 

To paraphrase: “This proposal can be waymarked “in other categories”.

 

Is this to mean “cross posting” into another category or as the example of the “Blue Lighthouse?

 

When reading forum posts or during peer review: what is “your” interpretation/understanding of redundant?

 

Those of us who read the peer review definition of redundant understand technically what it means, however is there more to the story?

[+Manville Possum]

 

When reading forum posts or during peer review: what is “your” interpretation/understanding of redundant?

 

 

To me it means are there other present categories that will accept my photo as a WM, or does it need a new category of it's own because no others will accept it. Or is it interesting enough that it deserves it's own category.

[+Benchmark Blasterz]

 

When reading forum posts or during peer review: what is “your” interpretation/understanding of redundant?

 

 

To me it means are there other present categories that will accept my photo as a WM, or does it need a new category of it's own because no others will accept it. Or is it interesting enough that it deserves it's own category.

 

Yes, MP -- but there's more to it, I think. Waymarking has been built around specific and sometimes narrow categories of things, which is why the old example of redundant (blue lighthouses instead of lighthouses) was put forward in that way.

 

Now we have a category in peer review that turns that concept around, by taking specific categories of things and lumping them all together into a general category, while denying there is any issue of redundancy.

 

I posted this elsewhere (bold for emphasis, not shouting):

 

Under Waymark Category Criteria for Redundant it states:

 

"Could this category be included as a variable in an existing category? For instance, let's say this new category is called "Blue Lighthouses". But, wait! There may already be a "Lighthouses category". Would it make more sense to add a variable for different colors in the "Lighthouses" details?"

 

In which existing category space art can be included as variable? Not existing categories but one category. Space art is not subset of any existing category.

 

But you still don't answer why creating a general category that will encompass all the artistic and space-themed waymarks in the various more specific categories is not redundant.

 

By your argument, I could create a category called CATS and all the Lion statues, all the Lions international Club markers, all the Figurative Public sculptures, all the cats in Animal Memorials, and cat graffitos in Graffiti, and all the Cat museums in Oddball Museums could also be waymarked in my new category, and this WOULD NOT create a redundancy issue.

 

THAT MAKES NO SENSE

 

You have the same issue with a category called CHURCHES, which would accept any and all churches everywhere, or the category BENCHMARKS, SURVEY STONES, PUBLIC LAND SURVEY MARKERS, BORDER/BOUNDARY MARKERS AND SIMILAR that would take everything worldwide that is used to mark a boundary or is part of a geodesic network.

 

You ... are failing to understand the core of Waymarking, which is to draw specific categories that include one kind of specific thing, and excludes other even similar kinds of things: think Roman Catholic Churches, for example. Lutheran Churches can't be waymarked there.

 

*IF you can narrow down your way too overly broad idea, AND

 

*IF you can create a category whose potential waymarks will not all fit 100% into another existing category and

 

*IF you can clearly articulate what is and is not allowed in the category, and

 

*IF your category will COMPLEMENT existing categories instead of being a copy-paste of existing waymarks from other categories, and

 

*IF you can provide enough specific examples of what the category seeks (and more importantly DOES NOT SEEK) so waymarkers can know what fits and what doesn't, then ...

 

 

So - even if you take a narrow blinders-on 'only categories that are subsets of other categories can be redundant' approach, that results in creation of a general category that makes dozens of EXISTING categories redundant under that narrow blinders-on definition.

 

Now what happens to all those now-redundant categories? Do the category owners have to modify them to EXCLUDE Space Art?

 

And what happens to all those already-approved waymarks? Will they be declined, with the message to submit to Space Art?

 

As a Waymarking community, do we want to go in that direction, where a new very overbroad and general category can wreak havoc on the classification system we have now, and that waymarkers know and function well in?

 

If so, why not do away with all the 1045-ish individual narrowly-defined categories and simply have 15 categories comprised only of the existing top-level categories:

 

Animals

Buildings

Business

Culture

Entertainment

History

Measurement Standards

Monuments

Nature

Oddities

Recreation

Signs

Structures

Technology

&

Waymarking Multifarious

Edited July 12, 2017 by Benchmark Blasterz