Jump to content

Event or Something Else?


TeamSeekAndWeShallFind
Followers 6

Recommended Posts

Is it acceptable to plan/create/submit an event under the guise of such but the actual purpose is to get a group together to target a specific single elusive cache or extensive series? For example: Host a Flash Mob event under the guise of/in honor of a very important historical event but in reality, the 'event' is not as much about that important historical event as it is about the event host finding the elusive cache which just so happens to be at GZ of said event?

Edited by TeamSeekAndWeShallFind
Link to comment

You can do all of those things, but it won't be published..

 

An event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together geocachers for an organized geocache search. Such group hunts are best organized using a discussion forum or an email distribution list.

http://www.geocaching.com/geocache/GC4QQNM_spaaaaaaace-flash-mob?guid=95b89011-7a91-433a-81d8-e720d0b38266

 

If you read the attendance logs you will clearly see that this event/flash mob was NOT at all about the launching of the space shuttle but all about organizing a group to find the cache at GZ where this event was held.

Edited by TeamSeekAndWeShallFind
Link to comment

 

There's nothing in the description which alludes to looking for a specific cache. I see mention of it in a log though.

 

Well they obviously didn't tell the reviewer if that was the real intent. :unsure:

Of course there's nothing in the description that alludes to looking for a specific cache! The event host knows better! All of that talk was done on FB. Every person who attended knew why the event was at that GZ! There is mention of the true intent in almost all of the logs. Thing is, this was an important/historical event that was used as a cover.

Link to comment

I'm not really sure how a reviewer could possibly "police" this sort of dual agenda.

For some clarity on the real reason for your post see GC3JGMM (sorry can't do a link on my iPad).

I would be honoured if an event was organised with one of the reasons being to try and find my cache. I would be somewhat embarrassed if it then turned out that the main reason it was so elusive was because the cords were considered soft!

Link to comment

I'm not really sure how a reviewer could possibly "police" this sort of dual agenda.

For some clarity on the real reason for your post see GC3JGMM (sorry can't do a link on my iPad).

I would be honoured if an event was organised with one of the reasons being to try and find my cache. I would be somewhat embarrassed if it then turned out that the main reason it was so elusive was because the cords were considered soft!

Wether the coords for the target cache/real reason for the event, were good or bad or soft or hard or whatever is beside the point isn't it?

 

An event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together geocachers for an organized geocache search. Such group hunts are best organized using a discussion forum or an email distribution list.

I'm done. I wish I could delete my original post. UGGHH.

Edited by TeamSeekAndWeShallFind
Link to comment

 

There's nothing in the description which alludes to looking for a specific cache. I see mention of it in a log though.

 

Well they obviously didn't tell the reviewer if that was the real intent. :unsure:

Of course there's nothing in the description that alludes to looking for a specific cache! The event host knows better! All of that talk was done on FB. Every person who attended knew why the event was at that GZ! There is mention of the true intent in almost all of the logs. Thing is, this was an important/historical event that was used as a cover.

 

It's a common way to get around the guideline and from my standpoint as a reviewer, perfectly fine. I publish any event that conforms to the guidelines according to the description on the page. What people actually do when they get there is out of my control and really none of my business. Where I live a common practice is to have a "donuts and coffee" event. Most locals know they are thinly disguised gatherings meant to hunt caches. They are usually held at a trail head parking lot and last about 30 minutes to an hour. The cache hunt aspect is discussed among potential attendees via emails, Facebook, forums, etc., but all the reviewer is concerned about is whether the coffee and donuts event complies with the guidelines as it is written up.

Edited by briansnat
Link to comment

 

There's nothing in the description which alludes to looking for a specific cache. I see mention of it in a log though.

 

Well they obviously didn't tell the reviewer if that was the real intent. :unsure:

Of course there's nothing in the description that alludes to looking for a specific cache! The event host knows better! All of that talk was done on FB. Every person who attended knew why the event was at that GZ! There is mention of the true intent in almost all of the logs. Thing is, this was an important/historical event that was used as a cover.

 

It's a common way to get around the guideline and from my standpoint as a reviewer, perfectly fine. I publish any event that conforms to the guidelines according to the description on the page. What people actually do when they get there is out of my control and really none of my business. Where I live a common practice is to have a "donuts and coffee" event. Most locals know they are thinly disguised gatherings meant to hunt caches. They are usually held at a trail head parking lot and last about 30 minutes to an hour. The cache hunt aspect is discussed among potential attendees via emails, Facebook, forums, etc., but all the reviewer is concerned about is whether the coffee and donuts event complies with the guidelines as it is written up.

 

As the reviewer who published the event, all I have to say is "This".

 

The event listing page conforms to Groundspeak's event guidelines, so it was published.

Link to comment

You can do all of those things, but it won't be published..

 

An event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together geocachers for an organized geocache search. Such group hunts are best organized using a discussion forum or an email distribution list.

You can do all of those things, and if you word it correctly, it will be published.

Link to comment

The purpose of the guideline is to prevent geocachers making it an event, every time they get together for a cache hunt. Groups getting together to go caching is just too common and TPTB saw no reasons for requiring reviewers to post an event each time there was a group hunt.

 

For the most part group hunts are organized on the fly or at least with less lead time than is required for an event. But there are times where a group is forming for a hunt far enough in advance that they may want to use an event as a way of publicizing the hunt and getting more geocachers to participate. Many geocachers probably would like to see Groundspeak change the rules to allow the event list to be used as a way to let people know about the hunt. People who get there knickers twisted over smileys, may see events as just a way for the group to add one more cache to the total they find in the group hunt. But if you don't view the find count as a score it would be reasonable to allow events to be used to publicize a group hunt.

 

One can have an event (even a flashmob event) that might even mention a cache hunt before or after the event. In the end however, Groundspeak wants events to stand alone. I've been to events where inclement weather forced the cancellation of the planned hunt, but we still held the event since it could stand on it's own. Some cachers decided to go urban cache hunting after the event anyhow.

 

I see no evidence that the flash mob did not stand alone as a geocaching-in-space event. I suspect many of these events were flash mobs and people went caching before or after the event. The fact that the flash mob was held at the coordinates of another cache may show the organizer was clearly planning to get a group to find that cache. But the people who attended the flash mob were not required to participate in this hunt.

Link to comment

There are many events where people go and find caches. Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't the guidelines say "...for the sole purpose of finding caches.."

 

I take that to mean that you can have an event at a coffee shop, and someone, either planned or spontaneous says "Hey anyone want to come and try to find XXX and YYY caches!"

 

You don't have to go find the caches to be able to log the event...

 

It's a bit different than an event that's pretty much "Let's meet at GZ for cache ABC and well find caches DEF, GHI,JKL as well."

 

As you can see there's a difference between finding caches at/after an event, and finding caches is the event. And on the plus side, if you hold an event more people will come, who might have some hints or advice on finding the cache. If you gather at the cache site, the CO, and others who have found it probably wont show up-after all they already found the cache, they don't need any help with it...

Link to comment

The reviewer obviously had no way of knowing.

 

I agree, it's dishonest for a cacher to hold such an event. If you were a new cacher, you'd show up at the event expecting something different. If they're already on Facebook, why not just arrange things through there?

 

I have to laugh that they published an event just to find a cache with bad coordinates. It doesn't even sound like it's a clever camo job... and with the string of DNFs on that 1.5 difficulty cache, you'd like to have hoped the reviewer would have stepped in and done something a long time ago...

Edited by The_Incredibles_
Link to comment

Contrary to popular belief the volunteer reviewers are not mind-readers. They aren't responsible for determining the intent of an event host, just ensuring that the listing itself meets the guidelines. If people make plans outside of the event listing for extra-curricular actions that's just fine. I cannot think of a single geocaching event that I have attended that didn't have at least a few attendees plan to find a cache before, during, or after the event. Cachers hide and seek caches; why should there be any surprise that some choose to do it as part of event attendance?

 

To the OP, do you ever start a forum discussion without the intent to stir the pot and complain about the actions of other geocachers? Here's a bigger spoon for your next thread; find your own pot.

 

42-17677832.jpg

Link to comment

Interesting.

 

My understand of all this is as follows:

 


  1.  
  2. The OP is first to log a find on a cache placed on 5/2/12 (the day the cache was published).
  3. A few DNFs are logged on that cache in the days that follow. The CO temporarily disables the cache, then enables the cache, reporting that the cache is in place.
  4. Some 30+ DNFs are logged over the next 15 or so months (with no Finds logged). Some of the DNFs question whether the coordinates are off. During that time, the CO posts several times that the cache is still in place, and shouldn't be that hard to find.
  5. Following the long string of DNFs, several cachers record finds in August 2013 (none mention coordinate issues).
  6. A few more DNFs (and a DNF disguised as a Found It) follow over the next couple of months.
  7. CO posts again that cache is in place, and reiterates that the cache isn't a particularly difficult or creative hide.
  8. A Flash Mob event is posted on 10/23/2013. The event coordinates are close to (within 25 feet or so of) the infrequently found cache that was placed back in 2012.
  9. The Flash Mob event takes place on 11/6/2013.
  10. On the same day, some 40 geocachers log finds on the infrequently found cache that was placed back in 2012. Some of the Found It logs report coordinates being off (most don't mention coordinates, but one cacher reports coordinates are off by "10-15 feet", another cacher reports coordinates are off by "20 to 30 feet".
  11. The next day, the CO archives the cache, apparently unhappy that the elusive cache was "mob logged" as the result of the event.
  12. Two days later, the person who logged the FTF on the formerly elusive cache back in May of 2012 starts this topic, questioning the legitimacy of the event that led to the large number of finds on 11/6/2013.
  13. The same day, the reviewer responsible for publishing the event responds, explaining that the event, as submitted, did not violate any guidelines. Other posters (and at least one other reviewer) post similar views.
  14. wimseyguy posts a picture of a chef carrying an over-sized spoon.
     

 

Does that sound about right? :unsure:

Link to comment

Interesting.

 

My understand of all this is as follows:

 


  1.  
  2. The OP is first to log a find on a cache placed on 5/2/12 (the day the cache was published).
  3. A few DNFs are logged on that cache in the days that follow. The CO temporarily disables the cache, then enables the cache, reporting that the cache is in place.
  4. Some 30+ DNFs are logged over the next 15 or so months (with no Finds logged). Some of the DNFs question whether the coordinates are off. During that time, the CO posts several times that the cache is still in place, and shouldn't be that hard to find.
  5. Following the long string of DNFs, several cachers record finds in August 2013 (none mention coordinate issues).
  6. A few more DNFs (and a DNF disguised as a Found It) follow over the next couple of months.
  7. CO posts again that cache is in place, and reiterates that the cache isn't a particularly difficult or creative hide.
  8. A Flash Mob event is posted on 10/23/2013. The event coordinates are close to (within 25 feet or so of) the infrequently found cache that was placed back in 2012.
  9. The Flash Mob event takes place on 11/6/2013.
  10. On the same day, some 40 geocachers log finds on the infrequently found cache that was placed back in 2012. Some of the Found It logs report coordinates being off (most don't mention coordinates, but one cacher reports coordinates are off by "10-15 feet", another cacher reports coordinates are off by "20 to 30 feet".
  11. The next day, the CO archives the cache, apparently unhappy that the elusive cache was "mob logged" as the result of the event.
  12. Two days later, the person who logged the FTF on the formerly elusive cache back in May of 2012 starts this topic, questioning the legitimacy of the event that led to the large number of finds on 11/6/2013.
  13. The same day, the reviewer responsible for publishing the event responds, explaining that the event, as submitted, did not violate any guidelines. Other posters (and at least one other reviewer) post similar views.
  14. wimseyguy posts a picture of a chef carrying an over-sized spoon.
     

 

Does that sound about right? :unsure:

 

14. Many of us (myself included) have waaaay too much time on our hands. :P

Link to comment

 

There's nothing in the description which alludes to looking for a specific cache. I see mention of it in a log though.

 

Well they obviously didn't tell the reviewer if that was the real intent. :unsure:

Of course there's nothing in the description that alludes to looking for a specific cache! The event host knows better! All of that talk was done on FB. Every person who attended knew why the event was at that GZ! There is mention of the true intent in almost all of the logs. Thing is, this was an important/historical event that was used as a cover.

 

It's a common way to get around the guideline and from my standpoint as a reviewer, perfectly fine. I publish any event that conforms to the guidelines according to the description on the page. What people actually do when they get there is out of my control and really none of my business. Where I live a common practice is to have a "donuts and coffee" event. Most locals know they are thinly disguised gatherings meant to hunt caches. They are usually held at a trail head parking lot and last about 30 minutes to an hour. The cache hunt aspect is discussed among potential attendees via emails, Facebook, forums, etc., but all the reviewer is concerned about is whether the coffee and donuts event complies with the guidelines as it is written up.

Not sure why TeamSeek in so upset about this - & I also wonder if such "policing" helps with their goal of better relations in the community....

Link to comment

First, I've always felt the guideline's wording was a bit off. It probably should read something like, "An event cache should not be set up for the sole primary purpose of drawing together geocachers for an organized geocache search." Even events intended as organized hunts have lots of other purposes: some socializing, some exercise, absorbing some Vitamin D, enjoying nature, getting that extra smiley, etc.

 

Second, Groundspeak actually conducted a pilot project to allow officially sanctioned organized hunt events in Ontario a couple years ago. As of 15 months ago, the idea had been placed on the backburner, although "active discussions" continued at the Lily Pad.

Link to comment

Is it acceptable to plan/create/submit an event under the guise of such but the actual purpose is to get a group together to target a specific single elusive cache or extensive series? For example: Host a Flash Mob event under the guise of/in honor of a very important historical event but in reality, the 'event' is not as much about that important historical event as it is about the event host finding the elusive cache which just so happens to be at GZ of said event?

 

http://www.geocaching.com/geocache/GC4QQNM_spaaaaaaace-flash-mob?guid=95b89011-7a91-433a-81d8-e720d0b38266

 

If you read the attendance logs you will clearly see that this event/flash mob was NOT at all about the launching of the space shuttle but all about organizing a group to find the cache at GZ where this event was held.

 

Of course there's nothing in the description that alludes to looking for a specific cache! The event host knows better! All of that talk was done on FB. Every person who attended knew why the event was at that GZ! There is mention of the true intent in almost all of the logs. Thing is, this was an important/historical event that was used as a cover.

 

Wether the coords for the target cache/real reason for the event, were good or bad or soft or hard or whatever is beside the point isn't it?

 

An event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together geocachers for an organized geocache search. Such group hunts are best organized using a discussion forum or an email distribution list.

I'm done. I wish I could delete my original post. UGGHH.

 

Why do you care? Is this somehow degrading your own game? If people had fun and the event is not against the guidelines (which it wasn't), why are you even complaining?

Link to comment
[*]The next day, the CO archives the cache, apparently unhappy that the elusive cache was "mob logged" as the result of the event.

 

Even though people mentioned that with good coordinates, the cache was pretty easy, the cache owner apparently thought his hide was great and so very much "elusive" simply because his coordinates were off. I guess any cache could be elusive with poor coordinates. :rolleyes:

Link to comment

It seems like there's an underlying issue within the OP's community on this topic given all of the facts presented. I will say though, this sort of thing happens all the time. I held a space event for the sole purpose of the launch. Not long after mine published, a fellow cacher in the community got a space event of his own published about twenty miles or so away. The listing didn't violate any guidelines, but it was pretty clear that he was using the launch to get cachers to follow him and find his caches that don't get found often.

 

This happens so frequently that I don't really remember the last time I attended an event that didn't involve an organized cache hunt afterwards.

 

Another thing to mention.....power trail kickoff events. It's obvious people are holding these events with the intent of cachers completing a power trail.....if organized cache hunts are not permissible as an event, than why are power trail kickoff events approved? I recently went to an event like this to tag along with some good friends and have some laughs.....it was literally called "Wizard Trail Event". The whole purpose of the event was to get the coords to the caches, get gps'rs loaded and find caches. Now how is that not an organized cache hunt?

 

I understand why all of the guidelines are in place, but sometimes they just downright confuse me.

Edited by billdavidsaurus
Link to comment

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Followers 6
×
×
  • Create New...