Charter Member info

Posted January 4, 2003 · January 4, 2003

Jeremy, Will I get an e-mail before my membership expires? I can't remember when I signed up. Thanx

Posted January 5, 2003 · January 5, 2003

I dont remember reading anything on this!

but when I looked up my paypal account history, it showed up as repeat billing.

This means it keeps on giving till you say woooooo.

somehow

More rules = Less fun!

NTGA member

Posted January 5, 2003 · January 5, 2003

Yes. We'll let you know. We started memberships in March of last year. I hope that by March this year we'll have some additional services that will make memberships even more worthwhile.

There is now an option to do a nonrenewable subscription, so some people's subscriptions will expire after a certain point. We will most likely be raising our subscriptions in March/April except for those who have been grandfathered in through the renewable plan.

Jeremy Irish

Groundspeak - The Language of Location

Posted January 5, 2003 · January 5, 2003

Howabout those of us who distrust PayPal, and sent a check to Groundspeak via snail mail? Are those subscriptions tracked in a database or something so that reminders will be sent 30 days prior to expiry? Or do I just mail another check in August? And are we "grandfathered" from the upcoming price hike, since there's no automatic renewal option, by definition?

Also, has a "lifetime membership" option been considered? It'd help upfront cash flow for Groundspeak, while relieving the lifetime member from worrying about renewal payments, price hikes, etc.

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If there's no accounting for stupidity, then why do I need to file a tax return?

Posted January 6, 2003 · January 6, 2003

Ya, I'm not sure it's fair to grandfather in a price just because someone opted to get a renewable subscription. I'd either make everyone pay the increase or give the break to anyone who renews before expiration, which would include those paying by check, yearly paypal, or renewable paypal. Or even grandfather those who joined in the first 6 months or the first year.

I could see it as well with a lifetime membership as Lep said, I was thinking that the other day too.

Some people are like Slinkies . . . not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs.

Posted January 8, 2003 · January 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Irish:
Yes. We'll let you know. We started memberships in March of last year. I hope that by March this year we'll have some additional services that will make memberships even more worthwhile.

I would be happier now if I could count on getting my Pocket Queries. Since about Jan 1st I think have gotten only one.

Posted January 8, 2003 · January 8, 2003

Originally posted by Jeremy Irish:
We will most likely be raising our subscriptions in March/April...QUOTE]

Hey, here's a thought, how about a price cut?

Let's go against the flow.

Posted January 8, 2003 · January 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Criminal:
Hey, here's a thought, how about a price cut?

Let's go against the flow.

Even if the fee doubled, it'd still be reasonable, IMHO. It'd be nice if the new map server is working by the time this happens, though.

Posted January 9, 2003 · January 9, 2003

Doubling the fee is not a problem to me. But instead of getting a map server running, I would prefer to get my pocket queries. I can build my own maps from the information in a GPX.

Posted January 9, 2003 · January 9, 2003

please dont price people out of membership

SR and dboggny.

Posted January 12, 2003 · January 12, 2003

With the rumor of the membership cost going up is there a rumor of how much? I've heard 5 dollars a month vs the now 3 dollars. Is that an accurate number?

______________________________________________________________________________________

So far so good, somewhat new owner of a second/new Garmin GPS V 20 plus finds so far with little to no problem. We'll see what happens when there are leaves on the trees again.

Posted January 12, 2003 · January 12, 2003

Oh, yeah and is there a discount for spending a fortune at the gc.com store?

______________________________________________________________________________________

So far so good, somewhat new owner of a second/new Garmin GPS V 20 plus finds so far with little to no problem. We'll see what happens when there are leaves on the trees again.

Posted January 12, 2003 · January 12, 2003

Actually the cost is determined variably, by the frequency with which you post in the forums. Some rumor about having to buy the "umc server array."

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If there's no accounting for stupidity, then why do I need to file a tax return?

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

I didn't visit for a couple months and come back and see all the talk of charging, and membership fees? Then I remember one of the first post I ever read on here from jeremy stating:

Topic: Changes to Geocaching.com / Trademarks

jeremy

Guest posted June 04, 2001 12:24 PM

4. Pay for Play - Recently there have been fears that the site will become Pay for Play. I want to make it clear right now that I, Jeremy Irish, CEO of Grounded Inc., will never make the geocaching sport a pay for play service, as least as far as I can control it on Geocaching.com. Hopefully that will quash any misinformation in the future. I believe the sport remaining free is in the best interests of the game.

UM, isn't membership 'pay for play' ???

God doesn't deal us a hand, he only supplies the cards and says "Go play"

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by sunsetnkc:
UM, isn't membership 'pay for play' ???

No, it's more like 'pay for better equipment' or 'pay because you love it'. There are still many that don't opt for the charter membership and they are having lots of fun. Then there are those of us who are addicts and couldn't get by without our pocket queries. Like I said in a previous post, paying 3 cents per cache for my charter membership is a bargin. If it goes up to 5 or 6 cents, it's still a bargain.

--Marky

"All of us get lost in the darkness, dreamers learn to steer with a backlit GPSr"

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

When I first paid for my membership, I wasn't 'quite' as addicted to geocaching as I am now. I just paid for the one year. Is there a way that I can get that easily changed to be the automatically renewing variety?

--Marky

"All of us get lost in the darkness, dreamers learn to steer with a backlit GPSr"

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

No, "play for pay" connotes that a membership fee has to be paid in order to gain access to the site and participate in the activity (here, looking up cache information, entering logs, hiding a cache, etc.). You can do all of these things for free. And, unlike some sites, you can keep it that way indefinitely.... not just a "free trial period" that's just long enough to get you hooked.

Deciding to become a charter member is entirely voluntary and is more aptly described as "try before you buy." I liked the low-pressure approach and gladly paid for my membership after a few months of caching. I fully respect others' decisions NOT to become members, for whatever reason. Not that I agree with everything around here, but this aspect of the site is just great.

x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x

If there's no accounting for stupidity, then why do I need to file a tax return?

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

quote:
UM, isn't membership 'pay for play' ???

"

UM, no. Membership is additional features for pay. You still have the same features available to you at NO CHARGE as when Jeremy made that statement. Jeremy simply added some additional features and said that they were available at a small charge to defray the cost of the expense involved. Now just cache away and don't worry about paying. I donated to the site before the Charter Membership was started and I pay now because I want to support the site. After all God did not say Jeremy's had a requirement to provide this expensive service to us out of his own pocket, did He?

________________________________________________________________________

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way, you'll be a mile from them, and you'll have their shoes.

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

I paid to support the site and the game. All the great features? I don't even know what a pocket queer is or a GPX. I think they're some sort of data files for those that know computer stuff. All I want to do load coordinates, do minimum mission planning, and go find caches. For doing this as long as I have, I probably should know a bit more about those things and other stuff like virtual or locationless caches.

My definitions:

Virtual Cache: a cache that I can find in my imagination, I have many finds if this is so, and all of them X-rated.

Locationless Cache: a cache that exists on another plane of reality, requires hallucinogenic drugs to find.

GPX: similar to dbx noise reduction, no before after, yes after before.

Pocket queer: cellmate.

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Criminal:
I paid to support the site and the game.

I love the game and have no problem with the annual dues. My check is good and I have credit cards that will cover the cost. Why grandfather prices for those who use PayPal and charge more if we prefer to pay directly?

Normally I pay more if there is value added, but I have supported the site by paying for services I don't use. Now the price of these unused services will be increased for me and not for others. Increased for me because I choose not to use middle-men PayPal, United Way.. people wanting to make a buck by stepping into the middle of a viable transaction. Groundspeak should be giving discounts to those who pay directly.

We just installed new skylights. The folks in the upper flat are upset.

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Trudy & The Beast:
Why grandfather prices for those who use PayPal and charge more if we prefer to pay directly?

Where did you hear this?

quote:
Now the price of these unused services will be increased for me and not for others. Increased for me because I choose not to use middle-men PayPal...

This is not true. If you renew by check prior to your subscription expiring then you'll be grandfathered in as well.

quote:
...people wanting to make a buck by stepping into the middle of a viable transaction. Groundspeak should be giving discounts to those who pay directly.

Actually, I'd argue that checks are more expensive to process on a per-transaction basis than Paypal. True there's no middle-man charges or fees, but the time it takes us to manually process checks is pretty significant when compared to Paypal's automated system.

We like Paypal because it's automated - their servers tell our servers in real time who subscribed and who unsubscribed. However, we don't like being tied to Paypal and don't like that their subscription service has some pretty serious bugs they're unwilling to admit exist or fix. We also know and understand that some people aren't comfortable using Paypal which is why we're happy to accept checks. Because of this, we're currently in the process of looking into other solutions.

We're not going to try to force or trick you or anyone else to pay an increased subscription rate due to some silly technicality of Paypal vs. check, renewable vs. non-renewable. As long as your subscription stays current, we're happy.

Geocaching.com exists today because of subscribers like you. And trust me, we know it.

-Elias

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

Elias, thanks very much for that post. Working in the banking industry, I've seen too many horror stories about Paypal and I'll never use it.

I think that the inference about Paypal subscriptions being renewable at grandfathered rates may have arisen at the top of this thread. Jeremy made a posting about automatic renewals, then myself and a few others asked for clarification about whether that grandfathering rule mentioned in Jeremy's post would also apply to non-Paypal subscribers. There was never a direct answer provided. Hopefully you've now cleared up the confusion.

x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x

If there's no accounting for stupidity, then why do I need to file a tax return?

Posted January 13, 2003 · January 13, 2003

Online payment?

What about paying online thru your (my) bank account. Would you be able and willing to accept this type of payment?

For my bank to process a payment it needs to know who to make the payment to and the address to send it to.

Also how would you tie they payment to my account? Would I use my member name as the account number?

Just another option for a lot of people nowadays.

Posted January 14, 2003 · January 14, 2003

I can certainly understand the expense involved in running a website this large, and the more geocachers that start up, the more people will be required to run the site. I don't mind a price increase because of it, but do think that members should start getting some major incentives for being members. I'm with others right now in that I don't really use the GPX/pocket query stuff......I don't know how actually.

It seems to me it would be only fair that the folks willing to pay the membership should have more benefits that are obvious to everyone. IE: every new cache would be a members only until after the first find.......then it would open up to eveyrone?

This would not only increase memberships, but would also help take some of the expense off those willing to pay for memberships.........

Children are natural mimics who act like their parents despite every effort to teach them good manners.

Posted January 14, 2003 · January 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Geo-Johnson's:
every new cache would be a members only until after the first find.......then it would open up to eveyrone.

As a member I all for members having extras, but I want it to be my choice if my cache is open for members only and when.

Posted January 14, 2003 · January 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Elias:

quote:
Originally posted by Trudy & The Beast:
Why grandfather prices for those who use PayPal and charge more if we prefer to pay directly.... Increased for me because I choose not to use middle-men PayPal...

This is not true. If you renew by check prior to your subscription expiring then you'll be grandfathered in as well.

-Elias

Thank you for your quick response. This was not clear when the increases and grandfathering were first mentioned. You will see my check before the expiration of my membership.

We just installed new skylights. The folks in the upper flat are upset.

Posted January 15, 2003 · January 15, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Geo-Johnson's:
I can certainly understand the expense involved in running a website this large, and the more geocachers that start up, the more people will be required to run the site. I don't mind a price increase because of it, but do think that members should start getting some major incentives for being members. I'm with others right now in that I don't really use the GPX/pocket query stuff......I don't know how actually.

It seems to me it would be only fair that the folks willing to pay the membership should have more benefits that are obvious to everyone. IE: every new cache would be a members only until after the first find.......then it would open up to eveyrone?

This would not only increase memberships, but would also help take some of the expense off those willing to pay for memberships.........

http://www.pressenter.com/~mdjohnso/worried.gif Children are natural mimics who act like their parents despite every effort to teach them good manners.

Personally, I got the premium membership specifically to get the pocket query! I was using AvantGo to get the caches, but it was not downloading all the info correctly, and ws eating all the memory on my PDA, (yes, more than the eBook!) For 3 bucks a month, it is well worth it!

Posted March 8, 2003 · March 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Elias:
This is not true. If you renew by check prior to your subscription expiring then you'll be grandfathered in as well.

Argh, my subscription was cancelled by Palpay because I forgot to change over the Groundspeak subscription to my new credit card - Paypay are going to attempt to debit again today (now I have changed my card over). At the moment I am listed as a non-charter member, does that mean when I renew I will not have the benefits of the grandfather scheme? If it does it might be nice to loosen the code that cancels the membership until after Palpays second attempt at payment (3 days) to prevent this problem happening to others.

Cheers

Nick.

Posted March 8, 2003 · March 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by BigNick:
At the moment I am listed as a non-charter member, does that mean when I renew I will not have the benefits of the grandfather scheme?.

If your subscription is current at the time of the increase, you'll be grandfathered in.

quote:
...it might be nice to loosen the code that cancels the membership until after Palpays second attempt at payment (3 days) to prevent this problem happening to others.

We're in the process of rewriting the subscription code to prevent these kinds of issues. We're also still looking into accepting more "traditional" types of payments.

-Elias

Posted March 8, 2003 · March 8, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by BigNick:
Argh, my subscription was cancelled by Palpay because I forgot to change over the Groundspeak subscription to my new credit card - Paypay are going to attempt to debit again today (now I have changed my card over).

Nick.

Exact same thing happened to me.I just went back thru the charter member sign up process again,with the updated credit card info,& within seconds, I was a charter member again. All my pocket queries & other member related stuff were unaffected by the lapse, & Pay Pal made no attempt to charge me a second time.

Monday is an awful way to spend 1/7th of your life.

Charter Member info

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