Worthless Contents vs. Thrill of the Hunt

April 30, 2009

My 10 year old son and I are getting back into caching after a year or so of being too busy. It was pretty popular in our area two years ago, and now has gotten even more so -- that is a GREAT thing. But one thing we have noticed is that every cache we found has nothing good in it at all.

Of course we are not in it for the "treasure" but he does like trading little doodads. We have a backpack full of stuff we like to trade - nothing major - Hot Wheels, action figures, Happy Meal toys that aren't totally junky, costume jewelry, things like that. We always try to leave something of equal value from what we take. We have a few higher value items we leave behind on the rare occasions there is something cool in a cache including TB's and coins.

The last two caches we've found have had: a broken bead necklace, some marbles and plastic jacks, wet stickers, a pen that didn't write, a filthy bubble pipe, etc. -- basically crap. I mean, come on, why bother leaving junk? It's better to leave nothing at all than to leave something nobody would want.

Now, my son doesn't mind so much (he says...) he just likes to get his name in the log book. Which is why he doesn't mind hunting micros; he enjoys the challenge. Sometimes I think I'd rather hunt a micro than find a big box full of trash.

Getting good SWAG for these caches is easy! Go to the dollar store or even a yard sale. Leave a dollar bill if you can't think of anything else. One very cool, cheap item to find, I think, is a foreign coin. Could be worth a nickel and a kid would be thrilled.

Now, my son and I would like to hide a cache of our own. But how do you keep it from falling victim to the same fate? It's such a shame. I think we would have to visit our cache every few months and replenish its contents, or else it would be embarrassing! I feel so sorry for the owners of the caches that are left with nothing but junk. What a disrespectful thing to do, both for the owners and the finders.

One idea I've had is to do the TB hotel thing. In your experience, has that worked out? If you specify that to take a TB/coin you have to leave one, do people generally honor that? Or is it a waste of time?

Any other ideas for getting people to be more honorable in what they take/leave?

2.2k · April 30, 2009

Here is a very recent topic that covers this subject, you might find interesting to read:

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=220203

In my opinion, since it's impossible to control others, you're doing the right thing by trading up. My husband and I stopped trading entirely because it didn't seem that interesting anymore, but we have recently (because of that last thread actually, and because we're doing an "anti-micro" challenge) went out and got some really great swag to trade up...

-Rozie

April 30, 2009

Here is a very recent topic that covers this subject, you might find interesting to read:

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=220203

In my opinion, since it's impossible to control others, you're doing the right thing by trading up. My husband and I stopped trading entirely because it didn't seem that interesting anymore, but we have recently (because of that last thread actually, and because we're doing an "anti-micro" challenge) went out and got some really great swag to trade up...

-Rozie

Gosh, this happens to me all the time, someone posts exactly what was on my mind and I don't read far back enough to see it!

Still, I think it's kind of sad. I suspect that in many cases it's a matter of educating the local cachers who think it's OK to rob the cache, even if it's an easy find. This is an affluent area; we can do better than this. I really hate the idea that if it's easy to find, it won't have anything good. That says more about the community than the cache, and a good easy to find cache can really inspire someone who's new to the hobby.

Also I have to say this: People in my area have really low standards about what constitutes a challenging cache. I found one recently that had comments like "wow, this is really a long hike!" and it took us about 20 minutes on a beautiful walk, with one small steep hill. Exhausting. ::roll eyes:: :unsure:

5.8k · April 30, 2009

Here is a very recent topic that covers this subject, you might find interesting to read:

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=220203

In my opinion, since it's impossible to control others, you're doing the right thing by trading up. My husband and I stopped trading entirely because it didn't seem that interesting anymore, but we have recently (because of that last thread actually, and because we're doing an "anti-micro" challenge) went out and got some really great swag to trade up...

-Rozie

Gosh, this happens to me all the time, someone posts exactly what was on my mind and I don't read far back enough to see it!

Still, I think it's kind of sad. I suspect that in many cases it's a matter of educating the local cachers who think it's OK to rob the cache, even if it's an easy find. This is an affluent area; we can do better than this. I really hate the idea that if it's easy to find, it won't have anything good. That says more about the community than the cache, and a good easy to find cache can really inspire someone who's new to the hobby.

Also I have to say this: People in my area have really low standards about what constitutes a challenging cache. I found one recently that had comments like "wow, this is really a long hike!" and it took us about 20 minutes on a beautiful walk, with one small steep hill. Exhausting. ::roll eyes::

If your Cache is to remain well stocked, you probably WILL have to revisit every few months and replenish the swag. Unfortunatly, the growth of the game makes it more and more appealing to people who think that 1/4 mile is a long hike, and a Handful of beads or foam stickers thrown in the bottom is good swag. If you read through the logs on my Cache "Stuck in Buckeye" you can see what people thought of the filler I keep in there. Most of it is interesting/nice but very cheap for me. A trick that I have learned is to place each and every item in a tiny ziplock, and just fill the Cache to the brim with tiny/small trade items. Items do not have to be medium/large in order to be nice/interesting. I think I put 50-60 items in a regular sized Cache, and people seem to love them. There are so many items in there that even if some people leave JUNK, then there's still plenty left. It works for me. I'm still working on making a list of the kinds of things I'm talking about.

April 30, 2009

One idea I've had is to do the TB hotel thing. In your experience, has that worked out? If you specify that to take a TB/coin you have to leave one, do people generally honor that? Or is it a waste of time?

Just remember... A person should NOT have to leave a TB/GC in order to pick one up and keep it traveling. They are not considered 'swag' and are treated differently. The goal of trackables is to keep moving & not get stuck in a cache.

April 30, 2009

You and your son could place a cache that only trades one item in particular. For example, there is a cache in our area that only trades Hot Wheels. The idea is if you are tired of your model Hot Wheel you can come here and exchange it for a different one. I am sure if you brain storm you could come up with a hundred different cache ideas like that one.

I have to agree with you. We really enjoy doing the long multi's in parks where hikes are involved and the containers are large. Recently, for the most part the swag has been pretty disappointing to say the least.

Good luck with your cache.

22k · April 30, 2009

One idea I've had is to do the TB hotel thing. In your experience, has that worked out? If you specify that to take a TB/coin you have to leave one, do people generally honor that? Or is it a waste of time?

Just remember... A person should NOT have to leave a TB/GC in order to pick one up and keep it traveling. They are not considered 'swag' and are treated differently. The goal of trackables is to keep moving & not get stuck in a cache.

When there are trade restrictions that type of cache is referred to as a TB prison, not a hotel.

As for swag then you read back through the forum you can find this issue going back to the start. The only thing I have found to do is to trade-up where I can. But I agree, after seeing what some people leave you sure do have to wonder what the heck they were thinking.

18.9k · April 30, 2009

Best we can do is lead by example. Always trade up or trade even. Leave a decent item in caches that have nothing without trading. Be a good steward. Stock your own caches well and check on them.

April 30, 2009

With under 5 finds I'm still very new to this, so my opinion may not count for much... :unsure:

I'm in it for the Thrill of finding the Cache box/Hide.. I've never taken anything from any of them, I just sign the log in the cache and on the website...

I have tried to tell a get a few friends and get them interested in Geocaching and tried to convery the excitment of just finding the cache....

They just don't seem to get as excited and seem to be more anxious to see or hear what they can get out of the find...

Each to their own, I guess..

Get Hobby either way, Thanks to all of you in the Geocaching Community that make it what it is!!!!

April 30, 2009

Just here to agree and post some ideas/experiences. My daughter and I always trade up. I taught her, if we forget to bring our "swag bag" or we don't have something of equal value, we take nothing.

We found a lot of the easy caches are the ones that have mostly junk in them.

Now, we recently got lucky on craigslist. A retired teacher was selling one of those large plastic "totes" full of toys. I know, a lot of cachers out there don't want to see them, but face it, kids dig this hobby. Anyway, I bet we got over 100 toys, plus pencils and educational items for $20. We probably have enough tradables to last us a year or more, unless we start hiding our own soon.

Also, one of the most interesting coins to me is the WWII 1943 pennies. They are made of steel, so they are silver in color (if they haven't been laying in the ground for years). I've placed a few in some caches we found and like someone said, it's monetary value isn't much, but I've heard from a couple people about how excited they were to find it.

It doesn't need to be expensive. Just make it something fun at least.

Edited April 30, 2009 by JakeInPA

April 30, 2009

Also, one of the most interesting coins to me is the WWII 1943 pennies. They are made of steel, so they are silver in color (if they haven't been laying in the ground for years). I've placed a few in some caches we found and like someone said, it's monetary value isn't much, but I've heard from a couple people about how excited they were to find it.

It doesn't need to be expensive. Just make it something fun at least.

My daughter and I have a ton of forigen (non-US) coins that I think we're going to start putting in caches that have the room... There is a coin shop near us that usaully has 5 Gallon buckets of them and sells them by the pound...

April 30, 2009

The thrill of the hunt is my main motivator, but it's fun to see good swag, too. If my boys come along, that's their prime motivator! :-) Since I know so many kids geocache, I bring "good stuff" to trade, things I know any of my children would enjoy getting. (Matter of fact, I've had to say "No, that's to trade in geocaches, leave it in the bag!")

A good place to get cheap stuff and lots of it, if you don't find what you need at the dollar store, etc., is Oriental Trading Company's website. They have some really cool items that I used to order when I did kids' summer day camps. You can get enough stuff to last all year, and maybe next!

1.6k · April 30, 2009

I always carry swag with me If the cache is a little low I might leave without taking. That's permitted. Think of it as Priming C

Carma!!! Personally I treat SWAG as travelers. I keep virtually none of what I take. I move it to another cache.

Edited April 30, 2009 by ras_oscar

April 30, 2009

We usually only take an item from a cache if it was a rewarding find and we want something that will remind us of our experience. We always leave something as good as we take, that's the best you can do.

Unfortunately it's usually the easier access caches where the swag degrades the fastest. Sometimes the ones that are farther out on the trails seem to keep the best items in them.

Trading up and setting the example is the best thing to do.

I know what you mean about comments about really long hikes, etc...

We enjoy difficult caches, with long hikes (7+ miles) and bushwhacking. There have been a few that we have done that are pretty extreme. One was a multi with 10 stages of intense bushwhacking on each stage (average about 600 feet through solid walls of palmettos or scrub brush). It took us 2 days, and most of the part that wasn't bushwhacking was about thigh deep in the swamp.

A few weeks ago we went out expecting to do some bushwhacking on another set of caches as we had seen those kinds of comments in the logs - "nice find, but lots of bushwhacking on these". When we got there, the worst one was about 100 feet off the trail in mostly open pine trees!

I guess one man's bushwhacking is another man's walk across a parking lot. :rolleyes:

Please don't make a cache that insists that one can only take a trackable item if you leave one. Trackables tend to get stuck in them for long periods of time as they wait for someone to come along with another trackable to free them from 'prison'. Trackables are meant to move and should be moved anytime by anyone who can assist them on their missions.

Good luck and have fun!

6.5k · April 30, 2009

I think the last time I found something in a cache I cared to possess was back in 2006. I still have those zircon encrusted tweezers; they come in handy for getting logs out of tiny micros that have too much log jammed into them.

I still carry some swag items around, and leave them behind just because. Perhaps this could be a good educational experience for you and your son that sometimes it's better to give than receive?

15.3k · April 30, 2009

A few weeks ago we went out expecting to do some bushwhacking on another set of caches as we had seen those kinds of comments in the logs - "nice find, but lots of bushwhacking on these". When we got there, the worst one was about 100 feet off the trail in mostly open pine trees!
I guess one man's bushwhacking is another man's walk across a parking lot.

Perhaps they found a way to bushwack, carefully avoiding the trails...

I found a cache that was perhaps 50' off the trail, with no poison oak at the cache site or between the trail and the cache site. Other logs mentioned bushwacking half a mile or a mile through poison oak. I figure they must have left the winding trail too early and then followed the GPSr arrow to the cache. They never would have been more than 100-200' from the trail, but they wouldn't have seen the trail either.

3.3k · May 1, 2009

While I always traid up, I am not willing to leave a several dollar item in exchange for either nothing or just junk.

Only some what on topic, but I just bought 12 PEZ dispencers of e-bay fo about $10 including shipping. I figure that a PEZ dispencer is a traid up for almost anything you are likely to find in a cache.

May 1, 2009

Oh my gosh...I am an EXPERT at "carefully avoiding trails.: :rolleyes: Happens to me all the time!

I do see your point about the "TB prison." There is one in a local park around here that seems to do pretty well with that concept, but I guess they're just lucky to have a good number of cachers around who enjoy TBs and coins.

Me, I'm a bit shy of taking them nowadays because last time I had one I really messed up (somehow I let the TB get separated from the hitchiker and a friend's kid took it home...I got it back though) and ended up keeping it for months! I still feel bad about that one.

My son and I have been thinking about a Pokemon cache; maybe that will inspire decent swag trades.

May 1, 2009

hello all my first post here so bare with me.I will take my 5 yr old grandson out treasure hunting as he calls it and he does take some of his toys in his little backpack so he can trade and he puts alot of thought into which toys he takes.so off we go for the so called kids hides and find nothing but junk.Now i'm tryen to teach him about give and take when we go out. but it just breaks my heart when we find the cache and he's so thrilled and then the look in his eyes when he finds nothing but junk that even a 5yr old doesn't want.but he'll still leave a toy for the next kid .so now i do two things one i always try to have some kids swag with me to leave as i hardly ever take anything just not my thing and two i try to bring this up at gatherings so maybe some folks will get a clue that a broken toy out of a gumball machine for a paint set is not right.just my two cents.

May 1, 2009

I think it's also the responsibility of the cache owner to keep it clean and stocked with good stuff.

19k · May 1, 2009

Leave a dollar bill if you can't think of anything else.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Do not "buy" swag!!! Please. Ever open up an ammo box only to find nothing but a bunch of coins sliding around on the bottom? In fact, I think that I may start carrying swag with me again, but only so I can swap out swag for coins. I don't want newbies to start thinking that its OK to buy swag. (besides, they NEVER buy it for replacement cost anyway)

3.8k · May 1, 2009

Of course we are not in it for the "treasure" but he does like trading little doodads. We have a backpack full of stuff we like to trade - nothing major - Hot Wheels, action figures, Happy Meal toys that aren't totally junky, costume jewelry, things like that. We always try to leave something of equal value from what we take. We have a few higher value items we leave behind on the rare occasions there is something cool in a cache including TB's and coins.

The last two caches we've found have had: a broken bead necklace, some marbles and plastic jacks, wet stickers, a pen that didn't write, a filthy bubble pipe, etc. -- basically crap. I mean, come on, why bother leaving junk? It's better to leave nothing at all than to leave something nobody would want.

I removed some content from the OP but these two paragraphs stuck out at me.

I think sometimes we assume that others are leaving junk. But to me this looks like the hideous sabatouge of good swag by a poor cache. Let me explain. It sounds like maybe the cache doesn't have a good seal. This would account for the wet stickers So lets see how the swag would look if the cache container had remained dry.

So below is my log of what could have been.

This cache was full of fun stuff for kids. We found some costume jewelry necklaces, some marbles and plastic jacks, schoolbook stickers, a pen from a Hawaiin resort hotel, and a bubble pipe.

My daughter took the jacks because she said it reminded her of Grandma, whom she used to play jacks with when we visited.

My son took the bubble pipe and when we got home he mixed up some bubble solution and annoyed the cat.

Thanks for keeping the cache well stocked. We left a couple of yo-yo's and a shiny Krugerrand, signed the log and continued on the nice walk through the park.

OK maybe I wouldn't leave the Krugerrand unless I found a ver1 Moun10bike coin but the rest of it is plausible.

Edited May 1, 2009 by webscouter.

19k · May 1, 2009

I think it's also the responsibility of the cache owner to keep it clean and stocked with good stuff.

No, it is not! It is the responsibility of the finders to trade equal or up. And the old "one man's trash is another man's treasure" rationalization does not cut it, in my opinion. We are adults and know fully well what the value of a swag item is.

Renewing swag is NOT considered part of cache maintenance, as has been discussed here many times. It costs enough just to put a well stocked regular cache out in the first place.

May 1, 2009

I don't even bother to look at the junk in most caches. Usually, I have to paw my way through it to get to the log, and this is a pain when you are trying to hurry so you don't get caught by the pack of muggles approaching down the trail. I am in it for the thrill of finding a well hidden or camouflaged cache, and sometimes for being led to a great area. I have never even considered carrying swag, as I know I will not find anything I really want to keep. The only thing that I will sometimes take is a travel bug, and I don't seem to run across many of these in the plethora of micros I seem to find.

24.7k · May 1, 2009

...Any other ideas for getting people to be more honorable in what they take/leave?

Be honorable in what you take/leave. Your son and you could take pride in leaving behind something a bit nicer than what you found.

Most times I leave a foreign coin. It's a nothing in my world, but it's good swag just the same. Overall I like to think this is a good thing, and having left it Im' happy, even if someone later merely takes it.

Worthless Contents vs. Thrill of the Hunt

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