Team of Cachers Going Off With Other Groups

[+StaticTank]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account. To me this seems like cheating. I haven’t seen much on this in the forums, but I would guess that most people feel the same way. They believe that it is an excellent way to get higher numbers.

 

Is this common place or do most people consider this cheating? I know there are no set rules and this is just a game (or sport, whichever you like) to play as you want. I just want to know what others think.

 

Thanks,

StaticTank

[+ReadyOrNot]

Your going to get the typical responses

 

"Its not hurting your enjoyment, so don't worry about it"

 

for what its worth, I agree.. It's not right, but there's not a whole lot we can do about it. They are only hurting themselves in the long run.

[+StaticTank]

That is the kind of response I am looking for. I just want to know what peoples personal opinion is. Thank you.

[+Renegade Knight]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account...

 

That becomes a "Team Account" and represents the work of all members of the larger team. So long as the Team has found the caches that account's infomation is accurate for the Team.

 

Any one member would of course have found less caches than the team they belong too. They may or may not log under their own account.

 

As long as you know it's a team account there is no harm. Especiallly since there is no way for individual members to form a team through another method (and have the site automaticly count up the team totals).

Edited March 21, 2008 by Renegade Knight

[+PrincessBTigress]

"Anything worth doing is worth doing well"

 

Last October I walked a 5 mile breast cancer walk, through a local big city, up and down a lot of hills. Multiple times there were short cuts, ways to cut multiple blocks off your walk and while my legs were killing me making the cut sound wonderful I knew I would not feel comfortable saying I had completed a 5 mile walk if I kept taking short cuts.

 

I have to attend a funeral in a tiny town south of me in a couple days. I looked to see if there were any caches I could grab real quick to kind of redeam the trip a bit. I found one that is a virtual, you have to look at a historical marker and answer a couple questions, being that my mother grew up in this tiny town I know the history and know exactly what answers the cache is looking for so technically I could log it without ever visiting it. But then again I'd be lying, I know the answers but I didn't actually look at the spot (least not in many years, I've not been to this town since my early teens).

 

In the end they are lying and cheating just as if they were playing Monopoly and grabbing money from the bank when no one was looking. But they are hurting themselves, just refuse to join in.

[+Cache O'Plenty]

Ref: "...there is no way for individual members to form a team through another method (and have the site automaticly count up the team totals)."

 

You've hit a a great idea - A Team Membership for families - with sub-accounts for individual members. How about individuals (each with their own Premium Membership) being able to join a group (or groups)?

[+briansnat]

If a husband and wife have a team account and the wife happens to bag a few caches while on a business trip and dad stays home and finds a few, I really don't see the big deal.

 

Now if they split up all the time and cache separately just so they can rack up numbers, it's cheesy but it's not something I would lie awake at night thinking about.

[+XopherN71]

Being new to the hobby (which is what it is to me) I guess I could really care less how other people log their finds.

 

Me, I won't log one unless I see it with my own eyes.

 

Really though, there's much more important things to worry about than other peoples numbers - it's fun to look at and I'm amazed by some peoples counts - but I'm not jealous, I'm just glad to be a part of it at the moment.

[+JohnnyVegas]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account. To me this seems like cheating. I haven’t seen much on this in the forums, but I would guess that most people feel the same way. They believe that it is an excellent way to get higher numbers.

 

Is this common place or do most people consider this cheating? I know there are no set rules and this is just a game (or sport, whichever you like) to play as you want. I just want to know what others think.

 

Thanks,

StaticTank

It is cheating, but you will see people say things like "Well if that is the way they want to play it is up to them now they play their game"

I think it is a bunch of Bull.

I know of a group of cachers that go out in an area together and then split up and sign logs for each other

I sure it will happen again at GWVI, when ever I see a "Group" get together for a numbers run, IMO, it is a cheat fest.

I know one cacher that carries a pocket full of micros to place in case he cannot find a cache. He only has over 6000 finds.

Edited March 22, 2008 by JohnnyVegas

[+Scrubsjm]

It depends on what you consider a team. My family caches together much of the time, Mom, Dad and two kids. Now due to work and school constraints we can only usually do this on the weekends. However most days my husband will grab a single cache on his way home from work. It's a long drive and this gives him a little fun to break up the tedium. Sometimes I go to a park or stop after a grocery store trip with the kids to grab a cache. I don't see anything wrong with this approach. It's not a shameless ploy to run up our numbers, we're a family and all the caches go on our family account. However we are also part of a "team", but there is no "team account". We go caching together and reference the "team" but we don't count their cache finds as our own. If we did that would be a shameless attempt to run up numbers. But I think our current approach of family and team caching is perfectly fair.

[+gof1]

With all the different ways people have logged caches as finds the numbers are meaningless. Not just unimportant, but actually without meaning. Now follow me on this one. You have people who won't count a cache that they didn't sign the log because it wasn't in the cache. On the far end of the spectrum you have people that will drop a container if they think the cache is missing and count that as a find. I won't argue the merits of either situation or any of the in between practices. All I am saying is that we can not compare our numbers to anyone else's because we have no way to know what their "system" is. Thus my belief that the numbers are meaningless.

[+Morning Dew]

I keep seeing the word "cheating". Cheating at what, is there some sort of benefit or award you gain by having more finds?

 

Sorry, this is a question coming from a guy who has only 3 finds (actually, my daughter found one but we were looking together).

[+TrailGators]

I can't speak for the people in this example because I don't know all the facts. But I can tell you that a small minority of people do all kinds of things to pad their numbers. What they don't realize is that people see right through it, and it doesn't make them look good. These people say they don't care what people think, but if they didn't care about what people thought, then they wouldn't be trying to pad their numbers in the first place.

Edited March 22, 2008 by TrailGators

[+the3gmen]

I have seen some cachers with astonomically high counts. I know that there is no way that they could actually find this many single handedly. I don't consider it cheating though because there is no prize to be gained in my mind.

 

I cache for the fun of the search and my reward is the feeling I have when I finally set my sight on the container.

 

I would be willing to bet that most cachers have hunted with buddies every now and then. When you do this, one of you must be the one to actually FIND the cache, but I bet it doesn't stop the other cacher from signing the log. I am sure some people would consider this cheating but it's not big deal in my book though.

[+TrailGators]

I would be willing to bet that most cachers have hunted with buddies every now and then. When you do this, one of you must be the one to actually FIND the cache, but I bet it doesn't stop the other cacher from signing the log. I am sure some people would consider this cheating but it's not big deal in my book though.

Because numbers are visible some people will think that way. A lot of people don't want their numbers visible because they play for other reasons.

[+XopherN71]

Was going to ask the same thing. To me it's like post count, nothing to get worked up about.

 

I keep seeing the word "cheating". Cheating at what, is there some sort of benefit or award you gain by having more finds?

 

Sorry, this is a question coming from a guy who has only 3 finds (actually, my daughter found one but we were looking together).

[+gof1]

Was going to ask the same thing. To me it's like post count, nothing to get worked up about.

 

I keep seeing the word "cheating". Cheating at what, is there some sort of benefit or award you gain by having more finds?

 

Sorry, this is a question coming from a guy who has only 3 finds (actually, my daughter found one but we were looking together).

 

It would depend on the definition you are using for the word cheating. If you say that there has to be a gain for the cheater then the gain to be had in their eyes is the adoration of others for whome the numbers matter. "OOO, Johnygeojurk has a bazillion finds! I want to be like Johny!"

[+CSpenceFLY]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account. To me this seems like cheating. I haven’t seen much on this in the forums, but I would guess that most people feel the same way. They believe that it is an excellent way to get higher numbers.

 

Is this common place or do most people consider this cheating? I know there are no set rules and this is just a game (or sport, whichever you like) to play as you want. I just want to know what others think.

 

Thanks,

StaticTank

 

 

So,if this cheating you speak of gets me ahead in some way, What do I get when I win?

 

This is really all you have to worry about?

[+XopherN71]

Some people are like Slinkies.

They serve no real purpose but still give you moderate

satisfaction when you push them down the stairs.

 

 

Sorry /hijack

[+TrailGators]

Was going to ask the same thing. To me it's like post count, nothing to get worked up about.

 

I keep seeing the word "cheating". Cheating at what, is there some sort of benefit or award you gain by having more finds?

 

Sorry, this is a question coming from a guy who has only 3 finds (actually, my daughter found one but we were looking together).

It would depend on the definition you are using for the word cheating. If you say that there has to be a gain for the cheater then the gain to be had in their eyes is the adoration of others for whome the numbers matter. "OOO, Johnygeojurk has a bazillion finds! I want to be like Johny!"

I agree with you. The gain is attention/adoration. I don't lose sleep over it either, but I know that's why people pad their numbers. Edited March 22, 2008 by TrailGators

[+Morning Dew]

Thanks, I get it now. I'm in the wrong thread. I just thought maybe there was something behind find count. If there isn't then of course it's not cheating and we all know this.

 

I say split 'um up and rack up those finds! Or course, I have 17,384 finds on 8 continents in over 150 different countries (I don't log them), so my opinion might be a little biased.

 

Who cares!

 

Happing caching....

[+StaticTank]

I would consider myself and my wife a team but I have been present at every cache. She doesn't care if she isn't there for them all.

 

The people in the example had an event in one state and one of them went off with a group that day and cached there. The other one on the same day went to a different state and cached with a group there. So they were both caching the same day miles apart. This is what I don't like. In the end it is only my opinion and I really apprecaite all the resposes. I just wanted to to see what others thought about it.

 

I know people will go out with buddies and cache and that is fine but I don't like when two people will go seperate ways on the same day just to make thier numbers look better.

 

StaticTank

[+WRASTRO]

It hasn't happened yet, but if I am out of town and find a few caches while my wife is at home and goes out and finds a newly published cache - and we log them under our one and only account - are we padding our numbers?

[+gof1]

Do you feel like you are padding your numbers?

[+DaFunkyFrogs]

There doesn't have to be a reward, award, gain, win, or any benefit received, for an action or behavior to be considered 'cheating'. If it feels like cheating--it is. If it looks like cheating--it is. This isn't just a caching question, but one that applies to everything in life.

[Trinity's Crew]

I have a team account of sorts. We are two separate families who occasionally cache together. I have been there for every find or DNF but no one else has. I am also the person who has logged all of these experiences online.

 

A few years back my friend wanted to geocache on his vacation and he wanted to log the finds under this account. I had a problem with that because I have come to think of this as my personal account. I didn't want him logging finds and messing up my numbers. I asked him to create a separate account. He thought I was nuts. I probably am, but he dropped it.

[+sseegars]

I don't have a problem with a team account as long as all members are there for all the finds. We have a couple of teams that supposedly log finds with or without the whole team.

 

That is an idea though. I would love to have a team account for long paddle trips or 5/5 caches that the "team" would go on. It's just getting everyone together.

[4wheelin_fool]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account. To me this seems like cheating. I haven’t seen much on this in the forums, but I would guess that most people feel the same way. They believe that it is an excellent way to get higher numbers.

 

Is this common place or do most people consider this cheating? I know there are no set rules and this is just a game (or sport, whichever you like) to play as you want. I just want to know what others think.

 

Thanks,

StaticTank

 

You are only cheating yourself out of a positive geocaching experience if you worry about the numbers of others, son

[CoyoteRed]

I would consider myself and my wife a team but I have been present at every cache. She doesn't care if she isn't there for them all.

So, if she then went and found a cache without you and logged it, would it be cheating?

 

The people in the example had an event in one state and one of them went off with a group that day and cached there. The other one on the same day went to a different state and cached with a group there. So they were both caching the same day miles apart. This is what I don't like. In the end it is only my opinion and I really apprecaite all the resposes. I just wanted to to see what others thought about it.

Here's the thing. If the account is a team account then you know that any one member can find a cache and log it under that account. In a lot of team sports not all players will get to play in any one game. Why should geocaching be any different.

 

Here's how we do it: Sissy likes long grueling hikes. Me, not so much. I like various flavors of urbans and micros. Sissy can't stand them. Now, she can go on a hike I don't care to go on and log it. That's fine. That cache was found by a member of this team. Same goes when I'm by myself hunting urbans. Neither really miss out on something they didn't want to do in the first place.

 

Now, if she goes on a hunt with someone else and finds a cache, she will typically not log it so it stays on our to do list for me to find. Works great.

 

If someone wanted to log under a team account and individual account then, really, the only problem is logs taking up additional slots--little different than logging individually, though.

 

Also, so what if folks split up. With enough time and resources a team that stays together could rack up the same or similar numbers anyway. Also, if you really dig into it teams have a huge advantage over individuals anyway. There are more eyes to find the cache. Teams divide responsibilities like driving, navigating, cache description reading, fueling, food purchase, etc. Plus, it seems as though the little bit of competitiveness between teammates get the cache found even quicker. That's not to mention teammate motivation.

 

All that is academic, though, once you realize the numbers are meaningless in the terms of being able to compare yourself to others. The number of individuals on a team, the amount of available resources, the amount of available time, the region in which one lives, etc. all contribute to one's potential numbers. We all are not on a level playing field. So why should I really care? What's more important to me is the quality of the experiences I have, not the quantity. If I'm not worrying about my quantity why should I worry about the next guy's?

[+Arndtwe]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account...

 

That becomes a "Team Account" and represents the work of all members of the larger team. So long as the Team has found the caches that account's infomation is accurate for the Team.

 

Any one member would of course have found less caches than the team they belong too. They may or may not log under their own account.

 

As long as you know it's a team account there is no harm. Especiallly since there is no way for individual members to form a team through another method (and have the site automaticly count up the team totals).

Did I miss something here? So you say that it's okay for only some of a teams members to find caches andlog them, but it is still the effort of the whole team? I'm not sure I understand this. According to the "bolded" statement, it's a "team" effort. If some of the team is not there, then the "team" should not log those finds. Yes, the individuals can, but not the team account. Furthermore, if for some weird reason one of the people in that team does not have their own account, then they should wait until each member of the team has successfully found that particular cache before that "team" logs a find.

[CoyoteRed]

Did I miss something here?

Yes. The criteria is not that every team member find, only one team member find it.

 

I've explained some of my reasoning above.

 

I'm wondering where the disconnect is coming from in terms of teams as it relates to geocaching versus other pursuits.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Did I miss something here? So you say that it's okay for only some of a teams members to find caches andlog them, but it is still the effort of the whole team? I'm not sure I understand this. According to the "bolded" statement, it's a "team" effort. If some of the team is not there, then the "team" should not log those finds. Yes, the individuals can, but not the team account. Furthermore, if for some weird reason one of the people in that team does not have their own account, then they should wait until each member of the team has successfully found that particular cache before that "team" logs a find.

 

Yeah, only one man swings the scoring bat or carries the ball over the goal, how dare the rest of the team (even guys out on medical that weren't even at the park!) claim their team scored?

 

Shameful.

[Mr.Yuck]

Some people are like Slinkies.

They serve no real purpose but still give you moderate

satisfaction when you push them down the stairs.

 

 

Sorry /hijack

 

Yes, but quite the funny hijack.

 

The practice is cheesy, but nothing you can do about it. To quote a hippy that was in front of me in the check out line once, and I remarked about someone having too many items in the express line (or something like that), "Live and let live, man".

[+mdplayers]

I'm a member of a team. If I find a cache alone (and have done several), I log it. If all three of us are together and find a cache, I log it. If my husband goes back to a DNF and finds it (and he has), I log it.

 

Does it matter to you?

Does it hurt the game/sport/hobby?

Did you loose or gain something by what I've logged?

Is Groundspeak going to shut off my account because I do that?

What if I didn't log anything at all?

What if I simply used GC.com to look up the cache pages, get my PQ's, and then found the caches but never logged the finds/DNF's? Isn't that just as 'bad' for the game/sport/hobby?

 

I agree with the statements above that talk about team sports. The entire team wins the game no matter if one member scored the only goal or they all threw the ball together. That's how we play, we are a team. One for all, all for one.

[+Ry and Ny]

Did I miss something here? So you say that it's okay for only some of a teams members to find caches andlog them, but it is still the effort of the whole team? I'm not sure I understand this. According to the "bolded" statement, it's a "team" effort. If some of the team is not there, then the "team" should not log those finds. Yes, the individuals can, but not the team account. Furthermore, if for some weird reason one of the people in that team does not have their own account, then they should wait until each member of the team has successfully found that particular cache before that "team" logs a find.

 

Yeah, only one man swings the scoring bat or carries the ball over the goal, how dare the rest of the team (even guys out on medical that weren't even at the park!) claim their team scored?

 

Shameful.

 

Analogies like this are inaccurate to the intent of the OP's statement, which was pretty clear that this "team" was splitting to search on the same day and the same time with other teams specifically to pad numbers. This isn't equivalent to some players riding the pine, it's about people playing in different games on the same day.

 

If you're going to make a team analogy, it would be much more accurate to paint it as: while the Red Sox are busy swinging the scoring bat at a home game in Boston, a couple of their players were off in New York swinging away for the Yankees to pad the number of Red Sox runs on the season. If you're going to use the ssports team analogy (baseball in particular), that works fine on training season split squad games that don't count, but it's not acceptable when the scores count.

 

Is it cheating? I don't think so. To the best of my knowledge, there is no rule against this.

 

Am I going to lose sleep over it? No.

 

Is it sort of sad and pathetic? IMO, yes. That it is. That's just my opinion, though. There's obviously at least one team out there who disagrees, and my opinion is no more valid than theirs.

 

EDIT: My point here is not to say that I think it's right or wrong. My point is that to make an analogy with other team sports isn't going to be accurate. There are no clearly defined objectives to geocaching. Is it most finds? Is it most FTF? Is it the find vs DNF ratio? The answer is going to be different for different people. In fact, I'd be more inclined to take issue with people calling this a "sport" as opposed to a "game" for this very reason than I'm inclined to call a team out for being at multiple sites simultaneously.

 

A team is a group of people working for a common goal. For some teams, that goal is a high find count. This is the way they've chosen to go about it.

Edited March 22, 2008 by Ry and Ny

[+Ry and Ny]

 

You are only cheating yourself out of a positive geocaching experience if you worry about the numbers of others, son

 

Seems to me that this is also true of the team splitting up to log multiple finds simultaneously.

[+tozainamboku]

To me it's like post count, nothing to get worked up about.

Exactly. The "find" count is simply a count of the number of found and attended logs for an account. It has nothing to do with the number of caches the account has found unless that account has personally decided that they will only log caches they found according to whatever rules you use to count finds. If the account is shared by more than one person they may decided that if any person finds a cache they can log it as a find. I personally would have no objection if they each log found it if they found the cache separately. Most teams don't do this however, preferring the first person to log the find and others to simple log a note.

 

There doesn't have to be a reward, award, gain, win, or any benefit received, for an action or behavior to be considered 'cheating'. If it feels like cheating--it is. If it looks like cheating--it is. This isn't just a caching question, but one that applies to everything in life.

I'm not sure whether I agree with this or not. It looks true enough on face value. However I object to applying it to many of logging practices that the puritans object to. Most people are using the found it and attended logs to keep a record of the their or their team's geocaching experience. They are not sitting in front of a computer entering things just so they can have a higher find count than the next person. They are not trying to lie about what caches they have been to or claiming a missing cache as find in order to fool briansnat's friends into driving 100 miles for no reason. While some would complain these people are cheating they are in fact playing the game by what they understand the "rules" to be. And since there is no agreed upon rule for determining a find, it is hard to imagine how someone could be cheating.

 

 

You are only cheating yourself out of a positive geocaching experience if you worry about the numbers of others, son

 

Seems to me that this is also true of the team splitting up to log multiple finds simultaneously.

In fact if the "team" always had to have every member present to claim a find this might be seen as cheating them out of opportunities to do more geocaching. Seems like some teams may have more fun by going to an area to find several caches together, then split up for a while each finding some separately, and then rejoining again later on. Or simply the member of the team are going to be in different places but each wants to find a few geocaches while they are there. Edited March 22, 2008 by tozainamboku

[+Sagefox]

Any one member would of course have found less caches than the team they belong too.

 

This is not always true though.

 

I have been to every one of our team finds. My wife and I started on day-one as a team and she has been to almost 1/2 our finds. We call ourselves a team because we discovered the game together and both enjoy caching together. Occasionally other family members without active accounts join us.

[Neos2]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account. To me this seems like cheating. I haven’t seen much on this in the forums, but I would guess that most people feel the same way. They believe that it is an excellent way to get higher numbers.

 

Is this common place or do most people consider this cheating? I know there are no set rules and this is just a game (or sport, whichever you like) to play as you want. I just want to know what others think.

 

Thanks,

StaticTank

 

You are only cheating yourself out of a positive geocaching experience if you worry about the numbers of others, son

I agree with 4wheelin_fool on this one. While some folks get really tangled up in hurling invectives about 'cheating' and 'false logging' and 'numbers padding' and so forth, other people are just happily caching along, having fun, and logging whatever way makes sense to them. It's been my observation the accusers usually care far more about the meaning of the numbers than the caches logging the numbers.

 

I disagree with the person who said they had seen folks with very high numbers and "knew" there was no way any one person could have that many finds. It's really pretty easy to get that many finds. It's time consuming, and it's expensive, but it's easy.

 

There are as many ways to look at the logs/numbers of caches found as there are cachers to do the looking:

 

There are people who want high numbers, and want to find each and every one all by themselves, and want to be admired for doing it the right way every time. In my area, we tend to congratulate these people on their milestones because they earn them and we know it.

 

There are people who log as a family/group and may or may not usually cache together-- everyone logs under the one account just to record the finds. Perhaps they like the premium features but don't want to pay extra to extra accounts. In my area, we tend to overlook their milestones, because "everyone knows" they are just logging under one account. We may say "Hey, I saw your team account has gotten to 5000 finds--cool!" in passing, though. However they did it, that is still a lot of caches.

 

There are people who log everything they go after as a find, not because they neccesarily found it, but because once they have looked for a cache, they are done with it and want a way to keep it off their lists in the future.

 

There are people who find many, many caches and never log any or them, or only post a note. They usually say it's because they don't want to compete with others. Which "others" ? I don't know...doesn't matter to me, either.

 

There are families that usually cache and log together, but once in a great while one of the members finds a cache solo, but records it on the family account anyway. Usually they are somewhere the rest of the family will never go, so again it's just a way to mark it off the future finds lists.

 

There are (I've heard, but never actually witnessed) groups who form for the sole purpose of trying to log a lot of caches in a short period of time and do it by splitting up and logging for each other. What that would "prove" is beyond me, (given all the ways of using cache logs I already talked about above) but hey, it doesn't make those caches harder or easier for me to find, so I don't care about them either.

 

There are people who are months behind in their logging, people who forget to log some of their finds, people who choose to leave off some of the caches they have found as some sort of protest (of the cache owner, of the hide, etc). There are people who log caches they find at events as additional attended to get the count for finding the cache, and there are people who won't log an attended at an event because it messes up their find count. There are people who accidentally log the wrong caches--sometimes hundreds of miles from the cache they actually found.

 

There are even people who never go look for a cache, have never logged a cache, and in fact have never heard of geocaching. I really don't understand those people!

 

None of those people affect my ability to log my caches the way I think I ought to log my caches, or my ability to use my caching history to record what I want it to record. I don't care that my record is public--you are welcome to look at it anytime you want--I would even be fine with having my DNFs show up on the public list (those are some fo my best logs anyway).

 

It's a game, get going, have fun... Cache on!

[+DaFunkyFrogs]

There doesn't have to be a reward, award, gain, win, or any benefit received, for an action or behavior to be considered 'cheating'. If it feels like cheating--it is. If it looks like cheating--it is. This isn't just a caching question, but one that applies to everything in life.

I'm not sure whether I agree with this or not. It looks true enough on face value. However I object to applying it to many of logging practices that the puritans object to. Most people are using the found it and attended logs to keep a record of the their or their team's geocaching experience. They are not sitting in front of a computer entering things just so they can have a higher find count than the next person. They are not trying to lie about what caches they have been to or claiming a missing cache as find in order to fool briansnat's friends into driving 100 miles for no reason. While some would complain these people are cheating they are in fact playing the game by what they understand the "rules" to be. And since there is no agreed upon rule for determining a find, it is hard to imagine how someone could be cheating.

 

What I meant was: If what you are doing feels like cheating to you--it is; If what you are doing looks like cheating to you--it is.

There are no rules governing the team aspect of caching, so people apply their own rules. If you are following your own rules and breaking none of the written rules then it can't be cheating.

[+Jedi Cacher]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account. To me this seems like cheating. I haven’t seen much on this in the forums, but I would guess that most people feel the same way. They believe that it is an excellent way to get higher numbers.

 

Is this common place or do most people consider this cheating? I know there are no set rules and this is just a game (or sport, whichever you like) to play as you want. I just want to know what others think.

 

Thanks,

StaticTank

 

You are only cheating yourself out of a positive geocaching experience if you worry about the numbers of others, son

 

I agree with 4WheelingFool on this one. You are only robbing yourself of the experience of Geocaching. It appears that everybody has there own agenda and preferences when it comes to Geocaching. Some cachers could care less about the experience of finding the cache or the adventure along the way, because for certain cachers it is about the numbers only. Is it illegal or does it hurt my caching experience, I think not. I prefer the longer hikes with scenery and historical locations, but I know that is my preference and not everyone else's. To each his own I guess!

 

In my opinion I think that if your family is a team, it is not right to split up on the same day in different areas to combine your cache count. But if your spouse wants to find a cache without you one day, I don't see the harm in that because you are a team and it's not like the whole family always has to be present. Maybe the team that StaticTank speaks of should get a separate account since they don't like to cache together, but then again that wouldn't change anything because they would probably just forge each others signatures to rack up each others accounts, that way they can tell each other how awesome they are!

[+PavlovsDog]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account. To me this seems like cheating. I haven’t seen much on this in the forums, but I would guess that most people feel the same way. They believe that it is an excellent way to get higher numbers.

 

Is this common place or do most people consider this cheating? I know there are no set rules and this is just a game (or sport, whichever you like) to play as you want. I just want to know what others think.

 

Thanks,

StaticTank

 

Kinda like Golf. Change the numbers all you want, you'll always know your real score. As long as you're having fun, that's all that matters.

[+south central beach ops]

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account. To me this seems like cheating. I haven’t seen much on this in the forums, but I would guess that most people feel the same way. They believe that it is an excellent way to get higher numbers.

 

Is this common place or do most people consider this cheating? I know there are no set rules and this is just a game (or sport, whichever you like) to play as you want. I just want to know what others think.

 

Even when we lived 90 miles apart, we never even tried to find a cache unless we were together. That's just one of our rules for how we play. For the nth time, hum the mantra: "How others cache does not really affect me," and just let it go. Geocaching is not a competition. People cheat at everything. There's always one bad apple. <Insert platitude here.>

 

ms south

of

south central beach ops

[+south central beach ops]

 

 

There are no clearly defined objectives to geocaching. Is it most finds? Is it most FTF? Is it the find vs DNF ratio? The answer is going to be different for different people.

 

Shall we add in the fact that all results are self-reported? Some are sort-of verified if the CO compares online logs with the log book, but that's not universal.

 

Caching is a lot of fun, a great family activity, challenging problem-solving, a guide to interesting areas, and sometimes a source of alarm. It will never compare to the NFL for the specifity of rules. I, for one, like it that way.

 

ms south

of

south central beach ops

[+Logscaler and Red]

Not sure just what the answer your looking for is.

 

A lot has been said about this same topic over the years.

 

And a lot will be said in the forthcoming years.

 

Will it make a difference? Not one bit. Period. End of story.

 

We don't consider ourselves a "team". We are a couple.

 

The only time I can see where team work will make a difference is if there is a "reward" in the end. Like our CCIO cache had a time limit and a "score" was kept.

 

The DeLorme challenges have a "reward" at the end for completing all the grids.

 

A team effort would complete them a lot faster and cheaper.

 

The cache owner can reject logs from any individual member of the team trying to log the find yet allow the team to log the find. In our CCIO cache, the entire team would have to be present to sign the final page at the same time, not just one member.

 

In the Baseball analogy I see it like this.

 

The Team has 20 hits.

 

Player # 1 has 4 hits,

player # 2 has 1 hits,

player # 3 has 6 hits,

player # 4 has 4 hits,

player # 5 has 1 hits,

player # 6 has 4 hits.

 

Sure, the entire team has 20 hits but each member can't say I have 20 hits. The same in geocaching. Your Team has 5000 finds but YOU signed your handle to 1,800. Make sense in a round about way?

 

I would have a problem with team members signing other team members individual handle to the log so they can claim an individual "found it" log. Up to that point, We don't believe there is anything to get up in a huff over.

 

All you have to tell yourself is that "Team XYZ" completed it and "I" did it by myself.

 

Keep your level of integrity, whatever that is, and the rest will have to take care of itself.

 

Logscaler and Red

[+MACH1SCJ]

We (me, wife & 2 kids) have one account & can not always go out together, Some are not sutible for a 2 1/2 yr old.

 

I did not see a family/team with sub acounts option, that would be nice.

 

I have been at all finds/logs/dnf's - so far.

 

If we get a second GPSr we might do a second account. We would not sign logs for each other.

 

We enjoy spending family time & having a good time. Kids finding a Cache is almost as good as when they open presents on B-day or X-MAS. Heck it's the same with me.

 

"To each, Thier own" "Different strokes...." ect...ect...ect...

[+P'ville Lions R Us]

I have only been caching for about 2 months. I met a girl who has been caching for a little over a year. She had done maybe 50 or 60 caches before she met me. After we met she began caching more frequently with me and we both claim the find when it is found. We do cache seperately, though rarely. She finds the cache probably 50% of the time and I do the other 50%. So we do not feel that we are cheating by doing it this way. We are very happy with our situation and the friendship has made our geocaching experience that much more awesome.

 

We do both have seperate accounts and we both claim each find. But, when she goes out caching alone I do not claim the cache. She does not sign my name on the log nor would I sign hers on a log.

 

In my opinion, I believe the numbers are really silly. If anything, the number should only be important to oneself. It is nice to see what I have accomplished. Not to show off or to compare to someone else.

 

Don't let those people who run up the numbers bother you. The only people that they should bother are the other people who are doing the same. Let them compete and fight amongst themselves. To me geocaching has been a wonderful sport that has helped me get exercise, challenge my brain, see new beautiful places, learn a lot about history, and make wonderful new friends.

 

Just think of it this way and leave them to their own way of "playing the game".

[+StaticTank]

I tend to have a lot of time in between things at work and decided to start reading the forums. My original intent was to just ask what people thought of this. I know that it doesn't matter in the end and I don't really care how others play. I love caching and would never let someone else ruin it for me. I see it as cheating and I would never do it. I have two GPSrs and I would never let my wife go caching on her own nor would she want to (I can't even get her to use the other GPS). I guess the account is really me (but in a way we are still a team). I have been to all of the caches we have found and it will be that way always. It doesn't matter to her if she is present for all of them but we still do the majority together.

 

The original situation was that the team was caching separately on the same day in different states and thought it was a great idea. I don't care if this is how they do it. I am not going to let it bother me and it won't affect how I play. I just wanted to know what others thought.

 

I think this is a great place to chat with other cachers and something to do when I am not caching. This topic isn't something that is causing me to lose sleep or ruin my experience I just came here to see what others thought since I cannot go caching right now.

 

Again, I do appreciate the responses!!

[CoyoteRed]

I have two GPSrs and I would never let my wife go caching on her own nor would she want to (I can't even get her to use the other GPS).

That's lots different than our situation. While she would love my company it's not always feasible. That doesn't stop her from taking multi-state trips camping and caching along the way.

[+JT3Halls]

Any one member would of course have found less caches than the team they belong too.

 

This is not always true though.

 

I have been to every one of our team finds. My wife and I started on day-one as a team and she has been to almost 1/2 our finds. We call ourselves a team because we discovered the game together and both enjoy caching together. Occasionally other family members without active accounts join us.

 

There are some groups or families in the area who will split up and go to different places with other groups and then log all the finds under one account. To me this seems like cheating. I haven’t seen much on this in the forums, but I would guess that most people feel the same way. They believe that it is an excellent way to get higher numbers.

 

Is this common place or do most people consider this cheating? I know there are no set rules and this is just a game (or sport, whichever you like) to play as you want. I just want to know what others think.

 

Thanks,

StaticTank

 

You are only cheating yourself out of a positive geocaching experience if you worry about the numbers of others, son

I agree with 4wheelin_fool on this one. While some folks get really tangled up in hurling invectives about 'cheating' and 'false logging' and 'numbers padding' and so forth, other people are just happily caching along, having fun, and logging whatever way makes sense to them. It's been my observation the accusers usually care far more about the meaning of the numbers than the caches logging the numbers.

 

I disagree with the person who said they had seen folks with very high numbers and "knew" there was no way any one person could have that many finds. It's really pretty easy to get that many finds. It's time consuming, and it's expensive, but it's easy.

 

There are as many ways to look at the logs/numbers of caches found as there are cachers to do the looking:

 

There are people who log as a family/group and may or may not usually cache together-- everyone logs under the one account just to record the finds. Perhaps they like the premium features but don't want to pay extra to extra accounts. In my area, we tend to overlook their milestones, because "everyone knows" they are just logging under one account. We may say "Hey, I saw your team account has gotten to 5000 finds--cool!" in passing, though. However they did it, that is still a lot of caches.

 

There are families that usually cache and log together, but once in a great while one of the members finds a cache solo, but records it on the family account anyway. Usually they are somewhere the rest of the family will never go, so again it's just a way to mark it off the future finds lists.

 

There are (I've heard, but never actually witnessed) groups who form for the sole purpose of trying to log a lot of caches in a short period of time and do it by splitting up and logging for each other. What that would "prove" is beyond me, (given all the ways of using cache logs I already talked about above) but hey, it doesn't make those caches harder or easier for me to find, so I don't care about them either.

 

It's a game, get going, have fun... Cache on!

My wife got me started geocaching after I return from Iraq in 2005. When we initially started, we geocached as a family and set the account up as a family account using all of our initials. Well, two years later, two of the teenagers have lost interest and I deploy to areas where the family cannot go. Generally, my wife and I geocache together and have fun. Do we deliberately separate to geocache? No, the only time we geocache separately is when I am deployed away from the house, otherwise there are at least two from the family together. Are we trying to pad our numbers? I don't think so, because I try to take pictures whenever I'm not with the family. Case in point was when I got "stuck" in Spain for 18 days and manage to go down to Gibraltor to geocache. The tour guide showed my co-workers and me a colony of monkeys, next thing you know one is sitting on my shoulder. My youngest daughter got to see the picture and was thrilled over it. Again, my family and I use geocaching as a way for them to live vicariously through me. I honestly don't see how I could have them combat cache in Iraq with me, but for them it is a way to experience some of what I am capable of doing. Yes, military personnel in Iraq get free time and some of that free time is spent geocaching. Just my thoughts on the "family / team" account.