Cache Location Restrictions.

[+Castlebrook]

I recently had a cache disapproved because it was less than .5 mile from an airport. The rationale is that people have been hassled by the FBI, DEA, TSA or other Gestapo types for indulging in a legal, innocent recreational activity. I am disappointed that we meekly put up with this. In my opinion, we should be allowed to place caches in any legal place, as long as they don't cause problems or violate laws. This country was founded by people who resisted tyranny. Are we losing it, or amI just an old reactionary?

[Keystone]

For the record, the red dot is the cache location.

 

Hey Otter & Lemur, does that airport look familiar? Yep, it's LAX.

 

[+briansnat]

I'd hardly equate this website's putting limitations on where caches can be placed with tyranny. And though I'm a libertarian at heart, I'm glad the authorities question suspicious people hanging around airports. All it takes is one Stinger missle and a full 747 and you have a lot of grief on your hands.

 

As long as you aren't detained beyond what is reasonable to determine your purpose for skulking around an airport, I don't see it as an infringement on liberty.

 

Also, you should read a little history and learn about what the Gestapo really was, before you start cavalierly throwing the term around like that.

Edited February 26, 2005 by briansnat

[+BadAndy]

I would be disappointed in TSA security of anyone wandering around that red dot wasn't thoroughly checked out.

 

edit: especially if they were fumbling with a small handheld device.

Edited February 26, 2005 by BadAndy

[+TeamK-9]

Seriously.

 

I don't see any reason why you'd even WANT to place a cache there. I mean, it would have to a really pretty view for me to ignore the noisy airplanes less than .5 miles from the cache...

[+Hemlock]

I mean, it would have to a really pretty view for me to ignore the noisy airplanes less than .5 miles from the cache...

Sheesh. The red dot is darn near in line with a runway. Its gonna be even noisier as those planes take off and land

Not a place I'd like to be snooping around.

[TahoeJoe]

Bad, bad, bad idea (did I mention it was a bad idea).

[+Cache Viking]

I used to ride my bike along the bike path there. There are plenty of places a cache can be placed further north and south of that location that are nowhere near the airport.

Edited February 26, 2005 by Cache Viking

[+Sputnik 57]

Castlebrook, there are no FBI, DEA, TSA or Gestapo types keeping you from placing a cache there. This site has understandably chosen not to list caches so placed, but some other (less responsible) site may be happy to list the cache.

 

If I were going to search for a cache there, I would expect the TSA to stop me and ask me what I was doing. When they found out, I would expect that they would detain me long enough to run a quick background check on me, then let me go, and remove the cache. I would expect that, but doubt that they have time to deal with every nut with a GPSr.

 

Interesting world we live in. No one is limiting your actions. You just need to be ready to deal with the consequences.

[uperdooper]

the last guy that found a cache there, ended up spending a few hours in handcuffs, and had a little talk with the FBI. i would be highly peeved if i had the same experience.

[+carleenp]

Castlebrook: Take a look at this thread which illustrates the problem with caches near airports, especially that one.

[+Hemlock]

Here is the log by Otter and Lemur that Keystone Approver and uperdooper are referring to.

 

Edit: Thanks, Carleen. I couldn't find that thread so I settled for the log itself.

Edited February 26, 2005 by Hemlock

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

which was located in a restricted area on a closed road next to the airport proper

 

after finding the cache and strolling off down the closed-off road next to the airport

 

none of the law enforcement authorities were amused by a geocache located in an area marked "restricted area, no loitering", right next to the airport.

 

So even if this one shouldn't have been approved, and despite the fact that it was well-visited, to me the real issue is that the geocachers involved obviously ignored the Road Closed, Restricted Area and No Loiteriong signs.

 

Yes, though the cache owner and to some extent the approver are responsible for location, permission, etc., the onus in on the cacher to follow the law - if the cache is in a restricted area, don't go after it!

Edited February 26, 2005 by TheAlabamaRambler

[+splicingdan]

How about a cache 100 meters from an airport?

 

Doesn't seem to be a problem here.

[+carleenp]

How about a cache 100 meters from an airport?

 

Doesn't seem to be a problem here.

The freeway in between helps. Although it still makes me nervous in light of the thread I posted earlier. That incident happened after the date that cache was placed.

[+Renegade Knight]

If the area is public and outside what would be considered a "Security Zone" the cache should be approved. If not, it should not be listed and it should by physically removed.

 

Since I don't know this area I don't have the answer.

[+NotThePainter]

Sheesh. The red dot is darn near in line with a runway. Its gonna be even noisier as those planes take off and land

Not a place I'd like to be snooping around.

Without commenting on the goodness of the location, I'd personally love to stand under the end of the runway as a big jet took off. I might not want to do it twice, but I'd sure love to do it once.

 

Paul

[+Cache Viking]

One mile south of the location in the picture above is the area in this picture. It is beach parking for day use or RV Camping. Must be plenty of hiding spots in this area if you must hide one along the coast there. Best I can tell there are not any caches in the area.

[jdoe]

I recently had a cache disapproved because it was less than .5 mile from an airport. The rationale is that people have been hassled by the FBI, DEA, TSA or other Gestapo types for indulging in a legal, innocent recreational activity. I am disappointed that we meekly put up with this. In my opinion, we should be allowed to place caches in any legal place, as long as they don't cause problems or violate laws. This country was founded by people who resisted tyranny. Are we losing it, or amI just an old reactionary?

I used to have a cache in this area. I originally had was a traditional micro cache, then a virtual. Finally after the incident with the with "Grand Central Station" my cache (Chop & Stamp - GCH9R1) was archived because I had changed the cache without going though the proper procedures (I should have archived and resubmit).

 

Basically the Airport Police are pretty antsy with this area. There is another cacher that got hauled in for doing a cache east of where you wanted your cache and that was a VIRTUAL. No... no good can come a cache in this area.

 

The area is pretty close to the airport. I personally I would try to locate the cache closer west (towards the ocean). I would contact the approvers and see if that would be better.

 

John Doe

[+fly46]

I would assume that since this is LAX that the issue isn't that the cache is .5 from an airport, it's that it's .5 from that airport. I have quite a few that are about .5 from BNA, but they're separated by roads and are obviously not on airport property.

 

As you can see from this image: The stars are my caches (yes, they're at least .1 apart), and there are more if you go down Elm Hill Pike to the left in that picture that belong to other cachers.

 

 

I would assume that in this instance, it's in the excution, not in the fact that there's a cache x distance from an airport.

[bug and snake]

Surely the very fact that there are people looking out for the safety of those using the airport is a part of what keeps us all free of tyranny.

Possibly your cache location is a 'legal' one. However, if you insist on placing your cache just because it is your right then others, with the clout to do so, might just be 'forced' to put a complete ban on caching in the area. 'Just because you can' is a bad reason to place a cache or, indeed, to do anything. How about if your neighbour decided to play his Engelbert Humperdink CD's at max volume every night up to the shut off time because he had decided that not doing so was to give in to tyranny?

[+Team Perks]

You have every right to place a cache in any "legal" place. However, this site has an equal right (and an ethical responsibility) not to list it if it will place at risk those who attempt to seek it.

 

For those not in the know...allow me to shed a little more light into the area this cache is in.

 

Take a look at the image Keystone posted. See all those empty streets? There used to be houses on those streets. They were torn many years ago down during an airport exansion.

 

Every single one of those small side streets is now all fenced off and is the property of, you guessed it, the airport. Security does patrol that area -- I've seen them cruising around on more than a few occasions.

 

The issue in this case is more than just it's less than half a mile from an airport. It's literally on the edge of the airport property. The approver was absolutely right in denying this cache listing.

[+Chamma]

Who can name this airport?

 

This is located right on the airport grounds, The next closest one is at the end of the runway. People are always excited about planes. Most Major airports that I fly into have an observation deck for spectators. I flew into an air show once, and the day of the airshow a spectator came up and told me my call sign. He had a VHF handheld radio that he was listening to at the end of a runway when we came in. At another airshow a photograper brought me some pictures of people from my crew from a previous airshow. I think alowing Caches near airports is ok. For one many TB's can get on to their goals easier if next to a major airport.

Edited February 26, 2005 by Cabear

[+Joe Smith]

it's good to have a Tb hotel by an airport to help fellow cachers.

 

The problem is safety. It isn't nice to put a cache next to a cliff because that you would put someone in danger.

 

putting a cache here will also put people in danger of being hassled by the cops. It may cause the frustration of being questioned for a few hours, and the cache may end up archived anyways. I'd put one somewhere else.

[+Camo-crazed]

when I saw this threads title, "cache restrictions, polemic" I thought this was another thread about lamppost micros

my brain works in weird ways

[+Colorado Cacher]

Oh the TSA. Thousands Standing Around to collect a federal pension.