Handheld vs. Car GPS

[+cjlinde]

 

I'm new and trying to use my Garmin 765 for geocaching. It seems like everyone else uses a handheld specificially for off road use. Does anyone else use a 765 or other gps meant for cars? Do I need to break down and buy a handheld? What will it get me that I don't already have.

 

Help, I'm addicted already!!

[+AlohaBra and MaksMom]

 

I'm new and trying to use my Garmin 765 for geocaching. It seems like everyone else uses a handheld specificially for off road use. Does anyone else use a 765 or other gps meant for cars? Do I need to break down and buy a handheld? What will it get me that I don't already have.

 

Help, I'm addicted already!!

 

I did not become productive until I got my Garmin Vista HCx (but I have been eyeing a DeLorme PN-40 lately).

You will still need the Garmin NUVI to navigate you there by car and for the paperless feature (using GSAK and an available macro).

 

The Vista HCx has a compass and will point you to the cache and tell you how many feet away it is. Much better to be close than start 30 feet away and trying the line up the coordinates with a NUVI.

 

That is the short answer.

Edited April 5, 2010 by alohabra

[+Gitchee-Gummee]

BOTH -- best answer.

[+Vater_Araignee]

I use a Mio Digiwalker c230 with the soft mod installed.

This allows me to use MioMaps with TTS if I'm unfamiliar with the area.

Then I close MioMaps and start up BeelineGPS after I park.

100% paperless caching too.

Just about any gpsr that uses windows ce can use MioPocket but if I remember correctly, Garmins use linux.

That doesn't mean there isn't a soft mod out there just waiting to turn your Garmin into a better unit.

[+Super-Ball]

I use a Garmin Nuvi 1350T for the car and then the Garmin Oregon 450t handheld. There are cheaper handhelds available but I must say that I have been very happy with the Oregon and the paper-less caching is great....

 

Peace....

[superALP]

I usually practice geocaching with a TOMTOM one. Not so accurate and not appropiate for mountain orientation but OK for geocaching everywere not just the city, at least for my.

[+briansnat]

I have a Nuvi for the car but I wouldn't dream of using it for geocaching. The battery life is not sufficient, it isn't waterproof, it's designed for the dashboard, not the rigors of outdooruse and it's awkward to hold in the hand. Most importantly it doesn't have a compass navigation screen.

 

Sometimes I load it with caches to see any caches on the route as I drive, but when I get out of the car I have my hand held.

[+rob3k]

I used a car GPS - Garmin Nuvi 650 - for my first 50 or so finds. Great idea to use it to see if you are into the hobby. But, once you know you are going to do a lot of geocaching, definitely worth the money to buy a nice handheld unit.

 

I picked up a Garmin Colorado when they were starting to be phased out for the Oregon for a pretty good price. Be sure to buy one that can handle paperless caching.

 

Advantages:

1) If dropped into a puddle, no problem. (But I am quick to pluck it out of the water!)

2) Don't have to worry over keeping it tucked under my body/inside my jacket if it starts to rain.

3) Can take more of a beating. Don't get me wrong, I'm very careful with it, but the Colorado just seems a lot tougher than a Nuvi.

4) No constantly switching modes on the Nuvi. I'd have to switch to 'Off Road' and 'Pedestrian' mode when I was going for a cache and then back to normal driving mode when I got back in the car to drive to the next cache. Royal pain.

5) Field notes - I can mark my finds on the unit and don't need to carry a notepad around to keep track of the caches as I find them.

6) I did paperless cache with the Nuvi using GSAK and a macro, but it's a lot cleaner and easier with the Colorado. I still load them with full details on the Nuvi, because I'm already set up to do it and it doesn't take long, but I rarely look at the cache write up on that unit. I do still use the Nuvi to drive between caches.

7) Hand held units are designed to lead you to a set of coords on foot. Much nicer navigation screen to zero down than what you can do on a Nuvi.

Edited April 6, 2010 by rob3k

[+NYPaddleCacher]

I apologize if this appears to be somewhat of a thread drift but I can't help but wonder if the proliferation of auto navigation GPS units has changed the perception of those about geocaching when they first become aware of the game.

 

Over the past couple of years I've seen numerous posts which seemed to have an underlying assumption that geocaching was about driving from cache to cache. I would guess that if a survey of the general population were done which asked "What is a GPS?" the most popular answer would be something related to a device used for navigation in a vehicle. It wouldn't be a stretch to assume that the general population would assume that because a GPS is used for geocaching, it mean that instead of using a GPS to find driving directions to the closest Chinese restaurant it would be used to provide driving directions to the nearest geocache and that the cache would be essentially be located where you stopped your car.

 

To me, I'm not geocaching until I've left the vehicle. Whether or not the GPS assists me in getting to a general location where I can park, up to that point it's just driving. I'm well aware that there are lots of geocachers with physical limitations and do condone geocache placements which don't require long hikes but when geocaching equates to "driving from cache to cache" become the rule rather than the exception I think the game has been significantly been degraded.

 

I'm not sure what the answer is for how to promote the game as an activity that is played outdoors once you get out of a vehicle but I think it's worth thinking about.

[knowschad]

I suspect that you are right-on with those assumptions, NYPaddlecacher. I think that people hear or read about geocaching using a GPS, and they think, cool! I have a GPS in my car! without realizing that there are some rather fundamental differences in functionality.

[+Castle Mischief]

Most importantly it doesn't have a compass navigation screen.

 

I 've seen you post this before in regards to car units and their unsuitability for caching (which I mostly agree with) and I'm a little puzzled. I've never used the compass feature on my handheld for caching. How are using this function to cache?

 

I use my Nuvi for street navigation and my aging Magellan for on the trail. I have used the Nuvi for a few really easy park-and-grabs and I usually have it in my camera bag when on the trail- turned on for the "ding" that alerts me to the cache being nearby. Because I like the "ding", not because it really helps me find the cache.

 

My Nuvi is also my paperless caching tool and in that regard it's very useful.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

I suspect that you are right-on with those assumptions, NYPaddlecacher. I think that people hear or read about geocaching using a GPS, and they think, cool! I have a GPS in my car! without realizing that there are some rather fundamental differences in functionality.

 

I'm not so sure that there is a great difference in functionality. My Garmin 76Cx will, for example, provide turn-by-turn directions (without the audio) with the appropriate base map product. Many auto navigation units will, provide "as the crow flies" directions to a waypoint. It's the application of that functionality that get muddled. Someone using an auto-navigation unit may assume that using a GPS for geocachings means that it's about getting turn-by-turn directions to a geocache.

[+Vater_Araignee]

I suspect that you are right-on with those assumptions, NYPaddlecacher. I think that people hear or read about geocaching using a GPS, and they think, cool! I have a GPS in my car! without realizing that there are some rather fundamental differences in functionality.

 

I'm not so sure that there is a great difference in functionality. My Garmin 76Cx will, for example, provide turn-by-turn directions (without the audio) with the appropriate base map product. Many auto navigation units will, provide "as the crow flies" directions to a waypoint. It's the application of that functionality that get muddled. Someone using an auto-navigation unit may assume that using a GPS for geocachings means that it's about getting turn-by-turn directions to a geocache.

Turn left at fallen oak in 100 yards.

Crest grassy knoll then make sharp right and jump over log in 100 yards.

You will arrive at cache site in in 25 yards.

[+Cache O'Plenty]

I started out using just a handheld, an old Magellan that you had to enter the coordinates manually. Didn't take long to upgrade to a Garmin so I could download 500 caches to it.

 

I converted to paperless when I found that my PDA and a third party app would hold all of the cache descriptions and I could make notes for later upload.

 

Then, for a vacation, we invested in a Garmin Nuvi for navigation (not necessarily for caching). However, being a bit of a computer geek, I found the "Favorites" section invaluable in getting me to the nearest road segment as well as seeing on-screen where the "pockets" were. Yes, I used the macro to download all the description/hints/logs/etc.

 

Now, having opted into the 21st century, I use a smartphone that also has the PDA capability plus Field Notes. PDA is now a paperweight.

 

The Nuvi is still integral to caching but it stays in the car (hidden!!!!). That's to get me to the general area, more or less. Even getting to trail areas are easier as the trailhead is usually next to the road.

 

The handheld is used in the field. The compass rose points to the cache area. The phone (which I always have with me - for safety if nothing else) has the cache descriptions.

 

I have seen, over the past year, a huge increase in the number of new cachers that use only their iPhone to do caching. And when they place their caches, they still use the less accurate iPhone. When searching for their caches, I have to increase the search range to 45-60 feet. One cacher's phone is always 30 feet off to the "East".

[Geodoll143]

I was in the same boat! I became aware of Geocaching because we bought a a Nuvi for Christmas. We intended to use it (and do) in the car for longer trips or unfamiliar routes.

 

When I tried using it for geocaching i realized that the nuvi was not suited for it. I found my first 15 or so caches with it, - but its harder to navigate offroad with and the battery is not intended to be untethered from the power socket for long.

 

I also was paranoid about dropping it and damaging the touch screen or gunking up the data or power ports with dirt.

[+LightHouseSeekers]

When we're driving somewhere we use the Magellan, the spoken directions (turn west on north st) are handy.

For cache runs I prefer the PN-40, though it only chimes for turn alerts.

The 'paperless' caching and accuracy make it a better unit.

[Keystone]

I am moving this thread from the Geocaching Topics forum to the GPS and Technology forum.

[+cfever]

Wheter or not one agrees with using a Nuvi for geocaching I do think that the Nuvi has helped introduce many to the sport, myself included. I have found over 50 caches using my Nuvi 675 and while it does have some limitations, here in the flat lands of Illinois it does an adequate job of getting you to the cache. The paperless feature is great and I find the time I spend with the family finding caches to be enjoyable. Thus, I think the Nuvi (or any car GPS) is a good all around tool for both caching and road navigation.

[BlackProphet]

I apologize if this appears to be somewhat of a thread drift but I can't help but wonder if the proliferation of auto navigation GPS units has changed the perception of those about geocaching when they first become aware of the game.

 

Over the past couple of years I've seen numerous posts which seemed to have an underlying assumption that geocaching was about driving from cache to cache. I would guess that if a survey of the general population were done which asked "What is a GPS?" the most popular answer would be something related to a device used for navigation in a vehicle. It wouldn't be a stretch to assume that the general population would assume that because a GPS is used for geocaching, it mean that instead of using a GPS to find driving directions to the closest Chinese restaurant it would be used to provide driving directions to the nearest geocache and that the cache would be essentially be located where you stopped your car.

 

To me, I'm not geocaching until I've left the vehicle. Whether or not the GPS assists me in getting to a general location where I can park, up to that point it's just driving. I'm well aware that there are lots of geocachers with physical limitations and do condone geocache placements which don't require long hikes but when geocaching equates to "driving from cache to cache" become the rule rather than the exception I think the game has been significantly been degraded.

 

I'm not sure what the answer is for how to promote the game as an activity that is played outdoors once you get out of a vehicle but I think it's worth thinking about.

 

I think you have missed the point. Most people put down $300+ on a GPS for their car. Most of these same people would like to avoid putting down another $300+ for a handheld. Even the OP was implying they they did not want to spend that extra cash. I personally think all of these questions have to do with keeping cost down, not driving from cache to cache. Its the same reason people are using an iPhone to cache. If I already have something that can do the job reasonable well, why double my costs? I understand that handelds do the job the best, but not eveyone has the money to shell out for one.

[Andronicus]

If you have a smart phone, use that for your handheld GPSr. There is good apps for most smart phone platforms. Most smart phones will have a fairly good GPSr now days.

[+ecanderson]

I think you have missed the point. Most people put down $300+ on a GPS for their car. Most of these same people would like to avoid putting down another $300+ for a handheld. Even the OP was implying they they did not want to spend that extra cash. I personally think all of these questions have to do with keeping cost down, not driving from cache to cache.

The problem is one of use model and design ergonomics. For starters, there's a reason that the manufacturers of "automotive" nav units don't make them with 1-1/2" x 2-1/2" screens, and why the manufacturers of "field" units do. There's a reason why "automotive" nav units tend to have LiPo battery packs (with few notable exceptions) with perhaps 2 hours of useful charge, and "field" units tend to use replaceable AA cells with far more hours, and the option of swapping out the cells when they start to fade. Those two issues alone are huge differentiators in the designs. The manufacturers fully understand that most of their customers wouldn't tolerate the inconvenience of using one design style for the other application. That doesn't even start to address other hardware features that add cost to one or the other, and are primarily applicable only to one of the two primary use models.

 

Attempting to substitute one type for the other's application will always represent a major compromise for the user.

 

Those that come here asking about the "universal" GPS are asking, sometimes without knowing it, which of the choices will cause the least inconvenience for them. On that, they will receive differing opinions based upon how each of us finds the inconveniences impacting our own use. Some people are just fine trying to read a small and cluttered screen on a handheld as they drive. Others shouldn't let their insurance companies know they're trying to do it Some are unconcerned about a device that isn't easy to carry and will eat away at the battery charge faster than it can be recharged in their vehicle. Other cachers need much more capacity for a day in the field.

 

The Nuvi 500 is about as close to a "safe" in-vehicle and field unit compromise as they come, but it's still a compromise on both sides of the equation. Some will find the even the little QVGA 3.5" screen a tad small compared to the 4.3" and 5" units on the market now. And although you can recharge and replace the lithium ion battery, it's the type used in a PDA or a digital camera -- not something you can pick up at the local 7-11. At Garmin retail, a home charger and spare battery will run you $64. By itself, $35 is about typical. While it's "geocaching friendly", it has the same 500 waypoint limit as the older eTrex line. Unlike other units, it has no audio-out feature, so you can't improve the sound by piping it through your vehicle's audio system. I'm having a hard time understanding how anyone benefits from the spoken street names on a motorcycle (they advertise it as "motorcycle friendly", too).

 

Folks -- an automobile and a bicycle will both take you somewhere, but not legally everywhere. Don't expect one to adequately replace the other. If your budget won't allow for anything else, stick with a decent routing/mapping handheld or the Nuvi 500 that tries to double a field unit. But don't say we didn't warn you.

Edited April 7, 2010 by ecanderson

[BlackProphet]

^^^^ I 100% agree with you.

 

but I am assuming (and maybe I'm wrong cause I am a noob) but geocaching is supposed to be inclusive. Saying "buy a hand held, its the only way to go" doesn't include somone who can't afford both. I understand the differences and the pitfalls of using a car GPS for caching, but it can be done. Its not the best way, but the best way is seldom the most accessible way. For you an extra $200 is no problem, for others, an etra $25 might break the bank.

 

My post was really in response to the implication that car GPS is shifting geocaching to be about driving, instead of experiencing nature. And I was saying that I think it is about people being cheap/not having the money to experience both.

 

Let me end off by saying I will be getting a handheld, but thats cause I can afford it. I heard about geocaching about 5 years ago, and am just starting now, because of not being able to afford it. So I can see both sides. I'm just advocating for encouraging anyone to participate anyway they can.

[+ecanderson]

So I can see both sides. I'm just advocating for encouraging anyone to participate anyway they can.

I'm with you on that, but I keep thinking that many of the solicitations for advice on this topic anticipate that there's a device out there that really will solve both problems conveniently. Consequently, all we can do is warn of the pitfalls of going either direction so that the user understands which set of compromises are being made.

 

As much as I would NOT like to carry a Nuvi 500 in the field, I have to come down on the side of a device that provides a reasonably safe and well featured road navigation experience. It also carries the advantage of spoken directions, so even the smaller 3.5" screen isn't quite such a problem. A simple "beep" from a 60CSx or Legend HCx is cute, but really requires that most drivers include a navigator to operate while driving in any kind of traffic.