Please, for the love of dog, log your FTFs

[+bittsen]

Why, O Why would someone get a FTF and not log it online? What logical reason is there in this?

Why must the cache page sit, with zero find, only for a cacher to arrive at the cache location and not see a pristine (pristine is the word of the day according to John Tesh) log? Why can't they all rush home and log the find?

Do they not know that some people have to seriously alter their schedule to go after FTF? Do they no know that by leaving the cache page empty, there will be people who will leave the comfort of their recliner? Is there a reason to not log this wonderful accomplishment, considering how they must have rushed out to find the cache first?

 

Why O Why did I rush out at 9PM to climb the stairs to the top of the small inner-city volcano? Why could my geosenses not kick in to tell me that the find could wait till another time because the coveted FTF was already claimed on the logsheet? Why?!

[+Minimike2]

Because the person with the FTF is still out. The bars don't close until 2AM.

[jholly]

Because when I start out in the morning I do the FTF's first and then go on for a day of caching. I come home have dinner, watch a bit of tube and then later in the evening I sit down and log. Sorry if I gave you a bit of a burn there.

 

Jim

[oakenwood]

It helps to deter rival FTF hounds. Get burned like that a few times, and you might stop.

[+SkellyCA]

Pehaps you haven't yet read This thread, posts #6 & 10.

 

Note my resposes at posts #7 & 17.

 

As I said, I'm glad that I don't share his negativity.

[aniyn]

I don't log my ftf's immediately. I do this to deliberately draw more cachers to the new hide. And because I'm evil like that.

[+Chrysalides]

Sounds like a different incarnation of this thread:

 

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=226784

[+jellis]

two reasons.

One if you log it right away, other cachers will put off even trying to find it for days.

Second I don't have an iphone or Blackberry. If it was the only cache I am going after then yes I would rub it in the noses of the local FTF hounds.(not really) But usually I am caching the whole day and it will have to wait till I get home and log the caches in.

[+The Blorenges]

There's something more to this isn't there?

 

You're just really disappointed you didn't get that sparkly butterfly tie clasp?

 

There, there...

 

MrsB

[+Morning Dew]

Just flip the log book over and sign the last page, log claiming a FTF and be all exciting about it. If anyone ever questions you, you just play dumb and say "I must have accidently signed the wrong side in my haste." There, problem solved. Sheesh. Rookie. Oh, don't forget to to back date / time it some too, this makes it official and binding in a court of law.

Edited November 12, 2009 by Morning Dew

[+Castle Mischief]

Recently after getting FTF on one of my caches, a finder asked if I wanted him to wait to log the find online so that more cacher would try for the FTF. I told him that I appreciated the consideration, but that I was fine with him logging the find online per his regular schedule and because I know that some people really get a kick out of the FTF I wouldn't want to "lead them on" unnecessarily.

 

So apparently there are some hiders that like to sand-bag in order to bring more seekers to the cache early on.

 

I don't really get this.

 

I also don't get the over-importance that some hunters place on the FTF. I understand that it's kind of a cool thing, but you have to realize that once it's accepted as a competition in you area that you are playing game of your own making and that it's subject to the rules of nobody (outside the usual caching guidelines).

[Andronicus]

There is one cacher in our area that waits till there is at least one dissapointed log before loging the FTF on the website. I left work for lunch early (1045h) to attempt a FTF only to find it had been found arount 0540h.

[+flask]

it's mean spirited and deceptive to wait to log until somebody else has made an attempt. the only point to that is to hand somebody else a bitter little pill of defeat.

 

if being there first isn't good enough for you unless you get to wipe somebody else's nose with your doot i guess that's your business, but why would you brag on such a thing?

 

there are two kinds of people on any racecourse: those who aspire to win and those who aspire to humiliate others. applause at the trophy presentation isn't all that enthusiastic when that second kind of racer takes the podium.

 

THAT said, i am typically months behind in writing my logs (although i spend on average an hour or two each day working on them) and a couple of times i've been firstfinder while i was on the road and did not return home for a couple of weeks.

 

more recently, i had a firstfind on 10/31 but have not yet logged it since i'm still logging 10/15. i'm not expecting anyone to be disappointed, though, because the second, third, and fourth finders were all there that same night.

[+niraD]

Sounds like a different incarnation of this thread:

 

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=226784

Yep. And as I wrote there, I think a lot depends on the FTF cacher's attitude.

 

Logging a morning FTF in the evening, because you haven't had time (or net access) all day? Great!

 

Logging an FTF a week later because you got the FTF at the beginning of a week-long backpacking trip, and you were offline in the backcountry? Great!

 

Never logging an FTF because you never log any of your finds online? Great!

 

Logging an FTF only after the STF logs online, just because you want to screw with the other FTF hounds in the area? Well...

[+Xaa]

Logging an FTF only after the STF logs online, just because you want to screw with the other FTF hounds in the area? Well...

 

The same thing happens if you jump in your car and the ftf cacher logs 1 minute afterwards. For whatever reason: your trip will not be successfull. It's the risk of playing the FTF game, right? If you can't stand that risk, don't play the game.

[+niraD]

Logging an FTF only after the STF logs online, just because you want to screw with the other FTF hounds in the area? Well...

The same thing happens if you jump in your car and the ftf cacher logs 1 minute afterwards. For whatever reason: your trip will not be successfull. It's the risk of playing the FTF game, right? If you can't stand that risk, don't play the game.

In a sense, the "same thing" happens in all the examples I mentioned: others will not know that the cache has already been found, and may seek an FTF after the cache has already been found.

 

The difference is in the attitude of the FTF cacher.

[+DragonsWest]

I'll soon be on a cross-country trip. What I have found I may not be able to log for a few days. If it happens I've got an FTF it will be logged with the others as opportunity presents itself.

[+bittsen]

There's something more to this isn't there?

 

You're just really disappointed you didn't get that sparkly butterfly tie clasp?

 

There, there...

 

MrsB

 

Of course there was inspiration for the thread, and for the record, I left the sparkly butterfly tie clasp. I suspect the FTF left it for the same reason I did. I wouldn't use it and would have been taking it just to take it. Not a great reason to take it IMHO.

 

I don't have a problem with people not posting their FTF because they can't. I only have a problem with those who do it to screw with people.

 

The few FTF's that I have had were logged at the first possible opportunity. I am hesitant to tick off other people who could decide to mess with my caches due to spite

[knowschad]

I don't have a problem with people not posting their FTF because they can't. I only have a problem with those who do it to screw with people.

But how do you tell the difference? (assuming they don't boast or laugh about it in their logs). Also, doesn't this fall into the category of stuff that you shouldn't bother to pet?

[+bittsen]

I don't have a problem with people not posting their FTF because they can't. I only have a problem with those who do it to screw with people.

But how do you tell the difference? (assuming they don't boast or laugh about it in their logs). Also, doesn't this fall into the category of stuff that you shouldn't bother to pet?

 

I don't tell the difference. It is, of course, a pattern one would look for. Or, if the person boasts about it.

[+StarBrand]

I don't have a problem with people not posting their FTF because they can't. I only have a problem with those who do it to screw with people.

But how do you tell the difference? (assuming they don't boast or laugh about it in their logs). Also, doesn't this fall into the category of stuff that you shouldn't bother to pet?

 

I don't tell the difference. It is, of course, a pattern one would look for. Or, if the person boasts about it.

I am aware of at least one cacher that "brags" about a delay in logging his FTF.

[+flask]

I don't have a problem with people not posting their FTF because they can't. I only have a problem with those who do it to screw with people.

But how do you tell the difference? (assuming they don't boast or laugh about it in their logs). Also, doesn't this fall into the category of stuff that you shouldn't bother to pet?

 

well, apparently people DO boast about it and laugh in their logs and here in the forums.

 

while there's really nothing to be done about it, it deserves to be called what it is: mean and petty.

 

in the world of cycling if you are known as a person who violates the common practices of decency, the pack can make sure that you never again enjoy a neutral "natural break" or an easy approach to anything.

 

i realize some people think they're being very clever indeed when they rain on someone's parade just because they can, but waiting to log just so that someone else's disappointment is just that much sharper has all the earmarks of the clever folks who go to trials and games and hearings just for the fun of watching people lose something important to them.

 

if your victory isn't sweet unless you can see someone else's hope broken, you will eventually get what you deserve.

[+fizzymagic]

I am aware of at least one cacher that "brags" about a delay in logging his FTF.

Bragging about this strikes me as even more pathetic than bragging about the FTF.

 

I am absolutely astonished at the lengths to which people will go to try to prove themselves better than others.

[+Scubasonic]

I have seen several published caches (not found yet) that the cache owner says in the description "If you do not post your FTF within 24 hrs your claim to the FTF will be denied and it will go to the STF"

 

Scubasonic

[+flask]

I have seen several published caches (not found yet) that the cache owner says in the description "If you do not post your FTF within 24 hrs your claim to the FTF will be denied and it will go to the STF"

 

 

that's silly.

 

no matter whom the owner would like to award the FTF to, the first person to find it is the first person to find it.

 

a cache owner tried to award one to me once because i was the first finder to meet his silly rule. i wasn't first. the signatures in the logbook tell the truth.

 

if i don't log some dopey cache until i get home, nobody but nobody can take my FTF away from me. cache owners do not get to award firstfinds. they are not flexible. you can screw up your eyes and stamp your feet and declare the sky green or award this year's booker prize to your cousin or declare yourself emperor of north america, but it doesn't make it so.

 

all it does when a cache owner pulls some goofy stunt like that is alert the general population that they're playing fast and loose with the facts.

 

even the cache page speaks the lie!

 

oh, man. if i saw a listing like that, i'd be there so fast with a dozen cachers NONE of whom will log it for a week.

 

"your claim to FTF".

 

ha.

 

that's rich.

[+Scubasonic]

Why, O Why would someone get a FTF and not log it online? What logical reason is there in this?

Why must the cache page sit, with zero find, only for a cacher to arrive at the cache location and not see a pristine (pristine is the word of the day according to John Tesh) log? Why can't they all rush home and log the find?

Do they not know that some people have to seriously alter their schedule to go after FTF? Do they no know that by leaving the cache page empty, there will be people who will leave the comfort of their recliner? Is there a reason to not log this wonderful accomplishment, considering how they must have rushed out to find the cache first?

 

Why O Why did I rush out at 9PM to climb the stairs to the top of the small inner-city volcano? Why could my geosenses not kick in to tell me that the find could wait till another time because the coveted FTF was already claimed on the logsheet? Why?!

 

So I guess it really did turn out to be a "Summit Surprise" It was the FTFers 1st FTF I think that is great, love to see the excitement on a cachers face when they get their very 1st one. I went out after 2 FTFs 20 miles north of me at about 10 pm or so pitch Dark, same owner about 2 miles from each other got the first one but a new cacher got the 2nd one and boy they were excited, I would call that "PRICELESS"

 

ScubaSonic

[+Scubasonic]

Sounds like a different incarnation of this thread:

 

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=226784

Yep. And as I wrote there, I think a lot depends on the FTF cacher's attitude.

 

Logging a morning FTF in the evening, because you haven't had time (or net access) all day? Great!

 

Logging an FTF a week later because you got the FTF at the beginning of a week-long backpacking trip, and you were offline in the backcountry? Great!

 

Never logging an FTF because you never log any of your finds online? Great!

 

Logging an FTF only after the STF logs online, just because you want to screw with the other FTF hounds in the area? Well...

 

One day I was heading over to a very well populated caching area to go after about 50+ caches I noticed that a Cache had come out the night before very late and no one had found it well I left my home at about 4:30 am to head to the sacred caching grounds and was going right by this FTF opportunity stopped by and grabbed the FTF but it was probably 8 PM by the time I finally got home to log it. Man you should have seen the pissed off people whining because I hadn't logged it yet. I do have a Blackberry but I didn't want to fool with it till I got home. It was not a pretty site.

 

ScubaSonic

[+bittsen]

So I guess it really did turn out to be a "Summit Surprise" It was the FTFers 1st FTF I think that is great, love to see the excitement on a cachers face when they get their very 1st one. I went out after 2 FTFs 20 miles north of me at about 10 pm or so pitch Dark, same owner about 2 miles from each other got the first one but a new cacher got the 2nd one and boy they were excited, I would call that "PRICELESS"

 

ScubaSonic

 

Summit Surprise was just the inspiration for the thread. It's a general feeling about the FTF though that I am expressing.

I have noticed that you tend to log the FTFs right away and thats a good trait

 

I forgive (well nothing to firgive, really) the cacher last night. His first FTF so he may not know how frustrating it is to chase a clean log, only to find it's already signed.

[+bflentje]

I don't have a problem with people not posting their FTF because they can't. I only have a problem with those who do it to screw with people.

But how do you tell the difference? (assuming they don't boast or laugh about it in their logs). Also, doesn't this fall into the category of stuff that you shouldn't bother to pet?

 

I don't tell the difference. It is, of course, a pattern one would look for. Or, if the person boasts about it.

I am aware of at least one cacher that "brags" about a delay in logging his FTF.

 

It begs the question.. SO WHAT?

 

Are you people so thin skinned that a little ribbing drives you into psycho-therapy?

[+flask]

I don't have a problem with people not posting their FTF because they can't. I only have a problem with those who do it to screw with people.

But how do you tell the difference? (assuming they don't boast or laugh about it in their logs). Also, doesn't this fall into the category of stuff that you shouldn't bother to pet?

 

I don't tell the difference. It is, of course, a pattern one would look for. Or, if the person boasts about it.

I am aware of at least one cacher that "brags" about a delay in logging his FTF.

 

It begs the question.. SO WHAT?

 

Are you people so thin skinned that a little ribbing drives you into psycho-therapy?

 

are ya meaning to imply that thinking a person's behavior to be rude necessarily indicates a personal crisis?

 

perhaps your inability to accept criticisms of rude behaviors might be addressed with therapy of your own.

 

are you so thin skinned that people talking of rude behaviors drives you into psychotherapy?

[+ChileHead]

Anytime you go out for a FTF you risk not being FTF. How long is acceptable before somebody posts? Should we force all FTFers to post their find from an internet enabled phone at the cache site? Within an hour? The same day? The same week?

 

Who cares. The FTFer has no obligation to post their find in a time schedule that the non-FTFers find acceptable.

 

Go out and find the cache and have fun. If you get FTF, it's a nice bonus.

[knowschad]

I have seen several published caches (not found yet) that the cache owner says in the description "If you do not post your FTF within 24 hrs your claim to the FTF will be denied and it will go to the STF"

Scubasonic

Claim?!?!? What claim? Its either a fact, or it is not a fact.

[+Chrysalides]

I am absolutely astonished at the lengths to which people will go to try to prove themselves better than others.

People do that all the time - trying to prove themselves better than others. It's completely normal and a survival trait. It's the in-your-face bragging and posturing that's distasteful.

[+bittsen]

I am absolutely astonished at the lengths to which people will go to try to prove themselves better than others.

People do that all the time - trying to prove themselves better than others. It's completely normal and a survival trait. It's the in-your-face bragging and posturing that's distasteful.

 

Exactly. I am better than most people but I don't get all "in your face" about it.

 

 

Anyone out there not realize I was joking?

[knowschad]

I am absolutely astonished at the lengths to which people will go to try to prove themselves better than others.

People do that all the time - trying to prove themselves better than others. It's completely normal and a survival trait. It's the in-your-face bragging and posturing that's distasteful.

 

Exactly. I am better than most people but I don't get all "in your face" about it.

 

 

Anyone out there not realize I was joking?

 

Not really. But anyway...

 

 

While I "get it" that there are some special challenges involved in FTF'ing (no PAF, possibly bad coords, etc.) really, isn't the basic idea of getting FTF trying to prove the "I'm better than you" thing, anyway? Or at least, "I'm faster than you", or "I'm more connected to the internet than you" or something.

 

Regular caching is "I found it, too". FTF is "I found it before you. (nyah nah nah nyah nah!!!)"

Edited November 13, 2009 by knowschad

[AZcachemeister]

it's mean spirited and deceptive to wait to log until somebody else has made an attempt. the only point to that is to hand somebody else a bitter little pill of defeat.

 

 

Some people deserve that little pill.

[+Lil Devil]

Hmmm. One of these days I should probably log those two FTFs from August 12th

[GOF and Bacall]

it's mean spirited and deceptive to wait to log until somebody else has made an attempt. the only point to that is to hand somebody else a bitter little pill of defeat.

 

 

Some people deserve that little pill.

 

Perhaps. But doing it this way is more akin to putting tabasco on a stick of gum then resealing the pack and placing it on the store shelf just to see what unlucky soul happens to get that pack.

[knowschad]

it's mean spirited and deceptive to wait to log until somebody else has made an attempt. the only point to that is to hand somebody else a bitter little pill of defeat.

 

 

Some people deserve that little pill.

 

Perhaps. But doing it this way is more akin to putting tabasco on a stick of gum then resealing the pack and placing it on the store shelf just to see what unlucky soul happens to get that pack.

I chose not to chew FTF gum. If anyone takes FTF'ing any more seriously than a simple "Hmmm... I wonder if I can get it before anyone else" then they deserve what they get. I wouldn't play either game, myself, though.

[+flask]

if, in the hunt for an FTF, i need to elbow a five-year-old out of the way, i'll do it.

 

what i won't do is pretend i didn't find it so i can watch him cry when he learns he didn't get it.

 

granted, some people need to be fed that little bitter pill, but by intentionally not logging that FTF you're shooting scattershot into a crowd instead of engaging a sniper.

[+bittsen]

if, in the hunt for an FTF, i need to elbow a five-year-old out of the way, i'll do it.

 

what i won't do is pretend i didn't find it so i can watch him cry when he learns he didn't get it.

 

granted, some people need to be fed that little bitter pill, but by intentionally not logging that FTF you're shooting scattershot into a crowd instead of engaging a sniper.

 

Bottom line is that anyone who derives pleasure by causing another grief is evil, petty and a few other adjectives not fit for a family friendly forum.

Whether you get pleasure from knowing people will go after a FTF when you know you were first, or if you slash tires, or whatever, you have performed a disservice to another for your own pleasure. That, by itself, defines the type of person you are.

[Clan Riffster]

Seems like there's a good life lesson to be learned here:

"The only true sin, is unnecessarily harming another soul.

Everything else is invented nonsense."

 

Choosing a particular course of action, solely to cause another person to experience something negative, is a bad thing.

[+bflentje]

 

It begs the question.. SO WHAT?

 

Are you people so thin skinned that a little ribbing drives you into psycho-therapy?

 

are ya meaning to imply that thinking a person's behavior to be rude necessarily indicates a personal crisis?

 

perhaps your inability to accept criticisms of rude behaviors might be addressed with therapy of your own.

 

are you so thin skinned that people talking of rude behaviors drives you into psychotherapy?

 

There is no inability on my part to accept or not accept anything. My point is, SO WHAT if someone scores a FTF and doesn't log it right away. If you're into the FTF hunt club, get over yourself (the collective FTFers who have a problem with this) and stop whining like a baby.

 

And those with thin skin who are easily offended perhaps DO have constant personal crises.

[+Scubasonic]

So I guess it really did turn out to be a "Summit Surprise" It was the FTFers 1st FTF I think that is great, love to see the excitement on a cachers face when they get their very 1st one. I went out after 2 FTFs 20 miles north of me at about 10 pm or so pitch Dark, same owner about 2 miles from each other got the first one but a new cacher got the 2nd one and boy they were excited, I would call that "PRICELESS"

 

ScubaSonic

 

Summit Surprise was just the inspiration for the thread. It's a general feeling about the FTF though that I am expressing.

I have noticed that you tend to log the FTFs right away and thats a good trait

 

Well I try to as much as possible, but there have been a few times that I was on my way to something else and couldn't.

 

Spoke to 1 FTF hound last night and he purposly holds off posting his FTF, so the cache gets more action. 2 each his own I guess.

 

ScubaSonic

[+BBWolf+3Pigs]

Back before logging via wireless devices, people went out hoping for a FTF, and assumed the risk that the cache may have been found already by the time they showed up. I know I did. And guess what, on occasion (which means usually) I was skunked. Was I all upset? No, because it was the thrill of the chase. If I wasn't willing to make the 1 hour drive for a *possible* FTF because someone else may have been there first, I just didn't do it.

 

Now it seems FTF hounds *expect* the other hounds to log the FTF online as soon as they find the cache. So what happens if a FTF hound is 5 minutes from the cache and gets an email indicating the cache was found? Do they abandon the run just becuase the lost the FTF? Do they get all upset becuase they just wasted 30 minutes of driving? What about those of us who don't have (or want) devices to allow instant logging?

 

People just need to learn to deal with the fact that someone else may get there before you, and may or may not log instantly.

 

(edited for typos)

Edited November 13, 2009 by BBWolf+3Pigs

[Skippermark]

I have seen several published caches (not found yet) that the cache owner says in the description "If you do not post your FTF within 24 hrs your claim to the FTF will be denied and it will go to the STF"

Scubasonic

Claim?!?!? What claim? Its either a fact, or it is not a fact.

Exactly. I don't think said cache owner understands the meaning of the word first. Someone else could say they were first, but if they found it after someone else, they are not first.

 

I know a cacher who often finds caches before anyone else, but he doesn't say anything about being first and lets the second to find say they were first to find.

[+flask]

 

I know a cacher who often finds caches before anyone else, but he doesn't say anything about being first and lets the second to find say they were first to find.

 

i typically do not mention that i was the first to find in my log, but usually the person finding it second does not claim to have been there first.

 

usually.

 

sometimes there are some comic log entries.

 

notably, i returned home from an extended road trip on which i had made a handful of first finds and on one of them, some cachers who came by twelve days later claimed the first find.

 

i didn't bother to correct them, but their log looks mighty silly above mine on the cache page.

[+Scubasonic]

I have over 400+ FTFs in about a year and a half of caching and the attitude I have on the way to hopefully get a FTF is if I get it great if I don't maybe I'll meet some other cachers, or at the very least I will get a smily out of the deal.

 

ScubaSonic

[oakenwood]

Even if you're not FTF, there are other firsts:

 

FTL = First To Log. You found the cache, but weren't the first to find it. Still, you were first to log your find online.

 

FTDNF = First To DNF. There's a certain pathetic charm to this one.

 

FTBSOBM = First To Be Scared Off By Muggles. You would have found it, but didn't want to give away the cache location.

 

FTP = First To Post. You may not have even been to the cache, but you were first to post a note. "Hello world" will do.

 

FTNET = First To Not Even Try. You read the cache listing and stayed home. Here's to you, Mr. I-played-Halo-instead guy!

 

FTLAPOEM = First To Leave A Picture Of Eva Mendes. In my book, that beats a FTF.

[+Scubasonic]

Even if you're not FTF, there are other firsts:

 

FTL = First To Log. You found the cache, but weren't the first to find it. Still, you were first to log your find online.

 

FTDNF = First To DNF. There's a certain pathetic charm to this one.

 

FTBSOBM = First To Be Scared Off By Muggles. You would have found it, but didn't want to give away the cache location.

 

FTP = First To Post. You may not have even been to the cache, but you were first to post a note. "Hello world" will do.

 

FTNET = First To Not Even Try. You read the cache listing and stayed home. Here's to you, Mr. I-played-Halo-instead guy!

 

FTLAPOEM = First To Leave A Picture Of Eva Mendes. In my book, that beats a FTF.

 

FTF=Fifth to find.