Another cache for the "Cache found by the bomb squad list"

[magellan315]

Link

[+Bill & Tammy]

Link

 

Another reason why caches shouldn't be made of PVC tube.

[+sbell111]

Ummm, that cache was not 'found by the bomb squad'.

 

Thanks for the fair and balanced story. All ended well. Nothing to see here.

[+roveron]

It just occured to me, that the police could save a lot of headache, with help from us. If a letter is sent to local law enforcement saying that if they are called to a bomb scare such as this, to take GPS coords near the device and then look up for geocaches near those coordinates and see if any match the container.

This of course wouldn't help with new caches that haven't been approved, but could lessen scares like this from happening. Also, it would make us proactive in helping to lessen the number of such incidents.

 

As for PCV pipe caches, I don't know. One of mine is such, http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...31-4a071e992e6b but it's clearly labled. Also, it would be easier to put a bomb in an ammo box that to make one from PVC pipe.

[GermanSailor]

A technician with the Brown County Bomb Squad indicated the unit has been called to similar incidents in the past, according to the release. [...]

 

Green Bay has not determined if it will bill Fond du Lac for the call, Liethen said. If it does, the money would come from the North Fond du Lac Police Department budget.[...]

 

Anyone involved with or having information concerning this cache should call...

 

Hopefully this little cache hunt doesn't get to expensive for the hider.

 

GermanSailor

[+sbell111]

A technician with the Brown County Bomb Squad indicated the unit has been called to similar incidents in the past, according to the release. [...]

 

Green Bay has not determined if it will bill Fond du Lac for the call, Liethen said. If it does, the money would come from the North Fond du Lac Police Department budget.[...]

 

Anyone involved with or having information concerning this cache should call...

Hopefully this little cache hunt doesn't get to expensive for the hider.

I assume that the cache wasn't hidden by the North Fond du Lac Police Department. Therefore, I can't imagine this adventure costing the cache owner anything. In fact, I'd be somewhat surprised if any of the cache owners of any of the caches that have been blown up have had to pay (directly) for the service.

 

Edited to add: What would they bill the owner for? Let's see, they drove halfway to the site which was seventy miles away. Their van get's 15 miles per gallon. Gas costs $2.29 at the Speedway on Mason Street. That makes a total cost to the bomb squad of $11.45. I think our tax dollars can take care of that bill.

Edited January 9, 2007 by sbell111

[+PlaidPirate]

Plus the salary of the bomb squad. Say a 3 man team (guessing here), at $100 per hour (guess here too...hazardous duty pay?)...seventy miles..each way is at least two hours..plus another hour or more for paperwork. Thats $900, plus the $11.45.

Edited January 9, 2007 by PlaidPirate

[+sbell111]

Plus the salary of the bomb squad. Say a 3 man team (guessing here), at $100 per hour (guess here too...hazardous duty pay?)...seventy miles..each way is at least two hours..plus another hour or more for paperwork. Thats $900, plus the $11.45.

These guys don't sit at home on the couch all day wondering if they are going to make money. They are already on the job.

 

Edit: Just for fun, I did a little research. It appears that in most jurisdictions, members of the bomb squad get an annual bump that ranges from about $500 to $2000 over their regular salary. They don't get paid extra if they have to deploy to a location.

Edited January 9, 2007 by sbell111

[+PlaidPirate]

These guys don't sit at home on the couch all day wondering if they are going to make money. They are already on the job.

 

True, but they usually have other duties, and having to answer to a bomb scare takes them away from those duties. Some states will pass the the expense of wasted resources to someone they think is at fault. Example: (in texas at least) If you have a home alarm system, that is monitored. And the police are called when it goes off. If you get to many false alarms they will start charging you for the calls. Those police officers are still on duty, not sitting on a couch, but they could be doing something more productive. Your false alarms are wasting tax payer money.

 

A bomb scare, COULD, have the same results. Trust me, if they decide to make the cache owner pay, it won't be for just gas.

[+sbell111]

These guys don't sit at home on the couch all day wondering if they are going to make money. They are already on the job.

True, but they usually have other duties, and having to answer to a bomb scare takes them away from those duties. Some states will pass the the expense of wasted resources to someone they think is at fault. Example: (in texas at least) If you have a home alarm system, that is monitored. And the police are called when it goes off. If you get to many false alarms they will start charging you for the calls. Those police officers are still on duty, not sitting on a couch, but they could be doing something more productive. Your false alarms are wasting tax payer money.

 

A bomb scare, COULD, have the same results. Trust me, if they decide to make the cache owner pay, it won't be for just gas.

I don't see it happening. At the end of the day, every false alarm is just good training for the bomb squad.

 

Also, remember that there is a big difference between me setting off my home alarm system and a non-involved citizen reporting a strange object. In your example, I would be actively requesting that the police come to my home. This is quite different from a third party calling the police out to check out a harmless item.

Edited January 9, 2007 by sbell111

[+PlaidPirate]

Hence the COULD and IF in my statement. I doubt they would unless they had reason to believe he did it for the purpose of causing a bomb scare, even then, they would just arrest him.

Edited January 9, 2007 by PlaidPirate

[+Renegade Knight]

Plus the salary of the bomb squad. Say a 3 man team (guessing here), at $100 per hour (guess here too...hazardous duty pay?)...seventy miles..each way is at least two hours..plus another hour or more for paperwork. Thats $900, plus the $11.45.

 

They like to quote those numbers but since they get paid regardless it's not really a valid number. This is of course ignoring that if you are going to have a bomb squad you are going to be having them respond to all manor of non bombs that get reported. It's a cost of doing business.

 

Sheriff's can and some do trump up charges. For the Rainbow Bridge is was "Placing Debris on state property". That must have been a loosely written law.

Edited January 9, 2007 by Renegade Knight

[Mushtang]

A quote from the police at the end of the article:

 

"While the Police Department recognizes the popularity and interest in geocaching… to avoid such misunderstandings and concern, caches should be clearly marked and/or readily identifiable as harmless," Liethen said.

 

Liethen then went on to add, "And if any would be bombers out there reading this could clearly mark their bombs as harmful, that would be a big help too. Please don't mark actual bombs as harmless because that would just confuse us. Thanks."

[+sbell111]

A quote from the police at the end of the article:

"While the Police Department recognizes the popularity and interest in geocaching… to avoid such misunderstandings and concern, caches should be clearly marked and/or readily identifiable as harmless," Liethen said.

Liethen then went on to add, "And if any would be bombers out there reading this could clearly mark their bombs as harmful, that would be a big help too. Please don't mark actual bombs as harmless because that would just confuse us. Thanks."

These aren't the droids you're looking for.

Edited January 9, 2007 by sbell111

[+perrycoscooter]

I wander how much trouble it would be, when a cache gets published, that a copy goes to the local police department in that area.

[+sbell111]

I wander how much trouble it would be, when a cache gets published, that a copy goes to the local police department in that area.

I wonder how many days it would take before that email went on their spam list.

[+karstic]

I like how the article refers to the container as a "device."

[+Quest Master]

Does anybody have a waypoint or link to the cache so that I can add it to my list of Bomb Scares and Other Fun Stuff?

 

I know of only one instance where a geocacher got billed for causing a bomb scare. See "GEO COURT" in the list for details. I think that it's hard to charge somebody for causing a bomb scare unless it was done deliberately or we would have seen it happen more than this one time. In this case, the cacher pleaded no contest to charges of trespassing and vandalism. If there had been no trespassing or vandalism, he probably wouldn't have had to pay a dime for the commotion that was caused.

[+VeryLost]

Just for fun, I did a little research. It appears that in most jurisdictions, members of the bomb squad get an annual bump that ranges from about $500 to $2000 over their regular salary. They don't get paid extra if they have to deploy to a location.

 

Yeah, but don't forget the intangible benefits. They get to blow stuff up, and that's a reward in itself!

[+sbell111]

Did they replace the cache, or are they holding it hostage?

 

Shoot the hostage cache.

[+roveron]

Just for fun, I did a little research. It appears that in most jurisdictions, members of the bomb squad get an annual bump that ranges from about $500 to $2000 over their regular salary. They don't get paid extra if they have to deploy to a location.

 

Yeah, but don't forget the intangible benefits. They get to blow stuff up, and that's a reward in itself!

Yeah, but they didn't get to blow anything up this time.

[+Rose and the thorn]

Does anybody have a waypoint or link to the cache so that I can add it to my list of Bomb Scares and Other Fun Stuff?

 

I know of only one instance where a geocacher got billed for causing a bomb scare. See "GEO COURT" in the list for details. I think that it's hard to charge somebody for causing a bomb scare unless it was done deliberately or we would have seen it happen more than this one time. In this case, the cacher pleaded no contest to charges of trespassing and vandalism. If there had been no trespassing or vandalism, he probably wouldn't have had to pay a dime for the commotion that was caused.

 

Here you go. GCQN52

[+Super_Nate]

Did you notice that the reporter who wrote that article obviously didn't know about geocaching and was very uncertian about what he/she was writing about

 

Examples:

 

Geocaches can range in size from "microcaches" ? too small to hold anything more than a tiny paper log ? to those placed in five-gallon buckets or even larger containers.

 

While the Police Department recognizes the popularity and interest in geocaching? to avoid such misunderstandings and concern, caches should be clearly marked and/or readily identifiable as harmless,"

 

What's up with all the question marks? Geocaches can range in size from....uhhh......."microcaches"? Whatever that means. Tiny paper log ? Ummm, okay?

Edited January 10, 2007 by Super_Nate

[+AStargirl]

Did you notice that the reporter who wrote that article obviously didn't know about geocaching and was very uncertian about what he/she was writing about

 

Examples:

 

Geocaches can range in size from "microcaches" ? too small to hold anything more than a tiny paper log ? to those placed in five-gallon buckets or even larger containers.

 

While the Police Department recognizes the popularity and interest in geocaching? to avoid such misunderstandings and concern, caches should be clearly marked and/or readily identifiable as harmless,"

 

What's up with all the question marks? Geocaches can range in size from....uhhh......."microcaches"? Whatever that means. Tiny paper log ? Ummm, okay?

 

I had no question marks in those places in the link I looked at. I thought the reporter did a decent job of explaining things.

[+Quest Master]

Does anybody have a waypoint or link to the cache so that I can add it to my list of Bomb Scares and Other Fun Stuff?

 

Here you go. GCQN52

 

Got it! Thanks!

[+mgbmusic]

"Anyone involved with or having information concerning this cache should call Liethen at (920) 906-5555. "

 

Uhh...mrs/ms. reporter person....

 

www.geocaching.com

 

Now where's my reward?

 

For an extra $1000, I'll send you all the online logs for the cache too! For another 5,000, I'll use my prem membership to run a pocket query for every cache within 100 miles so you can freak out aobut those too.

 

--MGb

[+VeryLost]

Geocaches can range in size from "microcaches" ? too small to hold anything more than a tiny paper log ? to those placed in five-gallon buckets or even larger containers.

 

What's up with all the question marks? Geocaches can range in size from....uhhh......."microcaches"? Whatever that means. Tiny paper log ? Ummm, okay?

 

The question marks have nothing to do with the writer's uncertainty, but rather are a result of your web browser not knowing how to display a certain character on the web page. In this case, that character looks like a long dash or hyphen.

[BRTango]

"Anyone involved with or having information concerning this cache should call Liethen at (920) 906-5555. "

 

Uhh...mrs/ms. reporter person....

 

www.geocaching.com

 

Now where's my reward?

 

For an extra $1000, I'll send you all the online logs for the cache too! For another 5,000, I'll use my prem membership to run a pocket query for every cache within 100 miles so you can freak out aobut those too.

 

--MGb

 

Hmmm... wouldn't that be a violation of the TOS?

[+Renegade Knight]

Does anybody have a waypoint or link to the cache so that I can add it to my list of Bomb Scares and Other Fun Stuff?

 

I know of only one instance where a geocacher got billed for causing a bomb scare. See "GEO COURT" in the list for details. I think that it's hard to charge somebody for causing a bomb scare unless it was done deliberately or we would have seen it happen more than this one time. In this case, the cacher pleaded no contest to charges of trespassing and vandalism. If there had been no trespassing or vandalism, he probably wouldn't have had to pay a dime for the commotion that was caused.

That makes two that I know of. The Rainbow Bridge cache was never actually listed for it to hit your bookmark list. The charge was "placing debris on state property".

[nonaeroterraqueous]

A PVC pipe bomb...now that's nothing but a firecracker. A stainless steel pipe bomb would be different. Gotta wrap those PVC pipe bombs, er, um, caches in nails or a chain to give it the right effect. Otherwise it's just a container.

[+mgbmusic]

A PVC pipe bomb...now that's nothing but a firecracker. A stainless steel pipe bomb would be different. Gotta wrap those PVC pipe bombs, er, um, caches in nails or a chain to give it the right effect. Otherwise it's just a container.

 

I kinda like the Ball berings of the movie "Swordfish"

 

--MGb

[magellan315]

An editorial was written, kind of rambling, the last sentence sounds like someone really didn't do any research when it comes to Geocaching. Nor do I want to educate them on their ignorance. the author thinks that there aren't that many Geocaches in the area. Based on comments fromthe orginal article the police and the area bombsquad are familiar with Geocaching and thats fine by me. Edited January 10, 2007 by magellan315

[+sbell111]

The editorial was pretty vanilla. I certainly agree that the last sentence was, shall we say, unrealistic. Do they actually expect the local police to track every cache in their jurisdiction? If that went into practice, we would see the police lobbying for a limitation on caches placed.

[+pigpen4x4]

The general public has an idea in their heads of what a pipe bomb looks like.

I doesn't matter if it's PVC, stainless, iron or even Poly.

If it looks like a duck, it must be a duck, right?

That's my personal feeling of why our caches should not look like a bomb.

Yes, a ammo can has far more potential than a PVC pipe.

But, drop one of each in any area with lots of people around and see which one sends them running.

How do people perceive our hobby?

We should not do things that can put it in a bad light.

Will the next land manager say no, those things might bring the bomb squad out here?

 

PP

[+Renegade Knight]

The general public has an idea in their heads of what a pipe bomb looks like. ...

 

Exactly. Anything that fits that pattern will get called in. That's why real bombs can look like anything.

[+TrailGators]

The general public has an idea in their heads of what a pipe bomb looks like.

I doesn't matter if it's PVC, stainless, iron or even Poly.

If it looks like a duck, it must be a duck, right?

That's my personal feeling of why our caches should not look like a bomb.

Yes, a ammo can has far more potential than a PVC pipe.

But, drop one of each in any area with lots of people around and see which one sends them running.

How do people perceive our hobby?

We should not do things that can put it in a bad light.

Will the next land manager say no, those things might bring the bomb squad out here?

 

PP

I agree. False alarms and bad press are all perception. I wish GC would ban the use of caches in PVC pipes for that reason. They are lousy containers anyhow.

[+sbell111]

The general public has an idea in their heads of what a pipe bomb looks like. ...

Exactly. Anything that fits that pattern will get called in. That's why real bombs can look like anything.

That's the very reason that none of my bombs are in pipes.

[+Recdiver]

The general public has an idea in their heads of what a pipe bomb looks like. ...

Exactly. Anything that fits that pattern will get called in. That's why real bombs can look like anything.

That's the very reason that none of my bombs are in pipes.

Exactly. That is why I pack mine in footballs.

[+WeatherednBoston]

I found a cache that looked like a bomb once. It was on a bridge. I saw this container...shook my head...took a look around to make sure nobody was looking...took a pic......opened it up, signed the log....looked around....placed it back....got in my car...kept looking behind me for 3 miles hoping the cops were not gonna come and get me.

 

I got away...but I always will wonder if this one might cause problems some day. NO...I dont remember which cache it was.

 

Edited January 10, 2007 by WeatherednBoston

[+gpsblake]

It just occured to me, that the police could save a lot of headache, with help from us. If a letter is sent to local law enforcement saying that if they are called to a bomb scare such as this, to take GPS coords near the device and then look up for geocaches near those coordinates and see if any match the container.

 

Disagree.

 

let's pretend I'm a terrorist and I want to plant a bomb.

 

I could switch a legitimate geocache with a bomb and simply label it with stickers saying geocaching.com all over it. Police go to it, see the label and notice it's on the website and ignore it. Bomb blows up.

 

That's why the police has to treat these as a real bomb threat regardless what the container says or what the website says.

--

 

WeatheredinBoston,

 

That cache should be archived. Report it as such as it violates the geocaching guidelines.

Edited January 10, 2007 by gpsblake

[+TexasGringo]

When I get permission to place caches...I always give them coordinates and a picture of the cache. I keep copies for myself...just in case I get accused of something...I have all the paperwork for the cache.

[+sbell111]

let's pretend I'm a terrorist and I want to plant a bomb. I could switch a legitimate geocache with a bomb and simply label it with stickers saying geocaching.com all over it. Police go to it, see the label and notice it's on the website and ignore it. Bomb blows up. That's why the police has to treat these as a real bomb threat regardless what the container says or what the website says.

You could also simply put the bomb into the cache.

WeatheredinBoston,

 

That cache should be archived. Report it as such as it violates the geocaching guidelines.

It may or may not violate the guidelines. It depends on the bridge.

 

BTW, at least it was clearly identified as a geocache.

[+sbell111]

Here's a story for you:

 

A friend of a friend was renovating a bathroom in his house and needed some help. He called his buddy over and they proceded to demo the old bath. As they removed the drywall, they discovered what appeared to be long pipe bombs hidden in the wall.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 10, 2007 by sbell111