+dogbreathcanada Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Saw this cache note by the cache owner on a local cache: "I spray Raid and use moth balls to keep the cache area clear of critters." Maybe it's just me, but depositing mothballs and spraying Raid in a city park seems somehow wrongheaded. If digging to hide a cache is wrong (that's not what's being done at this cache, mind you), then spraying poisons to keep a cache hiding spot (in a hole at the base of a tree) free of insects seems worse. What's next, setting leg hold traps to keep away squirrels and mice? Am I mad? Or is it fine for the cache owner to be doing this? Link to comment
+Prfctly Mad Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Does seem kinda wrong in my opinion, but you know what they say about opinions Link to comment
CoyoteRed Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Seems like a futile attempt while posioning the area. What's next? "My cache is supposed to be a one star so I used a couple of gallons of Round-up so you'll have a clear path through the poison ivy." Link to comment
+Rick618 Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Some areas are very prone to ants, espeicailly the nasty red ants. I' would much rather a bit of spray than getting set upon by those things. That's part of thier cache, if you don't care for it, then move on to the next one. Personally, I would be apt to leave a donation in a cache for the roundup trail as long as it was through the posoin ivy patch. Link to comment
PCFrog Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 posoin ivy patch. Great Idea -- I can hide my next one in a tree trunk full of ants surrounded by poison Ivy. That should bump the difficulty level up one. If you have to destroy an area of wildlife to hide a cache then the cache should not be placed there. How can you enjoy a hike when all the plants are dead and the ground is littered with animal and insect corps? Link to comment
+briansnat Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Killing poor, defenseless little bugs. Sick! Link to comment
ZoopD|ngle Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Am I mad? Or is it fine for the cache owner to be doing this? You may be mad but you are correct. Not only is this a bad thing, but I wonder if there's a bylaw prohibiting the spraying of pesticides in a public park without a licence? Put an SBA on the cache. Geez, there's bugs in and around our trees; who woulda thunk it? Link to comment
+Spencersb Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Let nature do it! C'mon October! I think, at least I hope the owner is talking about spraying the container with raid and leaving a couple of moth balls inside. I can't say I'd have much problem with that, though opening a hot ammo can in summer and having moth balls waft out at you doesn't sound appealing. Now if he/she is talking about spraying the area around the cache, I'd say 1. you shouldn't do it, 2. you're trying to spit out a forest fire! Link to comment
+Joe Smith Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 I just don't see the point. Not only is it pointless to go to these lengths in beating down Mother Nature, you are letting geocachers touch a cache that has been sprayed with poison. Being that few of us wash our hands after this, and touch eyes, food, or pick up our children the owner is placing catchers into deliberate harm and the cache should be archived. A new box in a new location would be required. Joe Smith Link to comment
+BlueDeuce Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 I just don't see the point. Not only is it pointless to go to these lengths in beating down Mother Nature, you are letting geocachers touch a cache that has been sprayed with poison. Being that few of us wash our hands after this, and touch eyes, food, or pick up our children the owner is placing catchers into deliberate harm and the cache should be archived. A new box in a new location would be required. Joe Smith I agree. Do they not understand it's the outdoors? So there are a few bugs on the cache, big deal. If the critters are so bad you can't retrieve it, then you need to move it. Link to comment
Tahosa and Sons Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 A good dose of Napalm usually clears the cache area of unwanted foilage or critters. Less cover better reception. Link to comment
madratdan Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 Saw this cache note by the cache owner on a local cache: "I spray Raid and use moth balls to keep the cache area clear of critters." It must be a lady that owns this cache. I know a few that would do something just like this. They go hiking and carry cans of wasp and bug spray to kill any bugs that might cross their path. You might call it enjoying nature in an unnatural way. Then again, it could be a type of medical condition linked to a phobia. Link to comment
+Miragee Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 I agree that an SBA note should be written. Some people are very sensitive to chemicals, especially those found in Raid. Getting out in nature is hoped to be a way to completely avoid such toxic chemicals. If you don't want to post the SBA note, at least send an email to the local reviewer about the cache. I have done that for some things I was concerned with and the problems were remedied. Link to comment
+dogbreathcanada Posted August 5, 2005 Author Share Posted August 5, 2005 Glad to see my thinking on the issue wasn't entirely out of line. I'll send a private email to my local approver. Link to comment
+dogbreathcanada Posted August 5, 2005 Author Share Posted August 5, 2005 The local approver is dealing with, and thankfully agrees that the practice is ill-advised. Thanks for all the comments. Link to comment
+dogbreathcanada Posted August 6, 2005 Author Share Posted August 6, 2005 Since closing this topic, I've received three positive emails from folks wanting to discuss the issue further. I guess I'll just re-open the topic for discussion. Some discussion points: 1. Should gc.com make it policy that cache hiders aren't to spray toxic chemicals in or around their caches, nor to leave toxic solids, such as mothballs or rat poison? 2. Should I post the link to the cache? I'm not sure what the forum policy is? I'm already in some hot water because of the cacher in question (they have a number of bad caches out there, a couple of which I've complained about), so don't want to press the issue on my own. But if anyone else wants to post a link, feel free. Here's the full text of their August 2nd cache note (since it's likely it will be deleted or archived soon): ok, I'll tell ya the safety secret. I spray Raid and use moth balls to keep the cache area clear of critters. I was there Aug 1, yesterday, doing cache check/Raid spray and it was fine. I think you might have been at wrong tree as there wasn't any kind of insect at cache site. Good news eh? Link to comment
+BlueDeuce Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 1. Should gc.com make it policy that cache hiders aren't to spray toxic chemicals in or around their caches, nor to leave toxic solids, such as mothballs or rat poison? I think since gc.com pretty much covers this in the 'what you shouldn't leave in a cache' info, it can be handled on a case by case basis. Should it be specifically listed in the standardrequirements? Well, it seems to be somewhat rare and hopefully covered by common sense. Again, when common sense fails, case by case is probably enough. Ya gotta draw the line somehwere, otherwise we'll need a "Don't eat the trinkets" clause. Link to comment
+Miragee Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 . . . Here's the full text of their August 2nd cache note (since it's likely it will be deleted or archived soon): ok, I'll tell ya the safety secret. I spray Raid and use moth balls to keep the cache area clear of critters. I was there Aug 1, yesterday, doing cache check/Raid spray and it was fine. I think you might have been at wrong tree as there wasn't any kind of insect at cache site. Good news eh? It appears that some people don't have any common sense, maybe they have delusions of grandeur. "Safety secret!" Aren't Geocachers supposed to be stewards of the environment? Isn't that why we hold CITO events like the one held last weekend down here in the San Diego area? Link to comment
+wornout Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 . . . Here's the full text of their August 2nd cache note (since it's likely it will be deleted or archived soon)...... It appears that some people don't have any common sense, maybe they have ..... Common sense means something different to everyone. To me, posting the actual log shows common sense, posting the name of the cache in a thread that will more than likely start a hate mail campaign, doesn't. But then again, it is a public forum. Link to comment
+dogbreathcanada Posted August 9, 2005 Author Share Posted August 9, 2005 Disappointing to see that the owner's "I Raid and mothball my cache location" note is still up, and that the cache is still active. Am fearful that other cachers (especially newbs) are going to come along, see that note and think to themselves: "Gee, that's a good idea." Visited the cache yesterday ... no mothballs present (they likely sublimated in the heat), but there were no signs of any insect life in the hole, not even the usual spiderwebs. So I guess the Raid was effective. Link to comment
+dogbreathcanada Posted August 9, 2005 Author Share Posted August 9, 2005 Well, the fact that some chucklehead is spraying poisons (and leaving poisons) at a cache site. You'd think GC would take that somewhat seriously. Not to mention that the cache owner is: 1) Contravening the law. 2) Contravening common sense. One wonders if they're doing it at all their cache sites. Link to comment
+sbell111 Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I sprayed raid last night. The black helicopters didn't come for me. You made your case. If TPTB want to take some sort of action, they will. Personally, I don't have a problem with killing a few of the bazillion skeeters and other insects that inhabit any particular park. The fact that when you visited the cache you couldn't tell that it had been bombed makes me even less likely to jump on the bandwagon. Link to comment
+Gorak Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Disappointing to see that the owner's "I Raid and mothball my cache location" note is still up, and that the cache is still active. Disappointing to see that you continue to attack this particular cacher at every opportunity and for any reason you can dream up. Why don't you just leave her alone. Other than hiding caches that you feel are lame, she's done nothing to you to warrant these ongoing attacks. Link to comment
+dogbreathcanada Posted August 9, 2005 Author Share Posted August 9, 2005 Other than hiding caches that you feel are lame, she's done nothing to you to warrant these ongoing attacks. I don't consider it an attack. The cache owner's lack of common sense seems to invite criticism. Perhaps if she exhibited some common sense, there'd be nothing to criticise. Again, she's breaking the law. And what happens when a cache owner finds the cache within hours of one of her mothball/Raid visits? Are they going to know that after handling the cache they'll likely have hands covered in poison? There's also a park nearby. And people seem to bring their dogs here to play. What if a dog got a hold of a mothball? How many of her other caches is she Raid'ing and mothballing? Link to comment
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