new topic as directed

[+Team GeoCan]

quote:

---

 

Frankly, it's discouraging to think that many posters here in the forums are grown adults.

---

 

Really? I actually used to enjoy the discussions in the forums, but lately it is all about people whining about the dictatorial aspects of moderation.

 

There wasn't as much negativism in the forums before the moderation was begun, and THAT seems to be a response to the negatism of a FEW who seem willing to undermine (I should note SUCCESSFULLY) the spirit of the activity, for apparent grudge reasons.

 

Sure every now and then a person will make a gaff, and something should be deleted, for the good of harmony, but it is getting to be a little authoritarian around here.

 

It seems (and it has happened to me) that if one person in authority doesn't like a topic, it gets slammed, almost instantly. Rather than delete content, and leave no explaination, how about just turning off the topic and leaving it as an example of what is NOT to be discussed? Deleting a subject, and it's content, but leaving the post subject ON the boards indicates to one and all that the posting party who was squashed is a public FOOL, and that the REASON for the squashing is NOT apparent. If you want to develop paranoia in posting participants, you are doing it right.

 

At this rate you might as well shut down the boards altogether, because the censorship police are doing it one message at a time.

 

There will be long lasting flack from these problems, less people will want to START geocaching, they will look for other activities, in a MORE friendly environment, they will choose OTHER places to socialize ABOUT geocaching, they will develop DESTRUCTIVE behaviors towards geocaching.com, and frankly, Jeremy will lose money.

 

Now to the POSTERS: Knock off the Bickering, whining and complaining, adapt or move on.

 

The bickering, complaining and destructive activities some have done have brought a sour taste to the activity, which is becoming VERY pungent on these boards.

 

THIS is the PUBLIC face of Geocaching, when someone learns of the sport this is where they come to learn more, what are YOU showing them?

[+cachew nut]

A Native American grandfather was talking to his grandson about how he felt.

 

He said, "I feel as if I have two wolves fighting in my heart. One wolf is the vengeful, angry, violent one. The other wolf is the loving, compassionate one."

 

The grandson asked him, "Which wolf will win the fight in your heart?"

 

The grandfather answered, "The one I feed."

[+Scoobie10]

Wow, something I've been looking for, for quite some time....a well thought out post. Very insightful Bo, thank you. I can't say I agree with everything, but I'll sit and read anyone's well organized thoughts and opinions versus Dennis Milleresque rants and self promotion. (Okay, I didn't mean to dis Miller, I like his rants.....maybe because they actually have a point as opposed to what I normaly see here.)

 

The only part I disagree with is what the mods are doing. Or more to the point, why they are doing it. I think Jeremy and gc.com have been pushed in to the current moderation of the forums by the childish behavior of a few who sit at home or at work and post all day every day in order too......well, who knows why they do it. The fervor has come to a boiling point and it was high time to take steps that would promote balance. I for one am happy to see some of these people addressed publicly and if they don't come into line I wish to see them suspended.

 

Now let me tell you what I completely agree with. This statement:

 

quote:

---

Now to the POSTERS: Knock off the Bickering, whining and complaining, adapt or move on.

 

The bickering, complaining and destructive activities some have done have brought a sour taste to the activity, which is becoming VERY pungent on these boards.

 

THIS is the PUBLIC face of Geocaching, when someone learns of the sport this is where they come to learn more, what are YOU showing them?

---

 

There is no question about the validity of this statement. As soon as I started caching I came to the forums to learn more, however I KNEW what forums consisted of and was prepared to weed through scores of posts in order to find a few with interesting content. Not everyone knows that there are people such as this in most forums and could be easily turned off by the content.

 

This IS the face of caching.....we should take all necessary steps to put our best foot forward and I think that's exactly what gc.com has been pushed into.

 

Thanks again for the post.

 

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Scoobie

 

A day without sunshine is like.....NIGHT!

 

[This message was edited by scoobie10 on October 13, 2003 at 10:33 PM.]

[+Renegade Knight]

Were you slapping GC.com, the people in the forums or both?

[+woodsters]

No offense here, but it gets me when people complain about the people who complain.

 

With that said, it has been said that people would not post on the message board because of the things going on here. My question is that since the moderators have been here with their style of moderating, have any of these people come forward and started posting yet? Don't wanna know who they are, but I was just wondering if the moderating style was what these people were after, or if they are still afraid to post?

 

Brian

www.woodsters.com

 

My Stats

Found: 70

Hidden: 2

[+Team GeoCan]

I am not "slapping" I am opining....

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

THIS is the PUBLIC face of Geocaching, when someone learns of the sport this is where they come to

learn more, what are YOU showing them?

http://blacksheep.rootsweb.com/

International Black Sheep Society of Genealogists

[BassoonPilot]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bo Peep & The Sheep:

 

Really? I actually used to enjoy the discussions in the forums, but lately it is all about people whining about the dictatorial aspects of moderation.

---

 

Is that what all the discussions have been about, or is that all that's been left after the moderators finished deleting everything else?

[Swagger]

quote:

---

Originally posted by scoobie10:

This IS the face of caching.....we should take all necessary steps to put our best foot forward and I think that's exactly what gc.com has been pushed into.

---

So we should pretend that we love and admire gc.com for acting in a monopolistic fashion while they keep taking functionality away from us, all for the benefit of the newbies that rarely visit the forums in the first place?

 

Puh-leeze.

 

In the immortal words of PWEI, "there's no doubt about our intention; we're shouting out our dissension." We're trying to get a message to TPTB and they're ignoring it. What's the normal response? Try harder. The more we're ignored, the more noise we're going to make. Some of that energy has now been shifted from vocalizations to creating a competing site. Way to alienate your customers.

 

GC.com is currently the best caching site on the web. I don't think that anyone disagrees with that. As competitors pop up, all they need to do to remain in the top slot is keep their customers happy. Quashing them in the forums is fine when there's nowhere else for them to go, but it's not a good long-term way to stay on top. What they need to do is forget about some of their idealistic concepts of what the activity should be about and give the people what they want. THAT, ultimately, is what will keep them on top of the game.

 

--

Pehmva!

 

[sTATS IMAGE REMOVED BY OVERBEARING ADMINS]

 

Random quote:

[RANDOM QUOTE IMAGE REMOVED BY OVERBEARING ADMINS]

[+seneca]

TO Bo Peep & The Sheep:

 

I accept your comments as being your sincere perception, but it is not mine. Just as I believe those who say “the cup is half empty”, even though I see it as “half full”.

 

These are excellent forums primarily created and contributed to by dedicated cachers who wish to share their thoughts about Geocaching. Just take a look at the last few pages on the topic lists of the various forums, including the general forum. Of course there is, some “bickering, whining and complaining”, and it is easy to find if you gravitate towards those type of threads. But, remember, we are dealing with real people, with differing personalities and ideas. Among real people, you will always find bickerers, whiners, and complainers.

 

Irony: Your post, will cause some (perhaps even myself) to put you into the category of “whiner and complainer”. And because I disagree with your perception, some may be inclined to put me into the category of “bickerer”.

 

Suggestion to you: If you don't like negativism, then be positive.

 

Suggestion to TBTB: How about a separate forum, dedicated to Forum Discussion.

 

I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me.

[+Team GeoCan]

I hardly expect everyone to agree with me on all issues. (Or in some cases any issues)

 

However it is NOT beyond reasonability to have the forums be within limits of topic specificity. Also, the Managers and creators of the system should have the ability to set the rules, and parameters for posting.

 

That being said, the "complaints" should be only that there is a lack of set standards previously existing that would guide the ON and off topic status of postings.

 

When threads like "add 5 words" go on for weeks and dozens of pages of nonsensical postings, while what appear to be geocaching related discussion get clipped quickly, (even they are not "solidly" about a specific Geocaching subject, but periferral to the discussion) seems to be an inconsistancy. I do note that the "add 5 words" topic did eventually get clipped.

 

The problem isn't necessarily in the moderation but in the determination of some to "push the limits" to see how far they can go before getting clipped, then complaining when it happens.

 

I run some topic specific mail lists, and keeping the posters within limits is a difficult thing, but I solved it by setting up an OFF topic chat mail list, and reminding people to use it gently (sometimes I had to get more assertive).

 

We as user should realize that we are in a place that is not paid for directly by us, and those who are contributing time and resources to the goal are being very generous in allowing the discussions. (Memberships and purchases fron GC/Groundspeak DO support the forums).

 

I do agree that people will go where they feel they are getting what they want, and I see two purposes at work, the actual Geocaching, and the DISCUSSIONS, which often are totally unrelated to the seeking/placing aspects.

 

I suggest that a OFF-topic board area be set up. One that is only archived for 30 days, and then the old posts expire. That way the off topics can eventually go away, are limited in storage space used, and can be ignored by those who want only On-topic discussions.

 

I also suggest that things like photos be limited in display/sorage size, OR they be stored off-site on the person's server of choice.

 

Membership only discussion boards may also be an incentive to get people to join, contribute to the system financially, and reduce the chaff.

 

A PUBLIC area could/should be maintained as well, but the membership area should have features to make it an attraction.

 

We should want to attract new cachers, not drive away the older members/participants, and we should want it to be a friendly hospitable place.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

THIS is the PUBLIC face of Geocaching, when someone learns of the sport this is where they come to

learn more, what are YOU showing them?

http://blacksheep.rootsweb.com/

International Black Sheep Society of Genealogists

[+Bilder]

Woodsets said:

quote:

---

No offense here, but it gets me when people complain about the people who complain.

---

 

Is not that comment a complaint? So therefore, should you not be upset at yourself for complianing about people complaining?

 

All that self hatred is not healthy.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have never been lost. Been awful confused for a few days, but never lost!

N61.12.041 W149.43.734

[+briansnat]

Personally, I don't see much of a problem. Is the "forced politeness" and topic steering a bit annoying? Sure. We really don't need a moderator to step in, slap our hands and tell us to "be nice". But is that really a major issue?

 

Overall, these forums are a great place to discuss geocaching. I don't see the moderators being heavy handed at all. Heck, I have close to 5,000 posts over the past couple of years and I've never had one deleted to my knowledge and I think I recall Keystone Approver mildly admonishing me once.

 

Stick to geocaching, don't call people names and don't advertise for competing websites and you won't have a problem with the moderators.

 

"You can't make a man by standing a sheep on his hind legs. But by standing a flock of sheep in that position, you can make a crowd of men" - Max Beerbohm

[+Zartimus]

quote:

---

Originally posted by cachew nut:

The grandson asked him, "Which wolf will win the fight in your heart?"

 

The grandfather answered, "The one I feed."

---

 

That is a great quote man.. Thanks for posting that.

[+Sir Cache-A-Lot]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bo Peep & The Sheep:

 

THIS is the PUBLIC face of Geocaching, when someone learns of the sport this is where they come to learn more, what are YOU showing them?

---

 

I would have to disagree. I have introduced several people to geocaching. None of them have viewed the forums. It's normally not needed. I have talked to them about issues I have read there, but most people don't seem interested in the forums. The game itself is pretty simple so with a little common sense and the cache pages, what more do you need? I don't post too often, but to say that this is the PUBLIC face of geocaching, I just don't get it. Oh, and where do they go to learn more? They usually ask me.

 

There is no spoon

[umc]

quote:

---

Originally posted by BrianSnat:

Stick to geocaching, don't call people names and don't advertise for competing websites and you won't have a problem with the moderators.

---

 

Its these simple things that make so much sense.

 

MiGO

__________________________

Caching with a clue....

[+ScottJ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sir Cache-A-Lot:

I would have to disagree. I have introduced several people to geocaching. None of them have viewed the forums. It's normally not needed. I have talked to them about issues I have read there, but most people don't seem interested in the forums.

---

 

If you hear about Geocaching through some media source and decide to do some Google searches to read up on it, chances are you'll find yourself here, in these forums. Likewise, people who see Geocaching as a social sport rather than a solitary activity tend to migrate here from the link on the main Geocaching site.

 

--

Scott Johnson (ScottJ)

[+hikemeister]

quote:

---

Originally posted by cachew nut:

A Native American grandfather was talking to his grandson about how he felt.

 

He said, "I feel as if I have two wolves fighting in my heart. One wolf is the vengeful, angry, violent one. The other wolf is the loving, compassionate one."

 

The grandson asked him, "Which wolf will win the fight in your heart?"

 

The grandfather answered, "The one I feed."

---

 

Now I'm going off topic, but have to say that this is the best post I ever have read on this site -- THANKS!