This makes me MAD!!

September 14, 2003

Was I too critical of my comments to this cache site. Please see GCFF70.

This is the Link:

This was my comment:

TRASHPICKERS, I wish to give my two cents to your above comments. This is a great sport and people participate in this because the love it!! They all are in it for the well being of others that wish to participate and share the same hobby.

When I found this cache it was GREAT, and in GREAT shape and also well hidden as noted in the comments since mine. It is also great park, and I have since brought my kids to it to enjoy…

One note when I went to the cache for the first time I thought to my self that this is such a busy place not that far of the beaten path. I wondered how long it would be before someone else “Not a GEOCACHER” stumbled upon it.

Hey we where all kids before and explored everywhere and this is in a place where a kid might find it..

Please don’t YELL at your fellow Geocachers as there are in this for the same reason you are. If you feel this badly when one of your caches gets plundered maybe you should stick to finding and not hiding.

AND if you are looking at JELLYFISH he is contributing as much to this sport as anyone else and he even was willing to take several TB’s to Australia before his trip was canceled. He has been at several of my caches and several of the caches that where visited by myself after him and all where great…

If this upsets you sorry, but pleases don’t YELL at your fellow Geocachers and please re-hide another cache in this park as it was a great choice on your part… If you need an ammo box or contents let me know and I will give you them…

Mark.

mark@draytonwoods.com

[This message was edited by Mark "Drayton Woods Observatory" on September 14, 2003 at 12:03 PM.]

[This message was edited by Mark "Drayton Woods Observatory" on September 14, 2003 at 04:16 PM.]

[This message was edited by Mark "Drayton Woods Observatory" on September 14, 2003 at 04:17 PM.]

[This message was edited by Waterfall on September 14, 2003 at 04:47 PM.]

September 14, 2003

Huh?

-------------------------------------

Becky Davis

Geocaching blog

San Jose, CA

September 14, 2003

No, I don't think you were too critical at all. Really sad that person is blaming cachers.

UMC should chime in and give his thoughts. I'm sure he'll be right behind me.

You handled it well, and I believe the cache has succumbed to MUGGLES. Sorry for the hype, and hope the TRASHPICKER hides another nearby.

Yup. That's MY goat!

9.5k · September 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by beckerbuns:
Huh?

-------------------------------------

Becky Davis

http://www.beckydavis.com/geo/blog.html

San Jose, CA

===Edited===

Ah - nevermind. I went and read the logs. Trashpickers strikes me as a newbie with a temper and a misappropriated higher expectation of the "noble" neighborhood kids over a wrongly perceived "irresponsible" geocaching peers.

Cheers!

TL

September 14, 2003

This is the cache in mention

Yup. That's MY goat!

9.5k · September 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by opey one:
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=578c734d-3e23-46f5-820d-ba9281a9deb8 is the cache in mention

http://img.Groundspeak.com/user/48511_5100.JPG

Yup. That's MY goat!

Thanks! I went to it and read it right after I posted. See my edited post above.

Cheers!

TL

September 14, 2003

So I assume the TB is gone also?

-Ken

September 14, 2003

I agree with opey one, I hope UMC will give his thoughts. I would feel bad if I was the last to visit a cache and be blammed for what sounds like some kids getting into mischief

2.3k · September 14, 2003

its a sad fact of geocaching...

This morning I went to replenish one of my caches only to find it gone! Gonzalgoo!

S**T happens, but I will replace it soon because its in a great little park and I have had nothing but very positve comments in the logs. This is the cache link if you want to check it out...

---------------------------------------------------

Free your mind and the rest will follow

3k · September 14, 2003

My Thoughts:

My first thoughts were OH NO when I just checked my email and saw that there was an archive note for this cache. I read the log from Mark and wasn't sure how to feel about it. An archive note is a bit harsh since its a new cache and they (the cache owners) may (if they haven't already) cleaned up the cache and are getting ready to enable it. After reading my note and possibly checking on the cache they disabled the cache which is the right approach.

If you read my post you will see that the person before me has deleted their log (for whatever reason). I surmised that the plunder took place after them and before me since I was the one who found it all tore up.

Yes it was too close to the trail for my liking and I wasn't surprised to see it plundered. Yes it is a nice park and should be replaced in a better location.

Now as far as the n00b comments on placement I can agree with those to an extent because of the other caches I have done of theirs and feel that they may suffer the same fate.

Sooooo, to answer the original question; I think you may have been a bit harsh and could have sent an email instead of posting a note to the cache page. An archive note was uncallled for when it was temp disabled already.

If you agree you may want to delete your cache note since they get a copy of that in email anyway. I do like how you did offer help with a container or whatever, thats what is needed.

__________________________

Caching without a clue....

September 14, 2003

I am fairly new at this also… It does not take me long to see how something in this world is going… As I myself run several large discussion boards and I might have jumped too soon. I have changed my comments to a NOTE.

The reason I thought this cache should be archived is because it is in a WRONG spot. Too heavy of traffic and too close to what is going on…

I want them to re-hide the cache but in a different location, at the same park.

So Sorry if I went about this the wrong way.

Mark.

mark@draytonwoods.com

[This message was edited by Waterfall on September 14, 2003 at 04:47 PM.]

September 14, 2003

I also do not see the deleated post before you.. All I see is Jellyfish then you and others before him and no edits in the middle... Must have to have Higher status to see the deleation that you see..

If this is the case you might want to include this feature on Premium Members.

Mark.

[This message was edited by Waterfall on September 14, 2003 at 04:48 PM.]

3k · September 14, 2003

Its not that you can see a deleted post because I cannot either. Its that I posted/logged right after Electric Shavers and made note of it in my cache log. What I was refering to was reading my log to see where I referenced how Electric Shavers was there just the day before I was.

__________________________

Caching without a clue....

1.8k · September 14, 2003

Did Electric Shavers delete their log, I wonder? Or did the cache owner delete it because he blamed them?

Bill

-------------------------------

"Ah, take the Cache and let the Credit go..."

The Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam, trans. Edward Fitzgerald

9.5k · September 14, 2003

==Edited==

Looks like Bill D and I had the same thought at the same time. GMTA

With the stats that Electric Shavers has, is it possible that he did not delete his log, but that his log was deleted by someone else?

Cheers!

TL

September 14, 2003

anybody who types a cache log in all caps is an idiot in my book. Maybe trashpickers should stop geocaching for a while until they are no longer a detriment to themselves...

3k · September 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by pnew:
anybody who types a cache log in all caps is an idiot in my book. Maybe trashpickers should stop geocaching for a while until they are no longer a detriment to themselves...

Was that really necessary? I agree that ALL CAPS is un-called for but doesn't warrant an insult.

__________________________

Caching without a clue....

September 14, 2003

Sorry UMC but the insult was aginst us fellow Geocachers, to begin with... and not aginst all caps lets not let this get out of control, AND lets focus where the problem is, blaming a fellow Geocacher with not hidding the site as HE/She found it... see where the problem is.. Check out the stats of the Geocachers that have found this site including "Electric Shavers"...

Mark.

IE: Remarks:

September 2 by trashpickers (trashpickers) (14 found)

I LARGLEY BLAME THE CONDITION OF THIS CACHE ON IRRESPONDSIBLE GEOCACHERS!

THE LAST TIME I CHECKED UP ON THIS CACHE< IT WAS NOT IN ITS RIGHTFUL AREA AND HAD WRAPPERS IN IT!

DONT BLAME THIS ON PLUNDERS BECAUSE THIS OTHER CACHERS HAVE REPORTED IT MOVED!

PLEASE DO A BETTER JOB RETURNING THE CACHE TO WERE IT WAS FOUND!!!!!!

TRASHPICKERS

That is my take on the subject.

Mark.

[This message was edited by Waterfall on September 14, 2003 at 04:48 PM.]

24.7k · September 14, 2003

Yes you were too critical. And they were overeactive to begin with. Your entire note should of been an email instead of a cache note. That way the dispute is private where it should be.

The truth is some cachers don't hide as well as they should. They can and do move caches and comprimise what could of been a very difficult find for anyone but a geocacher. I've seen this happen. While he took the wrong tack on presenting his dilema the problem is real.

Lastly I can't see a reason to archive the cache. He just needs to move it back and move his plea to re-hid well into the main description.

September 14, 2003

Sorry, UMC as I now see you are the "Great White Approver".

I hope to never achieve that status.

UMC has been a wealth of knowledge to me in the past, but I will refrain from posting any more in the near future.....

I hear alot of "yay's" from the back of the crowd.

Me too...

Yup. That's MY goat!

4.2k · September 14, 2003

The response was appropriate in my eyes but I think it should have been done via email.

I recently found a cache that a newbie had placed near me and it had some problems:

No ziplock for logbook, no parking coords for a tough spot which led cachers (myself included) to unknowingly trample through a habitat restoration area, final hide required you trample a bush to get to it (it was along a fence line with no other approach possible), and the obvious entry point crossing through County Prposerty next to a water tank.

On the page I psoted that I LOVED the location - which was true - and then I emailed the owner with a VERY carefully worded explanation on how to improve/fix the troubles. He responded right away and was glad to receive the help.

On the other hand, I had somebody take a wrong turn driving to get to one of mine and they went on my page and blasted me for sending them into a dangerous area. I immediately deleted the post (not becuase I disagreed with him, but because I knew he was on the wrong road) and emailed him to discuss it. He admitted he over-reacted and he was glad I deleted the log he posted in a blur of anger.

But, when I saw the post I immediately felt like I had to defend my cache (knee jerk reaction) so I can understand why they would react poorly alhtough I in no way condone it.

Bottome line: I would have handled it via email to avoid any public exchanges like what happened. I do commend you for choosing your words carefully and offering to help.

Their reaction to 'SCREAM' at cachers in general was uncalled for.

Now I'm rambling....back to football.

49ers lost

September 14, 2003

Great my take on this also... The site was great and the find was great lets just rehide this darn thing and get on with it...

Mark..

P.S. I just dont like YELLING at Geocachers.

[This message was edited by Waterfall on September 14, 2003 at 04:49 PM.]

[This message was edited by Waterfall on September 14, 2003 at 05:47 PM.]

3k · September 14, 2003

I was saying that calling someone an idiot is not necessary even though they typed their comment in all caps.

The "insult was against us fellow geocachers" is not true and I think it was directed towards one person and not everyone who visited that cache. Regardless, it is what it is and I currently have an email into the TrashPickers to see what is up. Like I said they have disabled their cache and are in control since it is their cache. I don't think there is a reason to make a huge deal out of this since its not a big deal.

__________________________

Caching without a clue....

3k · September 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by pnew:
anybody who types a cache log in all caps is an idiot in my book. Maybe trashpickers should stop geocaching for a while until they are no longer a detriment to themselves...

I was refering to this post...

__________________________

Caching without a clue....

September 14, 2003

ok guys lets read the comment again:

September 2 by trashpickers (trashpickers) (14 found)

I LARGLEY BLAME THE CONDITION OF THIS CACHE ON IRRESPONDSIBLE GEOCACHERS!

THE LAST TIME I CHECKED UP ON THIS CACHE< IT WAS NOT IN ITS RIGHTFUL AREA AND HAD WRAPPERS IN IT!

DONT BLAME THIS ON PLUNDERS BECAUSE THIS OTHER CACHERS HAVE REPORTED IT MOVED!

PLEASE DO A BETTER JOB RETURNING THE CACHE TO WERE IT WAS FOUND!!!!!!

TRASHPICKERS

if the cacher knows anything about internet etiquite he was yelling and if he didn't know that its about time he learns. The excess "!!!!!" kind of gives it away.

He put his cache in a high traffic spot where most finders will be spotted by muggles incresing its chances of being stolen or plundered.

Then he turns around and blames cachers for not hiding it properly. I'm sure it was hidden adequately but someone was seen putting it back.

The cache setter is in the wrong. He's dead right about this cache being plundered by "IRRESPONDSIBLE GEOCACHERS" because he didn't hide it in a good enough spot.

I do agree that the long reply could have done by e-mail and not note on the cache page.

The insult was intended to no one other then trashpickers for their accustaory comments and quick and incorrect assumptions.

9.5k · September 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by opey one:
Sorry, UMC as I now see you are the "Great White Approver".

I hope to never achieve that status.

UMC has been a wealth of knowledge to me in the past, but I will refrain from posting any more in the near future.....

I hear alot of "yay's" from the back of the crowd.

Me too...

http://img.Groundspeak.com/user/48511_5100.JPG

Yup. That's MY goat!

Sometimes advisement is given best by example. Among other things, UMC is showing tact is the better part of discretion. As well, insulting vis-a-vis tit for tat, merely displays the same tactless reaction Trashpickers chose and does little more than reduce oneself in their peers eyes. We (as a group as well as individuals) can do better than that by patience, education, and the appeal for sensible solutions by dialogue rather than by insults be they warranted or not.

Cheers!

TL

September 14, 2003

As far as I've ever heard, Electric Shavers' logs are all bogus. I don't think anyone from that team, if it even exists, visited the cache.

9.5k · September 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Kite & Hawkeye:
As far as I've ever heard, Electric Shavers' logs are all bogus. I don't think anyone from that team, if it even exists, visited the cache.

What's your source? It appears to be an unfounded rumor from what I just looked through. I just read through some of the logs s/he/they found and the one's they have hidden and archived. Seems fairly active to me. The find logs are pretty generic, but I've seen worse and less verbose. Their activity is pretty current too.

Cheers!

TL

7.2k · September 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by TotemLake:

quote:
Originally posted by Kite & Hawkeye:
As far as I've ever heard, Electric Shavers' logs are all bogus. I don't think anyone from that team, if it even exists, visited the cache.

What's your source? It appears to be an unfounded rumor from what I just looked through. I just read through some of the logs s/he/they found and the one's they have hidden and archived. Seems fairly active to me. The find logs are pretty generic, but I've seen worse and less verbose. Their activity is pretty current too.

Cheers!

TL

TL, they logged my DC virtual cache and could not answer the question. I deleted their log long before this whole thing blew up with them recently. They have admitted "It certainly appears as though there has been some dishonesty on our end" in this topic. They have logged benchmarks, travel bugs and caches that they have not been to.

September 14, 2003

hey, trashpickers, pull the stick outta your @ss and chill. it's only a freakin cache. holy bejesus, you need psycho counciler, this is a game it's not the army. $hit happens, deal with it....... your respone to the cacher who reported your cache plundered was hilarious, i got some good laughs outta that. thanks for the entertainment.

Creativity Within The Bounds Of Conformity

September 14, 2003

While I may agree with what others have posted, I must say georapper spoke way out of turn. He stated "pull the stick outta your @ss", while I'm just guessing here that is not a great way to have people take you seriously. Yes it is a game and not the Army, if it had been the Army you'd have been thrown out long ago Georapper.

I see your lips moving but all I hear is blah blah blah

September 14, 2003

this entire discussion board can't be taken seriously and is a barrel of laughs.

Creativity Within The Bounds Of Conformity

September 14, 2003

I'm glad I now know where you stand Georapper. We shouldn't believe anything you post since its all a joke to you.

I see your lips moving but all I hear is blah blah blah

September 14, 2003

ohhh, did i offend your sense of political correctness by not parodying everyone else on this topic. that's just too freakin bad isn't it...... by the way, what the *ell do you know about the army. i served in desert storm I, in '90-'91 the US should have kicked iraq @ss the first time, it was because of sensitive, PC, whimps like you that we had to do it all over again, 10 years later.

Creativity Within The Bounds Of Conformity

September 14, 2003

Dude you really don't know me, I think we should have nuked the whole friggin country. PC is the last thing on my mind. I bet you were on the tail end of a blanket party or two with that attitude. You would have been in my Company anyway.

I see your lips moving but all I hear is blah blah blah

September 14, 2003

I just reread the entire thread and have to say sorry for taking it so off topic. Again I show my n00bnees to the masses. To georapper, if you want to persue the flame war e-mail me. To the rest of you sorry for the lapse in judgement, I'll try and not let it happen agein.

I see your lips moving but all I hear is blah blah blah

9.5k · September 14, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by mtn-man:

quote:
Originally posted by TotemLake:

quote:
Originally posted by Kite & Hawkeye:
As far as I've ever heard, Electric Shavers' logs are all bogus. I don't think anyone from that team, if it even exists, visited the cache.

What's your source? It appears to be an unfounded rumor from what I just looked through. I just read through some of the logs s/he/they found and the one's they have hidden and archived. Seems fairly active to me. The find logs are pretty generic, but I've seen worse and less verbose. Their activity is pretty current too.

Cheers!

TL

TL, they logged my DC virtual cache and could not answer the question. I deleted their log long before this whole thing blew up with them recently. They have admitted "It certainly appears as though there has been some dishonesty on our end" in http://ubbx.Groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=4016058331&m=16860738&r=16360248#16360248. They have logged benchmarks, travel bugs and caches that they have not been to.

Thanks for the pointer. I didn't pay attention to that particular thread.

Cheers!

TL

September 15, 2003

Hello,

ELECTRIC SHAVERS here.

True enough there was dishonesty on our end.

10 year old neice Neice crew member in DC went through & logged about 80 travel bugs by using consecutive numbers in late August. That had us having finds in Austrailia, England etc...

We deleted everything back to a Columbus trip that we had photos attached.

Since that time, we were banned from game from Geocaching.com except for cache maintence for dishonesty.

We didn't mean to be dishonest, but rules are rules & that's OK.

In southern OH we have had several, missing caches, stuff thrown around etc.

The average cacher is very "clean-up" oreiented & I don't think has anything to do with the problems outlined.

Most times, I think it's kids who take the good items & pitch the rest.

Occasionlly though, if you don't have permission to hide the cache, the park district will pull the cache & you aren't notified. This probably didn't happen here, as they never leave trash.

Thanks

ELECTRIC SHAVERS

September 15, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by ELECTRIC SHAVERS:
ELECTRIC SHAVERS here.

True enough there was dishonesty on our end.

10 year old neice Neice crew member in DC went through & logged about 80 travel bugs by using consecutive numbers in late August. That had us having finds in Austrailia, England etc...

We deleted everything back to a Columbus trip that we had photos attached.

Since that time, we were banned from game from Geocaching.com except for cache maintence for dishonesty.

We didn't mean to be dishonest, but rules are rules & that's OK.

Rather than passing the buck, you would do better spending your time deleting all your faked travel bug entries. And all your faked benchmark finds. And most of all, all your faked geocache finds. They number in the hundreds.

Don't tell us how remorseful you are. Show us. Take corrective action. "Actions speak louder than words."

9.5k · September 15, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by ELECTRIC SHAVERS:
Hello,

ELECTRIC SHAVERS here.

True enough there was dishonesty on our end.

10 year old neice Neice crew member in DC went through & logged about 80 travel bugs by using consecutive numbers in late August. That had us having finds in Austrailia, England etc...

We deleted everything back to a Columbus trip that we had photos attached.

Since that time, we were banned from game from Geocaching.com except for cache maintence for dishonesty.

We didn't mean to be dishonest, but rules are rules & that's OK.

In southern OH we have had several, missing caches, stuff thrown around etc.

The average cacher is very "clean-up" oreiented & I don't think has anything to do with the problems outlined.

Most times, I think it's kids who take the good items & pitch the rest.

Occasionlly though, if you don't have permission to hide the cache, the park district will pull the cache & you aren't notified. This probably didn't happen here, as they never leave trash.

Thanks

ELECTRIC SHAVERS

Ok. It sounds like you should disband the team and team name due to lack of credibility from lack of proper control.

But I'm curious. Why was the log deleted at this particular cache? Was this part of the log deletions you mentioned? Or... attempting to get away from the bad press? The timing is fairly coincidental.

Cheers!

TL

1.4k · September 15, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by ELECTRIC SHAVERS:
...we were banned from game from Geocaching.com except for cache maintence...

When do you plan on doing cache maintenance? There are a few of yours in Michigan that need some serious attention.

--------

trippy1976 - Team KKF2A

Assimilating golf balls - one geocache at a time.

This makes me MAD!!

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