Paperless Caching

[+Viridios]

I was wondering exactly how the paperless caching works. I have read up on what it says on the site, and on the forum, but I have not found it to be easy to understand. I understand the concept (I mean, paperless is pretty self-explanatory). What do you use? What software? Do you need something that hooks up to the GPSr? Do you need a premium membership? I am looking for something as inexpensive as possible (ie. no iPhone ).

 

Any suggestions on what to get, what to look at? As much detail as possible, and preferably in layman terms.

 

Thanks!

[+ventura_kids]

Hmm.... do you already have a gps?

That's gonna be required at some point.

Then you can try to use as little paper as possible.

The high end gps units can accept a download (premium member) with all the web page info in it.

The lower end units don't.

If you are getting a lower end (cheaper) unit, you will need to write down a few notes, or read the cache page before you head out to find a cache.

[+DarkBeer]

I use a Blackberry Storm and Cacheberry. I typically have databases of caches loaded into Cacheberry (created with geocaching.com pocket queries) if I know ahead of time that I will be in a particular area. I have also just downloaded a few gpx files and then email them to myself so I can import them on my Storm. Or I could use the browser on my Storm and download gpx files that way as well.

 

I don't go caching as often as I would like, but have found 75 so far with this combination and have been happy with it.

 

The negative to this approach would be the cost of the Blackberry and the data plan, but since these are provided by my employer, this became a cheap paperless solution for me

[+Okiebryan]

You said that you don't want to use a smartphone solution, so I'll tell you what I did BEFORE I got smartphone.

 

I have a Palm. One of the newer ones with an SD card and a color screen that doesn't wash out in the sun.

 

I have always had a premium membership, that is absolutely required to go paperless. I set up pocket queries by date placed, and get the entire state of Oklahoma in 13 PQs. I get these once a week, sent to a special gmail account that is used for nothing else.

 

Ok, with me so far? I use a program called GSAK to manage this database of about 5500 caches. GSAK is set up to go to this email account, download all of the PQs, then crunch through them and update my entire database.

 

Then, I clean up the database. Delete all of the caches that didn't get updated within the last week, as they are archived. Delete all the caches that have had DNFs for the last 3 logs. If they get found later, they will come back into the database next week. Now filter out all of my finds and hides.

 

Now export everything that is left (about 4000 caches) and run them through a couple of pieces of software that spin them into html pages and render them in a way that palm can read. This process took me typically 4 hours, but would not of you weren't dealing with such a large export.

 

Then I have access to the cache page of any cache I want to go after, while out in the field.

 

I got sick and tired of this process, and got a smartphone. Now I do all of the same GSAK stuff, but then export the 4000 caches to the SD card of my phone, tell Geobeagle (free app for android) to sync to the card. This takes 20 minutes, and I don't have to do anything during this 20 minutes.

 

Now I'm out on the field, open geobeagle, it uses the phone's GPS to determine my location. It opens a list of the caches within 10 miles or so, I choose one, then a navigation screen (compass) opens up and leads me to the cache. It also ties in with Google maps (if I have data service) and shows me where the cache is on a map.

 

I've now found over 200 caches with nothing but my phone and a pen to sign the log.

 

The phone cost $149, the phone service costs $75/mo with unlimited talk, text, and data. The app was free. GSAK was $10 several years ago, and the premium membership is...what? $30/yr?

[+sduck]

There are as many paperless solutions as there are people using them. It all depends on your tech savvy/tolerance, what gadgets you have/eschew, and your needs and wants.

 

Me - currently using an iphone with the geocaching app, and a garmin oregon 550t. Ad GSAK running on my mac for gpx organization, which is actually not really nessesary. I've used a variety of other solutions in the past also, depending on what combination of gizmos have been in my possesion at any given point.

[Keystone]

I am moving this thread from the Geocaching Topics forum to the GPS and Technology forum.

[+Viridios]

Hmm.... do you already have a gps?

That's gonna be required at some point.

Then you can try to use as little paper as possible.

The high end gps units can accept a download (premium member) with all the web page info in it.

The lower end units don't.

If you are getting a lower end (cheaper) unit, you will need to write down a few notes, or read the cache page before you head out to find a cache.

 

I do already have a GPS. That is how I discovered how badly it sucks to have to input all the coordinates. I currently have a Garmin Etrex Summit, and don't have the means to upgrade. I have thought about picking up a palm pilot, but I am concerned that the one I pick up won't be able to run the software needed to go paperless.

 

My goal is to download all the caches for my area, then when I am out and about on errands and have a few minutes, I can pull out my GPSr, see what caches are nearby, then consult the gizmo of choice for information on hints, parking, size, difficulty, etc. without having to have my laptop and a wireless connection.

[+Okiebryan]

Hmm.... do you already have a gps?

That's gonna be required at some point.

Then you can try to use as little paper as possible.

The high end gps units can accept a download (premium member) with all the web page info in it.

The lower end units don't.

If you are getting a lower end (cheaper) unit, you will need to write down a few notes, or read the cache page before you head out to find a cache.

 

I do already have a GPS. That is how I discovered how badly it sucks to have to input all the coordinates. I currently have a Garmin Etrex Summit, and don't have the means to upgrade. I have thought about picking up a palm pilot, but I am concerned that the one I pick up won't be able to run the software needed to go paperless.

 

My goal is to download all the caches for my area, then when I am out and about on errands and have a few minutes, I can pull out my GPSr, see what caches are nearby, then consult the gizmo of choice for information on hints, parking, size, difficulty, etc. without having to have my laptop and a wireless connection.

 

GSAK is the way to go as far as getting caches into your GPS easily. On a separate note, which cell phone carrier are you on?

Edited November 5, 2009 by Okiebryan

[+Viridios]

Hmm.... do you already have a gps?

That's gonna be required at some point.

Then you can try to use as little paper as possible.

The high end gps units can accept a download (premium member) with all the web page info in it.

The lower end units don't.

If you are getting a lower end (cheaper) unit, you will need to write down a few notes, or read the cache page before you head out to find a cache.

 

I do already have a GPS. That is how I discovered how badly it sucks to have to input all the coordinates. I currently have a Garmin Etrex Summit, and don't have the means to upgrade. I have thought about picking up a palm pilot, but I am concerned that the one I pick up won't be able to run the software needed to go paperless.

 

My goal is to download all the caches for my area, then when I am out and about on errands and have a few minutes, I can pull out my GPSr, see what caches are nearby, then consult the gizmo of choice for information on hints, parking, size, difficulty, etc. without having to have my laptop and a wireless connection.

 

Which cell phone carrier are you on?

 

I am on Rogers

[+Team CowboyPapa]

Here is another option:

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=235249

[+Maingray]

Using a single paperless unit, here is my usual way:

 

Premium membership on gc.com for the pocket queries.

 

Continuous offline database of 100 mile radius of unfound caches in GSAK

 

- why? For immediate use and it keeps a record of solved puzzles, updated co-ordinates, DNF attempts etc. Can use to quickly sort out, for example, mutual unfound caches for a caching group.

 

Send targeted caches from GSAK-> Oregon 300 GPS unit (max of 2,000 caches at one time on the unit, full information plus GPS icons modified by GSAK to illustrate cache size, solved puzzle etc)

 

Use the unit to route to caches by road, read past logs on the cache, cache description etc in the field. Use the unit to log find / DNF etc on the unit, upload to the gc.com website for later logging.

[+twolpert]

Let's get back to basics for a second. There are four fundamental ways (with lots of variations) to go paperless. All of these (except the smart phone solution) require purchase of premium membership to enable bulk download of cache data (via pocket queries).

 

1) A handheld GPSr which has the functionality baked in. With this kind of unit, you can download all the information from the cache page -- name, D/T rating, description, hint, several recent logs -- to the unit and view it there. The only thing that is typically missing is pictures. Most such units also permit you to log your find on the unit and later upload that info to gc.com to serve as the basis for your log. The software required, if any, to get the information to the unit varies according to manufacturer (and personal preference). Units in this category (not an exhaustive list) include Garmin Colorado, Oregon and Dakota; DeLorme PN-series. Handheld GPSrs are rugged, have generally good performance. Number of caches the unit will hold is large but limited (varies by manufacturer and model).

 

2) Cell phone with built-in GPSr, data plan, and browser access. With this solution, you do everything online. Gives you the ability to view any cache page (albeit on a small screen) and log your finds in real time. Doesn't work where there is no cell phone coverage. Phones tend to be more fragile than handheld GPSrs, and GPS performance may not be as good.

 

3) Combined low-end handheld GPSr and PDA. Download the cache coordinates to the GPSr. Download the cache descriptions to the PDA. Use both together in the field. Solutions tend to be cheap (especially with a used PDA). You have to carry both devices. Getting the descriptions onto the PDA can be a bit of a hassle. Usually no assistance for uploading and logging your finds.

 

4) Combined handheld (without paperless baked in) and GSAK software. Use GSAK to massage the cache description, squishing the information you really need into the limited space available for descriptions on the GPSr. This is a favorite solution of veteran cachers who got into it before the advent of truly paperless units. Lacks full cache information, but does give you the basics. Reasonably easy to use once you get GSAK set up the way you want. No assistance for uploading and logging your finds. Can probably get by with a GPSr which is cheaper than a true paperless unit. Typically used with higher-end GPSrs like Garmin 60Csx.

 

It's all a matter of taste. The simplest solution overall tends to be either the truly paperless GPSr or the smart phone solution. But lots of veteran cachers swear by GPSr/PDA or GPSr/GSAK.

 

Edited because I can't spell or proof-read.

Edited November 5, 2009 by twolpert

[+Team CowboyPapa]

How reasonable is the second if I'm but 3 months into a 2 year contract, at $50/month, with a non-smart, non-GPS cellphone and/or my carrier does not have a download map option?

And the early cancellation penalty is YMMV?

 

...just sayin'.......

Edited November 5, 2009 by Team CowboyPapa

[+IBcrashen]

I have thought about picking up a palm pilot, but I am concerned that the one I pick up won't be able to run the software needed to go paperless.

 

Dont be to concerned about this. Every PP made will run any software I ever used for geocaching just fine. And memory size never came close into play.

The big deal on PP is the visibility out in sunlight. Most colored screens do just fine and gray screens might take your hand to shade some.

Software. You can go GSAK, Cachemate. Or the free route using Plucker or Sun and GPX2HTML, Watcher if you have combine PQ`s.

[+dakin55]

Cheapest solution I found for the wife was buy a BB ( 8330 built in gps) has a bad ESN on EBAY so no good as a phone but the GPS and paperess feature worked fine. I use a 8330 personaly and it works great her gps sometimes doesn't work the best so we have an old etrex that she breaks out if it is acting up.

[+soloyo]

I take it from a previous post that a Palm Pilot M500 which I can pick up pretty cheap on eBay will work. I was afraid to buy it and then find out it wouldn't work for downloading caching information. Should I not be concern about this. Any information about this is appreciated Thanks

[+dakin55]

Not sure what apps there are for the palm but I use cacheberry for the BB. I have heard of people using them but I do not have any experience myself I think I also seen reference to using an ipod but again never really looked indepth into these options.

[+EScout]

An excellent paperless device not yet mentioned is an inexpensive car GPS such as a Garmin Nuvi 205 or 255. These are easy to load with huge numbers of geocaches and contain the full cache info, hints, logs. There is the added bonus that they will route you to the cache. Check the auction site for really low prices on these.

[+dakin55]

An excellent paperless device not yet mentioned is an inexpensive car GPS such as a Garmin Nuvi 205 or 255. These are easy to load with huge numbers of geocaches and contain the full cache info, hints, logs. There is the added bonus that they will route you to the cache. Check the auction site for really low prices on these.

Yes they look ok juust add a "map" bag for wet days to keep the unit dry.I was doing some reading in this thread

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=202439

and want to thank you because I think I now know what I will get my wife for xmas she could use a GPS for the car and check it out for caching as well.

WOW just got a refurbished 255w for $129 hope she will be happy I am.

Edited November 6, 2009 by dakin55

[+Viridios]

So from what I can gather from everyone, I just need to buy a device that can connect with the computer, and there will probably be software out there for it...

 

I think I'll look for a Palm Pilot III or V. We have a discount store here with refurbished items, and they have things for dirt cheap. I just have to find the time (and the money... Ah, the life of a student ).

 

Thanks for all your help!

[+moosehadley]

Ever since I started geocaching, all my finds have been paperless.

 

I simply download all the coordinates for my area, then when I have some free time, go out find one.

 

I've never needed the page for a geocache... I don't understand why other people need them...

 

And yes, I have a low-end GPS that ONLY tells you where it is, and doesn't have any other information than the GC number.

[+Tippi2]

An excellent paperless device not yet mentioned is an inexpensive car GPS such as a Garmin Nuvi 205 or 255. These are easy to load with huge numbers of geocaches and contain the full cache info, hints, logs. There is the added bonus that they will route you to the cache. Check the auction site for really low prices on these.

 

So I can buy one of these and just plug it into Groundspeak and hit send to GPS and it will download everything? I have an Etrex Vista HCX but would love to have a Car GPS that I can program coordinates into and some details.....do you know how many caches it will hold? If not do you know where I could find out.....this would be the best way to go for me......WOW thanks

Edited November 9, 2009 by Tippi2

[+IBcrashen]

An excellent paperless device not yet mentioned is an inexpensive car GPS such as a Garmin Nuvi 205 or 255. These are easy to load with huge numbers of geocaches and contain the full cache info, hints, logs. There is the added bonus that they will route you to the cache. Check the auction site for really low prices on these.

 

So I can buy one of these and just plug it into Groundspeak and hit send to GPS and it will download everything? I have an Etrex Vista HCX but would love to have a Car GPS that I can program coordinates into and some details.....do you know how many caches it will hold? If not do you know where I could find out.....this would be the best way to go for me......WOW thanks

It will hold the same info that your Vista HCX will. You use GSAK and this macro.

[+twolpert]

The downside to the Nuvi solution (except for the one model, whose number escapes me, that is somewhat designed for hand-held use) is that the units tend to be fragile and not water-resistant. Not to mention awkward to carry.

 

They also lack the geocaching-specific workflows provided by the units which have paperless caching baked in. But they certainly do qualify as a paperless solution using the available GSAK macros.

[+soarfoot]

Now export everything that is left (about 4000 caches) and run them through a couple of pieces of software that spin them into html pages and render them in a way that palm can read. This process took me typically 4 hours, but would not of you weren't dealing with such a large export.

 

What software do you use to "spin them into html pages and render them in a way that palm can read"

 

I have a palm m515 with a 1G sd card. I can't figure out how to do this.

 

CAN YOU HELP PLEASE?

 

soarfoot

[+IBcrashen]

 

What software do you use to "spin them into html pages and render them in a way that palm can read"

 

I have a palm m515 with a 1G sd card. I can't figure out how to do this.

 

CAN YOU HELP PLEASE?

 

soarfoot

GPX2HTML (free) and Plucker (free) for desktop and palm will do it.

[+mrreet]

I just generate a Pocket Query GPX file/files for my area... copy it / them to my Garmin Dakota 20 ... then upload the txt file when I get home.

 

Why complicate things with extra steps, extra devices and extra software?

[+soarfoot]

 

What software do you use to "spin them into html pages and render them in a way that palm can read"

 

I have a palm m515 with a 1G sd card. I can't figure out how to do this.

 

CAN YOU HELP PLEASE?

 

soarfoot

GPX2HTML (free) and Plucker (free) for desktop and palm will do it.

 

OK, I've got the two softwares downloaded."GTX2HTML, and Plucker. I have some how created some HTML files from some cache pages. loaded into my folder that holds the GTX2HTML file. NOW, I can't figure out how to get these HTML files into the Palm m515. The palm software does not have a HTML file type for downloading. Can you lead me to a tutorial about all of this? I'm using a Garmin 60CSx, but would like to take all the notes with me on the Palm m515.

 

Thanks,

soarfoot

[+IBcrashen]

OK, I've got the two softwares downloaded."GTX2HTML, and Plucker. I have some how created some HTML files from some cache pages. loaded into my folder that holds the GTX2HTML file. NOW, I can't figure out how to get these HTML files into the Palm m515. The palm software does not have a HTML file type for downloading. Can you lead me to a tutorial about all of this? I'm using a Garmin 60CSx, but would like to take all the notes with me on the Palm m515.

 

Thanks,

soarfoot

 

Its been a while since I have done this so hope I get it right. E-mail me if need more help, I will try.

 

You will need to download and install Plucker desktop and the software for the palm pilot and install both.

Next run plucker desktop and create a new channel. For this either go to file or click the first button. Name it what ever you want.

On the channel window that opens on the starting tab select the "local file" radio button and point it to your index.html file in the HTML folder that GPX2html created.

On the spidering tab I have mine set to depth of 2.

On the formatting tab pick what color you want your hyperlinks to be on your palm pilot.

On the destination tab pick your hand held and also where you want the file to go. If I remember right Plucker will automatic set it so it will be ready to install on your next hotsync.

Then run plucker, the fifth button.

Next attach your palm and perform a hotsync.

 

Dont worry, once you have the channel set up all you have to do from then on is run gpx2html, then plucker and then hotsync.

If you do want to combine gpx files you can use Watcher (free) first and then do the process.

Edited November 10, 2009 by IBcrashen

[RodekillZ]

Howdy all, First post in the Forums... Paperless navigation/ Geocaching... WOW!!! Never woulda thought it 10- 15 years ago

 

Paperless is pretty cool... In reality it is just easier and saves time posting, logging etc..

But I guess I'm old fashioned... I am a bit of a techie... But when it comes to Navigation I have held off for as long as possible to not buy a GPS... (Finally did to get my kids interested in the outdoors)

 

I've been using them for almost 20 years courtesy of the military.. But I learned long ago Mapreading and navigating with a compass is a perishable skill... It is just kinda hard to find a cache off of a USGS 1:64,000 or 1:24,000 map... Done it, but is a bit slower..... And far from paperless..

 

I guess what I am trying to say that all of us here like/ love navigating in the outdoors.... It just pains me a bit to think How many people can use a GPS but have no clue how to terrain associate by a map or what a declination diagram is.... etc..

 

I know, I know... I need to shut up and go to Orienteering.org and stop ranting...

 

Don't get me wrong, GPS have their place..... And are much easier to navigate by then map and compass...

 

I guess what I am trying to say is.. I have crossed over the fence and embraced the GPS gods... But I still hold dear... my Silva compass and USGS maps...... I think some of ya might enjoy orienteering.. If so, check it out... I won't post the web site here .. bad etiquette I would think... Easy to google and figure out..

Edited November 10, 2009 by RodekillZ

[+Viridios]

Howdy all, First post in the Forums... Paperless navigation/ Geocaching... WOW!!! Never woulda thought it 10- 15 years ago

 

Paperless is pretty cool... In reality it is just easier and saves time posting, logging etc..

But I guess I'm old fashioned... I am a bit of a techie... But when it comes to Navigation I have held off for as long as possible to not buy a GPS... (Finally did to get my kids interested in the outdoors)

 

I've been using them for almost 20 years courtesy of the military.. But I learned long ago Mapreading and navigating with a compass is a perishable skill... It is just kinda hard to find a cache off of a USGS 1:64,000 or 1:24,000 map... Done it, but is a bit slower..... And far from paperless..

 

I guess what I am trying to say that all of us here like/ love navigating in the outdoors.... It just pains me a bit to think How many people can use a GPS but have no clue how to terrain associate by a map or what a declination diagram is.... etc..

 

I know, I know... I need to shut up and go to Orienteering.org and stop ranting...

 

Don't get me wrong, GPS have their place..... And are much easier to navigate by then map and compass...

 

I guess what I am trying to say is.. I have crossed over the fence and embraced the GPS gods... But I still hold dear... my Silva compass and USGS maps...... I think some of ya might enjoy orienteering.. If so, check it out... I won't post the web site here .. bad etiquette I would think... Easy to google and figure out..

 

I might work with a GPS most of the time, but after 13 years of boy scouts, I know 3 things never to go into the bush without:

 

1) Knife (I love my Swiss Army)

2) Map

3) Compass

 

It is just too easy for batteries to die, which can lead to other things dying. Like me...