Need A Gps That Darn-near Laughs At Tree Cover...

[+Sparrowhawk]

OK, I am now officially completely annoyed with my Map 330. Just a bit of tree cover, and it goes COMPLETELY deaf. Time to look for a handheld that can handle a normal Pacific NW forest. I know that getting a unit with an external antenna socket is the first thing to know... what else should I know? And what are the most recommended units in various price ranges?

 

Thanks in advance for any help...

[+Team GPSaxophone]

My Etrex Venture works ok most of the time

[+-=(GEO)=-]

My MeriPlat does not loose lock that easily in those Pacific NW forests that you speak about. I would highly recommend it.

[+Doc-Dean]

My Magellan Meridian GPS does well in the bush.

 

 

[+shunra]

So does my Magellan Blazer 12. I'll sell it after Christmas :-))

[+ShaneN4Girls]

I've had much better luck with my Rino 120 (Quad-helix antenna) than my buddies with there different E-Trex and Map GPSr's (patch antenna). Don't know much about specifics, but the Quad-helix antenna seems to work better.

[umc]

Well, you asked for opinions.

 

Here is mine.

 

My first GPS (5yrs ago) was the Lowrance Global Map 100. I still own this gps and have to say that it amazes me at how well it will get lock under heavy cover and hold it. It out shines my Garmin GPS V in this area hands down. As a matter of fact, I carry it as a spare and have had to use it when my V didn't know which way was up before. V wouldn't see but a bird or two (if that) I would pull out the GM 100 and get lock in the same spot the V lost it and the GM100 would hold it steady the rest of the time.

 

I know someone else that has a GM100 and has the same story as me. Its a great unit that holds lock like nothing I've ever seen before and has some great features to boot.

 

Don't ask me why I don't use it as my main gps as I don't know.

[umc]

I've had much better luck with my Rino 120 (Quad-helix antenna) than my buddies with there different E-Trex and Map GPSr's (patch antenna). Don't know much about specifics, but the Quad-helix antenna seems to work better.

I'm going to have to say apples to oranges here because I've had the opposite experience. I'm sure the pro's and con's of both types of antennas can be argued all day here along with what everyone thinks works better. Further more I'm sure that some patch antennas work better than others as I'm sure the same is true with the quadrifiliar helix.

[gm100guy]

Well, you asked for opinions.

 

Here is mine.

 

My first GPS (5yrs ago) was the Lowrance Global Map 100. I still own this gps and have to say that it amazes me at how well it will get lock under heavy cover and hold it. It out shines my Garmin GPS V in this area hands down. As a matter of fact, I carry it as a spare and have had to use it when my V didn't know which way was up before. V wouldn't see but a bird or two (if that) I would pull out the GM 100 and get lock in the same spot the V lost it and the GM100 would hold it steady the rest of the time.

 

I know someone else that has a GM100 and has the same story as me. Its a great unit that holds lock like nothing I've ever seen before and has some great features to boot.

 

Don't ask me why I don't use it as my main gps as I don't know.

what he said my gm100 has never let me down yet.

[+Right Wing Wacko]

As long as the GPSr has an external antenna port, you can add one of those amplified 28db Gain antenna's that are available from GPSGEEK and other sites. Just velcro the antenna on top of your hat and plug it into your GPSr. Note that your battery life will drop.

 

Note, the cheap $20 antenna's seem to be BETTER than the one that Garmin sells for $100!

[+GeckoGeek]

Something to keep in mind that with the extra gain comes the risk that you may not be seeing a signal coming though the trees, but something bounced off the rock cliffs a distance away and coming in under the treeline. That will cause a rather signficant error in the GPS reading - and the GPS won't know it's wrong.

 

After all, GPS is still radio signals, and radio signals do bounce.

[gpsaccessories]

Wacko is right- those gps geek antennas will do the job but they'll also draw down your batteries. the gpsaccessories antenna draws less than half as much power, and gives 33+dba of boost.

Garmin factory antennas are outdated and overpriced. Trimble has pretty good OEM antennas, otherwise aftermarket is the way to go.

 

GG- I've been testing all sorts of amplified antennas for 7 years in lots of situations and never seen anything like what you describe. I suppose it might be possible for ONE signal from ONE sat to bounce off a distant object, but your reciever uses more than that one signal, it'll see several birds through the trees and off the horizon in other directions. In a poor coverage area with a decent amp antenna you should expect strong signal from atleast 5-6 sats at any given time. Those stronger, consistent signals will be used to factor your location.

The closest thing you should see in real life is if you are in a cave or tunnel, might pick up stray signals from both ends of the tunnel, and with no other info it'll factor a location that may be a few hundred feet off, but that isn't really a bad thing if you understand that a non amplified gps in the same situation would loose position entirely.

-Ed

[+GeckoGeek]

The closest thing you should see in real life is if you are in a cave or tunnel, might pick up stray signals from both ends of the tunnel, and with no other info it'll factor a location that may be a few hundred feet off,

What about a cave with only one entrance? If you got a signal, wouldn't it give the position of the mouth with the altitude off by the distance you are away from the mouth?

 

but that isn't really a bad thing if you understand that a non amplified GPS in the same situation would loose position entirely.

 

Depends on your situation. Some may argue it's better to be right then to show something wrong and mislead the user. Others may say it's better to have something "in the neighborhood" then to be totally lost.

[+Team BlackZ]

I have a Garmin GPS V and have been in some pretty thick cover, never had any trouble with it. I'm not sure about the pacific NW forests, but i've been in heavy pine trees on cloudy rainy days, and never lost signal.

Edited November 24, 2003 by Team BlackZ

[McKenzie Clan]

I'll throw in my $0.02 (Canadian :-)...

 

I started off using a borrowed Garmin Legend and lost sat. signal in trees several times while searching - frustrating!

 

Since I have been using my Magellan SporTrak Map I have never lost signal once!

 

Now, it might be related to that fact that it is fall now and all the leaves are off the trees, but I have been caching in some serious evergreens and been OK.

 

I guess next summer I will have the final answer.

 

Scott

[+CurmudgeonlyGal]

Time to look for a handheld that can handle a normal Pacific NW forest.

I've only been hunting for two-point-five months now, and started out with a eTrex Legend. It took me approximately three weeks to get so completely and totally fed up with the eTrex that I shelled out the dough and went for something with a different antenna and sold the Legend on eBay.

 

I live up the road a piece from you, near the southern edge of the Olympic National Forest (temperate rainforest for those who don't know the area) and to say we have trees is something of an understatement. Some days it seems as if EVERYTHING is in the trees!

 

I've used three different GPSr's in the ensuing weeks, and have found myself with the GPS V as my main squeeze. Night and day difference for me in the type of caching I have been doing. It works just as well in urban situations - where I'm sure the Legend would also do a wonderful job - but I can go under reasonably heavy cover and still hold lock. YES it does drop coverage from time to time, but it also recovers very quickly if I get into a spot where it can see the sky well enough (which doesn't mean it has to be totally open.)

 

I often cache with a friend who is using an eTrex Yellow and he often ends up not even bothering to use his unit b/c he knows it's slipped into a peaceful oblivion about 20 feet into the forest.

 

I also have a Garmin GPSmap76S that works similarly well. Nice big screen on this bruiser with the same good quality resolution I'm finding myself to be VERY fond of on the Garmin units.

 

The other unit I used for about three weeks was a MeriPlat. It did a fabulous job under tree cover as well and I fell in love with the compass - verra slick. It has a bearing arrow and an indicator as to where the cache is - your mission, should you choose to accept it - is to get the two to line up and you're heading the right way. I ended up returning the THIRD unit I had (the first two were faulty which didn't impress me overmuch) and going with the 76S for a number of reasons. (Most of which were due to layout design of buttons (76S and V are quite alike in this regard so it was easy to switch between the two) and then I can use the same maps, same cords, a little less slingshot effect in the Garmins, blah blah blah.)

 

Send me an e if you want to talk in more specifics, Sparrowhawk. I know EXACTLY what you're dealing with! I LOVE the evergreen trees (I've lived without for 7 years and missed them desperately) but some days I'd like to be carrying a big chainsaw in with me!

 

-=-

michelle

[Cracker.]

Too funny!

 

I was going to reply that my Map330 is awesome at holding lock in tree cover, as compared to my Merigreen and Sportrak Map. I was kinda surprised that you HAVE a Map330 and are complaining of this problem....

 

It also seemed to hold MUCH better than the Garmin's other people had when I was caching with them under cover. (Couldnt tell you the Garmin models, I dont remember)....

 

As far as the receiver function goes, i have always noticed my Map330 holds lock better under cover, seems to find one or two more sats, and seems to get stronger signals than either my Merigreen or Sportrak Map....

[+GeckoGeek]

Something to consider is the type of trees and the seasons. I'm sure some types of trees are going to be better "blockers" then others. Likewise the moisture content in the leaves will have a major effect. I wouldn't be too surprised to see a different effect depending on how recent the rain as been - worse if the leaves are still wet with the last rain.

 

However, I would expect all GPS units to be similarly affected - that is I don't think we'll find Garmin is better under spruce and Magellen better under pine.

[+Sparrowhawk]

Thanks for all the good advice.

 

My Map 330 has pulled a new trick since my starting this thread: it thinks I am consistently 400 feet NW of wherever I am at. ARRRGGH! THAT's it...!

 

Yeah... shoulda bought an extended warranty... shoulda kept a receipt... ah well.

 

Times like this, whenever I have serious frustration with a device, after I replace it, I have a certain routine. I turn it over to a gun collector friend of mine, and he gets to play target practice on it for me. There's something extremely satisfying about that thought...

 

I will be without a GPS until January... I figure that the prices will have to drop after Christmas with the sales and such.

Edited November 29, 2003 by Sparrowhawk

[+blindleader]

Don't worry too much about whether the unit you get has an external antenna connection. I use a reradiating antenna with my Merigreen whenever going under the trees. It might cost a few dollars more than the antenna alone, but it’s a lot cheaper than a new gpsr.