nevermind the date.

4.7k · April 1, 2003

i'd like to say this is a joke, but PLEASE don't put live ammo in caches. i'm not even particularly comfortable removing live ammo.

and now that i've GOT one live shotgun shell, what do i do with it? where does one safely dispose of these things?

you folks who own firearms must know what the guidelines are. i know where to dispose of tires and batteries, but i'm not even sure whom to ask about the shell.

and given the current state of affairs, i'm not sure how to ask my local law enforcement what to do with it. i just know i probably don't want to toss it in the dumpster.

any help? i'm sorry about the timeing, but these goofy april fool threads reminded me i've got it in my pack.

it doesn't matter if you get to camp at one or at six. dinner is still at six.

April 1, 2003

If it's a 12 gauge, buy a Remington 870. It's an excellent upland bird gun. You can get different length barrels for the thing. Seriously, just take the thing to a local police station, they'll fire it off at a range or dispose of it by cutting the top off and dumping the powder out.

April 1, 2003

Turn it over to the police and tell them you found it in woods or wherever the cache is. There is no need to explain why you were there or what you were doing.

Or, try taking it to a local gun shop or shooting range and giving it to them. The range especially would be equipped to handle mis-fires and other live ammo.

I would not give it to 'a friend that has a gun' unless that friend was a recognized firearms expert.

RichardMoore

www.geocities.com/richardsrunaway

April 1, 2003

It's not as if it's ordinance or anything.

Something that small, simply throw it away. It's not any more dangerous than a mostly empty can of Lysol or hair spray. It's no more environmently damaging than most of the rest of the trash. It's not going to go off unless there is very high heat or a sharp rap on the primer.

Don't be afraid of it, just throw it away with the rest of your trash.

1.5k · April 1, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by SE7EN:
It's not as if it's _ordinance_ or anything.

Something that small, simply throw it away. It's not any more dangerous than a mostly empty can of Lysol or hair spray. It's no more environmently damaging than most of the rest of the trash. It's not going to go off unless there is very high heat or a sharp rap on the primer.

Don't be afraid of it, just throw it away with the rest of your trash.

Please, please tell me that was your idea of an April Fools Day joke????

April 1, 2003

First get a hammer....No really cut the top off, dump the lead, soak the powder in water. Just dont hit the metal bottom in the center.

Rino 110

MeriGreen 128

April 1, 2003

I pretty sure gun powder is fine after it dries, so there is no real use in getting it wet. But its kind of cool if you light it on fire (spread it around a little, do this out side). It pretty slow burning, so its kind of cool to whatch.

Wyatt W.

The probability of someone watching you is directly proportional to the stupidity of your actions.

2.5k · April 1, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by tirediron:

quote:
Originally posted by SE7EN:
It's not as if it's _ordinance_ or anything.

Something that small, simply throw it away. It's not any more dangerous than a mostly empty can of Lysol or hair spray. It's no more environmently damaging than most of the rest of the trash. It's not going to go off unless there is very high heat or a sharp rap on the primer.

Don't be afraid of it, just throw it away with the rest of your trash.

Please, please tell me that was your idea of an April Fools Day joke????

It's probably safe to say that the shell without the shotgun is not likely to accidentally hurt you. Not too say that you couldn't hurt yourself if you wanted to though.

I always laugh when I hear stories about how dangerous it is to store ammo, in case there is a fire. You really need the gun barrel to get any kind of velocity.

April 1, 2003

Water will degrade smokeless gun powder as well as blackpowder, pryodex, cleanshot, clearshot and so on. Shotgun powder is not a slow burner. Most are on the top of the burn rate chart. It will flash rather than burn.

Rino 110

MeriGreen 128

April 1, 2003

(I always laugh when I hear stories about how dangerous it is to store ammo, in case there is a fire. You really need the gun barrel to get any kind of velocity.)

Enough to kill you!!

Rino 110

MeriGreen 128

April 1, 2003

I say again, let a professional handle it. Every 4th of July you hear about kids getting hurt with firecrackers. How much gunpowder is in one of those compared to a shotgun cartridge?

'Just..' and 'probably..' don't belong in a conversation when the topic is safety.

RichardMoore

www.geocities.com/richardsrunaway

4.4k · April 1, 2003

Save your bullets you may needum some day..

WHEN ALL ELSE FAILS *GEOTRYAGAIN* http://www.msnusers.com/MissouriTrails

2.7k · April 1, 2003

people fear most what they don't understand.

This would be a good excuse to take a hunter safety course through your state DNR or a shooting class through your local gun shop.

You just might find yourself a new and enjoyable hobby and get rid of your shell as it was intended- shoot it.

BTW You are absolutely correct that this should not have ever been put in a cache.

GDAE, Dave

April 1, 2003

Sheesh! Stop it with the paronia. If you want to be afraid of something really dangerous, you wouldn't be driving.

No, I wasn't fooling. Just throw it away.

...and stop being so paranoid!

2.5k · April 1, 2003

ammo in fires

4.7k · April 2, 2003

i'm not being paranoid.

i simply have NO EXPERIENCE with live ammo (or ammo at all) and because of that i thought it would be good to get disposal advice from people who know.

to all of you who gave actual advice, thank you. i have an idea of what i'm doing and am comfortable now.

to those of you who told me to lighten up, i say that anytime i find anything i don't know what it is and how it works or if it might be dangerous, i'm coming over to your house to try it out. maybe your five-year old will help?

and i don't think live ammo belongs in caches. well, maybe macijman's stump remover cache. but that's it. no live ammo, no working firearms, no DIY explosives, and NO HOTEL SOAPS!

it doesn't matter if you get to camp at one or at six. dinner is still at six.

1.5k · April 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by SE7EN:
Sheesh! Stop it with the paronia. If you want to be afraid of something really dangerous, you wouldn't be driving.

No, I wasn't fooling. Just throw it away.

...and stop being so paranoid!

I realize that these forums are an open venue, and that everyone has the right to voice an opinion, informed or otherwise. I do not believe however, that anyone should be entitled to advocate dangerous or illegal activity. Since I don’t exactly where you are located, I can’t say for sure, but I am willing to bet that just like in all provinces in Canada, improper disposal of Category 1.3D Explosives (ammunition) is a criminal offence in your state.

Why do you feel the need to belittle someone because they are hesitant to deal with material about which they are not overly familiar? Granted, ammunition properly stored and handled is very safe, and that even if it is mis-handled, the risk is relatively low, but why take a chance? A quick search on the ‘net will reveal thousands on injuries occurring as a result of use, both proper and improper, with ammunition, and other low-grade explosives.

A short drive to your local law-enforcement agency will remove the problem completely and safely. Better still, if I find any ammunition in caches, I will mail it to you, and you can give it your children to play with, or toss it in the fireplace for disposal?

April 2, 2003

TiredIron, I never intended to belittle anyone, but your referenced quote was response to someone thinking so little of my previous response. No need to quote here--just look up.

So, out of curiosity, I took 60 seconds and called my local sheriff's office. I asked, "Hey, I'm trying to settle a dispute between a buddy and me. Say we were out in the middle of the woods and found a shotgun shell--unfired. Can we just throw it away or is there something special we have to do?"

"Chuck it," was his response with a slight chuckle.

"Just toss it?"

"Yep"

So, there you have it. At least in this part of the woods, disposal of a single unfired shell is a simple as throwing it away.

But, to ease your mind, look up the number to your local law enforcement and ask them. Spend the minute or two to find out what the requirements are in your area. Maybe you do have special requirements, maybe you don't. But then you'd know.

Also, let us know the final resolution. I'm curious.

1.5k · April 2, 2003

Well, it seems you may live in a unique part of the US. I contacted both the regional police for the area in which I live, and the Federal Police (RCMP). From both the answer was the same.

It is a crimminal offence to improperly dispose of ANY explosive material. It may be brought to the nearest police station, OR they will pick it up from your residence.

Interestingly enough, a telephone conversation to the South Portland Barracks of the Maine State Police brought forward a similar response (although they did not volunteer to come and pick it up). The individual to whom I spoke clearly indicated that in the state of Maine, it was an offence to dispose of ammunition in the manner you suggest, and further indicated, that to the best of his knowledge, this was the case in all US States.

I submit that the person to whom you spoke was simply taking an "easy way out" because in his view, there was little chance of damage or injury from such an occurrence.

April 2, 2003

When I have old rounds I want to get rid of, and I am not going to the range. I just hand them to a policeman or Law Enforcement person. The can "Throw" it where ever.

April 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by tirediron:
It is a crimminal offence to improperly dispose of ANY explosive material. It may be brought to the nearest police station, OR they will pick it up from your residence.

Ah, but that's the thing. It certainly should be illegal to do something that is against the law. That's a no brainer.

My question would have been, is it improper/illegal to throw a single unspent shell into the household garbage?

Is that what they said? Is the only way to dispose of a single, or very few, live cartridges is to deliver them to the local law enforcement facility? What could be the alternatives to legally dispose of said materials?

Still curious.

April 2, 2003

Actually, the last time someone left a hydrogen bomb in one of my caches, it was much appreciated!

You see, I had this pesky neighbor who just wouldn't turn his music down at night... well, I HAD a neighbor...

--majicman

20.7k · April 2, 2003

I thought that the question was answered. There appear to be a number of appropriate places to take the item. A partial list of these may be the police (or other law enforcement), perhaps the fire department, gun shops, shooting ranges, etc.

April 2, 2003

Well, I think the issue now is if it could be thrown in the household trash.

Just got off the phone with my state's law enforcement department. I again asked the question similar to above and the agent said that he knew of no law of disposing of a single shell. He'd simply toss it in the trash.

I did talk to a local gun shop that teaches self defense and CCW classes to get your CCW permit and he said he wouldn't toss it in the trash, but didn't know of any law that prevented it. He could certainly take it off our hands and dispose of it.

So, it appears to be unclear what the LAW is here, but two law enforcement personel, one county and one state, said they'd simply toss in the trash.

But if it makes you feel more comfortable, take it to any of the places sbell111 listed.

BTW, we've taken live ammo out of a cache, too. I think I still have it in my catch-all bowl.

1.5k · April 2, 2003

quote:
My question would have been, is it improper/illegal to throw a single unspent shell into the household garbage?

As per my previous post:

quote:
improperly dispose of ANY explosive material

Ok, at the risk of perpetuating a now rather pointless thread, I just had to ask this: How do you manage to define “any” in such a manner that the quantity of one is not included?

This may help

April 2, 2003

I use black powder for rocket ejection charges. I once considered using the "smokeless" powders, but found they were much less effective for this application.

Apparently the smokeless powders really need to be under quite a bit of pressure in order to really get going. Without pressure, it really doesn't do much.

I probably wouldn't throw one in the trash myself, but I wouldn't be too worried about it if I did.

George

April 2, 2003

Okay, TI, you got me on the ANY part.

However, I did call up to the Maine State Troop G headquarters. The gentleman I spoke to was of the mind that it wouldn't be a good idea to throw it in the trash. His reason wasn't for the fact that it's illegal--he couldn't say that it was--but for liability reasons. He said because it is so easy to simply take it to a gun shop or somewhere that the cons outweight the pros of just throwing it away. If something happened, though very unlikely, you could be held responsible if it could be determined you were the one that tossed it.

(BTW, he also said for me to not to try to take it apart as I could blow myself up.)

So there you have it. In the interest of being fair (and I don't mind being proved wrong, if I am) that's where it stands.

Do what you feel comfortable with.

Plus, this illustrates the contrasts of firearms policies in differing parts of North America.

1.5k · April 2, 2003

LOL, Ok, SE7EN, I don't reckon there are any more points to make on this issue. I make the final score six for you, five for me. Shall we put this to bed and save the rest of the forum readers further agony?

4.7k · April 2, 2003

wow. i was just looking for some simple advice.

i figured just throwning it in the trash was a bad idea since i share a common dumpster with my neighbors.. who have kids... who have been known to pitch rocks into the dumpster on a slow day.

and i realize that it's probably less of a risk to me than, say, my jug-o'-lighterfluid, but as a stranger in the land of firearms and ammunition i wanted to dispose of it properly. the lighter fluid, i know how to dispose of. i am no stranger to barbecues.

i appreciate you all going to the trouble of doing the research, if only to settle a bet.

if the police want it, can i mail it to them? (please don't panic. this last bit is a joke.)

it doesn't matter if you get to camp at one or at six. dinner is still at six.

24.7k · April 2, 2003

I take my ammo that I can't actually use to the Sherrifs office. The officer who collected it said "We'll throw it in the fire next time we burn contraband"

Anyway, they should know what they are doing and it gets it out of your hands.

Wherever you go there you are.

4.7k · April 2, 2003

just out of curiosity, i'm interested to know what ammo you'd have that you can't use. does it expire, or do you get the odd shell that's deformed, or a grab-bag-o-ammo that doesn't necessarily match the firearms you have?

it doesn't matter if you get to camp at one or at six. dinner is still at six.

April 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by tirediron:
Shall we put this to bed and save the rest of the forum readers further agony?

Fine by me.

quote:
Originally poster by flask:
i figured just throwning it in the trash was a bad idea since i share a common dumpster with my neighbors.. who have kids... who have been known to pitch rocks into the dumpster on a slow day.

Yeah, I'd have to agree, in those circumstances.

There was a recent incident with some kids shooting at a .22 shell with pellet guns. Yup, it went off and one of the kids got hurt. Nothing major, but enough to make the news.

April 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by flask:
just out of curiosity, i'm interested to know what ammo you'd have that you can't use.

There's the very rare misfire. Bad reloads. Inherited boxes of junk with live ammo. Ammo for guns you've gotten rid of.

...and, of course, from caches.

April 2, 2003

lock it in a visegrip pliers and throw it at a brick wall....

Oh wait, someone may actually DO that. (Works better with .22 rimfires).

In reference to the earlier posts -- yes, ammunition can explode and discharge in a fire. It will not achieve the same velocity or distance as discharged from a barrel, but may still be enough to serious injure or possibly kill someone nearby. Many firefighters have been injured this way. It is not common, but has occurred. In the case of house or garage fires, consider what is typically stored with and alongside ammunition. If you see reloading equipment in a room there is bulk amounts of powder and primer somewhere nearby.

========================================

Friends don't let Friends geocache drunk.

2.5k · April 2, 2003

quote:
Originally posted by Dave54:
If you see reloading equipment in a room there is bulk amounts of powder and primer somewhere nearby.

bulk powder in fire

April 3, 2003

No one cares what the FBI or NRA says. My post was based on the first hand experience of thousands of firefighters who have been injured or have had close calls.

Ammunition can discharge in a fire and bulk powder can explode. This does not mean it will do so every time. It does happen often enough that prudence and caution should direct any firefighting actions around ammunition. All the uninformed posts on the internet will not change reality.

========================================

Friends don't let Friends geocache drunk.

20.7k · April 3, 2003

I was a little bored and did a web search on this issue. Of the sites that were on-topic, every one advised to either take the ammo to the police or have them come to get it.

nevermind the date.

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