Missing cache well off the beaten path

[Chris737]

Just curious what the community's thoughts on this are: I own a regular sized cache in the woods, at least 100 yards off a trail, in what I thought was a very low traffic area. There's no reason to be there, other than to find my GC. It was pretty easy to find once you get there - not overly concealed. The cache just went missing, and I think it was well-secure from animals, so I'm assuming someone must have taken it. Do I just chalk this up as one of life's mysteries and replace it, or do I make some effort to hide it better or in a different spot, on the assumption that someone might take it again?

[nonaeroterraqueous]

I can't imagine how you can be so sure it wasn't an animal.

[Chris737]

Sitting down inside a hole in a tree trunk. Either requires arms an opposable thumbs, or to push it up at least a foot from underneath. But true, I can't argue that it's impossible.

[nonaeroterraqueous]

Well, anyway, I'd say a missing cache is probably worth replacing at least once, if you don't know why it went. Random things happen. If it happens a second time, then you might want to reevaluate it.

[+briansnat]

You will be surprised where people other than geocachers wander. What you think is off the beaten path might be a favorite spot of mushroomers, hunters, birders, couples looking to couple, or people who just like to explore.

 

I have a cache that is way off trail, several miles from the road in some pretty rugged terrain. No reason anybody but a geocacher would go back there... you'd think. One winter I was hiking in the area and saw a pair of footprints in the snow diverge from the trail and head in direction of my cache. They were pretty fresh so I assumed this person was going after my cache so I followed in hopes of catching up with another cacher. The cache gets maybe 2-3 finds a year it's that remote. I followed the prints through heavy brush, over boulder fields and they kept going toward my cache. I was certain it was a geocacher. Who else would leave the trail to traverse this rugged terrain in the snow without a good reason? That was until the tracks passed within 10 feet of my cache and kept going. A geocacher would have stopped, but this person didn't.

 

Another time I had a cache that was really well hidden in a rock formation. It wasn't too far off trail (maybe 100 feet) but it was the sort of place where I thought you had to be specifically looking for the cache to discover it. I receive a log from a non geocacher who found it. I was sort of shocked because no way in heck should someone be poking around these rocks so I emailed the guy asking how the heck he accidentally discovered it. He said he loves to go off trail and look for snakes and other reptiles among rocks.

 

Even if your cache is well away from the beaten path, never assume nobody goes there.

Edited June 22, 2014 by briansnat

[nonaeroterraqueous]

Yeah, no kidding. I just found one that was about a third of a mile from the nearest trail, a steep uphill bushwhack. It had a note from a muggle who found it by accident, nestled under a pile of rocks. I only had a short off-trail hike compared to what the other guy did to get to it and accidentally find it.

According to the note, he left the trail way down there in the area of that lake in the picture. I cannot fathom what that must have been like. Yet, he did it, and he ended up right on top of the cache. At least he was kind enough to put it back after leaving the note.

[+narcissa]

We found a very remote cache a few weeks ago and when we were flipping through the logbook, saw a log written by a muggle who found it by accident while exploring. There are lots of people who trek around for all sorts of reasons, and a hole in a tree can be enticing for anyone with a bit of curiosity - not just geocachers.

[+uxorious]

I found a cache that was back off the trail 75 ft or more, and had been signed by a muggle. His note said he was answering natures call and notice this ammo can in a stump.

 

Glad he signed it and put it back.

[+WarNinjas]

Lots of stuff can happen. You can secure it to the tree with something. Not screw it in but attach a rope or something. If you think a cacher took it you can make it premium member only to see if that helps.

[+terrkan78]

If it was an ammo can, I'd replace it with something cheaper now that someone's found the spot. I'd consider doing the same if it was a lock & lock (hopefully they'll not bother stealing a re-purposed peanut butter jar...unless, of course, it actually was an animal). I'm not sure I'd move it too much - I'd make the assumption that if they found it once, they can do so again even if they are a muggle.

 

I've always enjoyed hiking off trail, but it never occurred to me to stop and look inside stumps, tree hollows, etc., prior to geocaching. I see some pretty fun notes from muggles in geocaches, some at surprisingly remote locations. One was from mushroom hunters. One was from a parent/child who came back repeatedly and logged their visits (with the parent explaining how much the kid liked coming back to find this thing). Most don't mention why on earth they were searching around this particular tree in the middle of nowhere.

[+edscott]

We found a very remote cache a few weeks ago and when we were flipping through the logbook, saw a log written by a muggle who found it by accident while exploring. There are lots of people who trek around for all sorts of reasons, and a hole in a tree can be enticing for anyone with a bit of curiosity - not just geocachers.

 

Similar story for me. One of my most remote and inaccessible caches has at least two logged visits by hunters in the logbook. If a spot looks interesting to you it might just interest someone else.

[+Team OPJim]

I have caches well off the beaten path requiring serious bushwacking that have been found. The issue is that is exactly where deer and elk hunters will go.

[+-CJ-]

My opinion is that caches should be replaced in different locations wherever it's possible.

 

If you think that the cache could be taken away by some human, not animal, then there are chances that this human may be back to check if there's anything new for him there.

[+BAMBOOZLE]

You will be surprised where people other than geocachers wander. What you think is off the beaten path might be a favorite spot of mushroomers, hunters, birders, couples looking to couple, or people who just like to explore.

 

I have a cache that is way off trail, several miles from the road in some pretty rugged terrain. No reason anybody but a geocacher would go back there... you'd think. One winter I was hiking in the area and saw a pair of footprints in the snow diverge from the trail and head in direction of my cache. They were pretty fresh so I assumed this person was going after my cache so I followed in hopes of catching up with another cacher. The cache gets maybe 2-3 finds a year it's that remote. I followed the prints through heavy brush, over boulder fields and they kept going toward my cache. I was certain it was a geocacher. Who else would leave the trail to traverse this rugged terrain in the snow without a good reason? That was until the tracks passed within 10 feet of my cache and kept going. A geocacher would have stopped, but this person didn't.

 

Another time I had a cache that was really well hidden in a rock formation. It wasn't too far off trail (maybe 100 feet) but it was the sort of place where I thought you had to be specifically looking for the cache to discover it. I receive a log from a non geocacher who found it. I was sort of shocked because no way in heck should someone be poking around these rocks so I emailed the guy asking how the heck he accidentally discovered it. He said he loves to go off trail and look for snakes and other reptiles among rocks.

 

Even if your cache is well away from the beaten path, never assume nobody goes there.

 

This, exactly.

In traveling around the country we have found caches in VERY remote areas but often there it will be....the coffee cup or beer can. While I can't be sure I feel most all of the trash was left by non-cachers.

[team tisri]

Sitting down inside a hole in a tree trunk. Either requires arms an opposable thumbs, or to push it up at least a foot from underneath. But true, I can't argue that it's impossible.

 

So also an ideal place for people to stash a few bottles of beer for their late-night rendezvous, or to use as a drop for trading the kind of commodities where the buyer and seller don't need to meet in person and would rather the police didn't appear during the trade?

[team tisri]

According to the note, he left the trail way down there in the area of that lake in the picture. I cannot fathom what that must have been like. Yet, he did it, and he ended up right on top of the cache. At least he was kind enough to put it back after leaving the note.

 

From what I've seen the kind of person who is sufficiently interested in the wilder places to go off trail like that is likely to respect anything they find that isn't actively damaging to the environment. Either that or he just couldn't be bothered to haul a box full of Happy Meal toys back to the trail from where he found it

 

When I think of the kind of excuses geocachers give to people who ask what they are doing - looking for the dog's ball, looking for bugs, thought I saw a squirrel run up the tree, etc - the fact the excuse works at all indicates that it's conceivable that people do those things, and if people do those things and happen to be in an area where a cache is hidden they'll find the cache.

 

It also doesn't take a genius to realise that the odd-looking pile of sticks that appears to be hiding something is actually hiding something, and it just takes a little curiosity to take a look to see just what is hidden.

Edited June 30, 2014 by team tisri

[+BCandMsKitty]

It could have been human or animal.

Don't assume an animal can't pull something up out of the trunk of a tree.

 

Either way, you'd probably be better off moving the hiding spot.

[+Team Dredd]

I have to agree with almost every post in here.

 

Reference to animals, when we first started hiding caches in cleaned out food containers (peanut butter jars or coffee creamer jar) they disappeared a few times. We found one about 50 feet away one time all chewed up and realized animals smelled the ex contents. now if we use that kind of container we let it soak with vinegar then clean it really well with bleach, haven't had any get "chewed" since we started that.

 

Reerence new cachers, after reviewing the log for another one of our caches that disappeared twice (a commemorative cache too) we believe brand new cachers with unverified accounts may have carried it away because the new TB we put in it showed up in a cache that was the same new cacher's second find, and in our log they thanked us for the cool container and items they would use. After it disappeared three times (only twice by new cachers) we moved it about a hundred feet and changed to to a premium cache; it is still there it just doesn't get as many hits.

 

In reference to wooded area caches, although we are NOT veteran cachers or hiders, when we put one "off the beaten trail" or find a real old one out in the wilderness the best hides seem to be ones that cant be seen unless you are looking, and are not under strange looking piles of sticks and such; they seem to stay the longest. I like putting and finding them on the backside of something or under something completely natural that even someone exploring would be unlikely to locate. Putting a cache under a pile of sticks that wouldn't occur naturally, lor lean a big rock against something will draw anyone's attention. Also, if you put a cache back in an area that has tall grass on the way there will inevitably be the "cacher trail" of stomped down grass on the way that will also draw attention because curious George will be curious as to why so may people are walking to this specific spot.

 

Sorry for the long post, lol got carried away.

[team tisri]

Reerence new cachers, after reviewing the log for another one of our caches that disappeared twice (a commemorative cache too) we believe brand new cachers with unverified accounts may have carried it away because the new TB we put in it showed up in a cache that was the same new cacher's second find, and in our log they thanked us for the cool container and items they would use. After it disappeared three times (only twice by new cachers) we moved it about a hundred feet and changed to to a premium cache; it is still there it just doesn't get as many hits.

 

Quite a few people who have asked me about geocaching hear as far as the idea of finding boxes in the woods and assume that once you've found the cache you take it away with you. People often seemed surprised when I explained that you sign the log and put it back for the next person.

 

If new cachers don't understand the idea is to sign and replace the cache rather than taking the whole thing away, it's hardly surprising that caches go missing after being found by new cachers.

[+edscott]

Those that spend a lot of time off trail in the woods are usually observant enough to see the stick and rock piles that are man made. Often it is not the owner that left it so obvious, but more recent finders that thought they were covering it "better" and ended up making it a monument that was hard to miss. Monday I was in the woods setting up an Orienteering course in an area where I knew there were no geocaches, except maybe a random puzzle, so I wasn't really thinking about caches. I did however manage to find two letterboxes that were well off trail.

[+J Grouchy]

I have to agree with almost every post in here.

 

Reference to animals, when we first started hiding caches in cleaned out food containers (peanut butter jars or coffee creamer jar) they disappeared a few times. We found one about 50 feet away one time all chewed up and realized animals smelled the ex contents. now if we use that kind of container we let it soak with vinegar then clean it really well with bleach, haven't had any get "chewed" since we started that.

 

Just be sure you don't let the two mix! It gives off toxic chlorine gas...

[nonaeroterraqueous]

Don't assume an animal can't pull something up out of the trunk of a tree.

 

Sometimes one piece at a time, even. Though, that method usually results in a few pieces getting left behind.

[TahoeJoe]

Is it possible it was moved unintentionally nearby? Perhaps someone did not replace it in it's original location.

[+Harry Dolphin]

Don't assume an animal can't pull something up out of the trunk of a tree.

 

Sometimes one piece at a time, even. Though, that method usually results in a few pieces getting left behind.

 

I have problems with black bears. They seem to love to chew on plastic containers. Of course, if people would hide the containers back behind the rocks, the bear wouldn't get to them...

[Chris737]

For what it's worth, I checked with the previous successful finder, and there were no issues returning it. We don't have any large animals here other than deer and beaver. Not really a big enough forest for hunting (and too close to a highway). And I've never seen trash to think that kids would hang out there randomly, but who knows?

 

Like I said, just looking for ideas. Maybe I'll pick a slightly different spot. I really didn't want to make it difficult- I'm not a fan of making it hard when it doesn't have to be, and you've already made an effort to trek through the woods.

[+DanOCan]

You will be surprised where people other than geocachers wander. What you think is off the beaten path might be a favorite spot of mushroomers, hunters, birders, couples looking to couple, or people who just like to explore.

No kidding.

 

My most remote cache involves fording a river and then a relatively pleasant 4.7km hike. It has been found only eight times in nearly six years. One of the first finders commented: "I think it's safe to say that that logbook won't need replacing anytime soon, even if every visitor left a log as long as mine."

 

Imagine my surprise when the most recent finder mentioned this in his log:

It appears that more muggles have found the cache than cachers at this point. There is an entire page of people from all over the world that signed the logbook.

 

I never would have expected that!

[4wheelin_fool]

Reerence new cachers, after reviewing the log for another one of our caches that disappeared twice (a commemorative cache too) we believe brand new cachers with unverified accounts may have carried it away because the new TB we put in it showed up in a cache that was the same new cacher's second find, and in our log they thanked us for the cool container and items they would use. After it disappeared three times (only twice by new cachers) we moved it about a hundred feet and changed to to a premium cache; it is still there it just doesn't get as many hits.

 

Quite a few people who have asked me about geocaching hear as far as the idea of finding boxes in the woods and assume that once you've found the cache you take it away with you. People often seemed surprised when I explained that you sign the log and put it back for the next person.

 

If new cachers don't understand the idea is to sign and replace the cache rather than taking the whole thing away, it's hardly surprising that caches go missing after being found by new cachers.

 

That happens more often than what most would think. I had a cache in a small park that went missing a few times. After the second time I archived it. The following year I find it in a kiosk of another park 12 miles away. I open the logbook and find that muggles have been finding it for the last year in the new spot and writing nonsense in the logbook. I go back to a few months before it was last logged online and a muggle fisherman has written a log saying that he spotted 2 girls intentionally trashing it so he repaired it and rehid. A few more logs by geocachers follow, but no indication after that of why it was moved there. It seems that 2 female geocachers intentionally trashed it, but a muggle fixed it until someone else moved it for some reason. I think that Member Only hides are a good idea at this point..

[+hzoi]

I was wandering around the woods before geocaching. I just do it with more of a set purpose now.

[+briansnat]

I just did maintenance on a cache of mine that is a 2 mile hike over some pretty rugged terrain to a nice overlook. The cache itself was very well hidden, about 75 feet downhill from the overlook and away from the trail. Not really a place someone would have reason to go. No trail there just rocky terrain and the view is limited because it's below the treeline. Searchers are not likely to be observed from the overlook because they'd be concealed by some trees and a few huge boulders.

 

Anyway I've been getting confusing logs. DNFs from experienced cachers, then "Easy find" from relative newbies. I'd see the DNF and decide to take a look, then get a "found it". Finally a seasoned cacher mentioned he found it over 100 feet from the posted coords and mentioned it was pretty exposed.

 

Sure enough it's under a small rock overhang right next to the trail. Someone, for reasons I can't grasp, moved it but I suspect it wasn't a geocacher because they would know better. Apparently I got all of those "easy find" logs because anybody approaching the overlook could see it from right angle. It was not only being used as a geocache, but as a summit register (3/4 of the logs were from non geocachers) and a trash bin. I removed some pretty disgusting junk.

 

Anyway another example of a cache hidden where nobody but a geocacher would be expected to be probably found by a non geocacher.

Edited July 8, 2014 by briansnat

[+Paganmen]

I have had cache containers in out-of-the-way locations disappear and could only chalk it up to animals dragging it off for whatever reason. I also print out the paper from Groundspeak that explains what geocaching is, in case it is found by muggles, and I place one in every cache I have. Hopefully people will read it and realize that the container is a game piece and therefore they will leave it where they found it. I also make sure the log book and the explanation page have the GC code on it. They may even join geocaching.

 

Sadly, I've had several magnetic Hide-a-keys stolen from different locations regardless of the enclosed message. It shows the morals of some people and their attitude that they "found" a "lost" item and therefore it belongs to them. How sad.