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Time to archive the puzzle cache.


Roman!
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I did not like the puzzle, the favorite was going out in the pouring rain with a friend and a rough idea of where it was, getting soaked and after 40 or so minutes making the find that completed my grid. The puzzle had absolutely nothing to do with it.

 

People spent hours on this puzzle sitting on their butts in front of the computer, note how I pointed out being outdoors even if it was raining.

Well, it it were not a puzzle, I bet it didn't even fill in your empty D/T grid.

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I did not like the puzzle, the favorite was going out in the pouring rain with a friend and a rough idea of where it was, getting soaked and after 40 or so minutes making the find that completed my grid. The puzzle had absolutely nothing to do with it.

 

People spent hours on this puzzle sitting on their butts in front of the computer, note how I pointed out being outdoors even if it was raining.

Well, it it were not a puzzle, I bet it didn't even fill in your empty D/T grid.

 

Then it wouldn't have gotten a favorite.

 

And yes it did fill in my grid if you read my log, since then someone has changed the D/T rating on one of their caches which accounts for the hole I have now.

 

This is the second time that has happened, I believe I was quite active in a thread about changing your ratings the first time it happened.

Edited by Roman!
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People spent hours on this puzzle sitting on their butts in front of the computer, note how I pointed out being outdoors even if it was raining.

 

You are correct. How long before you place your multi-cache.

 

Multi cache?

 

Yes, the predecessor to puzzles caches that required people to something that was not just simply a traditional find. It was an completely acceptable cache in it's day.

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People spent hours on this puzzle sitting on their butts in front of the computer, note how I pointed out being outdoors even if it was raining.

 

You are correct. How long before you place your multi-cache.

 

Multi cache?

 

Yes, the predecessor to puzzles caches that required people to something that was not just simply a traditional find. It was an completely acceptable cache in it's day.

LOL, I do know what they are and my opinion on the is "meh", generally to much thinking involved but I like the short easy ones but why would I place one?

Edited by Roman!
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LOL, I do know what they are and my opinion on the is "meh", generally to much thinking involved but I like the short easy ones but why would I place one?

 

Because sometimes it can provide something other than sitting in front of your computer as part of the find.

 

Unfortunately you have simply proven you do not give a carp about finding caches and your point in this thread is nothing more than your game.

Edited by BlueDeuce
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LOL, I do know what they are and my opinion on the is "meh", generally to much thinking involved but I like the short easy ones but why would I place one?

 

Because sometimes it can provide something other than sitting in front of your computer as part of the find.

 

Unfortunately you have simply proven you do not give a carp about finding caches and your point in this thread is nothing more than your game.

 

Yah, you know me so well.

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I know enough that I was willing to accept your point in this thread. Still do.

 

Thought I could discuss it but it wouldn't be the first time I've been told, meh.

 

Unfortunately for me I'm not planing to be like everyone else.

 

I'm confused now, I was trying to understand why you asked when I'd place a multi, the "meh" was my thought on multis, not at you, anything you said or your question but I still don't undestand your question.

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This is a silly argument as you can't be out caching all the time.

Let me start off by saying puzzles frustrate me as well! Hiding caches and figuring them out. I would be OK if there wasn't any. We have placed many as others like them. I have also enjoyed solving the easy ones. What you said here is what brings me to like some puzzles. This is one of my favorite new hobbies. I like it a lot. I can't be out caching all the time so when I can't what to do? I can work on puzzles. I work 50-70 hours a week out in the field so not a lot of time for puzzles but I can enjoy them late at night when I can't be caching and still be doing my new hobbie. All of them seemed impossible in the beginning but if you start to understand them and maybe ask the CO's for help you can start to figure them out...(when not out actually finding caches) They can be fun but I also agree they are frustrating.

-WarNinjas

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I know enough that I was willing to accept your point in this thread. Still do.

 

Thought I could discuss it but it wouldn't be the first time I've been told, meh.

 

Unfortunately for me I'm not planing to be like everyone else.

 

I'm confused now, I was trying to understand why you asked when I'd place a multi, the "meh" was my thought on multis, not at you, anything you said or your question but I still don't undestand your question.

 

Of course you're confused, it's my fault.

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This is a silly argument as you can't be out caching all the time.

Let me start off by saying puzzles frustrate me as well! Hiding caches and figuring them out. I would be OK if there wasn't any. We have placed many as others like them. I have also enjoyed solving the easy ones. What you said here is what brings me to like some puzzles. This is one of my favorite new hobbies. I like it a lot. I can't be out caching all the time so when I can't what to do? I can work on puzzles. I work 50-70 hours a week out in the field so not a lot of time for puzzles but I can enjoy them late at night when I can't be caching and still be doing my new hobbie. All of them seemed impossible in the beginning but if you start to understand them and maybe ask the CO's for help you can start to figure them out...(when not out actually finding caches) They can be fun but I also agree they are frustrating.

-WarNinjas

 

Here's my dilemma, I'm an outdoors person, my family isn't, I spend my free time out caching and when I'm home I'm with my family.

 

Please don't bring up posting on this forum, it's easy, mindless and I can do it while talking to my wife.

 

But again, no answer to what puzzles have to do with geocaching, I maintain they promote the opposite what what geocaching was meant to be.

 

Should they be banned, I have been convinced to say no but I still don't like them.

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But again, no answer to what puzzles have to do with geocaching, I maintain they promote the opposite what what geocaching was meant to be.

And, yet again, I must point out that nobody has been able to definitively state "what geocaching was meant to be". You can't compare puzzles to an unknown quantity.

 

To try to answer that question, here's the original summary of the "Global Positioning Stash Hunt", posted on USENET on May 5, 2000:

The Global Positioning Stash Hunt (GPSH) is an entertaining

adventure game for gps users. Participating in a stash hunt is a

good way to take advantage of the wonderful features and

capability of a gps unit. The basic plan is to have individuals

and organizations set up stashes all over the world and share

the locations of these stashes on the internet. GPS users can

then use the location coordinates to find the stashes. Once

found a stash may provide the visitor with a wide variety of

rewards. All the visitor is asked to do is that if they get

something they should try to leave something for the stash.

If anything would outline the original intent of geocaching, this would be it, wouldn't it?

 

I'd like to point out that what you consider to be the original intent of geocaching, namely getting outdoors, isn't mentioned anywhere in there. The game was stated as "a good way to take advantage of the wonderful features and capability of a gps unit". The game was a way to play with a GPS, nothing more. Since all caches, including puzzles, must include GPS usage at some point, they all fit this original intent of, to paraphrase, "using a GPS". Some just take more effort than others.

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But again, no answer to what puzzles have to do with geocaching, I maintain they promote the opposite what what geocaching was meant to be.

And, yet again, I must point out that nobody has been able to definitively state "what geocaching was meant to be". You can't compare puzzles to an unknown quantity.

 

To try to answer that question, here's the original summary of the "Global Positioning Stash Hunt", posted on USENET on May 5, 2000:

The Global Positioning Stash Hunt (GPSH) is an entertaining

adventure game for gps users. Participating in a stash hunt is a

good way to take advantage of the wonderful features and

capability of a gps unit. The basic plan is to have individuals

and organizations set up stashes all over the world and share

the locations of these stashes on the internet. GPS users can

then use the location coordinates to find the stashes. Once

found a stash may provide the visitor with a wide variety of

rewards. All the visitor is asked to do is that if they get

something they should try to leave something for the stash.

If anything would outline the original intent of geocaching, this would be it, wouldn't it?

 

I'd like to point out that what you consider to be the original intent of geocaching, namely getting outdoors, isn't mentioned anywhere in there. The game was stated as "a good way to take advantage of the wonderful features and capability of a gps unit". The game was a way to play with a GPS, nothing more. Since all caches, including puzzles, must include GPS usage at some point, they all fit this original intent of, to paraphrase, "using a GPS". Some just take more effort than others.

 

So here's my argument, adding puzzles to take advantage of the wonderful features and capability of a gps unit is an arbitrary ALR, if they said you had to drink a beer before finding a cache it would be the same thing, probably better because responsible people would then walk/bike to the cache instead of drive adding to their outdoor time and getting more exercise.

 

The more I think about it the more it makes sense to replace puzzle caches with beer caches.

Edited by Roman!
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CRISIS AVERTED

OP Says "NO" To Mystery/Puzzle Cache Ban

In a startling turn of events today, geocacher "Roman!" has ceded

the possibility that the geocache type known as Mystery/Puzzle

Caches could remain as a viable form of geocache for those people

who enjoy them while stating "I still don't like them."

 

In fitness news, Roman! has just unveiled his revolutionary

"Beer Caching Exercise Regimen" for the betterment of humankind.

Story on page 6.

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I hate Traditional caches like this one. Can we just get rid of all Traditionals?

:rolleyes:

 

Meh, that one took me 10 minutes or so... :laughing:

 

I wouldn't go so far as to ban film canisters in rock walls. Or black bison tubes in hedges for that matter. :ph34r:

 

However, I do believe that any geocache that is not buried should be banned. If there's no hole dug, it's not in the right spirit.

 

The original spirit of geocaching was to bury containers with dirty videos in them. A can of beans was added, just in case you get hungry watching the dirty video.

 

In order to continue in this spirit, micros will have to be banned, obviously. Also each cache should be required to contain at least 1 can of beans.

 

Silliness aside, I think my point is that there is no 1 definition of what the 'spirit of geocaching' is. Also, the hobby has evolved with time and will continue to evolve, just like other hobbies do. Buried caches are no longer allowed. Nor are you permitted to put food in a cache. No more dirty videos either; contents are supposed to be 'family friendly'...And to top that off...for some caches you are not given the coordinates directly...you must first solve a puzzle to figure them out. :D

Edited by The_Incredibles_
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CRISIS AVERTED

OP Says "NO" To Mystery/Puzzle Cache Ban

In a startling turn of events today, geocacher "Roman!" has ceded

the possibility that the geocache type known as Mystery/Puzzle

Caches could remain as a viable form of geocache for those people

who enjoy them while stating "I still don't like them."

 

In fitness news, Roman! has just unveiled his revolutionary

"Beer Caching Exercise Regimen" for the betterment of humankind.

Story on page 6.

 

That's some funny s***. +2

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I hate Traditional caches like this one. Can we just get rid of all Traditionals?

:rolleyes:

 

Meh, that one took me 10 minutes or so... :laughing:

 

I wouldn't go so far as to ban film canisters in rock walls. Or black bison tubes in hedges for that matter. :ph34r:

 

However, I do believe that any geocache that is not buried should be banned. If there's no hole dug, it's not in the right spirit.

 

The original spirit of geocaching was to bury containers with dirty videos in them. A can of beans was added, just in case you get hungry watching the dirty video.

 

In order to continue in this spirit, micros will have to be banned, obviously. Also each cache should be required to contain at least 1 can of beans.

 

Silliness aside, I think my point is that there is no 1 definition of what the 'spirit of geocaching' is. Also, the hobby has evolved with time and will continue to evolve, just like other hobbies do. Buried caches are no longer allowed. Nor are you permitted to put food in a cache. No more dirty videos either; contents are supposed to be 'family friendly'...And to top that off...for some caches you are not given the coordinates directly...you must first solve a puzzle to figure them out. :D

 

So let's create the beer cache then.

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But again, no answer to what puzzles have to do with geocaching, I maintain they promote the opposite what what geocaching was meant to be.

And, yet again, I must point out that nobody has been able to definitively state "what geocaching was meant to be". You can't compare puzzles to an unknown quantity.

 

To try to answer that question, here's the original summary of the "Global Positioning Stash Hunt", posted on USENET on May 5, 2000:

The Global Positioning Stash Hunt (GPSH) is an entertaining

adventure game for gps users. Participating in a stash hunt is a

good way to take advantage of the wonderful features and

capability of a gps unit. The basic plan is to have individuals

and organizations set up stashes all over the world and share

the locations of these stashes on the internet. GPS users can

then use the location coordinates to find the stashes. Once

found a stash may provide the visitor with a wide variety of

rewards. All the visitor is asked to do is that if they get

something they should try to leave something for the stash.

If anything would outline the original intent of geocaching, this would be it, wouldn't it?

 

I'd like to point out that what you consider to be the original intent of geocaching, namely getting outdoors, isn't mentioned anywhere in there. The game was stated as "a good way to take advantage of the wonderful features and capability of a gps unit". The game was a way to play with a GPS, nothing more. Since all caches, including puzzles, must include GPS usage at some point, they all fit this original intent of, to paraphrase, "using a GPS". Some just take more effort than others.

 

I don't see the part where you're supposed to play CIA code breaker either.

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But again, no answer to what puzzles have to do with geocaching, I maintain they promote the opposite what what geocaching was meant to be.

 

You keep clinging to this belief that cachers who like to solve puzzle caches are sitting at home in front of the computer during the time they could be out geocaching. I seriously doubt this is true in most cases. I have no evidence besides my own habits, so yeah, I could be way off base but I'd guess that most puzzle cachers find time to solve puzzles when they wouldn't be out caching anyway. I do 80% of my puzzle solving at work. The other 20% would be when I couldn't or didn't want to go out caching anyway. I've never taken a single minute, that I intended to spend geocaching, sitting in front of a computer solving a puzzle.

 

As I said, I could be wrong. Maybe the norm is to spend quality geocaching time solving puzzles and then going out to find them. I would pity those poor souls who do that regularly as you'd be right...why spend a Saturday afternoon in by the computer if you really wanted to go out caching?. Me, I like my habit of solving puzzles and then just keep a running bookmark of my solves and keeping my GPS updated with the puzzles I've solved. When I get in the area, I will try to make the find. I can geocache and solve puzzles and one does not interfere with the other.

 

To try to answer your question on what puzzles have to do with geocaching: Puzzles keep my mind on geocaching during the times I can't be out geocaching.

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But again, no answer to what puzzles have to do with geocaching, I maintain they promote the opposite what what geocaching was meant to be.

 

You keep clinging to this belief that cachers who like to solve puzzle caches are sitting at home in front of the computer during the time they could be out geocaching. I seriously doubt this is true in most cases. I have no evidence besides my own habits, so yeah, I could be way off base but I'd guess that most puzzle cachers find time to solve puzzles when they wouldn't be out caching anyway. I do 80% of my puzzle solving at work. The other 20% would be when I couldn't or didn't want to go out caching anyway. I've never taken a single minute, that I intended to spend geocaching, sitting in front of a computer solving a puzzle.

 

As I said, I could be wrong. Maybe the norm is to spend quality geocaching time solving puzzles and then going out to find them. I would pity those poor souls who do that regularly as you'd be right...why spend a Saturday afternoon in by the computer if you really wanted to go out caching?. Me, I like my habit of solving puzzles and then just keep a running bookmark of my solves and keeping my GPS updated with the puzzles I've solved. When I get in the area, I will try to make the find. I can geocache and solve puzzles and one does not interfere with the other.

 

To try to answer your question on what puzzles have to do with geocaching: Puzzles keep my mind on geocaching during the times I can't be out geocaching.

 

You do puzzles at work?

 

Isn't that stealing, that's not the spirit of geocaching.

 

But don't feel bad, I know lots of others that do puzzles at work.

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I hate Traditional caches like this one. Can we just get rid of all Traditionals?

:rolleyes:

 

Meh, that one took me 10 minutes or so... :laughing:

 

I wouldn't go so far as to ban film canisters in rock walls. Or black bison tubes in hedges for that matter. :ph34r:

 

However, I do believe that any geocache that is not buried should be banned. If there's no hole dug, it's not in the right spirit.

 

The original spirit of geocaching was to bury containers with dirty videos in them. A can of beans was added, just in case you get hungry watching the dirty video.

 

In order to continue in this spirit, micros will have to be banned, obviously. Also each cache should be required to contain at least 1 can of beans.

 

Silliness aside, I think my point is that there is no 1 definition of what the 'spirit of geocaching' is. Also, the hobby has evolved with time and will continue to evolve, just like other hobbies do. Buried caches are no longer allowed. Nor are you permitted to put food in a cache. No more dirty videos either; contents are supposed to be 'family friendly'...And to top that off...for some caches you are not given the coordinates directly...you must first solve a puzzle to figure them out. :D

 

So let's create the beer cache then.

 

We could do that, however beer caches would discrimate against those people who are physically not able to handle their beer. Mr Incredible, for instance, has 1/2 beer and he's out cold. Obviously he would not be able to bike to the cache in this condition. If you started publishing beer caches, all those people who are allergic to alcohol would be excluded from the game. Are you trying to create some sort of elitist club or what? :mad:

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I hate Traditional caches like this one. Can we just get rid of all Traditionals?

:rolleyes:

 

Meh, that one took me 10 minutes or so... :laughing:

 

I wouldn't go so far as to ban film canisters in rock walls. Or black bison tubes in hedges for that matter. :ph34r:

 

However, I do believe that any geocache that is not buried should be banned. If there's no hole dug, it's not in the right spirit.

 

The original spirit of geocaching was to bury containers with dirty videos in them. A can of beans was added, just in case you get hungry watching the dirty video.

 

In order to continue in this spirit, micros will have to be banned, obviously. Also each cache should be required to contain at least 1 can of beans.

 

Silliness aside, I think my point is that there is no 1 definition of what the 'spirit of geocaching' is. Also, the hobby has evolved with time and will continue to evolve, just like other hobbies do. Buried caches are no longer allowed. Nor are you permitted to put food in a cache. No more dirty videos either; contents are supposed to be 'family friendly'...And to top that off...for some caches you are not given the coordinates directly...you must first solve a puzzle to figure them out. :D

 

So let's create the beer cache then.

 

We could do that, however beer caches would discrimate against those people who are physically not able to handle their beer. Mr Incredible, for instance, has 1/2 beer and he's out cold. Obviously he would not be able to bike to the cache in this condition. If you started publishing beer caches, all those people who are allergic to alcohol would be excluded from the game. Are you trying to create some sort of elitist club or what? :mad:

 

Ah but puzzle caches discriminate against those of lower intelligence and discriminating against them is a lot worse than discriminating against those that can't hold their liquor.

 

Again another reason why the beer cache needs to replace the puzzle cache.

Edited by Roman!
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Ah but puzzle caches discriminate against those of lower intelligence and discriminating against them is a lot worse than discriminating against those that can't hold their liquor.

 

Again another reason why the beer cache needs to replace the puzzle cache.

 

That almost sounded like you insulted yourself. :unsure:

 

How about keeping puzzle caches, but adding an option. If you are unable to solve the puzzle, you can drink 3 beers, take a test to confirm your blood alcohol level and will be emailed the solution. :blink::D

Edited by The_Incredibles_
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I hate Traditional caches like this one. Can we just get rid of all Traditionals?

:rolleyes:

 

That's just silly, without traditionals you won't have geocaching, without puzzles you'll still have geocaching.

 

There are several aspects about power trails that some don't consider to be geocaching. For many, the "hides" are so obvious you don't even really have to search for them. On many trails the cache owners allow container swapping which goes against a basic guideline of replacing the container where you found it. On some power trails "leapfrogging" seems to be somewhat common and condoned by the cache owners, allowing people to log a find on a cache even though the never even went to the cache location (how is *that* geocaching). Most p/t cache owners condone cut-n-paste logs, a practice which many cache owners despise for distinct caches but are acceptable if the cache is part of a powertrail. When a road or trail is used for a powertrail, with containers hidden every 528', it prevents any other caches from being hidden along that road/trail due to proximity guideline. All in All, power trail "geocaching" bears little resemblance to distinct traditional geocaches. Not only would geocaching continue to exist without powertrails, but they were prohibited for about the first nine years the game existed.

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I hate puzzles!

 

I have a lot of responsibility at work and my brain is always in overdrive but when I get home I like to relax my brain. I go geocaching to get outside and away from my responsibilities, the last thing on earth I want to do is have to think and solve puzzles. As a result my map of unfound caches is nothing but ?s.

 

What has sitting on your butt googling ideas for hours on end have to do with getting outside and discovering new places?

 

Furthermore they cause nothing but angst to people wanting to hide new caches because of proximity rules.

 

It's time to retire the puzzle cache just like we did with virtuals and webcams, they've had their day but it's time to move on.

 

Let's promote getting outside, not giving people more excuses to sit on their butts.

 

Who's with me?

 

Point me to where the people that are against you are standing.. I want to go stand over there. I love puzzles.. especially in the winter.

 

Don't like them? Don't do them!

 

Shaun

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I hate Traditional caches like this one. Can we just get rid of all Traditionals?

:rolleyes:

 

Meh, that one took me 10 minutes or so... :laughing:

 

I wouldn't go so far as to ban film canisters in rock walls. Or black bison tubes in hedges for that matter. :ph34r:

 

However, I do believe that any geocache that is not buried should be banned. If there's no hole dug, it's not in the right spirit.

 

The original spirit of geocaching was to bury containers with dirty videos in them. A can of beans was added, just in case you get hungry watching the dirty video.

 

In order to continue in this spirit, micros will have to be banned, obviously. Also each cache should be required to contain at least 1 can of beans.

 

Silliness aside, I think my point is that there is no 1 definition of what the 'spirit of geocaching' is. Also, the hobby has evolved with time and will continue to evolve, just like other hobbies do. Buried caches are no longer allowed. Nor are you permitted to put food in a cache. No more dirty videos either; contents are supposed to be 'family friendly'...And to top that off...for some caches you are not given the coordinates directly...you must first solve a puzzle to figure them out. :D

 

So let's create the beer cache then.

 

We could do that, however beer caches would discrimate against those people who are physically not able to handle their beer. Mr Incredible, for instance, has 1/2 beer and he's out cold. Obviously he would not be able to bike to the cache in this condition. If you started publishing beer caches, all those people who are allergic to alcohol would be excluded from the game. Are you trying to create some sort of elitist club or what? :mad:

 

Ah but puzzle caches discriminate against those of lower intelligence and discriminating against them is a lot worse than discriminating against those that can't hold their liquor.

 

Again another reason why the beer cache needs to replace the puzzle cache.

 

I have seen more than my share of puzzle caches that seem to have been created for no other reason than to show us all just how intelligent the creator is. It was either that or to show me that neat lamp post in the drug store parking lot.

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NOTE: Reply is not at the listed location. To discover the true reply, you will have to utilize the code below:

 

Z htiab dgzmcse sufixd fkok.

 

Hint: Vingenere would be proud.

 

Great. This illustrates some of the points that have been brought up. Some sort of code? It's not rot13. Is it 12, 14, 9? I guess I could test them all. Is it a simple substitution, simple that is until you figure out that the CO made up the substation at random. Okay, so I play around with this for an hour or so and bam, the so called eureka moment. I decode it, get the coordinates, punch them into Google Earth and zoom down to a freaking light post in the WalMart parking lot. I have no desire to run out there to find it. And you didn't just waste my time? How? What exactly did I learn from this experience? How did it enrich my life or advance my education? Did trying random substitutions for hours until I finally got the right one help offset the advance of Alzheimer's disease, or dementia? Or, did it just advance my baldness by pulling my hair out.

 

Meanwhile, I'm trying to place a cache on the hiking trail up on the hill above WalMart and the reviewer is telling me that I can't because there is a puzzle final in the area. Okay, which one do I have to solve? There's 55 of them down there.

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I have seen more than my share of puzzle caches that seem to have been created for no other reason than to show us all just how intelligent the creator is. It was either that or to show me that neat lamp post in the drug store parking lot.

This is my only beef with Mystery/Unknown caches. I always get a little tooth grinding going on when I solve a tough puzzle, and find out that it is something along the lines you say above. (emphasis on the quote mine)

Edited by NeverSummer
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NOTE: Reply is not at the listed location. To discover the true reply, you will have to utilize the code below:

 

Z htiab dgzmcse sufixd fkok.

 

Hint: Vingenere would be proud.

 

Great. This illustrates some of the points that have been brought up. Some sort of code? It's not rot13. Is it 12, 14, 9? I guess I could test them all. Is it a simple substitution, simple that is until you figure out that the CO made up the substation at random. Okay, so I play around with this for an hour or so and bam, the so called eureka moment. I decode it, get the coordinates, punch them into Google Earth and zoom down to a freaking light post in the WalMart parking lot. I have no desire to run out there to find it. And you didn't just waste my time? How? What exactly did I learn from this experience? How did it enrich my life or advance my education? Did trying random substitutions for hours until I finally got the right one help offset the advance of Alzheimer's disease, or dementia? Or, did it just advance my baldness by pulling my hair out.

 

Meanwhile, I'm trying to place a cache on the hiking trail up on the hill above WalMart and the reviewer is telling me that I can't because there is a puzzle final in the area. Okay, which one do I have to solve? There's 55 of them down there.

 

I can sympathize with this. I just hate it when the key to solving a puzzle cache is some random thing that the cache owner came up with that is near impossible to guess. I recently spent 3 weeks trying to solve a puzzle cache like this. I did learn many things, however, it was incredibly frustrating. After trying many things, I emailed the cache owner who said 'Most people need a nudge to get started.' The puzzle was then solvable in 5 minutes. My not-so-humble opinion is that if most people have to PAF or email the cache owner for help, the hint should be ON the cache page.

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I love puzzles!

 

I have a lot of responsibility at work and my brain is always in overdrive but when I get home I like to relax my brain. I go geocaching to get outside and away from my responsibilities, the first thing I want to do is have a go at solving some juicy geopuzzles. As a result my map of unfound caches is nothing but crap micros.

 

Every now and again I love sitting on my butt googling ideas for hours on end before getting outside and discovering new places?

 

Furthermore they cause nothing but angst to people wanting to hide crap new micros because of proximity rules.

 

It's time to promote the puzzle cache just like we did with virtuals and webcams, they've had their day and will eventually take over.

 

Let's promote getting outside, do some puzzle caches and not give people more excuses to sit on their butts or do lame micros.

 

Who's with me?

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NOTE: Reply is not at the listed location. To discover the true reply, you will have to utilize the code below:

 

Z htiab dgzmcse sufixd fkok.

 

Hint: Vingenere would be proud.

 

Great. This illustrates some of the points that have been brought up. Some sort of code? It's not rot13. Is it 12, 14, 9? I guess I could test them all. Is it a simple substitution, simple that is until you figure out that the CO made up the substation at random. Okay, so I play around with this for an hour or so and bam, the so called eureka moment. I decode it, get the coordinates, punch them into Google Earth and zoom down to a freaking light post in the WalMart parking lot. I have no desire to run out there to find it. And you didn't just waste my time? How? What exactly did I learn from this experience? How did it enrich my life or advance my education? Did trying random substitutions for hours until I finally got the right one help offset the advance of Alzheimer's disease, or dementia? Or, did it just advance my baldness by pulling my hair out.

 

Meanwhile, I'm trying to place a cache on the hiking trail up on the hill above WalMart and the reviewer is telling me that I can't because there is a puzzle final in the area. Okay, which one do I have to solve? There's 55 of them down there.

 

I can sympathize with this. I just hate it when the key to solving a puzzle cache is some random thing that the cache owner came up with that is near impossible to guess. I recently spent 3 weeks trying to solve a puzzle cache like this. I did learn many things, however, it was incredibly frustrating. After trying many things, I emailed the cache owner who said 'Most people need a nudge to get started.' The puzzle was then solvable in 5 minutes. My not-so-humble opinion is that if most people have to PAF or email the cache owner for help, the hint should be ON the cache page.

 

I honestly believe that almost all of the difficult puzzles in my area are solved with a nudge from the CO or a PAF to someone else that got that nudge from the CO. I can only think of three, maybe four cachers locally that have the ability to solve most of these without help. Quite often the response to people that ask about puzzles in the forum is to direct them to ask the CO. For some reason, this is very alien to me. I tend to try to be self sufficient, sometimes to the point that it can be detrimental. I really have no desire to join the PAF network. I think that I have made a PAF from a GZ twice, and both had special circumstances. But that is just me, and it is easy to forget that not everyone is like me. Obviously, I like traditional caches and almost exclusively have hidden traditional caches. I want people to find them and try to leave enough information that allows them to still have to search, but be able to find them without help. It's very rare that someone asks me for help.

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It's time to retire the puzzle cache just like we did with virtuals and webcams, they've had their day but it's time to move on.

Just because virtual got archived, doesn't mean it was a good idea. Virtual caches allow geocachers to explore places that would suffer from physical containers or where they're simply not permitted.

If you wanted to promote outdoor activity, it would make sense for you to support virtuals and webcam caches.

 

I can see why some people would dislike puzzles. But they help to convince puzzle geeks to enjoy the outdoors. No one is forcing you to solve them and you can get them off your map if unsolved caches bug you. Retiring all of them (all over the world) just because you happen to not like them is incredibly selfish. Give other people their fun and just do the caches you enjoy.

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I find interesting the two reactions to what people want in a puzzle GZ after solving. Some want a trip to the woods for the cache site, some want a PnG type.

 

Of my puzzzle caches, most are PnG's, with three being more of a trek into the woods type. That's probably not too far off the ratio for caches in general around here.

 

I've set most of my puzzle GZ's as PnG type for two reasons: I know some people are going to skip the puzzle-why should I remove a nicer GZ from a trad they may hunt?; and, since fewer beginners will solve puzzles in general, they won't be exposed to as many PnG hides. That one seems to be a losing battle, though.

 

I guess I never really thought about people who both solve puzzles and try to avoid PnGs; how after already becoming emotionally committed to a puzzle cache they may feel let down by a simpler hide.

 

I'm lucky to live in a metropolitan area with a lot of clever puzzle creators. Sure we get our share of Google lookups-including a few of my own-but in general the Twin Cities have plenty of well thought out, interesting puzzles, that let me exercise my mind, not just my legs before getting to GZ.

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So here's my argument, adding puzzles to take advantage of the wonderful features and capability of a gps unit is an arbitrary ALR, if they said you had to drink a beer before finding a cache it would be the same thing
"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." - Inigo Montoya, The Princess Bride

 

It isn't an ALR (Additional Logging Requirement) if it's part of navigating to GZ, finding the cache, and signing the log. It's an ALR (Additional Logging Requirement) if after you've signed the log, the CO requires you to do something additional before you can log your find online.

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I don't mind there being puzzle caches at all. In fact, I work on solving them when I am stuck inside and want to do something at least geocaching related. Otherwise I don't have the blue question mark caches in my PQs.

 

And THERE'S my problem.

 

I would much rather have the "solve them before you leave the house" or "homework" puzzle caches as their own type or identifable by their own attribute or something so they can be filtered out without also zapping all of the other caches of the same type (challenge caches, sovle in the fields, etc.).

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But again, no answer to what puzzles have to do with geocaching, I maintain they promote the opposite what what geocaching was meant to be.

 

You keep clinging to this belief that cachers who like to solve puzzle caches are sitting at home in front of the computer during the time they could be out geocaching. I seriously doubt this is true in most cases. I have no evidence besides my own habits, so yeah, I could be way off base but I'd guess that most puzzle cachers find time to solve puzzles when they wouldn't be out caching anyway. I do 80% of my puzzle solving at work. The other 20% would be when I couldn't or didn't want to go out caching anyway. I've never taken a single minute, that I intended to spend geocaching, sitting in front of a computer solving a puzzle.

 

As I said, I could be wrong. Maybe the norm is to spend quality geocaching time solving puzzles and then going out to find them. I would pity those poor souls who do that regularly as you'd be right...why spend a Saturday afternoon in by the computer if you really wanted to go out caching?. Me, I like my habit of solving puzzles and then just keep a running bookmark of my solves and keeping my GPS updated with the puzzles I've solved. When I get in the area, I will try to make the find. I can geocache and solve puzzles and one does not interfere with the other.

 

To try to answer your question on what puzzles have to do with geocaching: Puzzles keep my mind on geocaching during the times I can't be out geocaching.

+1

Today, we went out geocaching and we found 16 caches - all traditional. It was a beautiful day in the mountains and there weren't many people around to disturb the serenity. We did some hiking and enjoyed the pine trees and the blue sky. Then we came home and logged those 16 traditional caches. And then we worked on a bunch of puzzles we hope to solve and go out for someday. All in all, a real geocaching-filled day!

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A purely vain enquiry, Roman!, but would you find this puzzle of mine a tolerable "mystery/unknown" experience?

 

That looks more like a multi and I'd opt for the steeper choice over the horsier choice.

 

It's a puzzle as there is nothing at the posted coordinates... you first need to figure out where the dots are.

 

When I first looked at this I had no idea how to start (mainly as I could not see the dots!). Now I see; and it's not too far from me... will put on the to-do list!

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When I first looked at this I had no idea how to start (mainly as I could not see the dots!). Now I see; and it's not too far from me... will put on the to-do list!

Good man! Now I suppose I'd better check the micros are still in place since no other players are doing that for me :)

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I dislike [insert element here] and because I seem to have a compulsive disorder that prevents me from ignoring this aspect of the game and, instead, focusing on what I do enjoy, everyone else should feel the same as I do and it must be removed...

 

There's logic for you.

 

Great statement. I was going to suggest that they take puzzles out of their PQ. Although i don't do many puzzles because I prefer to be out and about rather than at home I don't care if others do. I have one pair I meet for coffee occasionally on Sunday morning and she has her current puzzle cache work scattered across the table as we talk.

 

I take time to add ones I don't want to do (most) to my ignore list while watching sports so they don't show up.

 

As to most puzzles ending in LP's since the real challenge to them is finding the solution who cares where you go Kind of unrealistic to expect a good puzzle and a nice location.

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I absolutely love them. To me - all of geocaching is a puzzle, regardless of cache type, but puzzle caches are even more fun. On a traditional, I still have to solve lots of problems, try a few different things, decipher hints sometimes, use a variety of tools.

 

Puzzle caches just kick that up a notch. It's okay if you don't feel like doing that extra work -- I dont' feel like kayaking or rappelling to some caches, so we're even. :)

 

I have some extremely creative people in my area - a recent favorite had a game piece with a folding puzzle in it and it was so much fun. I'd certainly rather "butt sit" and use my brain than watch TV, especially since the result is a nice walk the next morning to my reward.

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I still believe puzzles have nothing to do with geocaching.

 

 

And some people believe the world is flat. Doesn't make it correct.

 

In its simplest form, yes, geocaching was the traditional. But the game evolved. Some took a step outside the box to see how they could make it a little more interesting, add that additional challenge. I suspect if they didn't, the game would not have lasted it as long as it has. It would have become stagnant and fizzled out long before you discovered it last year.

 

Remember this slogan? "Geocaching - You are the search engine" Sometimes you have to search for the container, and sometimes you have to search for the container AND the co-ordinates. It's still a search.

 

I like most puzzle caches (Not all puzzle caches are created equally). I see it as exercise for my brain, and then exercise for my body. It's win/win!

 

I think many people can see how puzzles and geocaching compliment each other quite nicely. But like the great Satchmo once said, "If you have to ask what Jazz is, you'll never know." B)

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