Garmin Lifetime Map Updates "Lifetime"

[+Red90]

I realize that the mods closed the other topic and asked not to start another, so this might get canned....

 

I believe it is important that we post facts on this subject in order to provide real information for people that have or might want to purchase the lifetime updates.

 

I would like to hear if sviking is successful or not in getting the updates.

 

I would like to know if anyone else has been refused updates.

I had always "assumed" that the only reason for them to stop providing the updates would be that there was a technical reason such as a change in the map format that was not supported by the older units. If they start denying updates based on age or some other criteria, that would be quite disheartening.

 

Please post your factual information only in order to avoid a philosophical discussion that brings things outside of the forum guidelines once again...

[+Chrysalides]

I hope this thread doesn't get closed. I'm very interested in the situation as I'm on the fence regarding getting a lifetime subscription. A factual thread without all the nasty stuff going on in the other thread would be tremendously helpful, and I hope the mods agree.

 

If anyone was refused an update, when the update would clearly work on the device, please also let us know the model and the date you purchased the subscription.

Edited February 23, 2011 by Chrysalides

[jholly]

FWIW, my 750 is discontinued and I am still loading updates. What was curious to me was that in the other thread some reported being able to update their 2720's. I'm wondering if there is not some sort of hardware divide where some can update and some can't, and this hardware divide is not being communicated. If the older units still can support and use the current format maps I see no reason to deny the update, other than Navteq deciding they need to maintain or increase revenue.

[robertlipe]

I was grumpy when I discouraged the topic itself. Repeated required intervention for name calling, profanity, and license violations doesn't bring out my warm, fuzzy side. Factual discussion of tech topics is fine and encouraged. That last thread was on a bad path and several leash-corrections failed to help it, so I ended it.

 

Carry on. (Politely.)

[+Walts Hunting]

I was grumpy when I discouraged the topic itself. Repeated required intervention for name calling, profanity, and license violations doesn't bring out my warm, fuzzy side. Factual discussion of tech topics is fine and encouraged. That last thread was on a bad path and several leash-corrections failed to help it, so I ended it.

 

Carry on. (Politely.)

 

I love the comment about leash corrections. Sometimes you might even consider a choke collar.

[sviking]

Nope, not yet. Two emails with no response and two phone calls with 30+ minutes on hold before I gave up.

[+Bullygoat29]

Does anyone know when the 750 and the 2720 were discontinued. Being able to pin down dates might give a better understanding of what Garmin considers a lifetime.

[jholly]

Does anyone know when the 750 and the 2720 were discontinued. Being able to pin down dates might give a better understanding of what Garmin considers a lifetime.

750 - I'm guessing late 2008 or early 2009. The 755 replacement came out 8/08.

[+Chrysalides]

Wikipedia has a list of Garmin products with release date.

 

From anecdotal evidence from the other thread, it seems that updates for the 2720 has not been discontinued across the board, but by individual subscription. Therefore "useful lifetime" does not appear to be the lifetime of the product, but instead of the subscription. Just speculating on what little information we have.

[+Bullygoat29]

Ok, that goes back to the question I asked in the first thread. How much is an individual update and how much was the lifetime subscription. How many updates is everyone getting from a lifetime update?

[sviking]

Therefore "useful lifetime" does not appear to be the lifetime of the product, but instead of the subscription. Just speculating on what little information we have.

 

Doesn't make any sense. I had my Nuvi 660 subscription quite a while before my 2720 subscription. It was my wife's GPS unit...and she barely ever used it. I only got the 2720 subscription because we had a cross country move from New England to Arizona and needed to update it for her to use. I was able to update the much older 660 subscription just fine to 2011.40. Not so for my 2720...

 

I've performed every single update ever offered on my Nuvi 660. I bought the subscription as soon as Garmin offered it. The 2720 was probably 1.5-2 years later. Both units were purchased in 2006.

Edited February 24, 2011 by sviking

[sviking]

Ok, that goes back to the question I asked in the first thread. How much is an individual update and how much was the lifetime subscription. How many updates is everyone getting from a lifetime update?

 

And, as I said in that thread...who cares? When a lifetime subscription is just a little bit more than a single update, it's stupid to by a single update anyway.

[+Bullygoat29]

Which is exactly the point I'm trying to make. If a map update is $100 and "lifetime" is $150 and you got ten updates then you saved a lot of money on updates. But hey, Garmin could easily stop offering "lifetime" updates and everyone would have to go back to paying for individual updates. I for one wouldn't want to see that scenario happen.

[sviking]

Which is exactly the point I'm trying to make. If a map update is $100 and "lifetime" is $150 and you got ten updates then you saved a lot of money on updates.

 

But, that is NOT how it works now, does it?

 

If Garmin wants to institute a policy like that then DELINEATE it in their "fine print"...and grandfather existing subscription holders. But, they haven't done that now, have they? As it stands, Garmin is in the WRONG by cutting off subscriptions to owners of compatible units that still work...regardless of how much money they would have "saved" over individual update purchases... Comprende?

[+Chrysalides]

Which is exactly the point I'm trying to make. If a map update is $100 and "lifetime" is $150 and you got ten updates then you saved a lot of money on updates. But hey, Garmin could easily stop offering "lifetime" updates and everyone would have to go back to paying for individual updates. I for one wouldn't want to see that scenario happen.

To answer your question, individual update is about $50 (price varies) and subscription is $75.

 

Subscription allows up to 4 updates a year. I don't know if this means 1 update every 3 months or 4 a year. I also don't know if they go by calendar year or period of 365 / 366 days.

[+Chrysalides]

Therefore "useful lifetime" does not appear to be the lifetime of the product, but instead of the subscription. Just speculating on what little information we have.

 

Doesn't make any sense. I had my Nuvi 660 subscription quite a while before my 2720 subscription. It was my wife's GPS unit...and she barely ever used it. I only got the 2720 subscription because we had a cross country move from New England to Arizona and needed to update it for her to use. I was able to update the much older 660 subscription just fine to 2011.40. Not so for my 2720...

 

I've performed every single update ever offered on my Nuvi 660. I bought the subscription as soon as Garmin offered it. The 2720 was probably 1.5-2 years later. Both units were purchased in 2006.

The whole situation doesn't make any sense, that's why we're trying to get more data. Maybe Garmin takes # of updates into account, or some combination of model # and length of subscription, maybe they just roll dice every morning to decide who to mess up that day, maybe someone there has a grudge against you. Thanks for supplying another data point (that your 660 subscription is older but still active).

[sviking]

Which is exactly the point I'm trying to make. If a map update is $100 and "lifetime" is $150 and you got ten updates then you saved a lot of money on updates. But hey, Garmin could easily stop offering "lifetime" updates and everyone would have to go back to paying for individual updates. I for one wouldn't want to see that scenario happen.

To answer your question, individual update is about $50 (price varies) and subscription is $75.

 

I've also seen the lifetime subscription for as low as $59. I jumped on it at $69 for the 2720. It's a no brainer as compared to paying $50+ for a single update.

Subscription allows up to 4 updates a year. I don't know if this means 1 update every 3 months or 4 a year. I also don't know if they go by calendar year or period of 365 / 366 days.

 

I've been doing this since day one. They've always offered four updates per "year". It's not a calendar year. It runs about Feb/Mar to Feb/Mar. Four updates per "cycle", such as 2011.10 -> .40. Next will be 2012.10.

 

I've seen the subscription for as low as $59. I jumped on it at $69 for my 2720. No brainer when a single update is $50+

Edited February 24, 2011 by sviking

[+Chrysalides]

I've been doing this since day one. They've always offered four updates per "year". It's not a calendar year. It runs about Feb/Mar to Feb/Mar. Four updates per "cycle", such as 2011.10 -> .40. Next will be 2012.10.

 

I've seen the subscription for as low as $59. I jumped on it at $69 for my 2720. No brainer when a single update is $50+

So there are 4 updates released per "year", instead of multiple updates but you can only download 4 (which is what Garmin's blurb sounds like to me). Makes sense. Thanks for the info.

[sviking]

So there are 4 updates released per "year", instead of multiple updates but you can only download 4 (which is what Garmin's blurb sounds like to me). Makes sense. Thanks for the info.

 

4 updates per "year" doesn't count as multiple updates in your "world"? What do you mean by download "only four"? That's all that's offered per cycle.

[+Chrysalides]

So there are 4 updates released per "year", instead of multiple updates but you can only download 4 (which is what Garmin's blurb sounds like to me). Makes sense. Thanks for the info.

 

4 updates per "year" doesn't count as multiple updates in your "world"? What do you mean by download "only four"? That's all that's offered per cycle.

*sigh* Why must you argue with every one here, even when no one is arguing with you?

 

Let me explain.

 

By "multiple" I mean more than 4. I did not know that Garmin offers exactly 4 updates a year. I thought updates would be released whenever they felt like it, but under annual subscription, you can update the unit only 4 times a year.

[sviking]

 

Let me explain.

 

By "multiple" I mean more than 4.

 

Ok, let me explain. "Multiple", to most people, means more than ONE.

 

I did not know that Garmin offers exactly 4 updates a year.

 

Historically, yes. However, that could change at any moment under their "UP TO four updates per year" caveat...

 

I thought updates would be released whenever they felt like it

 

Again, historically... Updates have been released pretty much every three months. The actual day varies.

 

but under annual subscription, you can update the unit only up to 4 times a year.

[+Chrysalides]

Ok, let me explain. "Multiple", to most people, means more than ONE.

Thank you. You are right. I am wrong. Have a nice day.

[+geodarts]

Please post your factual information only in order to avoid a philosophical discussion that brings things outside of the forum guidelines once again...

 

It did not take long to stray from this, but I would still be interested in whatever factual experiences people have had with being denied further updates under the "lifetime" subscription plan.

Edited February 25, 2011 by mulvaney

[sviking]

It did not take long to stray from this, but I would still be interested in whatever factual experiences people have had with being denied further updates under the "lifetime" subscription plan.

 

So, exactly what is in this thread (specifically, what I've said) that is not based on experience, which is as close as "factual" as it gets?

 

You're not going to get FACTUAL unless Garmin starts posting.

[+Red90]

OK... as the OP.....

 

STOP talking about the philosophical side of this issue. This thread is NOT about cost and NOT about what Garmin "should" do. I sugeest that if you wish to have that discussion to take it to the Garmin forums.

 

Please limit your comments to providing details of the product you own and the date you purchased the lifetime subscription. Please do not add any new posts unless you have NEW information.

 

Mods, please feel free to delete the off topic posts.

 

Thanks,

[sviking]

I'm the one with the "problem", so I have every right to post in this thread. It was I who tried to nip the idiotic questions about cost in the bud. I didn't bring them up, nor was it even germane to this problem. And, I DID say when I got my units and subscriptions.

Edited February 25, 2011 by sviking

[+baloo&bd]

There seems to be an obvious question that needs to be asked here: Has anyone else with a subscription on the 2720 had an issue?

 

While it is a reasonable expectation that electronics have a useful life cycle, and maybe I missed it somewhere however in both threads it appears to be one unit has the issue while others have not.

Edited February 25, 2011 by baloo&bd

[+baloo&bd]

Mods, please feel free to delete the off topic posts.

 

 

Glad that got clarified.

Edited February 25, 2011 by baloo&bd

[sviking]

Mods, please feel free to delete the off topic posts.

 

 

Glad that got clarified.

 

Yeah, like your post?

[jholly]

I went back and wandered through the previous thread. One person did report installing the latest update and a couple 2720's. I then read the lifetime update info. It does mention that you might not be able to install the update if your unit does not have enough memory. I have noticed that as time goes on the size of the updates have been getting larger. I would make a suggestion but I probably will be told I don't know what I'm talking about.

[sviking]

I went back and wandered through the previous thread. One person did report installing the latest update and a couple 2720's. I then read the lifetime update info. It does mention that you might not be able to install the update if your unit does not have enough memory. I have noticed that as time goes on the size of the updates have been getting larger. I would make a suggestion but I probably will be told I don't know what I'm talking about.

 

Memory isn't an issue. The 2720 has 2 gigs and all of North America fits...for now. It does on my 2gig Nuvi 660. And, I could always elect to NOT install Canada, Mexico, etc. There's PLENTY of room on that device for "something" 2011.40 updated.

[yogazoo]

This thread (and the previous one) crack me up. How does such an interesting question turn to childish poop-flinging each and every time? Amazing!

[sviking]

This thread (and the previous one) crack me up. How does such an interesting question turn to childish poop-flinging each and every time? Amazing!

 

And, yet again, thanks for that "insightful" addition, which adds absolutely NOTHING.

[+Chrysalides]

It would appear that except for sviking, so far no one else have reported that they had purchased a lifetime subscription and been denied an update.

 

I searched using google as well, and I have not come across any such reports either. But I admit that I did not go beyond the first 2 pages of search result.

 

Again, this is a call for information. Has anyone other than sviking with a NuMaps lifetime subscription been denied an update, and if so, can you provide details please?

[sviking]

Bump...should be stickied at top of page anyway...

[+Cardinal Red]

Bump...should be stickied at top of page anyway...

I understand the great importance you personally place on this topic. I am reasonably interested and have not had any problem following the discussion without sticky status. I certainly can't see any justification for bestowing sticky status on any thread about a Garmin product policy.

 

Since you came back here to bump this topic without any further information, I have to assume Garmin has not responded with an official clarification of their "lifetime" update policy. If they won't tell you anything, what do you expect anybody else can add of an official nature?

[sviking]

It's the FIRST instance of Garmin beginning the process of denying owners of older COMPATIBLE units further map updates when they purchased a LIFETIME SUBSCRIPTION.

 

It's potentially important for a great many and who may have these update conflicts with Garmin. Comprende?

Edited February 27, 2011 by sviking

[+Cardinal Red]

It's the FIRST instance of Garmin beginning the process of denying owners of older COMPATIBLE units further map updates when they purchased a LIFETIME SUBSCRIPTION.

 

It's potentially important for a great many and who may have these update conflicts with Garmin. Comprende?

Roll your eyes? Really? I do understand perfectly. It still a GARMIN policy. Not a Groundspeak policy. It is a worthy discussion, but it doesn't rise to the level of needing sticky status. I think you are so upset you are not able to see this objectively.

[+baloo&bd]

It's the FIRST instance of Garmin beginning the process of denying owners of older COMPATIBLE units further map updates when they purchased a LIFETIME SUBSCRIPTION.

 

It's potentially important for a great many and who may have these update conflicts with Garmin. Comprende?

Roll your eyes? Really? I do understand perfectly. It still a GARMIN policy. Not a Groundspeak policy. It is a worthy discussion, but it doesn't rise to the level of needing sticky status. I think you are so upset you are not able to see this objectively.

 

More on topic (i.e not about sticky) this was cleared up some time ago when it was explained that it was the usable life of the unit, not your lifetime, which is a commonly accepted practice in consumer electronics and if memory serves was listed in the subscription agreement.

 

You also seem to be the only one experiencing it as some have mentioned they updated the same unit and, even after being asked repeatedly, no one else has come forward. This would lead one to believe that it may be a glitch in your particular unit that may or may not be cleared up with a factory reset.

[jholly]

It's the FIRST instance of Garmin beginning the process of denying owners of older COMPATIBLE units further map updates when they purchased a LIFETIME SUBSCRIPTION.

 

It's potentially important for a great many and who may have these update conflicts with Garmin. Comprende?

I might agree with you, but in the other thread there have been reports of 2720's being updated. So it sounds like Garmin is still updating older compatible units. I own an older, discontinued compatible product and I still get updates to work. Nobody else has complained about this "problem" so I can only assume it is not very wide spread.

[sviking]

Roll your eyes? Really?

 

Yup. Why so incredulous? Miss it the first time? :rolleyes:

 

[+Red90]

For the THIRD time, please ONLY add factual and new information about whether or not YOU have received or not lifetime updates.

 

If you want to discuss Garmin's policies make your own thread.

Edited February 28, 2011 by Red90

[+baloo&bd]

For the THIRD time, please ONLY add factual and new information about whether or not YOU have received or not lifetime updates.

 

If you want to discuss Garmin's policies make your own thread.

 

You need to realize this is a forum. Other than the sniping being done by sviking this stayed on topic.

 

So here are the facts: This has only been a problem for one user as no one in either thread, actually any of the three threads, has voiced an issue even though it has been asked repeatedly. Garmin has and does update older units. Garmin has defined lifetime as the usable life of the unit and put this in writing that is available prior to purchasing a subscription which is a common practice in consumer electronics with software based subscriptions. There has even been an explanation given for this.

 

Assumptions: Based on the rudeness that has taken place when others have offered to try to explain and/or help, along with the fact that others with the same units are still receiving the updates in question, it would be reasonable to assume this is an issue with the one unit and or possibly user error and not something that is common.

 

Not sure what information you are wanting at this point as all of this was addressed in the other thread and then repeated here.

[sviking]

Garmin has defined lifetime as the usable life of the unit

 

That is NOT a definition of lifetime NOR did Garmin provide a definition of "usable life". Mine turns on and works fine. It's USABLE.

[+baloo&bd]

That is NOT a definition of lifetime NOR did Garmin provide a definition of "usable life". Mine turns on and works fine. It's USABLE.

 

You can keep repeating that, however while you may eventually convince yourself it is true, fact is that in consumer electronics that use software, firmware, etc. this is the commonly accepted definition. Titling at windmills will not change it.

[sviking]

You can keep repeating that, however while you may eventually convince yourself it is true, fact is that in consumer electronics that use software, firmware, etc. this is the commonly accepted definition. Titling at windmills will not change it.

 

Then show me EXACTLY where Garmin agrees with your "philosophy" in their user license agreement...or anywhere else "official" for that matter...

 

Oh...that's right... You CAN'T, Mr. La Mancha.

Edited February 28, 2011 by sviking

[jholly]

You can keep repeating that, however while you may eventually convince yourself it is true, fact is that in consumer electronics that use software, firmware, etc. this is the commonly accepted definition. Titling at windmills will not change it.

 

Then show me EXACTLY where Garmin agrees with your "philosophy" in their user license agreement...or anywhere else "official" for that matter...

 

Oh...that's right... You CAN'T, Mr. La Mancha.

[sviking]

 

Right click..."save as"... I'm stealing this one!

[+Cacheoholic]

This link says:

 

"This purchase lets you download the most up-to-date map information available...for the lifetime of your Garmin device. No monthly fees, no maintenance costs. You can update every time a quarterly map update is released from Garmin and not pay again."

 

I don't see any reference to "useable"?

[+baloo&bd]

Then show me EXACTLY where Garmin agrees with your "philosophy" in their user license agreement...or anywhere else "official" for that matter...

 

Oh...that's right... You CAN'T, Mr. La Mancha.

 

I'm not going to re-wade through the threads, it was already posted and you replied you were aware and had seen it "many times before". In either case, it really doesn't matter as your unit still receives updates as indicated by at least two users who have posted posted, at least one in this thread.

 

I suspect the issue is that 1. you have done something to your unit that is causing this, which may or may not be solved by doing a factory reset, or 2. are using a subscription you did not purchase. The latter, based on your behavior, seems the most likely.

 

In either case, this is a non-issue for anyone but you.

Edited February 28, 2011 by baloo&bd