davester Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 This has to be worth a thread because time and time again I have come across it. When I was out yesterday I visited this cache. One of the items inside the cache was a box of matches from a hotel. This isn't the first time that this has occured when I've been to a cache. Now this cache was located in a disused railway cutting whose sides were covered with tinder dry vegitation. The railway cutting runs through a large section of woodland. The consequences of the matches igniting doesn't bear thinking about. Therefore, I implore all UK cachers to:- 1. NEVER ever EVER place matches, lighters or other ignition sources inside geocaches. They are possibly the most unsuitable swap item imaginable. 2. If you do come across matches or a lighter, REMOVE them instantly, even if you have no swap to replace them with. Quote Link to comment
+alma Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 know how you feel i havnt found matches but i have found with globetrotter.uk a sharp swiss army knife was not impressed you sometimes wonder what people are thinking of when they put items like that in Quote Link to comment
+Skippy and Pingu Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 We've removed lighters and matches from caches before when we've not had stuff to swap. Our feeling is they are contraband and shouldn't have been placed there in the 1st place. For the record we have also removed chocolate, a sandwich, boiled sweets and crisp packets from a cache (not all from the same one). Why do people leave such stuff? Quote Link to comment
+Cave Troll and Eeyore Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 Last summer we removed lighters from 5 or 6 caches all on the same day. We were surprised to find one in the first cache and couldn't believe it when we found more of the same in the next lot of caches. Quote Link to comment
davester Posted July 10, 2005 Author Share Posted July 10, 2005 We've removed lighters and matches from caches before when we've not had stuff to swap. Our feeling is they are contraband and shouldn't have been placed there in the 1st place. For the record we have also removed chocolate, a sandwich, boiled sweets and crisp packets from a cache (not all from the same one). Why do people leave such stuff? A sandwich!!! Ewwww. Wouldn't have liked to have come to that cache if it hadn't been found for a while during a hot spell. Quote Link to comment
+-Phoenix- Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 Ive got a growing collection of confiscated fire lighting equipment from caches its surprising that given that there are so many of us apparantly removing this stuff, that its still findable in such quantity Quote Link to comment
+Bob Smith Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 Contraband probably gets put in caches because not everyone reads the forum. How about cache owners leaving a list of undesirable items in the cache container? Then all cachers would be aware of the potential problems. Quote Link to comment
+Skippy and Pingu Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 We've removed lighters and matches from caches before when we've not had stuff to swap. Our feeling is they are contraband and shouldn't have been placed there in the 1st place. For the record we have also removed chocolate, a sandwich, boiled sweets and crisp packets from a cache (not all from the same one). Why do people leave such stuff? A sandwich!!! Ewwww. Wouldn't have liked to have come to that cache if it hadn't been found for a while during a hot spell. Luckily the sandwich was in my cache and from the log written on the webpage I thought something undesirable had been left. It was cleared out within 24 hours. It would have stunk otherwise. Putting a note in the cache might work but how many people read the "Congratulations you've found it intentionally or not ... ". We stopped reading them after our 2nd find as you know what it says. You would have to put a separate sheet in to make people notice it. Quote Link to comment
+*bingoboy* Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 (edited) I have twice foun dmatches while caching in the US - I could have made a BIG mess fo teh national park with them Also last summer I found beer in a cache was not impresed at all (was warm) Edited July 10, 2005 by *bingoboy* Quote Link to comment
+Teasel Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 i have found with globetrotter.uk a sharp swiss army knife was not impressed you sometimes wonder what people are thinking of when they put items like that in Totally agree about lighters and food (both of which I've found a number of times) as they're a threat to the environment, but I'm less convinced that a short-bladed penknife is such a problem. We're all grown-ups here, aren't we? And those of us who aren't are under adult supervision, surely? If a child is not yet responsible enough to be able to handle a 2" blade without causing injury or mischief, are they really mature enough to be allowed out caching by themselves? Quote Link to comment
+Learned Gerbil Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 That has reminded me to edit the log of one of the caches I found today to note the removal of the discusiting wet and slimy carrier bag the cache was inside. A white cache container is not camoflaged by a white carrier bag - but I guess the way it was going it would be covered in green gunge in no time! Quote Link to comment
+HazelS Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 We have removed loads of contrabrand too - swiss army knives, lighters (which is great becasue there's a smoker in our midst and ALWAYS loses lighters!) food stuffs including sweets and dog biscuits. There is a certain Cheshire Cacher that for a while used lighters for their swaps... not naming any names, I see they have since stopped doing so! I go along with the separate warning NOT to put such items in the box... I shall be doing this with my next release! Quote Link to comment
+Happy Humphrey Posted July 11, 2005 Share Posted July 11, 2005 I wouldn't mind finding a Swiss Army Knife in a cache: I don't think I'd have anything of equal value to swap, though! HH Quote Link to comment
+lathama Posted July 11, 2005 Share Posted July 11, 2005 I have said it before and will say it again: I am happy to place a lighter or matches into a cache in a location where they might be used, such as in an extremely remote. I realise this is not the "opinion" of most and neither does it "conform" with the guidelines, BUT if i find a location where i feel a lighter/matches may be needed in futre i WILL place them Quote Link to comment
Lactodorum Posted July 11, 2005 Share Posted July 11, 2005 I realise this is not the "opinion" of most and neither does it "conform" with the guidelines, BUT if i find a location where i feel a lighter/matches may be needed in futre i WILL place them When you log n to the Groundspeak website you agree to abide by the terms and conditions. One of those is NOT to leave matches or lighters. You might not agree with the T&C's but you should not deliberately flout them. There are certain constraints I happen to disagree with (and have voiced my opinions in the past) but I go along with them. Please do not leave matches or lighters (or food). Quote Link to comment
+lathama Posted July 11, 2005 Share Posted July 11, 2005 (edited) Edited July 11, 2005 by lathama Quote Link to comment
+Couparangus Posted July 11, 2005 Share Posted July 11, 2005 You can't control what people put in caches, just be grateful they put something in. Creating and enforcing more and more rules is just going to ensure the demise of this hobby. And besides, I've never heard of a box of matches or disposable lighter in a watertight container starting a forest fire. I've also never heard of anyone being offended with finding a pocket knife in a cache and people seem to be down on that. Isn't a knife standard hiking gear anyway?? Remeber, its only a hobby... Quote Link to comment
Lactodorum Posted July 11, 2005 Share Posted July 11, 2005 Creating and enforcing more and more rules is just going to ensure the demise of this hobby. Enforcing the existing guidelines has helped the sport to develop and has persuaded a number of large landowners to allow caching on their land. Ignoring them will only be to the detriment of the sport. At the end of the day, to use the GC.COM website you agree to abide by them. No iffs, no buts. Quote Link to comment
davester Posted July 11, 2005 Author Share Posted July 11, 2005 You can't control what people put in caches, just be grateful they put something in. Creating and enforcing more and more rules is just going to ensure the demise of this hobby. And besides, I've never heard of a box of matches or disposable lighter in a watertight container starting a forest fire. I've also never heard of anyone being offended with finding a pocket knife in a cache and people seem to be down on that. Isn't a knife standard hiking gear anyway?? Remeber, its only a hobby... As Lactordorum says, no if's and no buts. There are no excuses. As for your observation that matches or lighters are non-hazardous in a sealed box. Well, that may be the case, but it isn't unknown for a geocacher to accidently drop a swap item is it? Quote Link to comment
+The Northumbrian Posted July 11, 2005 Share Posted July 11, 2005 I have said it before and will say it again: I am happy to place a lighter or matches into a cache in a location where they might be used, such as in an extremely remote. I realise this is not the "opinion" of most and neither does it "conform" with the guidelines, BUT if i find a location where i feel a lighter/matches may be needed in futre i WILL place them If you can mention in your cache found logs which caches that you have left matches and lighters it would be of great help , so that they can be quickley removed. Nige Quote Link to comment
+Fangsy Posted July 11, 2005 Share Posted July 11, 2005 Aside from items such as matches and lighters, which can have devestating effect even accidentaly in some locations, I have myself removed a contraceptive item from one cache I found (thankfuly still in it's wrap...) which I thought to be a bit unsuitable considering the age range of people who geocache. Obviously not as dangerous as lighters etc, but still got confiscated.... and remains confiscated.... Quote Link to comment
+t.a.folk Posted July 11, 2005 Share Posted July 11, 2005 Remeber, its only a hobby... But it is not a hobby to wild life and flora living in areas devastated by fire . It's not only cachers children find caches . This is part of the last log in GCIBBD a few children playing in the thicket when we came past so stopped for a breather on the bench slightly past this, excellent views. When the kids left we went back and found the cache disturbed and open, all contents still in place though. Quote Link to comment
+lathama Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 I have said it before and will say it again: I am happy to place a lighter or matches into a cache in a location where they might be used, such as in an extremely remote. I realise this is not the "opinion" of most and neither does it "conform" with the guidelines, BUT if i find a location where i feel a lighter/matches may be needed in futre i WILL place them If you can mention in your cache found logs which caches that you have left matches and lighters it would be of great help , so that they can be quickley removed. Nige I think this is a topic which i am going to agree to DISAGREE on. From the background i have in teaching outdoor recreation management there have been many occasions when lighters have failed or matches have got wet and so an available cache would have been extremely usful. Northumbrian : I always put a TOOK: LEFT: in my logs. I have checked and i haven't (luckily for this convo) left a lighter for quite a while. the last was in Denzil cache (near naefearjustbeer) but this was swapped by a cacher later who was most greatful as his lighter had packed up - thus proving my point. Someone else (who's name escapes me): "we are all responsible people and so finding a knife in a cache we know what to do with it" If your that responsible well surly you know how a lighter works too???? Courporangs: "isnt a knife standard hiking gear anyway?" Yes and so are matches, and you dont see people complaining that hikers carry matches in remote areas because "they might accidentally drop one". Quote Link to comment
+Brenin Tegeingl Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Might I remind those from both sides of the discussion that these forums are monitored by both Landowners/Managers who have already given permission for cache placements or agreements, or who cachers are working with to obtain agreements or permission to place a cache. Many of these have agreed on the understanding that there is a list of prohibited items which should not be placed in caches. County Councils have their own forums in which geocaching has been mentioned, and I'm aware of at least one CC who are pro caching but were an agreement is in the process of being worked towards. This involves monitoring current caches, they were extremely happy to be informed that we have a prohibited items list, as what was placed in caches was a worry to them. I can see both sides of the discussion, but believe that this is something which is best discussed away from a open forum. So that we can present a united front to help those who are in discussion with Landowners/Managers and is not an attempt at censorship, as there is other geocaching forums and chat rooms that can be used, also a large no of events still to take place this year. Dave Quote Link to comment
Lactodorum Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 For those with a knowledge of the history of UK Geocaching, this discussion will promote a sense of deja vu. They will also find some irony in the stand I am taking as a UK reviewer. That being said, neither Eckington nor I will knowingly allow ANY cache to contain prohibited items such as matches or lighters. As Mancunian Pyrocacher has said, this forum is open for anybody to read and I intend the message to get across that cache contents are being policed to comply with the guidelines. Quote Link to comment
+Pengy&Tigger Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 I have to disagree Dave. This is exactly the place it should be discussed, even if it only serves to make people aware that there is a banned items list. There will always be one or two people who break rules (or guidelines) in whatever situation in life, and I'm sure any landowners reading this thread will realise that the vast majority of cachers are responsible people. I'm sure their spectacles aren't so rose-tinted that they believe 100% of cachers follow every guideline to the letter. As for other forums, most of those are open too, and not everyone attends events. T Quote Link to comment
+Pharisee Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 And besides, I've never heard of a box of matches or disposable lighter in a watertight container starting a forest fire. That's probably very true... Come to think of it, I've never heard of a box of matches in a sealed box starting a forest fire either. The trouble starts when a kid finds the box and unseals it. Whooo hooo...... a box of matches. The kid opens it, strikes one... just for the hell of it you understand... and watches it burn down to his fingers... THEN HE DROPS IT Quote Link to comment
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